....and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

*******s.

On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 18:47:25 +0000, R D S wrote:

...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Niether seems to be a reasonable approach in my book. The former truly are
predators the latter was ok until he arrived to find out why it needed to
be reset. At least it should have been something like "call me if it goes
again you might have a more serious problem".


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

"Ed Sirett" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 18:47:25 +0000, R D S wrote:

...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me
to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen
to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different
engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Niether seems to be a reasonable approach in my book. The former truly are
predators the latter was ok until he arrived to find out why it needed to
be reset. At least it should have been something like "call me if it goes
again you might have a more serious problem".

Sorry I wasn't clear, and like everything I post there are typo's, 2nd guy
talked me through it on the phone so it cost nothing.

R D S wrote:

"Ed Sirett" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 18:47:25 +0000, R D S wrote:

...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me
to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about ?250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen
to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different
engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Niether seems to be a reasonable approach in my book. The former truly are
predators the latter was ok until he arrived to find out why it needed to
be reset. At least it should have been something like "call me if it goes
again you might have a more serious problem".

Sorry I wasn't clear, and like everything I post there are typo's, 2nd guy
talked me through it on the phone so it cost nothing.

Not the point.
It's not a fix.
What you presumably did was simply to reset the overheat thermostat.
However, it overheated for a reason.
This should be fixed.

In message , R D S
writes
...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

did you ask him, so you know how to do it yourself next time?

Its quite possible that there's a common failure on these boilers and if
you gave them the same lack of useful information that you've posted
here, what else would you expect them to say ?

Of course, being someone with a technical background, really, you should
have tried to work it out a bit yourself

People often get ripped off because they are ignorant, so now go along
and learn how your boiler works


--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes
...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me
to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen
to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different
engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

did you ask him, so you know how to do it yourself next time?

I did it this time, he told me what to do on the phone.

Its quite possible that there's a common failure on these boilers

It isn't a boiler.

and if
you gave them the same lack of useful information that you've posted
here, what else would you expect them to say ?

If I phoned you up after an appliance I bought from you went on the blink
would you talk about part replacement before advising me to push a reset
switch? Are you a robbing ****?

Of course, being someone with a technical background, really, you should
have tried to work it out a bit yourself

My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them.

People often get ripped off because they are ignorant, so now go along
and learn how your boiler works

Well given that the point of my post was about not being ripped off I can't
see you point.
Were you ****ed when you posted this?

"R D S" wrote in message
...
"geoff" wrote in message
...

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

Here's the thing : If you did know, or cared enough to find out, you'd
understand whether there was a real problem or not. That reset or overheat
switch is there for a reason - if it trips, something's gone wrong. If it
was a one-off, I'd ignore it, but if it keeps doing it you really need to
get the underlying problem sorted.

The other thing is if you do make the effort to find these things out,
you're in a better position to work out if you're being ripped off later on.

did you ask him, so you know how to do it yourself next time?

I did it this time, he told me what to do on the phone.

Its quite possible that there's a common failure on these boilers

It isn't a boiler.

boiler, water heater, whatever - his comment still applies.

and if
you gave them the same lack of useful information that you've posted
here, what else would you expect them to say ?

If I phoned you up after an appliance I bought from you went on the blink
would you talk about part replacement before advising me to push a reset
switch? Are you a robbing ****?

From what I've heard, he isn't.

People often get ripped off because they are ignorant, so now go along
and learn how your boiler works

Well given that the point of my post was about not being ripped off I
can't
see you point.
Were you ****ed when you posted this?

He's written broadly sensible advice. Why are you taking such umbrage at it?

clive

"Clive George" wrote in message
...
"R D S" wrote in message
...
"geoff" wrote in message
...

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

Here's the thing : If you did know, or cared enough to find out, you'd
understand whether there was a real problem or not. That reset or overheat
switch is there for a reason - if it trips, something's gone wrong. If it
was a one-off, I'd ignore it,

Precisely.

He's written broadly sensible advice. Why are you taking such umbrage at
it?

His advice might have been better recieved if I was asking why a heater
might not fire and if it didn't have an underlying tone of condescention.

My post was one about a heating engineer overly keen to come (just happens
to have one in the van, free that afternoon etc...) out and change a part
which as it stands appears to be working perfectly.

**** me usenet is annoying.

On Nov 8, 8:48 pm, "R D S" wrote:
"Ed Sirett" wrote in message

...





On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 18:47:25 +0000, R D S wrote:

...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me
to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen
to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different
engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Niether seems to be a reasonable approach in my book. The former truly are
predators the latter was ok until he arrived to find out why it needed to
be reset. At least it should have been something like "call me if it goes
again you might have a more serious problem".

Sorry I wasn't clear,

Yes you were

In message , R D S
writes
"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes
...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me
to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about £250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen
to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different
engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

did you ask him, so you know how to do it yourself next time?

I did it this time, he told me what to do on the phone.

Its quite possible that there's a common failure on these boilers

It isn't a boiler.

and if
you gave them the same lack of useful information that you've posted
here, what else would you expect them to say ?

If I phoned you up after an appliance I bought from you went on the blink
would you talk about part replacement before advising me to push a reset
switch? Are you a robbing ****?

Of course, being someone with a technical background, really, you should
have tried to work it out a bit yourself

My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them.

People often get ripped off because they are ignorant, so now go along
and learn how your boiler works

Well given that the point of my post was about not being ripped off I can't
see you point.
Were you ****ed when you posted this?

One way to not get ripped off is to understand things, not to say

"My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them."


--
geoff

In message , R D S
writes
"Clive George" wrote in message
...
"R D S" wrote in message
...
"geoff" wrote in message
...

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

Here's the thing : If you did know, or cared enough to find out, you'd
understand whether there was a real problem or not. That reset or overheat
switch is there for a reason - if it trips, something's gone wrong. If it
was a one-off, I'd ignore it,

Precisely.

He's written broadly sensible advice. Why are you taking such umbrage at
it?

His advice might have been better recieved if I was asking why a heater
might not fire and if it didn't have an underlying tone of condescention.

see below


My post was one about a heating engineer overly keen to come (just happens
to have one in the van, free that afternoon etc...) out and change a part
which as it stands appears to be working perfectly.

That bit seems to be missing from your original post

and maybe he carries the particular bit which he thought you would need
because its a common failure point on the appliance

the fact that someone else talked you through the problem is neither
here nor there, it's just a difference in mentality


You're an optician, you therefore must have some kind of physics /
technical background

You have a bike - you should have some idea about mechanical systems

.... yet you post like a hairdresser



--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes
"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes
...and generally trust nobody.

We have a gas heater at work fitted by the heater seller's fitters of
choice. I didn't get a good feeling from these guys when they were
installing.

Recently it refused to light, so phoned the seller who in turn asked me
to
phone the fitters.
'Oh yeah', he said, 'its common for those to need a [some regulator or
summat] and its over a year old so it will need a service etc, about
£250
mate, when do you want me to come.'
I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen
to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it.

I phoned the seller again, see if they could recommend a different
engineer,
fortunately this time I got someone competent, he had me open a paned,
unscrew a little cover and push a switch, heater fixed.

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

did you ask him, so you know how to do it yourself next time?

I did it this time, he told me what to do on the phone.

Its quite possible that there's a common failure on these boilers

It isn't a boiler.

and if
you gave them the same lack of useful information that you've posted
here, what else would you expect them to say ?

If I phoned you up after an appliance I bought from you went on the blink
would you talk about part replacement before advising me to push a reset
switch? Are you a robbing ****?

Of course, being someone with a technical background, really, you should
have tried to work it out a bit yourself

My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them.

People often get ripped off because they are ignorant, so now go along
and learn how your boiler works

Well given that the point of my post was about not being ripped off I
can't
see you point.
Were you ****ed when you posted this?

One way to not get ripped off is to understand things, not to say

"My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them."

Fair play to you, if you know everything.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes
"Clive George" wrote in message
...
"R D S" wrote in message
...
"geoff" wrote in message
...

Well not necessarily

Was it the overheat cut off or the reset switch?

I don't know, or really care.

Here's the thing : If you did know, or cared enough to find out, you'd
understand whether there was a real problem or not. That reset or
overheat
switch is there for a reason - if it trips, something's gone wrong. If
it
was a one-off, I'd ignore it,

Precisely.

He's written broadly sensible advice. Why are you taking such umbrage at
it?

His advice might have been better recieved if I was asking why a heater
might not fire and if it didn't have an underlying tone of condescention.

see below


My post was one about a heating engineer overly keen to come (just happens
to have one in the van, free that afternoon etc...) out and change a part
which as it stands appears to be working perfectly.

That bit seems to be missing from your original post

to quote me...
"I told him i'd get back him and something about the way he was mad keen to
pin me to a booking made me tell him to leave it."

and maybe he carries the particular bit which he thought you would need
because its a common failure point on the appliance

the fact that someone else talked you through the problem is neither here
nor there, it's just a difference in mentality

Well I prefer the mentality of the guy who tells me to push a button for
free to the mentality of the guy who guesses that I need to spend £200
replacing a potentially perfectly working part, but each to their own.


You're an optician, you therefore must have some kind of physics /
technical background

What's that sir, you cant see out of your specs? Mmmh, I recommend you get
yourself in sharpish for a sight test and a brand new pair.... Or you might
just want to wipe that smudge off them.

You have a bike

I have a pushbike, is that what you mean?

you should have some idea about mechanical systems

I am not ashamed to say I know **** all about gas heaters. I have a carpet
cleaner I can't fix as well.

... yet you post like a hairdresser

Maybe I am due a career change.

In message , R D S
writes
My post was one about a heating engineer overly keen to come (just happens
to have one in the van, free that afternoon etc...) out and change a part
which as it stands appears to be working perfectly.

That bit seems to be missing from your original post

to quote me...

"just happens to have one in the van"

sorry, where was that ?


and maybe he carries the particular bit which he thought you would need
because its a common failure point on the appliance

the fact that someone else talked you through the problem is neither here
nor there, it's just a difference in mentality

Well I prefer the mentality of the guy who tells me to push a button for
free to the mentality of the guy who guesses that I need to spend £200
replacing a potentially perfectly working part, but each to their own.

Of course, but you don't get someone like him (or me) very often

and it doesn't pay the rent



You're an optician, you therefore must have some kind of physics /
technical background

What's that sir, you cant see out of your specs? Mmmh, I recommend you get
yourself in sharpish for a sight test and a brand new pair.... Or you might
just want to wipe that smudge off them.

I'll be in touch for those cheap lenses sometime


You have a bike

I have a pushbike, is that what you mean?

Why were you posting in UKRM a while ago then ?


you should have some idea about mechanical systems

I am not ashamed to say I know **** all about gas heaters. I have a carpet
cleaner I can't fix as well.

Then you have the mentality of someone who deserves to be ripped off


--
geoff

In message , R D S
writes


One way to not get ripped off is to understand things, not to say

"My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them."

Fair play to you, if you know everything.


You really just don't get it, do you ?


--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes
My post was one about a heating engineer overly keen to come (just
happens
to have one in the van, free that afternoon etc...) out and change a
part
which as it stands appears to be working perfectly.

That bit seems to be missing from your original post

to quote me...

"just happens to have one in the van"

sorry, where was that ?

I thought I had put enough background in the OP, it didn't need to be an
autobiography.

and maybe he carries the particular bit which he thought you would need
because its a common failure point on the appliance

the fact that someone else talked you through the problem is neither
here
nor there, it's just a difference in mentality

Well I prefer the mentality of the guy who tells me to push a button for
free to the mentality of the guy who guesses that I need to spend £200
replacing a potentially perfectly working part, but each to their own.

Of course, but you don't get someone like him (or me) very often

and it doesn't pay the rent

Then I am right to be cynical, wouldn't you say.

You're an optician, you therefore must have some kind of physics /
technical background

What's that sir, you cant see out of your specs? Mmmh, I recommend you get
yourself in sharpish for a sight test and a brand new pair.... Or you
might
just want to wipe that smudge off them.

I'll be in touch for those cheap lenses sometime


You have a bike

I have a pushbike, is that what you mean?

Why were you posting in UKRM a while ago then ?

I am toying with the idea of taking my test.

you should have some idea about mechanical systems

I am not ashamed to say I know **** all about gas heaters. I have a carpet
cleaner I can't fix as well.

Then you have the mentality of someone who deserves to be ripped off

So there are people who deserve to be ripped off? I agree that many people
are ripe for a ripping off but *deserve*?

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes


One way to not get ripped off is to understand things, not to say

"My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them."

Fair play to you, if you know everything.


You really just don't get it, do you ?

I do get it mate, I really do.

But I guess you haven't got the equipment/know how to make yourself a pair
of specs[1]. If you come to me I won't rip you off or suggest that you
should be.

I would rather see rip off merchants dealt with properly[2] than have every
Tom Dick and Harry poking about inside dangerous equipment they know little
about.

[1] On second thoughts, *you* probably do!
[2] Don't worry, I 'm not so gullible to expect that will ever happen.

In message , R D S
writes

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes


One way to not get ripped off is to understand things, not to say

"My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them."

Fair play to you, if you know everything.


You really just don't get it, do you ?

I do get it mate, I really do.

But I guess you haven't got the equipment/know how to make yourself a pair
of specs[1]. If you come to me I won't rip you off or suggest that you
should be.

I would rather see rip off merchants dealt with properly[2] than have every
Tom Dick and Harry poking about inside dangerous equipment they know little
about.

[1] On second thoughts, *you* probably do!

Well, yes, I do to a sufficient extent for a layman. Of course, not
being professional, there's quite a lot I don't know - the difference is
that I've made an effort to at least have a fundamental understanding of
the tools and principles involved

[2] Don't worry, I 'm not so gullible to expect that will ever happen.

There will always be people who take advantage of the ignorant, you just
seem determined to remain in that category

That is my point


--
geoff

In message , R D S
writes

That bit seems to be missing from your original post

to quote me...

"just happens to have one in the van"

sorry, where was that ?

I thought I had put enough background in the OP, it didn't need to be an
autobiography.

maybe you also didn't give the first tradesman sufficient information on
which to make a more informed diagnosis

maybe you just assumed that he knew your thoughts - as above


and maybe he carries the particular bit which he thought you would need
because its a common failure point on the appliance

the fact that someone else talked you through the problem is neither
here
nor there, it's just a difference in mentality

Well I prefer the mentality of the guy who tells me to push a button for
free to the mentality of the guy who guesses that I need to spend £200
replacing a potentially perfectly working part, but each to their own.

Of course, but you don't get someone like him (or me) very often

and it doesn't pay the rent

Then I am right to be cynical, wouldn't you say.

You're an optician, you therefore must have some kind of physics /
technical background

What's that sir, you cant see out of your specs? Mmmh, I recommend you get
yourself in sharpish for a sight test and a brand new pair.... Or you
might
just want to wipe that smudge off them.

I'll be in touch for those cheap lenses sometime


You have a bike

I have a pushbike, is that what you mean?

Why were you posting in UKRM a while ago then ?

I am toying with the idea of taking my test.

you should have some idea about mechanical systems

I am not ashamed to say I know **** all about gas heaters. I have a carpet
cleaner I can't fix as well.

Then you have the mentality of someone who deserves to be ripped off

So there are people who deserve to be ripped off? I agree that many people
are ripe for a ripping off but *deserve*?

In this world, those who doggedly prefer to remain ignorant can only
blame themselves

sorry mate, the world is not a cuddly toy


--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes

That bit seems to be missing from your original post

to quote me...

"just happens to have one in the van"

sorry, where was that ?

I thought I had put enough background in the OP, it didn't need to be an
autobiography.

maybe you also didn't give the first tradesman sufficient information on
which to make a more informed diagnosis


If that was the case then he shouldn't have made any diagnosis.

Anyway, that is my last word on the matter, my post was about the fact that
the world is full of conmen, you seem to agree, this has since descended
into an argument about how much the layman should know about the appliances
which surround him/her in order to avoid being ripped off.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , R D S
writes


One way to not get ripped off is to understand things, not to say

"My field isn't gas appliances, I would rather not mess with them."

Fair play to you, if you know everything.


You really just don't get it, do you ?

I do get it mate, I really do.

But I guess you haven't got the equipment/know how to make yourself a pair
of specs[1]. If you come to me I won't rip you off or suggest that you
should be.

I would rather see rip off merchants dealt with properly[2] than have
every
Tom Dick and Harry poking about inside dangerous equipment they know
little
about.

[1] On second thoughts, *you* probably do!

Well, yes, I do to a sufficient extent for a layman. Of course, not being
professional, there's quite a lot I don't know - the difference is that
I've made an effort to at least have a fundamental understanding of the
tools and principles involved

Go on, surprise me....