Cylinder v thermal store
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 11:45:31 +0100, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 21:12:30 +0100, "IMM" wrote:



Which model. I am a pro, not amateur,


This has never been substantiated....

Andy, grow up. Keep polishing the CAT boots.

All that you have to do is substantiate your claim to being a
professional. You have always ducked the issue, and also the issue
of qualifications.

If you didn't persist in turning this into some kind of perceived
superiority issue and the put down of others and their views, the
questions would not arise.

One can only deduce that absence of evidence equals absence of
qualification and professional status.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Cylinder v thermal store
 

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 11:45:31 +0100, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 21:12:30 +0100, "IMM" wrote:



Which model. I am a pro, not amateur,


This has never been substantiated....

Andy, grow up. Keep polishing the CAT boots.

All that you have to do is substantiate your claim to being a
professional. You have always ducked the issue, and also the issue
of qualifications.

If you didn't persist in turning this into some kind of perceived
superiority issue and the put down of others and their views, the
questions would not arise.

Your views are based on incomplete knowledge of systems and only from a pure
amateur viewpoint. When poor advise is given I will step in and correct. It
is simple as that.

But you do persist in clevercloggsness




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Cylinder v thermal store
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 12:28:28 +0100, "IMM" wrote:



All that you have to do is substantiate your claim to being a
professional. You have always ducked the issue, and also the issue
of qualifications.

If you didn't persist in turning this into some kind of perceived
superiority issue and the put down of others and their views, the
questions would not arise.

Your views are based on incomplete knowledge of systems and only from a pure
amateur viewpoint.

Even in areas where I can claim and demonstrate professional
involvement, I do not claim to have a complete knowledge. That is for
the arrogant, naive and uneducated. I do, however, know where to find
information that I may need and how to validate it.

In areas here I am an amateur, and have always made that clear,
comments are from personal experience and sound engineering principle.

The essence of DIY is, after all, by definition an amateur one.

Why is it that the known professionals who contribute to this NG do so
without all the hullabaloo about being professional and the put downs
of others?


When poor advise is given I will step in and correct.

It's a pity that you are unable to spell or to construct sentences in
a grammatically correct manner. "Advise" is the verb - "advice" is
the noun.

The notion that you are qualified to "correct" the comments of others
seems to somehow lack credibility.



---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Cylinder v thermal store
 

How much does a spare heat exchanger cost? I think that along with a
flow
switch, and anything else that I find as unique to these beasts, one
will
have to go onto the spares list, as if it breaks it's a showstopper
until
I
could get one flown in.

You could have an "integrated" hybrid. Range will do one. One with a
coil
"and" a plate heat exchanger. Cold water enters the bottom of the coil and
out the top and then into the plate heat exchanger.

In your situation you may be better off with a thermal store using a coil,
then no pump or flow switch is required...very simple indeed. Look at the
Albion Mainsflow. Their web site shows all the models, in exploded view.
Range also give an option of either a plate heat exchanger or an immersion
coil.

Well it doesn't really make much difference. If I'm going for one of these
systems there is the posibility that the cylinder itself will fail. I'm not
going to carry a complete spare system.

But if the only flow through any part of the cylinder is closed system water
then corrosion should be minimal.

I'll keep looking though.

Cylinder v thermal store
 

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 12:28:28 +0100, "IMM" wrote:

"Advise" is the verb - "advice" is
the noun.

I know.


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Cylinder v thermal store
 

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Chris Harris" wrote in message
...


How much does a spare heat exchanger cost? I think that along with a
flow
switch, and anything else that I find as unique to these beasts, one
will
have to go onto the spares list, as if it breaks it's a showstopper
until
I
could get one flown in.

You could have an "integrated" hybrid.
Range will do one. One with a coil
"and" a plate heat exchanger. Cold water
enters the bottom of the coil and
out the top and then into the plate heat exchanger.

In your situation you may be better off with a
thermal store using a coil, then no pump or flow
switch is required...very simple indeed. Look at the
Albion Mainsflow. Their web site shows all the
models, in exploded view.
Range also give an option of either a plate heat
exchanger or an immersion coil.

Well it doesn't really make much difference. If I'm going for one of
these
systems there is the posibility that the cylinder itself will fail. I'm
not
going to carry a complete spare system.

That is a good point. With a heat bank, the plate heat exchanger, flow
switch and blending valve (common to TS's and heat banks) are the only
parts
that may require hunting down. A normal blending valve may be available
off-the-shelf down there, if so then only two items. The plate heat
exchanger will last a hell of a long time being made of stainless steel.
To
ensure you may want to buy a plate heat exchanger and a flow switch, just
in
case.

But if the only flow through any part of the cylinder is closed system
water
then corrosion should be minimal.

What is the water like in the Falklands? High Scale? The correct
proportion of inhibitor should be inserted into the system to prevent
corrosion. that is the water in the rads, pipes and store cylinder. Many
don't put enough and find they have problems in hard water areas. Replace
the inhibitor every five years and the complete system should last a
lifetime.

Basic coiled thermal stores are so simple I am surprised they are not the
norm down there. If a dealer stocked a few then no problems.

For plate heat exchagers, try:

GEA ECOFLEX UK
Tel.: 01909 551107
FAX : 01909 550885

http://www.gea-ecoflex.com

You want a 14 plate brazed plate heat excahnger for thermal store use.



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Cylinder v thermal store
 

"IMM" wrote in message ...
"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
I thought you said that you had an Ideal combi boiler......

No. A Microgenus and an Ideal condensing heating boiler.

Sorry, can't resist this - You have always preached in the past about
how good combis are. Why don't you have one then? Did you have some
constraints that meant a Combi wasn't the way to go?

Cylinder v thermal store
 

"David" wrote in message
om...

I thought you said that you had an Ideal combi boiler......

No. A Microgenus and an Ideal condensing heating boiler.

Sorry, can't resist this - You have always preached in the past about
how good combis are. Why don't you have one then? Did you have some
constraints that meant a Combi wasn't the way to go?

A Microgenus is a combi.


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Cylinder v thermal store
 

What is the water like in the Falklands? High Scale? The correct
proportion of inhibitor should be inserted into the system to prevent
corrosion. that is the water in the rads, pipes and store cylinder. Many
don't put enough and find they have problems in hard water areas. Replace
the inhibitor every five years and the complete system should last a
lifetime.

Very soft, no scale. Here in Stanley it's properly treated so it's not too
harsh, but in some parts of the islands it eats copper cylinders and things
like ordinary steel kettles for breakfast, no make that before breakfast. I
guess it's because most of the water comes from peaty sources so is acidic.


Basic coiled thermal stores are so simple I am surprised they are not the
norm down there. If a dealer stocked a few then no problems.

It needs somebody to take the plunge and fit one, if it prooves to be a good
hassle free economic system after a few years then it'll catch on.

I'm prepared to take the risk, if I think the rewards will be justified.

Chris


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Cylinder v thermal store
 

"Chris Harris" wrote in message
...


What is the water like in the Falklands? High Scale? The correct
proportion of inhibitor should be inserted into the system to prevent
corrosion. that is the water in the rads, pipes and store cylinder.
Many
don't put enough and find they have problems in hard water areas.
Replace
the inhibitor every five years and the complete system should last a
lifetime.

Very soft, no scale. Here in Stanley it's properly treated so it's not too
harsh, but in some parts of the islands it eats copper cylinders and
things
like ordinary steel kettles for breakfast, no make that before breakfast.
I
guess it's because most of the water comes from peaty sources so is
acidic.


Basic coiled thermal stores are so simple I am surprised they are not
the
norm down there. If a dealer stocked a few then no problems.

It needs somebody to take the plunge and fit one, if it prooves to be a
good
hassle free economic system after a few years then it'll catch on.

I'm prepared to take the risk, if I think the rewards will be justified.

You would be better off with a heat bank with a plate heat-exchanger. If
the exchanger corrodes, then you change it, which is 0.5 - 1 hour job. It
is small, the size of a medium sized thick book. As you realised, changing
a whole thermal store cylinder because a coil corroded can be expensive and
inconvenient. As long as the correct ratio of inhibitor is in the system
and it is changed 4-5 years then the whole lot will last a lifetime. At
least corrosion will not fail it. The only part that comes into contact
with maybe corrosive fresh water is the plate heat-exchanger. You could
ensure that you have "full-bore" isolating valves between the pump and the
other side of the plate heat-exchanger then no big drain down if either the
plate or the pump goes. Even if a heat bank cylinder goes, in your case
where availability is the problem, a normal vented cylinder can be used, by
taking the parts from the heat bank and adapting them. Not difficult once
you understand the operation.

You never know, you may start a trend. You could become the importers and
agents. :)



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Cylinder v thermal store
 

You would be better off with a heat bank with a plate heat-exchanger. If
the exchanger corrodes, then you change it, which is 0.5 - 1 hour job.

That's what I'm thinking. And that is the route that I am investigating at
the moment.

How long do DPS usually take to get back to enquiries. I sent one off on
Sunday and haven't had an acknowledgment from them yet. I would have thought
that two working days was long enough to clear their emails from the
weekend.

It
is small, the size of a medium sized thick book. As you realised,
changing
a whole thermal store cylinder because a coil corroded can be expensive
and
inconvenient. As long as the correct ratio of inhibitor is in the system
and it is changed 4-5 years then the whole lot will last a lifetime. At
least corrosion will not fail it. The only part that comes into contact
with maybe corrosive fresh water is the plate heat-exchanger. You could
ensure that you have "full-bore" isolating valves between the pump and the
other side of the plate heat-exchanger then no big drain down if either
the
plate or the pump goes.

Good point, I'll specify them in case they are not already there.

Even if a heat bank cylinder goes, in your case
where availability is the problem, a normal vented cylinder can be used,
by
taking the parts from the heat bank and adapting them. Not difficult once
you understand the operation.

That is what I was thinking.

Cylinder v thermal store
 

"Chris Harris" wrote in message
...


You would be better off with a heat
bank with a plate heat-exchanger. If
the exchanger corrodes, then you change
it, which is 0.5 - 1 hour job.

That's what I'm thinking. And that is the route that I am investigating at
the moment.

How long do DPS usually take to get
back to enquiries. I sent one off on
Sunday and haven't had an acknowledgment
from them yet. I would have thought
that two working days was long enough to
clear their emails from the weekend.

I would have thought they would have responded by now. Try a fax. Have you
contacted Range? They do thermal store/heat banks.



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