Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?
--
Vass

Vass wrote:
Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
so surely would sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

Woof! (AFAIK)

"Vass" wrote
Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would
sit on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

See: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasc.../chem03364.htm

Steve S

On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 12:18:23 -0000, "Vass"
wrote:

Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

Where did you get that idea/

They are not intended to mount on the ceiling but on the wall near to
the gas appliance.

sponix

"sPoNiX" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 12:18:23 -0000, "Vass"
wrote:

Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would
sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

Where did you get that idea/

They are not intended to mount on the ceiling but on the wall near to
the gas appliance.

must have lost my presence of mind... apols..
--
Vass

"Vass" typed


Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

It's lighter than air and gases diffuse and mix fairly thoroughly anyway.

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.

Vass wrote:
Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?


CO is lighter than air.


--
Grunff

Grunff wrote:

CO is lighter than air.


--
Grunff

True, but only just. Molecular weights a

CO = 12 + 16 = 28
N2 = 14 + 14 = 28
O2 = 16 + 16 = 32

Air is (effectively) 80% N2 and 20% O2, average molecular weight 28.9.

--
LSR

On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 14:54:42 GMT, Helen Deborah Vecht
wrote:

It's lighter than air and gases diffuse and mix fairly thoroughly anyway.

I suppose it must be...otherwise it wouldn't go up chimneys/flue
pipes.

sponix

But won't all the nitrogen float to the top? LOL!!

Phil.

wrote:
Grunff wrote:

CO is lighter than air.


--
Grunff

True, but only just. Molecular weights a

CO = 12 + 16 = 28
N2 = 14 + 14 = 28
O2 = 16 + 16 = 32

Air is (effectively) 80% N2 and 20% O2, average molecular weight 28.9.

--
LSR

Phil wrote:
But won't all the nitrogen float to the top? LOL!!

Phil.

wrote:
Grunff wrote:

CO is lighter than air.


--
Grunff

True, but only just. Molecular weights a

CO = 12 + 16 = 28
N2 = 14 + 14 = 28
O2 = 16 + 16 = 32

Air is (effectively) 80% N2 and 20% O2, average molecular weight 28.9.

--
LSR

No - but for some reason your post has. Replies should be heavier than
the quoted article.

--
LSR

On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 12:18:23 +0000, Vass wrote:

Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would sit
on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

I have read through the replies... um ... not a lot of light....

CO is very much the same density as air, obviously hot CO will convect
upwards but essentially once mixed with air it stays mixed.
The N2 and O2 components of air don't separate out by themselves and
neither will CO.

CO is extremely toxic just 0.4% is fatal in minutes and even 0.1% can be
fatal with a long exposure time.

CO is produced when fuels containing Carbon have insufficient air(oxygen)
to properly burn. If any flame is yellow like a candle, be it from coal,
coke, oil, gas, paper, wax, wood or garbage then soot (carbon) and CO are
being produced.

There is really no reason to install a Carbon Monoxide detectors in the
home, but there again there is no harm. You can get simple non-electronic
orange spot cards "dark spot is danger" for much less cost and to much the
same purpose.

Open flued and flueless gas appliances, and even an open fire grate all
carry a CO poisoning risk. This risk can be brought to a safe level (i.e.
where other aspects of life are much more risky) by
1) Never blocking any vents provided for gas appliances and open fires.
2) Having the gas appliance regularly checked.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

Ed Sirett wrote:
I have read through the replies... um ... not a lot of light....

CO is very much the same density as air, obviously hot CO will convect
upwards but essentially once mixed with air it stays mixed.
The N2 and O2 components of air don't separate out by themselves and
neither will CO.

CO is extremely toxic just 0.4% is fatal in minutes and even 0.1% can be
fatal with a long exposure time.

CO is produced when fuels containing Carbon have insufficient air(oxygen)
to properly burn. If any flame is yellow like a candle, be it from coal,
coke, oil, gas, paper, wax, wood or garbage then soot (carbon) and CO are
being produced.

There is really no reason to install a Carbon Monoxide detectors in the
home, but there again there is no harm. You can get simple non-electronic
orange spot cards "dark spot is danger" for much less cost and to much the
same purpose.

Open flued and flueless gas appliances, and even an open fire grate all
carry a CO poisoning risk. This risk can be brought to a safe level (i.e.
where other aspects of life are much more risky) by
1) Never blocking any vents provided for gas appliances and open fires.
2) Having the gas appliance regularly checked.

The spot cards don't give an audible alarm. Unless you happen to notice
them, they're of limited use.
CO alarms will work if an appliance develops a fault or it's air supply
becomes unexpectedly restricted by whatever means. They are also being
used to detect fires I'm told. I would always favour a smoke alarm for
this though.
I have heard the detection ability of domestic CO alarms questioned. Of
course the questioner was a sales person for a more sophisticated
comercial variety but I do wonder how good the really cheap ones are
especially when it's so difficult for a householder to test them.
I agree that having gas appliances checked is always advisable but a CO
alarm is a valuable second defence.

John

"Vass" wrote in message
...
Carbon Monoxide poisoning

these alarms you can buy appear to hang from the ceiling
as I understand it, carbon monoxide is heavier than air so surely would
sit on the ground
i.e. bit late if the gas reaches the ceiling
am I barking mad or have a point here?

You are thinking of carbon dioxide, which is about 2.5 times heavier than
air.

Colin Bignell

(sPoNiX)typed


On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 14:54:42 GMT, Helen Deborah Vecht
wrote:

It's lighter than air and gases diffuse and mix fairly thoroughly anyway.

I suppose it must be...otherwise it wouldn't go up chimneys/flue
pipes.

sponix

No, it's heat and convection that do that.

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.

Only if you want to bottom-post.

wrote:
Phil wrote:
But won't all the nitrogen float to the top? LOL!!

Phil.

wrote:
Grunff wrote:

CO is lighter than air.


--
Grunff

True, but only just. Molecular weights a

CO = 12 + 16 = 28
N2 = 14 + 14 = 28
O2 = 16 + 16 = 32

Air is (effectively) 80% N2 and 20% O2, average molecular weight 28.9.

--
LSR

No - but for some reason your post has. Replies should be heavier than
the quoted article.

--
LSR

In article .com
John wrote:
snip
The spot cards don't give an audible alarm. Unless you happen to notice
them, they're of limited use.
CO alarms will work if an appliance develops a fault or it's air supply
becomes unexpectedly restricted by whatever means. They are also being
used to detect fires I'm told. I would always favour a smoke alarm for
this though.

I suspect that in the large majority of cases where a domestic appliance
produces dangerous amounts of CO it is as a result of prolonged and
gradual deterioration, rather than sudden failure. In this situation
the spot cards should be adequate.

Many US Cities now require CO alarms fitted in all domestic residences
and not just new build.

If you have fossil fuel appliances installed it is prudent to fit a
Kitemarked CO Alarm. There was even a case some years back where an all
electric home had a CO event caused by chemical recation in storage
heaters!