On Wed, 7 Jan 2009 22:00:33 +0000, D.M. Procida wrote:

As was said earlier, an ECC not connected will often show full mains
voltage due to capacitive coupling.

I was assuming that it was indeed a genuine earth-gone-live fault (and
would Pete have received such a shock otherwise?).

Capacitive coupling is well capable of giving you quite a tingle but
nothing like a belt from the mains. Has Pete ever had a direct contact
shock from the mains? If he hasn't he might think "quite a tingle" is the
mains.

IIRC this was also a hand to hand shock. If it was direct mains, I'd
expect him to have reported numbness/tingling down both arms for several
hours afterwards and achey elbow and shoulder joints. Those are certainly
the after effects I've had after picking up the mains. Fortunately all
belts so far have been confined to across a small distance say a finger or
side of hand. The worst was hand to elbow.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:

I was assuming that it was indeed a genuine earth-gone-live fault (and
would Pete have received such a shock otherwise?).

Capacitive coupling is well capable of giving you quite a tingle but
nothing like a belt from the mains. Has Pete ever had a direct contact
shock from the mains? If he hasn't he might think "quite a tingle" is the
mains.

IIRC this was also a hand to hand shock. If it was direct mains, I'd
expect him to have reported numbness/tingling down both arms for several
hours afterwards and achey elbow and shoulder joints. Those are certainly
the after effects I've had after picking up the mains. Fortunately all
belts so far have been confined to across a small distance say a finger or
side of hand. The worst was hand to elbow.

I've had a couple, but one of the nastiest wasn't actually mains, but
450V. I was working in a factory that made meters (moving coil meters,
in my case), and got it from hand to hand, right across my chest.

Apart from the shock itself, which I felt go right through my heart, my
whole body felt as though it had been wrung out like a cloth for hours
afterwards.

Daniele
--
Your chance to own a nearly immaculate BMW C1 (Cardiff, UK)
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220341650190

On 4 Jan, 16:14, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article
,
petek wrote:

It is showing approx 230 volts
between one side of the switch terminal and the earth terminal, which
I think is to be expected.

Should actually be 240v.

Why? We went to 230V years ago. Or are you expecting a -10V earth?

Ian

The Real Doctor wrote:
On 4 Jan, 16:14, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article
,
petek wrote:

It is showing approx 230 volts
between one side of the switch terminal and the earth terminal, which
I think is to be expected.
Should actually be 240v.

Why? We went to 230V years ago. Or are you expecting a -10V earth?


Ah but its a Nu Laber 230v, like the crime rate. Its *specified* lower
because we were always 240v, so its 230v +5%..;-)


Ian

In article
,
The Real Doctor wrote:
It is showing approx 230 volts
between one side of the switch terminal and the earth terminal, which
I think is to be expected.

Should actually be 240v.

Why? We went to 230V years ago.

No we didn't. The actual voltage hasn't changed. Only the spec.

--


Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Jan 9, 1:52 pm, The Real Doctor wrote:
On 4 Jan, 16:14, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

In article
,
petek wrote:
It is showing approx 230 volts
between one side of the switch terminal and the earth terminal, which
I think is to be expected.

Should actually be 240v.

Why? We went to 230V years ago. Or are you expecting a -10V earth?

No we didn't. The standard is now 230V +10% / -6% - but the CEGB
still tends to push out 240V +/- 6% (which happens to be towards the
top end of that range).

On 9 Jan, 20:21, wrote:
On 9 Jan, *
* * *Martin Bonner wrote:

No we didn't. *The standard is now 230V +10% / -6% - but the CEGB
still tends to push out 240V +/- 6% (which happens to be towards the
top end of that range).

Mine's rarely above 234, currently 225 but it never has been any higher.
We're far from the sub station. when we used incandescents they rarely
failed.

At the previous house we were very close to the SS. We had a good stock of
bulbs when we moved in, but in a year they had all blown. IIRC we were nearer
250v there.

--
* B Thumbs
* Change lycos to yahoo to reply

Just to bring this post to a conclusion I thought I would update you
all on the outcome.

The fault was eventually traced to a nail fixing the skirting on the
upstairs landing which had been hammered through the 3core+earth cable
used as strappers for the 2-way light on the stairs. The nail was
touching the bare earth wire and had penetrated the insulation on the
blue wire. This must have been done when the house was built in 1979
as no other work has ever been done in this area (we've lived here
since the house was new). It was a devil of a job finding the fault.
We had to isolate every light on the circuit by disconnecting the
live, neutral and earth wires at each rose and switch, and testing
each one individually. Sod's law applied as the staircase light was
the last but one on the circuit and hence the last but one to be
tested. I then had to cut a section of chipboard floor out for access,
and cut a chase in the landing wall to get the defective cable out,
and install a new length.

The earth wire in first section of the upstairs lighting circuit (i.e.
between the CU and the first light) had been cut back at both ends and
not connected either at the CU or at the ceiling rose of the light. So
even though all the other earth wires in the circuit were connected,
the earth was effectively non-existant. I strongly suspect this was
done deliberately when the house was first built in order to conceal
the short circuit as the leccy at the time probably couldn't be
bothered tracing the fault. We have upgraded the CU from old style
wired fuses to a RCD/MCB type and ensured that all earths are properly
connected.

I have taken a chance on the Part P thing, and used the leccy I
originally got in (who was a JIB Approved Electrician if you remember
from my previous posts). He seemed to me very competent, and welcomed
me acting as his "apprentice/assistant". Total cost was £275 (£210 for
the CU and £65 for tracing and fixing the faulty cable) which included
materials and 11 - 12 hours labour over 2 days (most of the labour
time was tracing the fault).

Thanks again for all your constructive comments. It really does help
being part of this group and I enjoy participating immensely.

Pete

petek wrote:

Thanks again for all your constructive comments. It really does help
being part of this group and I enjoy participating immensely.

Thanks for the update Pete. It's nice to know the eventual outcome of
these things.

--
Cheers,

John.

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