An elderly relative has been approached by the supply company, asking him to
sign for them to underground the supply to his property, resulting in the
removal of overhead wires across his garden. so far so good. But the next
door house "don't want to be undergrounded" so they will still have an OH
supply running from the UG mains in the road. (?).
For some reason the supply co. want to run this from a new pole in relatives
garden, rather than putting the pole in the neighbours garden. So even tho
relative will have no need of a pole, being UG from road to house, he would
have a pole at the boundary of his property to serve next door (and
presumably will share the part of the UG mains from road to pole). The
distances involved are not large, the whole front gardens are only about
75ft square. I would like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in
his own garden, also what should relative be looking out for when all this
is arranged? Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the UG
road supply? Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway? Am I missing
something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to
persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue, ie
would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more expensive
for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.? Has anyone any
experience to share before I try to advise relative? Thanks.
Nat.

Nat wrote:
An elderly relative has been approached by the supply company, asking
him to sign for them to underground the supply to his property,
resulting in the removal of overhead wires across his garden. so far
so good. But the next door house "don't want to be undergrounded" so
they will still have an OH supply running from the UG mains in the
road. (?).
For some reason the supply co. want to run this from a new pole in
relatives garden, rather than putting the pole in the neighbours
garden. So even tho relative will have no need of a pole, being UG
from road to house, he would have a pole at the boundary of his
property to serve next door (and presumably will share the part of
the UG mains from road to pole). The distances involved are not
large, the whole front gardens are only about 75ft square. I would
like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in his own garden,
also what should relative be looking out for when all this is
arranged? Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the
UG road supply? Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway? Am I
missing something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time
trying to persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And
here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue,
ie would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more
expensive for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.?
Has anyone any experience to share before I try to advise relative?
Thanks.
Nat.


Don't know what the legal position is here, and I have added uk.legal to see
if someone there can help, but I would personally refuse, point blank to
allow this to happen.
Or, negotiate an extortionate rent, that would allow them to place the pole,
and see me alright throughout my retirement!

"Nat" wrote in message
...
An elderly relative has been approached by the supply company, asking him
to
sign for them to underground the supply to his property, resulting in the
removal of overhead wires across his garden. so far so good. But the next
door house "don't want to be undergrounded" so they will still have an OH
supply running from the UG mains in the road. (?).
For some reason the supply co. want to run this from a new pole in
relatives
garden, rather than putting the pole in the neighbours garden. So even tho
relative will have no need of a pole, being UG from road to house, he
would
have a pole at the boundary of his property to serve next door (and
presumably will share the part of the UG mains from road to pole). The
distances involved are not large, the whole front gardens are only about
75ft square. I would like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in
his own garden, also what should relative be looking out for when all this
is arranged? Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the UG
road supply? Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway? Am I missing
something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to
persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue, ie
would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more expensive
for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.? Has anyone any
experience to share before I try to advise relative? Thanks.
Nat.



The existing service head (box above ground next to the pole) already has a
supply to it. The two houses are already supplied from this box, i.e.. from
under the road to the box. From the box to the pole. From the pole to the
houses.

To install another box and pole further along the road would mean an awful
load of upheaval in the highway for the supply company, so it is really down
to them not wanting to make a bigger mess than is necessary.

I would have thought the supply company would have made a compulsory order
in the area and have everyone taken from a new underground supply. Or are
they asking your relative to pay for this to be done ?


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On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 23:52:25 +0000 (UTC), Nat wrote:

snip

But the next
door house "don't want to be undergrounded" so they will still have an OH
supply running from the UG mains in the road. (?).
For some reason the supply co. want to run this from a new pole in relatives
garden, rather than putting the pole in the neighbours garden.

I suspect the neighbours have become awkward towards the leccy company
and they're looking for an easy way out.

So even tho
relative will have no need of a pole, being UG from road to house, he would
have a pole at the boundary of his property to serve next door (and
presumably will share the part of the UG mains from road to pole). The
distances involved are not large, the whole front gardens are only about
75ft square. I would like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in
his own garden, also what should relative be looking out for when all this
is arranged?

No reason at all. Your relative doesn't have to have the pole in his
garden. Full stop.

Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the UG
road supply? Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway? Am I missing
something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to
persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue, ie
would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more expensive
for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.? Has anyone any
experience to share before I try to advise relative? Thanks.

The wayleave payments are more or less fixed and aren't negotiable. If
you want to start negotiating, then you have to look at granting them a
permanent easement, which they would have to 'buy', so you do then have
some scope to negotiate. But, the downside to that is that once your
relative grants a permanent easement, the leccy company have a legal
right to be there. That isn't the same with a wayleave, where said
relative could give notice to the company who would have to move the
pole after a predetermined time, usually 12 months.

In that position, I'd tell the company, sorry, not interested. Remember,
though that they might just finish up sticking the pole in the back edge
of the foorpath outside your relative's house anyway. I suspect the
bottom line is that it's doing things in the easiest and cheapest way
for the leccy company. If you start making things really difficult,
*you* won't see the cost implications, but if everyone did, then slowly
but surely costs would rise.

You pays your money and takes your choice.....

Nat wrote:

An elderly relative has been approached by the supply company, asking him to
sign for them to underground the supply to his property, resulting in the
removal of overhead wires across his garden. so far so good. But the next
door house "don't want to be undergrounded" so they will still have an OH
supply running from the UG mains in the road. (?).
For some reason the supply co. want to run this from a new pole in relatives
garden, rather than putting the pole in the neighbours garden. So even tho
relative will have no need of a pole, being UG from road to house, he would
have a pole at the boundary of his property to serve next door (and
presumably will share the part of the UG mains from road to pole). The
distances involved are not large, the whole front gardens are only about
75ft square. I would like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in
his own garden, also what should relative be looking out for when all this
is arranged? Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the UG
road supply? Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway? Am I missing
something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to
persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue, ie
would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more expensive
for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.? Has anyone any
experience to share before I try to advise relative? Thanks.
Nat.




M.. I paid upwards of £18k to part shgare the cost of undergrounding the
supply over MY garden.

The initial quote involved putting a pole in the boundary hdges with
stays coming into the garden - naturally a pople at the end of an
overground un needs bracing, and if its all to be done on your property,
thats where the stays end up. I suspect some6hing like that is the issue
here.

Ultimately, we undergrounded 600 meters of line, from a pole on a field
edge necxt to a track where they could put stays, to a place where
someone up the road had undergrounded it already. I got my very own
substation in the corner of the garden. Talk about good supply
regulation :-)

I suspect your neighbour has to find some part of the cost - even if its
only making good the mess after they lay cables - to get the thing
undergrounded.

Seriously, I'd have a chat wih him, and even offer to help pay for
anything if only he will take the UG supply.

Electricity companies have very limited budgets but they will always
nderground if they can. Less maintenance. alk to all involved, find ouyt
what the issues and options are, and, if you can afford it, get the
elederly relative to wave a slittle cash around - often its not huge
amounts - and it should pan out.


As far as your situation is concerned, phone up and get to talk to
someone who deals with 'undergroundimng teh netwwork in your area, and
strat teh conversation with 'how much would ypu cahrge me to underground
my cable'

THAT will get a surveyor out on site and talking to you pretty fast.
Th3en its down to haggling. If you can get a whole road to agree, it may
be even cheaper.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 23:52:25 +0000 (UTC), "Nat"
wrote:

I would like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in
his own garden,

He can but presumably he doesn't want it. It's a bit odd but that's
his decision

also what should relative be looking out for when all this
is arranged?

Just make sure he doesn't sign anything which gives the electricity
board permanent rights over his garden. A standard wayleave should be
fine. It allows your relative to request the removal of the pole at a
later date if he gives sufficient notice

Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the UG
road supply?

I'm not sure what you mean here. It's more likely that your relative
and his neighbour will be on totally separate supplies (i.e. different
phases) to spread the load even though they come from the same "cable"

Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway?

Perhaps the neighbour doesn't want his garden disturbed (or he's just
bloody-minded :-) )

Am I missing
something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to
persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue, ie
would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more expensive
for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.?

More likely the neighbour is being stroppy and the electricity company
is trying to find an easier way out (and who can blame them)

Has anyone any
experience to share before I try to advise relative? Thanks.

I've had experience of having mine and my neighbours supply put
underground recently but that all went fairly smoothly

Cheers,

John

"John Anderton" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 23:52:25 +0000 (UTC), "Nat"
wrote:

I would like to know why the neighbour can't have the pole in
his own garden,

He can but presumably he doesn't want it. It's a bit odd but that's
his decision

also what should relative be looking out for when all this
is arranged?

Just make sure he doesn't sign anything which gives the electricity
board permanent rights over his garden. A standard wayleave should be
fine. It allows your relative to request the removal of the pole at a
later date if he gives sufficient notice

Is there a downside to sharing part of the "spur" from the UG
road supply?

I'm not sure what you mean here. It's more likely that your relative
and his neighbour will be on totally separate supplies (i.e. different
phases) to spread the load even though they come from the same "cable"

Why would anyone NOT want to be UG anyway?

Perhaps the neighbour doesn't want his garden disturbed (or he's just
bloody-minded :-) )

Am I missing
something here? ( I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to
persuade the supply people to UG my wires, to no avail. And here is
someone - the neighbour - actively refusing it) Is this a cost issue, ie
would having the pole in the neighbours garden possibly be more expensive
for the company to do, or is there some other issue here.?

More likely the neighbour is being stroppy and the electricity company
is trying to find an easier way out (and who can blame them)

Has anyone any
experience to share before I try to advise relative? Thanks.

I've had experience of having mine and my neighbours supply put
underground recently but that all went fairly smoothly

Cheers,

John


Thank you all for your thoughts on this. I'm going to speak to the supply co
with my relative so I'll let you know what goes down.
Nat

On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 16:54:37 +0100, Colin Wilson
wrote:



Nat - drop me an email, I have an article that might be of interest from
a newspaper at the weekend (in GIF format)



Any chance of any details here ?

Cheers,

John

Nat - drop me an email, I have an article that might be of interest from=
=20
a newspaper at the weekend (in GIF format)
Any chance of any details here ?

http://www.phoenixbbs.dsl.pipex.com/wayleave.gif

(Sunday Post)

Basically, a couple needed a pole moving, but were told it would cost=20
=A35k.

They discovered there wasn`t a wayleave in force, and are getting it=20
moved it for free.

--=20
Please add "[newsgroup]" in the subject of any personal replies via email
My email address has "btiruseless" and @btinternet.com in it ;-)

On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 23:57:16 +0100, Colin Wilson
wrote:

Nat - drop me an email, I have an article that might be of interest from
a newspaper at the weekend (in GIF format)
Any chance of any details here ?

http://www.phoenixbbs.dsl.pipex.com/wayleave.gif

(Sunday Post)

Basically, a couple needed a pole moving, but were told it would cost
£5k.

They discovered there wasn`t a wayleave in force, and are getting it
moved it for free.


Thanks for that,

Cheers,

John

Basically, a couple needed a pole moving, but were told it would cost
£5k.

They discovered there wasn`t a wayleave in force, and are getting it
moved it for free.

Same thing happened to me with MEB.

They quoted me *much* more than £5K. I invited them around to discuss it.
Discovered that the wayleave had expired and pointed it out.
"Ahah" said the Wayleave Manager, "If you cash the annual rental check, then
that means that you are extending the wayleave for another year."
"Ahah" said I, "I haven't cashed the last two cheques..."

His attitude changed instantly. We agreed that if I dug the trench (approx
75meters) then they would resite a transformer, bury the cables and remove
two poles.

In the end, they used a mole and did the whole lot for free.

Once through the red tape at the beginning, everybody turned out to be
really accommodating, reasonable chaps.

This was 5 years ago though...

Colin

On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 16:16:20 +0100, Colin wrote:


Basically, a couple needed a pole moving, but were told it would cost
£5k.

They discovered there wasn`t a wayleave in force, and are getting it
moved it for free.

Same thing happened to me with MEB.

They quoted me *much* more than £5K. I invited them around to discuss it.
Discovered that the wayleave had expired and pointed it out.
"Ahah" said the Wayleave Manager, "If you cash the annual rental check, then
that means that you are extending the wayleave for another year."
"Ahah" said I, "I haven't cashed the last two cheques..."

His attitude changed instantly. We agreed that if I dug the trench (approx
75meters) then they would resite a transformer, bury the cables and remove
two poles.

In the end, they used a mole and did the whole lot for free.

Once through the red tape at the beginning, everybody turned out to be
really accommodating, reasonable chaps.

Yes, you have to remember that they *are* after all employees of the
company, and they ain't just going to give the company's money away
without a bit of a try to see if they can get someone else to pay first.

On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 23:57:16 +0100, Colin Wilson
wrote:

Nat - drop me an email, I have an article that might be of interest from
a newspaper at the weekend (in GIF format)
Any chance of any details here ?

http://www.phoenixbbs.dsl.pipex.com/wayleave.gif

(Sunday Post)

Basically, a couple needed a pole moving, but were told it would cost
£5k.

They discovered there wasn`t a wayleave in force, and are getting it
moved it for free.

Out of interested what is a wayleave? I've recently bought a house
which has, for want of a better description a telegraph pole in the
garden carrying electricity to the whole of the terrace (five houses).
It's supplied by a transformer at the end of the road and I am
therefore assuming it to be 240v. I've had to fit a UPS since we moved
here as we get occasional brownouts which are sufficient to upset my
computers.

From the brief reading of the deeds of the house there was no mention
of the pole.

The previous owners have screwed a hanging basket bracket to the pole
but I would assume the pole is the property of the electricity company
and they're probably not allowed to do this. The pole doesn't appear
to have a lightning conductor on it, but then I'm now entirely sure
this would be a good thing on an electricity supply pole.

Regards,
Jason.

Jason Arthurs wrote:

From the brief reading of the deeds of the house there was no mention
of the pole.

Is that normally mentioned in the deeds? I've gone through the deeds for
my house, line by line, and I see nothing about the telephone and
electricity poles on the property. I would LOVE to have them moved - they
make noise (are they supposed to do that?) and they mar the otherwise
gorgeous view.

They discovered there wasn`t a wayleave in force, and are getting it
moved it for free.
Out of interested what is a wayleave? I've recently bought a house
which has, for want of a better description a telegraph pole in the
garden carrying electricity to the whole of the terrace (five houses).

A wayleave is a bit of paper saying you grant them permission to plant
equipment in your garden / on your land etc. Wayleaves will normally pay
a small sum (a very small sum) for this right, and the agreement can be
terminated - they may require a notice period to terminate the agreement
though.

An easement is similar, but is a permanent right of way for the third
party to use your land, and to dig it up if need be to repair any
problems or lay new cable.

As the pole supplies your house it complicates matters in that you want
an electric supply - you`ve been provided with an electric supply. The
equipment in the back of the garden was deemed necessary to get it to
you, and permission for that is implied as part of the works necessary to
give you that supply.

Whether that then gives them carte blanche to supply anyone else from the
same pole and oversailing your land is another matter...

As for the brown-outs, how often, how frequent, and could they be tying
in with other possible disturbances on the network ? (ie. farmer with
welding kit further up the link)

Ask your local supplier to fita voltage recorder (they`re supposed to be
fitted within 10 days of the request) and you might get something usable
from that data (depending on what they send you back).

Remember that nominal voltage is now 230v +10% / -6% but voltages have
generally remained at their "old" level to reduce resistivity losses on
the network (the higher the voltage, the less they lose in transmission /
getting it to you)

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