A 6 month old combi boilered system, plumbed in mainly plastic pipe.

About two months ago I got a problem with the hot water (DHW) not
flowing hot enough.

I called the boiler engineer (under warranty) who said that the heat
exchanger was blocked with metal flakes that must have come from the
inside of the radiators.

He said it was rare but there was no other explanation. Therefore not
a warranty repair, but he cleaned out the muck from the fine-finned
DHW heat exchanger in return for some beer money and all was well for
a while.

It's happened again now and I've cleaned out the gunk myself.

My call to the merchant who supplied the whole package has resulted in
a request for a sample, which I will be taking in tomorrow. Not an
unreasonable request I guess.

I'm just seeking anyone's advice who might have come across this
problem before. What causes it? I cannot think of anything other
than the rads, since nothing else is iron(magnetic).

Is there an easy solution? A plumber friend suggested fitting a
Magnatec inline filter to trap the flakes but I then wonder how long
the rads will last if they are cheapos or a bad batch that are
disintegrating from the inside. Equally, the idea of swapping them
all out is not too appealing either. And that's assuming that the
merchant is willing to do that.

Are there any arguements the merchant could use to try to avoid
dealing with the issue? I know they are unlikely to pay for a plumber
to swap out the rads, but it would be nice to know I was on firm
ground about insisting on replacements.

FYI, all the treatments (cleanser/inhibitor etc) were by the book.

Help!

Thanks as always.
Rob

In message , Kalico
writes
A 6 month old combi boilered system, plumbed in mainly plastic pipe.

About two months ago I got a problem with the hot water (DHW) not
flowing hot enough.

I called the boiler engineer (under warranty) who said that the heat
exchanger was blocked with metal flakes that must have come from the
inside of the radiators.

Is it a complete new system or just a new boiler (sorry, I might have
cut too much of your post)

If a complete install, then the responsibility lies with the installer,
since this is who you have a contract with

unless you bought the bits yourself

otherwise, the installer should have cleared out the system, so again,
prolly his responsibility
--
geoff

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 23:41:30 GMT, raden wrote:

Is it a complete new system or just a new boiler (sorry, I might have
cut too much of your post)

If a complete install, then the responsibility lies with the installer,
since this is who you have a contract with

unless you bought the bits yourself

otherwise, the installer should have cleared out the system, so again,
prolly his responsibility

Completely new system, boiler, rads and all. There was no GCH before.

I did it all myself excpet for boiler fix. It's not rocket science.
Done about half a dozen now and never had this problem but then I've
never bought from this merchant before!

Cheers
Rob

If it's a combi, aren't the heating and DHW sides separate?
How does the internal state of the CH system affect the DHW side of the
boiler heat exchanger?
Sorry if this doesn't answer or clarify the original question.

I have the same issue of "magnetite" (as a visiting plumber called it).
Looks a bit like fine(ish) coal fragments.
My system is 20 years old though and has suffered pump over problems etc.
It is not clear from the OP whether the CH side of his system is sealed or
open.

Phil

"Kalico" wrote in message
...
A 6 month old combi boilered system, plumbed in mainly plastic pipe.

About two months ago I got a problem with the hot water (DHW) not
flowing hot enough.

I called the boiler engineer (under warranty) who said that the heat
exchanger was blocked with metal flakes that must have come from the
inside of the radiators.

He said it was rare but there was no other explanation. Therefore not
a warranty repair, but he cleaned out the muck from the fine-finned
DHW heat exchanger in return for some beer money and all was well for
a while.

It's happened again now and I've cleaned out the gunk myself.

My call to the merchant who supplied the whole package has resulted in
a request for a sample, which I will be taking in tomorrow. Not an
unreasonable request I guess.

I'm just seeking anyone's advice who might have come across this
problem before. What causes it? I cannot think of anything other
than the rads, since nothing else is iron(magnetic).

Is there an easy solution? A plumber friend suggested fitting a
Magnatec inline filter to trap the flakes but I then wonder how long
the rads will last if they are cheapos or a bad batch that are
disintegrating from the inside. Equally, the idea of swapping them
all out is not too appealing either. And that's assuming that the
merchant is willing to do that.

Are there any arguements the merchant could use to try to avoid
dealing with the issue? I know they are unlikely to pay for a plumber
to swap out the rads, but it would be nice to know I was on firm
ground about insisting on replacements.

FYI, all the treatments (cleanser/inhibitor etc) were by the book.

Help!

Thanks as always.
Rob

Installing the Magnaclean is a very idea. Firstly it will protect the
boiler for the rad problems you have. Once sorted it will them protect the
boiler and system for sludge. They are pretty essential in at least boiler
changes.

"TheScullster" wrote in message
...
If it's a combi, aren't the heating and DHW sides separate?
How does the internal state of the CH system affect the DHW side of the
boiler heat exchanger?
Sorry if this doesn't answer or clarify the original question.

I have the same issue of "magnetite" (as a visiting plumber called it).
Looks a bit like fine(ish) coal fragments.
My system is 20 years old though and has suffered pump over problems etc.
It is not clear from the OP whether the CH side of his system is sealed or
open.

Fit a Magnaclean or the Fernox version on the return top the boiler. That
will get rid of it.

"Doctor Drivel" wrote

Fit a Magnaclean or the Fernox version on the return top the boiler. That
will get rid of it.

Thanks Doc

Have you fitted one and seen the results?
Opinion on this group power flushing suggests it is not worth
considering.
I was looking at power flushing then fitting this Magnaclean thingy to
protect the investment of a new boiler.
Any thoughts?

Phil

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 11:29:33 +0100, "TheScullster"
wrote:

If it's a combi, aren't the heating and DHW sides separate?
How does the internal state of the CH system affect the DHW side of the
boiler heat exchanger?
[snip]
Yes the CH and DHW sides are seperate but the water that is
circulating around the rads (and is therefore nice and hot) is
diverted through an exchanger which has the DHW flowing through it.
This then heats the hot water to the tap quickly.

Obviously, if the flakes are blocking the flow of water through the
rads side of the heat exchanger, then there is not as great a transfer
of heat to the DHW.

Hope I have explained that clearly.
Rob

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 11:35:48 +0100, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:
Fit a Magnaclean or the Fernox version on the return top the boiler. That
will get rid of it.

I think this may be my first port of call and what the merchant may
offer me (for free hopefully).

However, my concern is that the rads could be (for whatever reason)
distintergrating from the inside.

Rob

Im sure others would agree here that a magnaclean
is a sympton preventer rather than a cure especially
considering the price.

I was thinking of getting one but then decided not to.
Im just going to keep the system topped up with inhibitor
and maybe occasional flushing of the rads.

Matthew

"TheScullster" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote

Fit a Magnaclean or the Fernox version on the return to the boiler. That
will get rid of it.

Thanks Doc

Have you fitted one and seen the results?

Yep. Impressive.

Opinion on this group power flushing suggests it is not worth
considering.
I was looking at power flushing then fitting this Magnaclean thingy to
protect the investment of a new boiler.
Any thoughts?

Put "Fernox" desludger in the system, for as long as possible before the old
boiler is ripped out. Also fit the Magnaclean filter on the old boiler
return, to get out as much crap as possible before the new boiler goes in.
It can be in a temporary location on the pipework. Flush many times. Change
boiler, fix Magnaclean in a suitable position on the new boiler/system,
flush, insert inhibitor. Best run the pump without the burner on, then
empty the filter after 2 hours. The amount of crap it catches is
impressive. Then empty the filter after the first day of normal burner-on
operation, then each week until clean and then once a year at boiler service
time. A DIY job to clean the filter. Don't have an expensive powerflush.

Inserting desludger and flushes means a few visits and lots of time.
Contractors don't want this, that is why they push a one time, very
expensive powerflush, which can bring on leaks.

"Matthew" wrote in message
oups.com...
Im sure others would agree here that a magnaclean
is a sympton preventer rather than a cure especially
considering the price.

I was thinking of getting one but then decided not to.
Im just going to keep the system topped up with inhibitor
and maybe occasional flushing of the rads.

You are right. A properly cleaned and flushed system, with inhibitor added
every 4 years will be fine all its life. However with a sludged up existing
system the Magnaclean is the best way, and if the inhibitor is not topped up
the Magnaclean gathers the crud. It also grabs non-magnetic particles too.

In message , Kalico
writes
On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 23:41:30 GMT, raden wrote:

Is it a complete new system or just a new boiler (sorry, I might have
cut too much of your post)

If a complete install, then the responsibility lies with the installer,
since this is who you have a contract with

unless you bought the bits yourself

otherwise, the installer should have cleared out the system, so again,
prolly his responsibility

Completely new system, boiler, rads and all. There was no GCH before.

I did it all myself excpet for boiler fix. It's not rocket science.
Done about half a dozen now and never had this problem but then I've
never bought from this merchant before!

So, then you have a problem that there's no single point of
responsibility.

It's wait to see what the merchant says time then


--
geoff