There is an interesting article in the current British Medical Journal on
lead poisoning.

A couple were renovating their 100-year old house. Renovations included
burning off old lead-based paints.

Both of the household cats were, eventually, diagnosed with lead
poisoning. One of the cats died. Domestic pets are very likely to be
poisoned during renovations of this type because of their tendency to
lick their fur and ingest harmful toxins.

The female half of the couple was pregnant at the time, and tests showed
the amount of lead in her blood was far in excess on what is considered
safe and normal. She required treatment to reduce the lead
concentrations in her blood and that of the foetus. She gave birth
successfully and with no apparent harm to her child.

We have all been warned !

Terry W

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 12:26:03 GMT, "Terry W."
wrote:

|There is an interesting article in the current British Medical Journal on
|lead poisoning.
|
|A couple were renovating their 100-year old house. Renovations included
|burning off old lead-based paints.
|
|Both of the household cats were, eventually, diagnosed with lead
|poisoning. One of the cats died. Domestic pets are very likely to be
|poisoned during renovations of this type because of their tendency to
|lick their fur and ingest harmful toxins.
|
|The female half of the couple was pregnant at the time, and tests showed
|the amount of lead in her blood was far in excess on what is considered
|safe and normal. She required treatment to reduce the lead
|concentrations in her blood and that of the foetus. She gave birth
|successfully and with no apparent harm to her child.
|
|We have all been warned !

Again modern Health and Safety rules transferred back into past ages.
I and many others lived when all paints were lead based, and myself picked
flaking lead based paint off wood. At the time people did not show
symptoms of lead poisoning. No doubt at the time, "the lead
concentrations in my blood" would have been "far in excess on what is *NOW*
considered safe and normal" but not tests were ever done.
--
Dave Fawthrop dave hyphenologist co uk Google Groups is IME the *worst*
method of accessing usenet. GG subscribers would be well advised get a
newsreader, say Agent, and a newsserver, say news.individual.net. These
will allow them: to see only *new* posts, a killfile, and other goodies.

snipped load of tosh
We have all been warned !

Terry W

I have been using lead based solder for over 30 years every day at work.
Have blood tests every 2 months for a blood disorder and no problems shown
up yet. I am still alive and kicking. Some things need that pinch of salt.

Dave

gort wrote in :

snipped load of tosh
We have all been warned !

Terry W

I have been using lead based solder for over 30 years every day at
work. Have blood tests every 2 months for a blood disorder and no
problems shown up yet. I am still alive and kicking. Some things need
that pinch of salt.

Dave



To describe a properly conducted medical trial, vetted by other experts
in the field, as a "load of tosh" shows an appalling lack of awareness
and intelligence.

YOU may not have any effects "using lead based solder" but the animals
and human involved in this study DID show an effect - severe lead
poisoning. Neither the trial, nor my posting, implied that all or
anyone who comes into contact with lead-based products will suffer harm.

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and idiotic
conmments.

Terry W

Dave Fawthrop wrote in
:


Again modern Health and Safety rules transferred back into past ages.
I and many others lived when all paints were lead based, and myself
picked flaking lead based paint off wood. At the time people did
not show symptoms of lead poisoning. No doubt at the time, "the
lead concentrations in my blood" would have been "far in excess on
what is *NOW* considered safe and normal" but not tests were ever
done.

According to research correctly carried out, you possibly/probably DID
show symptons of lead poisoning and may even, possibly, still be
suffering the effects - to a greater or lesser degree.

It was this research that informed the ban on lead-based paints etc. It
proved quite categorically that ingestion of lead was harmful to humans
and animals. I cannot find the original research papers, but seem to
remember that a) no in-depth study was done on the levels needed to cause
*permanent* harm and b) it was found that the younger the human subject,
the greater the damage caused.

My original post was intended to educate and/or inform members of the
group about the probable dangers in renovating old buildings. I am not
a medical scientist.

Terry W.

"Terry W."

SNIP

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and
idiotic
conmments.

Terry W

Well you came to the wrong place then didn't you G

AWEM

To describe a properly conducted medical trial, vetted by other experts
in the field, as a "load of tosh" shows an appalling lack of awareness
and intelligence.

YOU may not have any effects "using lead based solder" but the animals
and human involved in this study DID show an effect - severe lead
poisoning. Neither the trial, nor my posting, implied that all or
anyone who comes into contact with lead-based products will suffer harm.

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and idiotic
conmments.

Terry W

Grow up

Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Terry W."

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and
idiotic
conmments.

Well you came to the wrong place then didn't you G

maybe so.

Do you have more info on this study Terry? Different methods of removal
may make a fair difference.


NT

gort wrote in :


To describe a properly conducted medical trial, vetted by other
experts
in the field, as a "load of tosh" shows an appalling lack of awareness
and intelligence.

YOU may not have any effects "using lead based solder" but the animals
and human involved in this study DID show an effect - severe lead
poisoning. Neither the trial, nor my posting, implied that all or
anyone who comes into contact with lead-based products will suffer
harm.

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and
idiotic
conmments.

Terry W

Grow up



One of the effects of lead poisoning is distubance to the brain.

Going by the intelligence levels of your replies, perhaps you ARE
suffering the effects of lead poisoning.

My advice is that you get treatment AND give up your job :-)

Terry W

Dave Fawthrop wrote:

Again modern Health and Safety rules transferred back into past ages.

No doubt we should also have no truck with these modern notions of
antisepsis and drinking water treatment either.

I and many others lived when all paints were lead based, and myself picked
flaking lead based paint off wood. At the time people did not show
symptoms of lead poisoning.

Only because the rickets, cholera and King's Evil carried them off
first.

Are you suggesting that we should go back to having a healthy dose of
lead in the diet, because back then it was safe to leave your front
doors open and the sun hadn't yet set on the Empire ?

wrote in news:1167403968.702026.167400
@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Terry W."

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and
idiotic
conmments.

Well you came to the wrong place then didn't you G

maybe so.

Do you have more info on this study Terry? Different methods of removal
may make a fair difference.


NT

Sorry, no discussion of types of removal took place.

It was a Case Report on the effects of lead poisoning on animals and a
pregnant human.

It can be found at:
http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/short/333/7582/1302?etoc

Terry W.

One of the effects of lead poisoning is distubance to the brain.

Going by the intelligence levels of your replies, perhaps you ARE
suffering the effects of lead poisoning.

My advice is that you get treatment AND give up your job :-)

Terry W

BTW remember that the trials of Thalidomide were vetted by medical experts.

gort wrote:

I have been using lead based solder for over 30 years every day at work.
Have blood tests every 2 months for a blood disorder and no problems shown
up yet. I am still alive and kicking. Some things need that pinch of salt.

Yup, and I have lead flashing on my roof for years, and it has not
harmed me either...

Not really comparing like with like though is it?

Perhaps if you ground your solder down to a powder, atomised it into the
air, and then had a good lung full on a regular basis you may find you
get different results.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:03:32 +0000, gort wrote:


One of the effects of lead poisoning is distubance to the brain.

Going by the intelligence levels of your replies, perhaps you ARE
suffering the effects of lead poisoning.

My advice is that you get treatment AND give up your job :-)

Terry W

BTW remember that the trials of Thalidomide were vetted by medical experts.

Dishonest ones, who selected against unfavourable results.

DG

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 13:59:30 GMT, "Terry W."
wrote:

YOU may not have any effects "using lead based solder" but the animals
and human involved in this study DID show an effect

Getting a beagle to smoke a 20 pack of Marlboro is easier than getting
a hamster to use a soldering iron.


--

On 29 Dec 2006 06:52:48 -0800, wrote:



Do you have more info on this study Terry? Different methods of removal
may make a fair difference.

http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PUBS/5055.html

:-(

DG

Terry W. wrote:
There is an interesting article in the current British Medical
Journal on lead poisoning.

A couple were renovating their 100-year old house. Renovations
included burning off old lead-based paints.

Both of the household cats were, eventually, diagnosed with lead
poisoning. One of the cats died. Domestic pets are very likely
to be poisoned during renovations of this type because of their
tendency to lick their fur and ingest harmful toxins.

The female half of the couple was pregnant at the time, and tests
showed the amount of lead in her blood was far in excess on what is
considered safe and normal. She required treatment to reduce the
lead concentrations in her blood and that of the foetus. She gave
birth successfully and with no apparent harm to her child.

We have all been warned !

Terry W

My dad was a painter from leaving school in 1940, he and his colleagues had
to have their fingernails checked monthly, anyone who shown signs that they
were nailbiters were sacked on the spot! - the thing is with lead poisoning
is that it's cumulative...tiny amounts can enter the body without any kind
of symptoms, but they build up over a period of time into something very
dangerous indeed...lead poisoning damages the brain and kidneys, it can
cause abdominal pain, constipation, vomitting and anaemia, it also causes
reproductive problems in men.

"Terry W." typed


To describe a properly conducted medical trial, vetted by other experts
in the field, as a "load of tosh" shows an appalling lack of awareness
and intelligence.

YOU may not have any effects "using lead based solder" but the animals
and human involved in this study DID show an effect - severe lead
poisoning. Neither the trial, nor my posting, implied that all or
anyone who comes into contact with lead-based products will suffer harm.

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and idiotic
conmments.

Umm...

I've not read that much of the current BMJ, which is the Christmas/New
Year Bumper Edition, packed with entertaining anecdotes and various
people's musings. I don't thik 'proper clinical trials' feature.

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 12:26:03 GMT, "Terry W."
wrote:

There is an interesting article in the current British Medical Journal on
lead poisoning.

A couple were renovating their 100-year old house. Renovations included
burning off old lead-based paints.

Both of the household cats were, eventually, diagnosed with lead
poisoning. One of the cats died. Domestic pets are very likely to be
poisoned during renovations of this type because of their tendency to
lick their fur and ingest harmful toxins.

The female half of the couple was pregnant at the time, and tests showed
the amount of lead in her blood was far in excess on what is considered
safe and normal. She required treatment to reduce the lead
concentrations in her blood and that of the foetus. She gave birth
successfully and with no apparent harm to her child.

We have all been warned !

Just as an aside...

I wonder how much lead ingestion came from the paint fumes - and how
much from dust.
Many old houses were painted with a very dense primer/undercoat -
which I presume would also have contained lead.
This stuff ( whatever it is ) doesn't come off that well with a heat
gun - it tends to need so much heat that the wood scorches, and when
it does eventually melt enough to be shifted it very rapidly cools and
sets. It can't be sanded - it'll clog a disc in a matter of seconds.
It's very brittle, however, and can be scraped off ( with enough
effing and blinding ), and in the process sheds a large quantity of
dust.

Regards,



--
Stephen Howard - Woodwind repairs & period restorations
www.shwoodwind.co.uk
Emails to: showard{whoisat}shwoodwind{dot}co{dot}uk

On 29 Dec 2006 15:56:15 GMT, Huge wrote:

On 2006-12-29, Derek Geldard wrote:

BTW remember that the trials of Thalidomide were vetted by medical experts.

Dishonest ones, who selected against unfavourable results.

Can I suggest that both of you do some reading?

OK.

Neither statement is true.

Be fair, the posting was in uk.d-i-y on the topic of the safe removal
of lead bearing paint ! For that purpose it was accurate enough IMO,
even if unbalanced in the face of conflicting opinions.

The trouble for a layman reading this topic up nowadays is the amount
of single interest group propaganda (mostly anti vivisectionist) out
there. In any event it is always difficult to differentiate between
conspiracies and cock-ups.

Having checked, I accept that nowadays the conventional wisdom is that
the Thalidomide disaster was as a result of a cock-up. They marketed a
drug for the treatment of Morning Sickness in Pregnancy and didn't
test it on pregnant animals. What is more, the regulatory agency
(whoever it was at the time) failed to protect the public from this.
This seems scarcely credible from today's perspective and feeds the
conspiracy theories.

OTOH A report I read (can't find it now, conspiracy theorists, no
doubt) said they tested it and discarded unfavourable results.

The anti-vivisectionists say that even if they had tested it on
pregnant animals then it wouldn't have revealed any hazard.

I note from my reading that the FDA never allowed Thalidomide to be
prescribed in the USA because they were not satisfied with the rigor
of the testing in Europe.

All that said, I'm sure you wouldn't want to let any of this give
succour to people who say that Lead may not be toxic because medical
testing is not reliable.

And finally, I'd just add that my cousin had a baby sometime around
1961 which was stillborn with deformed limbs, she had been taking
Thalidomide. The midwife said they (at the maternity hospital)
couldn't understand what was happening, they had been "overwhelmed"
with babies with deformed limbs over the previous fortnight,
presumably when all the involved pregnancies started to come to term.

DG

In article ,
gort writes:
Grow up

Talking of which, I came across a couple of interesting cases.

One was a child, who eat a couple of lead soldiers. For that
short time, his body was probably way over any permitted lead
dosage, but it passed without anything notable at the time
AFAIK. It came to light a number of years later when he was
xrayed. There were no lead soldiers visible, but the excess
lead was depositied in his growing bones at the growth plates.
The bones continued growing normally afterwards, but xrays
showed an opaque plate a certain distance back from the ends
in each bone at what had been the tips of the bones (growth
plates) at the time he eat the soldiers. As such, it was a
good demonstration of how bones grow.

The second case was that of someone who was shot but not
killed. Bullets are often not removed when they are not in
a position to do physical harm. The body detects an alien
object and grows a covering round it to protect the body,
which is normally very effective. One place where this
turned out not to work was a bullet which is near a bone
joint. The synovial fluid turns out to be a good solvent
for lead, allowing it to disperse continuously throughout
the body and cause slow lead poisening.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Re - lead poisoning - how about mercury? when I was a kid in the fifties my
dad and uncle were elctrical type guys who cobbled together all sorts of
gadgets that actually worked. I used to love playing with the mercury -
rolling it about on the floor - watching the globules all find themselves
and join together. I would push it all together with my fingers and
eventually get it back in the jar.
I became an Electrical Engineer and in 1971 sold a mercury switch these guys
had made to a factory which was shut down for lack of one. By then mercury
was banned. I got £100 for the switch - I still have one.
I am still here and have probably been exposed to this stuff more than
most - but I have no problems - ha ha ha he he he he.

Health and Safety and experts all gone way over the top (in pursuit of money
of course) ha ha ha

"Stephen Howard" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 12:26:03 GMT, "Terry W."
wrote:

There is an interesting article in the current British Medical Journal on
lead poisoning.

A couple were renovating their 100-year old house. Renovations included
burning off old lead-based paints.

Both of the household cats were, eventually, diagnosed with lead
poisoning. One of the cats died. Domestic pets are very likely to be
poisoned during renovations of this type because of their tendency to
lick their fur and ingest harmful toxins.

The female half of the couple was pregnant at the time, and tests showed
the amount of lead in her blood was far in excess on what is considered
safe and normal. She required treatment to reduce the lead
concentrations in her blood and that of the foetus. She gave birth
successfully and with no apparent harm to her child.

We have all been warned !

Just as an aside...

I wonder how much lead ingestion came from the paint fumes - and how
much from dust.
Many old houses were painted with a very dense primer/undercoat -
which I presume would also have contained lead.
This stuff ( whatever it is ) doesn't come off that well with a heat
gun - it tends to need so much heat that the wood scorches, and when
it does eventually melt enough to be shifted it very rapidly cools and
sets. It can't be sanded - it'll clog a disc in a matter of seconds.
It's very brittle, however, and can be scraped off ( with enough
effing and blinding ), and in the process sheds a large quantity of
dust.

Regards,



--
Stephen Howard - Woodwind repairs & period restorations
www.shwoodwind.co.uk
Emails to: showard{whoisat}shwoodwind{dot}co{dot}uk

"Denn013" wrote in message
...
Re - lead poisoning - how about mercury? when I was a kid in the fifties
my dad and uncle were elctrical type guys who cobbled together all sorts
of gadgets that actually worked. I used to love playing with the mercury -
rolling it about on the floor - watching the globules all find themselves
and join together. I would push it all together with my fingers and
eventually get it back in the jar.
I became an Electrical Engineer and in 1971 sold a mercury switch these
guys had made to a factory which was shut down for lack of one. By then
mercury was banned. I got £100 for the switch - I still have one.
I am still here and have probably been exposed to this stuff more than
most - but I have no problems - ha ha ha he he he he.

Health and Safety and experts all gone way over the top (in pursuit of
money of course) ha ha ha

Try burning the stuff and breathing in the vapours and you might feel
different.
Or maybe a nice organic compound?

"dennis@home" wrote in message
...

"Denn013" wrote in message
...
Re - lead poisoning - how about mercury? when I was a kid in the fifties
my dad and uncle were elctrical type guys who cobbled together all sorts
of gadgets that actually worked. I used to love playing with the
mercury -
rolling it about on the floor - watching the globules all find
themselves
and join together. I would push it all together with my fingers and
eventually get it back in the jar.
I became an Electrical Engineer and in 1971 sold a mercury switch these
guys had made to a factory which was shut down for lack of one. By then
mercury was banned. I got £100 for the switch - I still have one.
I am still here and have probably been exposed to this stuff more than
most - but I have no problems - ha ha ha he he he he.

Health and Safety and experts all gone way over the top (in pursuit of
money of course) ha ha ha

Try burning the stuff and breathing in the vapours and you might feel
different.
Or maybe a nice organic compound?

Google for Minamata Bay for a nice (?) example.

Metallic Hg is relatively benign as it is not absorbed that well from the
gut, make it more lipophillic by adding a methyl group (CH3) and it can
cross lipid membranes like the blood-brain barrier. At this point it is
metabolised back to Hg and so cannot cross out of the brain and so it
accumulates causing toxicity to the CNS.

Cheers

Mark (the ex-toxicologist)

Terry W. wrote:
wrote in news:1167403968.702026.167400
@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Terry W."


Do you have more info on this study Terry? Different methods of removal
may make a fair difference.

Sorry, no discussion of types of removal took place.

It was a Case Report on the effects of lead poisoning on animals and a
pregnant human.

It can be found at:
http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/short/333/7582/1302?etoc

Terry W.

thanks for the link. Removal was using a hot air gun, which is an
inappropriate method for removal of lead and arsenic bearing paints.
Removal using gel creates larger particles and traps them in the gel
instead of creating fine particles and blowing them round the place, as
a hot air gun does.


NT

Derek Geldard wrote:
On 29 Dec 2006 06:52:48 -0800, wrote:

Do you have more info on this study Terry? Different methods of removal
may make a fair difference.

http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PUBS/5055.html

:-(

DG

I cant help but wonder when someone claims a job thats perfectly
diyable must only be done by a professional. No evidence of risk of gel
stripper removal of lead paint was presented, and it is hard to see how
the precautions recommended would be appropriate for any appropriate
removal method, ie gel paint stripper.


NT

Terry W. wrote:
wrote in news:1167403968.702026.167400
@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

Andrew Mawson wrote:
"Terry W."

My post was meant to inform and educate - not to draw biased and
idiotic
conmments.

Well you came to the wrong place then didn't you G

maybe so.

Any comparison with medical practices then and now was inviting silly
comment to go with your OP.

Anyone working in a factory anywhere in the UK, was liable to any
amount of serious illness all unexplained by the death certificate.
These days the opposite is true with anyone entering hospital likely to
get dead for their cure.

Why do you think that the cotton industry moved to India after
centuries of employing western Europeans at the huge rate disparity
between Asian and European pay rates?

All of a sudden people were getting the idea that there was a
conspiracy in the industry about the numbers of deaths due to cotton
dust in the factories. And overnight the factories "couldn't compete".

A recent report has been released in the Stoke on Trent area, showing
that after decades of being the most dangerous place to have children,
other hospitals in the country have caught them up.

(The incidence of mentally damaged people here outnumber those of any
other place I have been, all due to techniques used in maternity units
here.)

"Denn013" wrote in message
...
Re - lead poisoning - how about mercury? when I was a kid in the fifties
my dad and uncle were elctrical type guys who cobbled together all sorts
of gadgets that actually worked. I used to love playing with the mercury -
rolling it about on the floor - watching the globules all find themselves
and join together. I would push it all together with my fingers and
eventually get it back in the jar.
I became an Electrical Engineer and in 1971 sold a mercury switch these
guys had made to a factory which was shut down for lack of one. By then
mercury was banned. I got £100 for the switch - I still have one.
I am still here and have probably been exposed to this stuff more than
most - but I have no problems - ha ha ha he he he he.

Health and Safety and experts all gone way over the top (in pursuit of
money of course) ha ha ha

"
Mercury poisoning has been shown to cause severe top-posting in test
subjects ;-)

H

John Rumm wrote:
gort wrote:

I have been using lead based solder for over 30 years every day at
work. Have blood tests every 2 months for a blood disorder and no
problems shown up yet. I am still alive and kicking. Some things
need that pinch of salt.

Yup, and I have lead flashing on my roof for years, and it has not
harmed me either...

Lead flashing? I'll send the local pikeys round :-)

I don't suppose they care about H&S when nicking it!


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes

The second case was that of someone who was shot but not
killed. Bullets are often not removed when they are not in
a position to do physical harm. The body detects an alien
object and grows a covering round it to protect the body,
which is normally very effective. One place where this
turned out not to work was a bullet which is near a bone
joint. The synovial fluid turns out to be a good solvent
for lead, allowing it to disperse continuously throughout
the body and cause slow lead poisening.

What does Zinc do to you?

Perfect ventilation is not really practical welding large work pieces,
farm gates etc. I was angle grinding the corners off some galvanised
brackets today and watched the Zinc fume off with a purple flame.

regards


--
Tim Lamb

"Tim Lamb" wrote in message
...
In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes

The second case was that of someone who was shot but not
killed. Bullets are often not removed when they are not in
a position to do physical harm. The body detects an alien
object and grows a covering round it to protect the body,
which is normally very effective. One place where this
turned out not to work was a bullet which is near a bone
joint. The synovial fluid turns out to be a good solvent
for lead, allowing it to disperse continuously throughout
the body and cause slow lead poisening.

What does Zinc do to you?

Perfect ventilation is not really practical welding large work pieces,
farm gates etc. I was angle grinding the corners off some galvanised
brackets today and watched the Zinc fume off with a purple flame.

regards


--
Tim Lamb

There appears to be a dose response relationship with inhaled ultrafine
zinc-oxide powder (at least in guinea pigs) - this leads to increased airway
resistance and decreased volume. This experiment was looking at acute doses
(dosed for a week). (1)

"The type of lung disease caused by metal compounds depends on the nature
of the offending agent, its physicochemical form, the dose, exposure
conditions and host factors. The fumes or gaseous forms of several metals,
e.g. cadmium (Cd), manganese (Mn), mercury (Hg), nickel carbonyl (Nl(CO)4,
zinc chloride (ZnCl2), vanadium pentoxide (V2O5), may lead to acute chemical
pneumonitis and pulmonary oedema or to acute tracheobronchitis. Metal fume
fever, which may follow the inhalation of metal fumes e.g. zinc (Zn), copper
(Cu) and many others, is a poorly understood influenza-like reaction,
accompanied by an acute self-limiting neutrophil alveolitis." (2)

The short answer would appear to be that you may get flu-like symptoms from
inhaling too much Zn dust. However overall Zn appears to be relatively
benign compared to the heavy metals like Pb and Hg. I'd suggest using a mask
and/or ventilation where practical.

Cheers

Mark

(1) Pulmonary function of guinea pigs exposed to freshly generated
ultrafine zinc oxide with and without spike concentrations. Lam HF et al.
American Industrial Hygeine Association Journal 1988

(2) Metal toxicity and the respiratory tract. Nemery B. The European
Resipirtory Journal 1990

In message , Tim Lamb
writes
In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes

The second case was that of someone who was shot but not
killed. Bullets are often not removed when they are not in
a position to do physical harm. The body detects an alien
object and grows a covering round it to protect the body,
which is normally very effective. One place where this
turned out not to work was a bullet which is near a bone
joint. The synovial fluid turns out to be a good solvent
for lead, allowing it to disperse continuously throughout
the body and cause slow lead poisening.

What does Zinc do to you?

Keeps your pecker up ...


Perfect ventilation is not really practical welding large work pieces,
farm gates etc. I was angle grinding the corners off some galvanised
brackets today and watched the Zinc fume off with a purple flame.

Not so good


--
geoff

Tim Lamb wrote:


What does Zinc do to you?

Perfect ventilation is not really practical welding large work pieces,
farm gates etc. I was angle grinding the corners off some galvanised
brackets today and watched the Zinc fume off with a purple flame.

No idea Tim - but you probably won't ever go rusty :-)


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

In message , AJH
writes
On Sat, 30 Dec 2006 19:53:51 +0000, Tim Lamb
wrote:

I was angle grinding the corners off some galvanised
brackets today and watched the Zinc fume off with a purple flame.

Zinc oxide fumes are a cumulative poison. In small doses the effect is
headaches and flu like symptoms. Do a google on welder's fume fever.
http://www.osha.gov/doc/outreachtrai.../weldhlth.html is a
high hit.

Easily overdone even working outdoor.

That explains Monday mornings:-)

Current weather makes outdoor work a pain anyway.

I have fitted the barn trusses using my patent fork lift extension and
am currently dodging between fitting purlins and pre-painting feather
edge boarding as showers permit.

regards
--
Tim Lamb

In message , Mark Spice
writes

There appears to be a dose response relationship with inhaled ultrafine
zinc-oxide powder (at least in guinea pigs) - this leads to increased airway
resistance and decreased volume. This experiment was looking at acute doses
(dosed for a week). (1)

"The type of lung disease caused by metal compounds depends on the nature
of the offending agent, its physicochemical form, the dose, exposure
conditions and host factors. The fumes or gaseous forms of several metals,
e.g. cadmium (Cd), manganese (Mn), mercury (Hg), nickel carbonyl (Nl(CO)4,
zinc chloride (ZnCl2), vanadium pentoxide (V2O5), may lead to acute chemical
pneumonitis and pulmonary oedema or to acute tracheobronchitis. Metal fume
fever, which may follow the inhalation of metal fumes e.g. zinc (Zn), copper
(Cu) and many others, is a poorly understood influenza-like reaction,
accompanied by an acute self-limiting neutrophil alveolitis." (2)

The short answer would appear to be that you may get flu-like symptoms from
inhaling too much Zn dust. However overall Zn appears to be relatively
benign compared to the heavy metals like Pb and Hg. I'd suggest using a mask
and/or ventilation where practical.

I certainly recognise the headache/flue symptoms following this sort of
work. Rust dust also gives a rapid headache but responds to a simple
filter mask.

Fumes from galvanised material tend to be vapour so presumably need
something more sophisticated and hence bulky. Gas welding wearing
reading glasses is an acquired skill:-(

regards

--
Tim Lamb

In article ,
Tim Lamb writes:

That explains Monday mornings:-)

Current weather makes outdoor work a pain anyway.

I have fitted the barn trusses using my patent fork lift extension and

What, a bit like this?
http://www.systems4business.co.nz/im...3/htrucksl.jpg

am currently dodging between fitting purlins and pre-painting feather
edge boarding as showers permit.

--
Andrew Gabriel