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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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'Steam' powered cars...
In Autocar this week.
BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. On the test bed they're getting a 15% saving in fuel consumption - at the same time as more power and torque. Seems it's not a new idea, but BMW reckon it is practical and should be in production within 10 years. -- *If you think nobody cares about you, try missing a couple of payments * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#2
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'Steam' powered cars...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In Autocar this week. BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. On the test bed they're getting a 15% saving in fuel consumption - at the same time as more power and torque. Seems it's not a new idea, but BMW reckon it is practical and should be in production within 10 years. When I was a nipper my old man was a tinkerer in electric motors and generators and although this is very vague he put together on a piece of wood a small cycle light generator a 12 or 24 volt motor(?) and rechargable battery connected together whereby the battery started the motor which in turn rotated the generator wheel thus fed power to the battery for charging purposes, obviously there was some electronics in between which as i said was very vague recollection -- Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite |
#3
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'Steam' powered cars...
The3rd Earl Of Derby wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In Autocar this week. BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. On the test bed they're getting a 15% saving in fuel consumption - at the same time as more power and torque. Seems it's not a new idea, but BMW reckon it is practical and should be in production within 10 years. When I was a nipper my old man was a tinkerer in electric motors and generators and although this is very vague he put together on a piece of wood a small cycle light generator a 12 or 24 volt motor(?) and rechargable battery connected together whereby the battery started the motor which in turn rotated the generator wheel thus fed power to the battery for charging purposes, obviously there was some electronics in between which as i said was very vague recollection http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion Alas, not. However, the BMW gadget suffers from none of this - car engines are quite inefficient (thermodynamically), and the exhaust temperature (at the exhaust valve) is around 700C. Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. Theoretically, about 66% of this could be recovered by a completely efficient heat engine, but in practice, even large power stations only get about 50%, and they start off a bit hotter, as well as having ready access to cooling water. 10% is probably achievable - in the long term, for maybe a recovery of 7.5%, or a gain in efficiency of 30%. This means however major additional systems such as much, much bigger radiators. |
#4
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'Steam' powered cars...
"Ian Stirling" wrote in message
... The3rd Earl Of Derby wrote: Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In Autocar this week. BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. On the test bed they're getting a 15% saving in fuel consumption - at the same time as more power and torque. Seems it's not a new idea, but BMW reckon it is practical and should be in production within 10 years. When I was a nipper my old man was a tinkerer in electric motors and generators and although this is very vague he put together on a piece of wood a small cycle light generator a 12 or 24 volt motor(?) and rechargable battery connected together whereby the battery started the motor which in turn rotated the generator wheel thus fed power to the battery for charging purposes, obviously there was some electronics in between which as i said was very vague recollection http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion Alas, not. However, the BMW gadget suffers from none of this - car engines are quite inefficient (thermodynamically), and the exhaust temperature (at the exhaust valve) is around 700C. Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. Theoretically, about 66% of this could be recovered by a completely efficient heat engine, but in practice, even large power stations only get about 50%, and they start off a bit hotter, as well as having ready access to cooling water. 10% is probably achievable - in the long term, for maybe a recovery of 7.5%, or a gain in efficiency of 30%. This means however major additional systems such as much, much bigger radiators. Best cars, maybe 18% efficiency, power stations lucky if 25%, fluidised coal bed stations can reach 33% efficiency. |
#5
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'Steam' powered cars...
Best cars, maybe 18% efficiency, power stations lucky if 25%, fluidised
coal bed stations can reach 33% efficiency. Can't remember the formulae following the Xmas lunch, but I think modern coal/oil plant is knocking on 40% and CCGT more like 50 |
#6
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 16:58:29 -0000, "Ian_m" wrote:
"Ian Stirling" wrote in message ... The3rd Earl Of Derby wrote: Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In Autocar this week. BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. On the test bed they're getting a 15% saving in fuel consumption - at the same time as more power and torque. Seems it's not a new idea, but BMW reckon it is practical and should be in production within 10 years. When I was a nipper my old man was a tinkerer in electric motors and generators and although this is very vague he put together on a piece of wood a small cycle light generator a 12 or 24 volt motor(?) and rechargable battery connected together whereby the battery started the motor which in turn rotated the generator wheel thus fed power to the battery for charging purposes, obviously there was some electronics in between which as i said was very vague recollection http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion Alas, not. However, the BMW gadget suffers from none of this - car engines are quite inefficient (thermodynamically), and the exhaust temperature (at the exhaust valve) is around 700C. Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. Theoretically, about 66% of this could be recovered by a completely efficient heat engine, but in practice, even large power stations only get about 50%, and they start off a bit hotter, as well as having ready access to cooling water. 10% is probably achievable - in the long term, for maybe a recovery of 7.5%, or a gain in efficiency of 30%. This means however major additional systems such as much, much bigger radiators. Best cars, maybe 18% efficiency, power stations lucky if 25%, fluidised coal bed stations can reach 33% efficiency. What class of power station? Coal fired steam turbine with/without passout, gas turbine, gas turbine with cogen, Low speed heavy fuel diesel engine with waste heat recovery,? There are many combinations the most efficient of which is likely the slow speed heavy oil diesel engine with waste heat recovery that will exceed 50% efficiency, however, this type of generation is not, I believe, used in the UK. Industrial gas turbine with cogen is probably a very close second, again with 50% plus efficiency. |
#7
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'Steam' powered cars...
In message , Edward W.
Thompson writes What class of power station? Coal fired steam turbine with/without passout, gas turbine, gas turbine with cogen, Low speed heavy fuel diesel engine with waste heat recovery,? There are many combinations the most efficient of which is likely the slow speed heavy oil diesel engine with waste heat recovery that will exceed 50% efficiency, however, this type of generation is not, I believe, used in the UK. Industrial gas turbine with cogen is probably a very close second, again with 50% plus efficiency. Baglan Bay in South Wales is the worlds most efficient (non-cogen) power station with an expected test efficiency of around 60% (Google GE 9H gas turbine), add in cogeneration and you can expect the thermal efficiency to exceed 70%. Your typical coal fired station like Drax or Didcot will be around 36% efficient. -- Andrew Sinclair http://www.smellycat.org |
#8
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'Steam' powered cars...
Ian_m wrote:
Best cars, maybe 18% efficiency, power stations lucky if 25%, fluidised coal bed stations can reach 33% efficiency. diesel engines are better. the most efficient non vehicular diesel engine can achieve over 50% efficiency. a demonstration 1 litre car was able to travel over 100km on 0.89 litres of fuel. in practice production cars can do 100km on 3 litres of fuel. shokk |
#9
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'Steam' powered cars...
Ian Stirling wrote:
Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. |
#10
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'Steam' powered cars...
"Chris Bacon" wrote in message ... Ian Stirling wrote: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. If the head gasket goes on any car, you could sa it is steam powered..! ) |
#11
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 23:00:38 +0000, Chris Bacon
wrote: Ian Stirling wrote: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. Cars are about 30% efficient at peak, usual operation is about 25%. Cooling power = engine power is reasonable rule of thumb and assume the remainder (33% up to 50%) goes down the exhaust pipe. Some of the cooling is direct to air from hot under bonnet surfaces. Not enough heat goes down exhaust pipe to run ancillaries at town road speeds and idle. 70mph only needs about 35bhp, so maybe as little as 35bhp or up to 50bhp goes to exhaust. They claim to extract 15% extra giving about 5bhp at 70mph which would just about do for the ancillaries but not with air-con. |
#12
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 23:00:38 +0000, Chris Bacon wrote:
Ian Stirling wrote: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. Nope. Exhaust. |
#13
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'Steam' powered cars...
Chris Bacon wrote: Ian Stirling wrote: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. Strangely enough, cooling though the radiator is just as important as the heating in the combustion for achieving high efficiency. You can only extract mechanical energy between two temperatures; the larger the gap, the more efficient. |
#14
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'Steam' powered cars...
Johannes wrote:
Chris Bacon wrote: Ian Stirling wrote: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. Strangely enough, cooling though the radiator is just as important as the heating in the combustion for achieving high efficiency. You can only extract mechanical energy between two temperatures; the larger the gap, the more efficient. So what does the radiator cool that forms the 'cold' part of that pairing? |
#15
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'Steam' powered cars...
In article ,
Johannes wrote: Strangely enough, cooling though the radiator is just as important as the heating in the combustion for achieving high efficiency. You can only extract mechanical energy between two temperatures; the larger the gap, the more efficient. That's a bit of an over simplification. Engines don't run at their most efficient until up to temperature. Probably to do with proper atomisation of the fuel. -- *Life is hard; then you nap Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#16
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Fri, 23 Dec 2005 21:46:02 GMT, Johannes wrote:
Chris Bacon wrote: Ian Stirling wrote: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. I thought most was lost through the radiator. Strangely enough, cooling though the radiator is just as important as the heating in the combustion for achieving high efficiency. You can only extract mechanical energy between two temperatures; the larger the gap, the more efficient. Sadly however, on car, the radioator does notr cool the exhaust gasses. So you are talking ********. If te exgaust were dindensed in te raradiator, it woudl indeed enable a more efficient engine to be produyced, but teh cat enbsures that the exhaust temperetures are high enough to make this impossible |
#17
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'Steam' powered cars...
"Ian Stirling" wrote in message ... car engines are quite inefficient (thermodynamically), and the exhaust temperature (at the exhaust valve) is around 700C. Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. No, 75% of "energy" is wasted. |
#18
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'Steam' powered cars...
Doctor Drivel wrote:
"Ian Stirling" wrote in message ... car engines are quite inefficient (thermodynamically), and the exhaust temperature (at the exhaust valve) is around 700C. Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. No, 75% of "energy" is wasted. 75% of both. Energy = power * time. |
#19
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'Steam' powered cars...
The message
from Ian Stirling contains these words: Current car engines are about 25% at best efficient, so 75% of power goes out the exhaust pipe wasted. No, 75% of "energy" is wasted. 75% of both. I hate to agree with Dribble, particularly when he is only right by accident, but in the instance above his answer does seem to fit the facts. Some of the wasted energy departs via the radiator rather than the exhaust pipe. :-) BTW Dribble thought up a convincing definition for 'mountain' yet? -- Roger Chapman Seasons greetings to all, even Dribble. |
#20
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'Steam' powered cars...
"The3rd Earl Of Derby" wrote in message . uk... Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In Autocar this week. BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. On the test bed they're getting a 15% saving in fuel consumption - at the same time as more power and torque. Seems it's not a new idea, but BMW reckon it is practical and should be in production within 10 years. When I was a nipper my old man was a tinkerer in electric motors and generators and although this is very vague he put together on a piece of wood a small cycle light generator a 12 or 24 volt motor(?) and rechargable battery connected together whereby the battery started the motor which in turn rotated the generator wheel thus fed power to the battery for charging purposes, obviously there was some electronics in between which as i said was very vague recollection A Perpetual Motion Machine. I hope it worked. Some do, but can only turn themsleves and produce no more power for other work. |
#21
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 14:11:42 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote: BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. http://www.gizmag.co.uk/go/4936/ |
#22
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'Steam' powered cars...
Andy Dingley wrote: BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. http://www.gizmag.co.uk/go/4936/ Looking at the pics ( which aren't very clear & I haven't spent very long looking) it seems they're using the heat from the catalytic converter as a superheater. My understanding was that a catalytic converter increased fuel consumption by about 10%, whilst the heat generated in catalysing CO into CO2 was sufficient to make it a fire hazard in dry grass. So now the Germans have added on a steam engine which recovers 10% of the efficiency. I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief period at the helm. |
#23
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'Steam' powered cars...
In article .com,
Aidan wrote: My understanding was that a catalytic converter increased fuel consumption by about 10%, whilst the heat generated in catalysing CO into CO2 was sufficient to make it a fire hazard in dry grass. So now the Germans have added on a steam engine which recovers 10% of the efficiency. Nothing like 10% with a modern cat. I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief period at the helm. Rover never produced a lean burn engine - although they may have researched it. Indeed, they limped on with carburettors long after everyone had gone to EFI - not surprising since they owned SU carburettors. Even although they produced the first EFI equipped UK model in the SD1 Vitesse and it was obvious then this was the way to go. -- *Certain frogs can be frozen solid, then thawed, and survive * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#24
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 09:12:59 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote: Indeed, they limped on with carburettors long after everyone had gone to EFI - not surprising since they owned SU carburettors. Nothing wrong with carburettors (as Rover developed them) in terms of performance, just the problems of extra cost, complexity and (mainly) poor performance in later life. EFI is _very_ cheap to make these days - hardly any expensive machining and we all know what Moore's law did to anything needing the electronic smarts of the average GameBoy. |
#25
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'Steam' powered cars...
In article ,
Andy Dingley wrote: Indeed, they limped on with carburettors long after everyone had gone to EFI - not surprising since they owned SU carburettors. Nothing wrong with carburettors (as Rover developed them) in terms of performance, just the problems of extra cost, complexity and (mainly) poor performance in later life. The last versions with ECU controlled mixture and idle speed in an attempt to control emissions were hardly paragons of reliability - although they did work ok when they worked. However, must have come very close to the cost of decent EFI, so really rather pointless. EFI is _very_ cheap to make these days - hardly any expensive machining and we all know what Moore's law did to anything needing the electronic smarts of the average GameBoy. True. Or would,be if I knew what Moore's law was. ;-) -- *Why can't women put on mascara with their mouth closed? Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#26
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'Steam' powered cars...
Aidan wrote:
I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief period at the helm. "Europe" followed legislation implemented in California, to cause a horrendous own-goal re. environmental impact. Catalytic converters have little place in motoring in the UK. |
#27
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'Steam' powered cars...
On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 10:24:54 +0000, Chris Bacon
wrote: | Aidan wrote: | I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about | catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more | cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, | which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted | engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn | technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief | period at the helm. | | "Europe" followed legislation implemented in California, to | cause a horrendous own-goal re. environmental impact. Catalytic | converters have little place in motoring in the UK. IIRC only the maximum emissions of cars are limited, there is nothing to say you *must* have catalytic converters. -- Dave Fawthrop hyphen Hyphenologist.co.uk Register your mobile phone IMEI *free* on http://www.menduk.org/. Keep the username and password. If it gets stolen report it your provider to get it blocked. To hopefully get it back report on http://www.menduk.org/ or 08701 123 123. |
#28
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'Steam' powered cars...
Dave Fawthrop wrote:
Chris Bacon wrote: | Aidan wrote: | I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about | catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more | cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, | which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted | engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn | technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief | period at the helm. | | "Europe" followed legislation implemented in California, to | cause a horrendous own-goal re. environmental impact. Catalytic | converters have little place in motoring in the UK. IIRC only the maximum emissions of cars are limited, there is nothing to say you *must* have catalytic converters. AFAIK all new cars made since January 1993 *must* have a catalytic converter fitted. Europead directive blah, unless it's only UK law, which I doubt. |
#29
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'Steam' powered cars...
In article ,
Chris Bacon wrote: I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief period at the helm. "Europe" followed legislation implemented in California, to cause a horrendous own-goal re. environmental impact. Catalytic converters have little place in motoring in the UK. Yes they do - as anyone who walks close to town traffic will know. You can instantly tell an older non cat equipped car by the smell. And it's not pleasant. CO2 may be bad for global warming, but CO, NOX and hydrocarbons aren't pleasant at the point of emission. -- *I took an IQ test and the results were negative. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#30
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'Steam' powered cars...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Chris Bacon wrote: Aiden wrote, but the DP munged the attributions: catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief period at the helm. "Europe" followed legislation implemented in California, to cause a horrendous own-goal re. environmental impact. Catalytic converters have little place in motoring in the UK. Yes they do - as anyone who walks close to town traffic will know. You can instantly tell an older non cat equipped car by the smell. And it's not pleasant. This is rubbish. Most cars are used for short journeys, during which their catalytic converters do not work properly. There's also another potential health problem in that masses of finely- divided platinum is now being deposited all over the place. CO2 may be bad for global warming, but CO, NOX and hydrocarbons aren't pleasant at the point of emission. What does a catalytic converter spit out then it's not yet functioning well? Perhaps you'd like to transfer this (or x-psot) to a relevant car-related NG. |
#31
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'Steam' powered cars...
On 21 Dec 2005 16:41:05 -0800, "Aidan" wrote:
I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, For late-80s designs of catalyst, and for late-80s Ford-based predictions of lean burn engines. Catalysts are much less restrictive now than they were then. The Yanks put up with rubbish for 20 years and just threw a few more cylinders at the problem. Europe wouldn't, so we fixed it. As for lean-burn, then much of the hype over it came from Ford, who were themselves being hoodwinked by outsourced R&D to a bunch of cowboys. A particular cowboy in fact who nicked my '50s edition of Ricardo. *******. |
#32
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'Steam' powered cars...
"Aidan" wrote in message oups.com... Andy Dingley wrote: BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. http://www.gizmag.co.uk/go/4936/ Looking at the pics ( which aren't very clear & I haven't spent very long looking) it seems they're using the heat from the catalytic converter as a superheater. My understanding was that a catalytic converter increased fuel consumption by about 10%, whilst the heat generated in catalysing CO into CO2 was sufficient to make it a fire hazard in dry grass. So now the Germans have added on a steam engine which recovers 10% of the efficiency. I saw Maggie Thatcher (ex industrial chemist) on TV ranting about catalytic converters, the only time I heard her speak sense. A more cost-effective method of reducing emissions was the lean-burn engine, which was both more efficient and less polluting that an un-catted engine. I believe Rover had done much development on the lean-burn technology, but that seems to have been scuttled after BMW's brief period at the helm. BL and Honda had much work on it. The problem was that all the world had gone over to catalyst, so us and Japs had to follow. A bit like the VHS v Betamax. |
#33
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'Steam' powered cars...
"Aidan" wrote in message oups.com... Andy Dingley wrote: BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. http://www.gizmag.co.uk/go/4936/ Looking at the pics ( which aren't very clear & I haven't spent very long looking) it seems they're using the heat from the catalytic converter as a superheater. It's overcomplex and cannot compete with the simplicity and efficiency of a Toyota setup hybrid, which most major companies are adopting. |
#34
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'Steam' powered cars...
"Andy Dingley" wrote in message ... On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 14:11:42 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: BMW are experimenting with using the waste heat from an IC engine to produce steam which drives a motor attached to the main engine. http://www.gizmag.co.uk/go/4936/ A non starter. As much as 25% of an engines power may be to run the ancillaries not to drive the wheels. This SteamCell is the size of a PC tower and is very clean using external combustion and ceramic fibre burners. They have installed these in buses and coaches, and leave the engine just to turn the wheels with no fan belts on it at all. Then the overall emissions are down, and overall efficiency up as this thing is well above 25% efficient, more like 80%. It can actually drive a small car too. http://www.enginion-ag.de/en/ It can also turn a genny to power and electric motor. This is viewed as feasible and economical too. It can also run off natural gas and be used as microCHP in a building. Battery technology has come along, long way, to the point the electric car is technologically here. Any other innovation is a stop-gap or a desperate attempt at a comp[any which can't grasp the future. What have BMW ever innovated that matters? Using Lithium batteries in a car only 5%, or less, of the energy stored in the vehicle is lost, while 75% of the energy in your tank is wasted. It is more efficient overall to pour the fuel in a motor at a power station with efficient combustion, energy re-claim and advanced scrubbers, which turns a genny, which sends the electricity down a line, charges a vehicle battery and runs the motor, rather than pour the fuel in the car directly. Also they are 100% clean at point of burn. |
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