Hi everyone.

Last year, I made a ceiling, after loads of great advice from people
on this group.
Then I had it plastered, then painted it, now looks lovely.

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

The problem is that the plasterboard is below Kingspan insulation, and
this insulation is below the woodwork. Kingspan is faced with metal
foil.
This metal foil interferes with my stud-detector. And I cannot find
lines
of screws with a metal detector, because it just detects the foil.
Here is
a word-picture of the layers:

Roof
Void
Woodwork
Kingspan
Plasterboard
Plaster
Paint


Of course, I know roughly where the joists and noggins are, because
the lighting cables come down from where I attached them - but I do
not know well enough to start drilling.

The only thing I can think of is to start drilling small holes until I
find
the right place, then patch up the test holes that missed the woodwork
when I have finished. Not ideal.

Is there a better way?

Thanks,
David P.

On 17 Feb, 18:32, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

To answer my own question: I could perhaps glue the ceiling rose
to the ceiling with No More Nails or caulking or something like that.
The back of the ceiling rose is shiny plastic that looks like it would
not take glue very well. And I have a funny feeling that this would
not be electrically safe....

What do you think?

Thanks,
David P.

"myheadisonbackwards" wrote in
message oups.com...
On 17 Feb, 18:32, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

To answer my own question: I could perhaps glue the ceiling rose
to the ceiling with No More Nails or caulking or something like that.
The back of the ceiling rose is shiny plastic that looks like it would
not take glue very well. And I have a funny feeling that this would
not be electrically safe....

What do you think?

Thanks,
David P.


Don't do the glue thing, because when you want to change the light youwont
beable to, and you will probably end up replastering the ceiling when the
plaster gives way, because of the ornate lamp shade SWMBO has requested.

I have the Bosch Stud detector and it is excellent, but expensive failing
that you a small screwdriver knocked in to find the joist.

--
Rgds

Steve

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 10:32:58 -0800, myheadisonbackwards wrote:

Hi everyone.

Last year, I made a ceiling, after loads of great advice from people on
this group.
Then I had it plastered, then painted it, now looks lovely.

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

The problem is that the plasterboard is below Kingspan insulation, and
this insulation is below the woodwork. Kingspan is faced with metal foil.
This metal foil interferes with my stud-detector. And I cannot find lines
of screws with a metal detector, because it just detects the foil. Here is
a word-picture of the layers:

Roof
Void
Woodwork
Kingspan
Plasterboard
Plaster
Paint


Of course, I know roughly where the joists and noggins are, because the
lighting cables come down from where I attached them - but I do not know
well enough to start drilling.

The only thing I can think of is to start drilling small holes until I
find
the right place, then patch up the test holes that missed the woodwork
when I have finished. Not ideal.

Is there a better way?

Thanks,
David P.

===============================
Use a strong magnet in a circular motion around the light fitting to find
the screws / nails holding the plasterboard. A bit tedious but should
work.

Cic.

--
================================
Testing UBUNTU Linux
Everything working so far
================================

On 17 Feb 2007 10:32:58 -0800, "myheadisonbackwards"
mused:

Is there a better way?

Plasterboard fixings.
--
Regards,
Stuart.

On 17 Feb, 18:32, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:
Hi everyone.

Last year, I made a ceiling, after loads of great advice from people
on this group.
Then I had it plastered, then painted it, now looks lovely.

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

The problem is that the plasterboard is below Kingspan insulation, and
this insulation is below the woodwork. Kingspan is faced with metal
foil.
This metal foil interferes with my stud-detector. And I cannot find
lines
of screws with a metal detector, because it just detects the foil.
Here is
a word-picture of the layers:

Roof
Void
Woodwork
Kingspan
Plasterboard
Plaster
Paint

Of course, I know roughly where the joists and noggins are, because
the lighting cables come down from where I attached them - but I do
not know well enough to start drilling.

The only thing I can think of is to start drilling small holes until I
find
the right place, then patch up the test holes that missed the woodwork
when I have finished. Not ideal.

Is there a better way?

Thanks,
David P.

Thanks everyone, for your advice yesterday.

I think plasterboard fixings are the best way to do this.
I had thought of this already, but had a weird mental
block on it for some reason - like this was giving up,
and I should stick with my original method. Daft of
course, and plasterboard fixings it is.

As for the magnet idea - I cannot find one at the moment,
but I tried moving a compass around close to the ceiling,
and the needle did deflect as I did so. But not strongly
enough to identify the position of anything.

Thanks again,
David P.

myheadisonbackwards wrote:
On 17 Feb, 18:32, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:
Hi everyone.

Last year, I made a ceiling, after loads of great advice from people
on this group.
Then I had it plastered, then painted it, now looks lovely.

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

The problem is that the plasterboard is below Kingspan insulation, and
this insulation is below the woodwork. Kingspan is faced with metal
foil.
This metal foil interferes with my stud-detector. And I cannot find
lines
of screws with a metal detector, because it just detects the foil.
Here is
a word-picture of the layers:

Roof
Void
Woodwork
Kingspan
Plasterboard
Plaster
Paint

Of course, I know roughly where the joists and noggins are, because
the lighting cables come down from where I attached them - but I do
not know well enough to start drilling.

The only thing I can think of is to start drilling small holes until I
find
the right place, then patch up the test holes that missed the woodwork
when I have finished. Not ideal.

Is there a better way?

Thanks,
David P.

Thanks everyone, for your advice yesterday.

I think plasterboard fixings are the best way to do this.
I had thought of this already, but had a weird mental
block on it for some reason - like this was giving up,
and I should stick with my original method. Daft of
course, and plasterboard fixings it is.

As for the magnet idea - I cannot find one at the moment,
but I tried moving a compass around close to the ceiling,
and the needle did deflect as I did so. But not strongly
enough to identify the position of anything.

Thanks again,
David P.


Did you try the low-tech method of sounding it out with a hammer or any solid
object? The sound will change when you hit (gently of course) over a joist.

--
Karen

If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning.'
Catherine Aird

On 18 Feb, 09:46, Duracell Bunny wrote:
myheadisonbackwards wrote:
On 17 Feb, 18:32, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:
Hi everyone.

Last year, I made a ceiling, after loads of great advice from people
on this group.
Then I had it plastered, then painted it, now looks lovely.

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

The problem is that the plasterboard is below Kingspan insulation, and
this insulation is below the woodwork. Kingspan is faced with metal
foil.
This metal foil interferes with my stud-detector. And I cannot find
lines
of screws with a metal detector, because it just detects the foil.
Here is
a word-picture of the layers:

Roof
Void
Woodwork
Kingspan
Plasterboard
Plaster
Paint

Of course, I know roughly where the joists and noggins are, because
the lighting cables come down from where I attached them - but I do
not know well enough to start drilling.

The only thing I can think of is to start drilling small holes until I
find
the right place, then patch up the test holes that missed the woodwork
when I have finished. Not ideal.

Is there a better way?

Thanks,
David P.

Thanks everyone, for your advice yesterday.

I think plasterboard fixings are the best way to do this.
I had thought of this already, but had a weird mental
block on it for some reason - like this was giving up,
and I should stick with my original method. Daft of
course, and plasterboard fixings it is.

As for the magnet idea - I cannot find one at the moment,
but I tried moving a compass around close to the ceiling,
and the needle did deflect as I did so. But not strongly
enough to identify the position of anything.

Thanks again,
David P.

Did you try the low-tech method of sounding it out with a hammer or any solid
object? The sound will change when you hit (gently of course) over a joist.

--
Karen

Yes, thanks Karen.

Unfortunately, the thick layer of insulation sort of acoustically
disconnects the joints from the plasterboard.

Regards,
David P.

On Feb 18, 2:53 pm, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:
On 18 Feb, 09:46, Duracell Bunny wrote:



myheadisonbackwards wrote:
On 17 Feb, 18:32, "myheadisonbackwards" nonlinearman-
wrote:
Hi everyone.

Last year, I made a ceiling, after loads of great advice from people
on this group.
Then I had it plastered, then painted it, now looks lovely.

Some months passed, and then I realised I should not leave the light
fittings
dangling forever, and I should screw them to the ceiling. But I cannot
find the wood to screw them to!

The problem is that the plasterboard is below Kingspan insulation, and
this insulation is below the woodwork. Kingspan is faced with metal
foil.
This metal foil interferes with my stud-detector. And I cannot find
lines
of screws with a metal detector, because it just detects the foil.
Here is
a word-picture of the layers:

Roof
Void
Woodwork
Kingspan
Plasterboard
Plaster
Paint

Of course, I know roughly where the joists and noggins are, because
the lighting cables come down from where I attached them - but I do
not know well enough to start drilling.

The only thing I can think of is to start drilling small holes until I
find
the right place, then patch up the test holes that missed the woodwork
when I have finished. Not ideal.

Is there a better way?

Thanks,
David P.

Thanks everyone, for your advice yesterday.

I think plasterboard fixings are the best way to do this.
I had thought of this already, but had a weird mental
block on it for some reason - like this was giving up,
and I should stick with my original method. Daft of
course, and plasterboard fixings it is.

As for the magnet idea - I cannot find one at the moment,
but I tried moving a compass around close to the ceiling,
and the needle did deflect as I did so. But not strongly
enough to identify the position of anything.

Thanks again,
David P.

Did you try the low-tech method of sounding it out with a hammer or any solid
object? The sound will change when you hit (gently of course) over a joist.

--
Karen

Yes, thanks Karen.

Unfortunately, the thick layer of insulation sort of acoustically
disconnects the joints from the plasterboard.

Poke up something exactly where you want the fittings to hang. Remove
what light fittings you have placed on the wires.

Take some timber, some gripfill and a saw with you. Squares of 3/4 ply
with an hole pre-drilled in each, will do. Climb into the void and
drill holes in the ceiling where your markers popped through.

Pop a square of ply over each hole and feed the wire back down that.
Make sure the glue has adhered to both surfaces, if not apply more to
the surface that failed and replace ply.

When the glue has set, the patresses will now be ready to accept
screws for the light fittings.

It would have been better to put the noggins in situ to take these
fittings before you started closing the ceiling. Next time check
further afield for the right advice.

Or remember to include the detail in the original post. But I suppose
had you remembered to ask, you would not have needed the advice in the
first place.

On Feb 18, 4:31 pm, "Weatherlawyer" wrote:

[ ... snip ... ]
Or remember to include the detail in the original post. But I suppose
had you remembered to ask, you would not have needed the advice in the
first place

Absolutely right. Lack of experience led me to mess this up, and if
I ever do it again I will not make this mistake (unless I forget).

Anyway, I have fixed it now. Plastic wall plugs with caulk down the
holes are strong enough for these lightweight lights.

Thanks everyone,
David P.