Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a couple of
questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we get
used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of this problem,
initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but is not forthcoming
with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and there
is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in the
mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which leads me to
believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a short while rather
than it dissipating, the smell is a definite chemical smell rather than an
'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be described further. The soil stack in
the toilet is about 5 inches higher than the cistern (so about 3.5ft-ish
total) and I believe it to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but cannot
confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Mrs Mouse wrote:

Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a
couple of questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or
we get used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of
this problem, initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but
is not forthcoming with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and
there is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in
the mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which
leads me to believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a
short while rather than it dissipating, the smell is a definite
chemical smell rather than an 'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be
described further. The soil stack in the toilet is about 5 inches
higher than the cistern (so about 3.5ft-ish total) and I believe it
to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but cannot confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my
husband and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

Can you tell where the smell is coming from - toilet pan, top of the stack,
washbasin, etc.? Does the thing at the top of the stack look something like
http://tinyurl.com/dw2pu ? If so, it's probably an air admittance valve
(AAV).

I assume that the smell is coming from the sewer by one means or another. It
seems to me that the most likely possibilities a
* the AAV is letting gas *out* as well as taking it in, or
* the AAV isn't working at all - with the result that any depressions in the
sewer will 'pull' the traps in the washbasin and/or shower tray - removing
the water barrier and giving a direct air path to the sewer. As soon as you
have flushed some water down whatever it is, the barrier is restored.

If one or more traps *are* being pulled, you need to ensure that the AAV
*is* working, and possibly replace the traps with deeper ones - particularly
if you only have a simple U bend at the moment.
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Mrs Mouse wrote:

Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a
couple of questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or
we get used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of
this problem, initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but
is not forthcoming with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and
there is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in
the mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which
leads me to believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a
short while rather than it dissipating, the smell is a definite
chemical smell rather than an 'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be
described further. The soil stack in the toilet is about 5 inches
higher than the cistern (so about 3.5ft-ish total) and I believe it
to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but cannot confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my
husband and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

Can you tell where the smell is coming from - toilet pan, top of the
stack,
washbasin, etc.? Does the thing at the top of the stack look something
like
http://tinyurl.com/dw2pu ? If so, it's probably an air admittance valve
(AAV).

I assume that the smell is coming from the sewer by one means or another.
It
seems to me that the most likely possibilities a
* the AAV is letting gas *out* as well as taking it in, or
* the AAV isn't working at all - with the result that any depressions in
the
sewer will 'pull' the traps in the washbasin and/or shower tray - removing
the water barrier and giving a direct air path to the sewer. As soon as
you
have flushed some water down whatever it is, the barrier is restored.

If one or more traps *are* being pulled, you need to ensure that the AAV
*is* working, and possibly replace the traps with deeper ones -
particularly
if you only have a simple U bend at the moment.
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.



Thanks for your quick reply

The top of the soil stack doesn't look like the picture. It's a screw-on
cap-type top (like those on a coffee jar is probably the best way I can
describe it!) about 5" diameter, just over an inch deep and flat on the top.
Haven't unscrewed it completely as I'm a little afraid what I may unleash!

Not entirely certain where exactly the smell is coming from either - the wc
is extremely small! I'm pretty sure that the smell disappears prior to a
flush, but my husband disagrees - although that could be a speed issue
IYSWIM! Have just been in to see if I can smell it, and I can, but not as
pungent as it is first thing in the morning - probably due to overnight
build-up (or lack thereof)!

I googled this issue and found an article telling me that I may drop dead
soon from Hydrogen Sulphide inhalation - hence my slight anxiety! However
please don't mistake me for a neurotic woman who believes everything the
internet tells her lol! This was my reasoning for asking here rather than
checking myself into the local hospital!!!!

Thanks again

Clare

[i]

I googled this issue and found an article telling me that I may drop dead
soon from Hydrogen Sulphide inhalation - hence my slight anxiety! However
please don't mistake me for a neurotic woman who believes everything the
internet tells her lol! This was my reasoning for asking here rather than
checking myself into the local hospital!!!!

Thanks again

Clare

If it's hydrogen sulphide (which I doubt), then the smell would be more appropriately defined as rotten eggs, rather than "chemical". If it does not smell like rotten eggs, then don't worry about the H2S...

Good luck!

Davide

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Mrs Mouse wrote:


The top of the soil stack doesn't look like the picture. It's a
screw-on cap-type top (like those on a coffee jar is probably the
best way I can describe it!) about 5" diameter, just over an inch
deep and flat on the top. Haven't unscrewed it completely as I'm a
little afraid what I may unleash!

It's not an AAV then - it just a removeable cap to provide rodding access.

What else is in the same room as the offending toilet - is it a bathroom
with any or all of bath, bidet, washbasin, shower cubicle - or is it just a
very small room with just a bog?

I'm a bit confused about upstairs/downstairs. How many toilets are there
altogether? Is the offending one up or down? Is the smell just local to this
toilet, or does it permeate to other parts of the house?
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Mrs Mouse wrote:


The top of the soil stack doesn't look like the picture. It's a
screw-on cap-type top (like those on a coffee jar is probably the
best way I can describe it!) about 5" diameter, just over an inch
deep and flat on the top. Haven't unscrewed it completely as I'm a
little afraid what I may unleash!

It's not an AAV then - it just a removeable cap to provide rodding access.

What else is in the same room as the offending toilet - is it a bathroom
with any or all of bath, bidet, washbasin, shower cubicle - or is it just
a
very small room with just a bog?

I'm a bit confused about upstairs/downstairs. How many toilets are there
altogether? Is the offending one up or down? Is the smell just local to
this
toilet, or does it permeate to other parts of the house?
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.



Hi again

It is a very small room with a loo and a very small handbasin. It's the
downstairs loo that is causing the problem and we cannot smell the smell
anywhere else. Something is boxed in behind the toilet, but it is not the
cistern or the soil stack as they are visible. Think possibly just the
pipes boxed in not anything else. There is an upstairs loo in the bathroom.

Further to Davide's answer - it is not an eggy smell, although we could
smell this a couple of weeks ago in the kitchen, the door to which is
directly opposite the wc, for the entire evening but could not determine
where exactly this was coming from - just seemed to fill the kitchen.
Wasn't from outside as smell eased when we opened back door to ventilate the
room. Also seemed to be isolated to the kitchen and not coming from the wc
so not certain the incidents are related at all.

Not sure what else I can add.

Thanks again for your help

Clare

Mrs Mouse wrote:
It is a very small room with a loo and a very small handbasin. It's the
downstairs loo that is causing the problem and we cannot smell the smell
anywhere else. Something is boxed in behind the toilet, but it is not the
cistern or the soil stack as they are visible. Think possibly just the
pipes boxed in not anything else. There is an upstairs loo in the bathroom.

You could try leaving the plug in the sink and bunging the overflow up
with something overnight - if there is no smell in the morning then
somthing is probably causing the trap on the basin to empty. At least
then you will have isolated the problem a little.

(of course you could simply take the trap off one morning and check it
has water in there)

I googled this issue and found an article telling me that I may drop dead
soon from Hydrogen Sulphide inhalation - hence my slight anxiety! However
please don't mistake me for a neurotic woman who believes everything the
internet tells her lol! This was my reasoning for asking here rather than
checking myself into the local hospital!!!!

Thanks again

Clare



apparently the smell of H2S is so strong (assuming normal senses) that it is
almost impossible die from it - it becomes physically unbearable
retching/vomitting at concentrations 1000 times below lethal concentrations,
iirc it is detectable at levels of parts per billion

Nik

"Mrs Mouse" wrote in message
...
Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a couple
of
questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we get
used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of this problem,
initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but is not forthcoming
with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and there
is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in the
mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which leads me to
believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a short while rather
than it dissipating, the smell is a definite chemical smell rather than an
'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be described further. The soil stack
in
the toilet is about 5 inches higher than the cistern (so about 3.5ft-ish
total) and I believe it to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but
cannot
confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

Are you sure its just in the mornings, and not when you flushed the upstairs
loo?

Is the valve working? If valve is jammed closed, water could be being sucked
out of the pan, letting air through.

Inform environment health, refuse to pay rent until problem sorted.

Dave Jones wrote:
"Mrs Mouse" wrote in message

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we get

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Its your landlords job to get it fixed.

Inform environment health, refuse to pay rent until problem sorted.

Tell landlord you'll do that if he doesnt deal with it. Only if he
doesnt would you need that type of action.


NT

wrote in message
oups.com...
Dave Jones wrote:
"Mrs Mouse" wrote in message

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we
get

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my
husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Its your landlords job to get it fixed.

Inform environment health, refuse to pay rent until problem sorted.

Tell landlord you'll do that if he doesnt deal with it. Only if he
doesnt would you need that type of action.


NT

Hi

Thanks for your reply. I'm getting a bit fed up with living with this smell
whilst he is dragging his heels over this matter. If it is a simple (and
preferably cheap) problem to fix, I am more than willing to deal with it
just to get it done! If it is a complex job that's going to cost - it's all
his!

Clare

"Dave Jones" wrote in message
...

"Mrs Mouse" wrote in message
...
Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a
couple
of
questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we
get
used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of this
problem,
initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but is not forthcoming
with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and
there
is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in the
mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which leads me
to
believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a short while
rather
than it dissipating, the smell is a definite chemical smell rather than
an
'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be described further. The soil
stack
in
the toilet is about 5 inches higher than the cistern (so about 3.5ft-ish
total) and I believe it to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but
cannot
confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my
husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

Are you sure its just in the mornings, and not when you flushed the
upstairs
loo?

Is the valve working? If valve is jammed closed, water could be being
sucked
out of the pan, letting air through.

Inform environment health, refuse to pay rent until problem sorted.


Thank for your reply.

Just sent his lordship upstairs to flush the loo and the smell didn't get
any worse (or better!) downstairs afterwards.

Upon flushing downstairs loo, not noticed all the water being sucked out,
but (very) occasionally the loo does fill to the top and then very rapidly
return to normal level.

Don't know if it makes any difference but we are an end house so probably on
the end of a run.

Sorry I can't be more precise, not sure of any of the terminology and trying
not to sound like a total imbecile!

I shall try environmental health in the morning and see if that forces
landlord into action, but if there is anything I can do in the meantime to
solve this issue I will as it's not particularly pleasant to live with!

Clare

"Mrs Mouse" wrote in message
...

"Dave Jones" wrote in message
...

"Mrs Mouse" wrote in message
...
Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a
couple
of
questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we
get
used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of this
problem,
initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but is not
forthcoming
with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and
there
is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in the
mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which leads me
to
believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a short while
rather
than it dissipating, the smell is a definite chemical smell rather than
an
'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be described further. The soil
stack
in
the toilet is about 5 inches higher than the cistern (so about
3.5ft-ish
total) and I believe it to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but
cannot
confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my
husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

Are you sure its just in the mornings, and not when you flushed the
upstairs
loo?

Is the valve working? If valve is jammed closed, water could be being
sucked
out of the pan, letting air through.

Inform environment health, refuse to pay rent until problem sorted.


Thank for your reply.

Just sent his lordship upstairs to flush the loo and the smell didn't get
any worse (or better!) downstairs afterwards.

Upon flushing downstairs loo, not noticed all the water being sucked out,
but (very) occasionally the loo does fill to the top and then very rapidly
return to normal level.

Sounds like the air admitance valve is stuck, if your brave enougth or get
hubby to do it, remove and see if it is working. (open windows)


Don't know if it makes any difference but we are an end house so probably
on
the end of a run.

Sorry I can't be more precise, not sure of any of the terminology and
trying
not to sound like a total imbecile!

I shall try environmental health in the morning and see if that forces
landlord into action, but if there is anything I can do in the meantime to
solve this issue I will as it's not particularly pleasant to live with!

Clare

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Dave Jones wrote:

Sounds like the air admitance valve is stuck, if your brave enougth
or get hubby to do it, remove and see if it is working. (open windows)


But from the OP's subsequent description of the cap at the top of the
sub-stack, I'm pretty sure that there *isn't* an AAV.
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

--
www.davidarthur.ws
"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Dave Jones wrote:

Sounds like the air admitance valve is stuck, if your brave enougth
or get hubby to do it, remove and see if it is working. (open windows)


But from the OP's subsequent description of the cap at the top of the
sub-stack, I'm pretty sure that there *isn't* an AAV.
--
Well considering she doesn't know what one is, and seen as the pipe ends 5
in above the cistern, I hope it is!

Could be one of this type, seems to fit the bill

www.scobles.co.uk/ Product_Images/PPA308-T.jpg

On Thu, 8 Sep 2005 22:15:39 +0100, "Mrs Mouse"
wrote:

Hi

Sorry to post here if wrong group but I am after some answers to a couple of
questions and I have been pointed in this direction!

I have just moved into a rented property (23/07) and the downstairs wc
appears to be having some difficulties. In the mornings, there is a
dreadful chemical stench which seems to go after a little while (or we get
used to it - not sure which!). The landlord was informed of this problem,
initially 4 weeks ago and a few more times since, but is not forthcoming
with either any answers or repairs.

The wc is vented appropriately (it is in the middle of the house and there
is an extractor fan in there), the smell appears to be there in the
mornings, regardless of whether the door is open or not which leads me to
believe that we become accustomed to the smell after a short while rather
than it dissipating, the smell is a definite chemical smell rather than an
'organic waste(!)' smell but cannot be described further. The soil stack in
the toilet is about 5 inches higher than the cistern (so about 3.5ft-ish
total) and I believe it to be fitted with an aav or durgo valve, but cannot
confirm.

My questions a

a) what is causing this smell?
b) is it harmful (we have 3 children aged 7,5 and 3 as well as my husband
and myself)
c) what can I do to fix it?

Many thanks in advance for your help/advice!

Clare

Hi,

Is the loo carpeted? It could be someone has spilled a lot of loo
cleaner on it at some point and the smell accumulates overnight.

BTW if putting the plug in the sink overnight to see if it helps, tape
over the overflow too.

cheers,
Pete.