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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
I attempted different ways of cutting .042 phosphor-Bronze into strips and concluded that the only way to do this quickly and consistently with the tools I have is to create some sort of a jig that would hold the work on my lathe bed and then use a slitting saw.
The strips I need to cut will have to be about 0.156 pitch.(Wide). Can I get advice/ideas on the best way to go about doing this? Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#2
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
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#3
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:19:41 -0800 (PST),
wrote: I attempted different ways of cutting .042 phosphor-Bronze into strips and concluded that the only way to do this quickly and consistently with the tools I have is to create some sort of a jig that would hold the work on my lathe bed and then use a slitting saw. The strips I need to cut will have to be about 0.156 pitch.(Wide). Can I get advice/ideas on the best way to go about doing this? Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Whats wrong with using a nice big old desktop paper cutter with the lever blade? http://www.ebay.com/itm/STACK-PAPER-...-/331395178484 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Guillotine-S...-/281491928420 "At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child, miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats." PJ O'Rourke |
#4
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:19:44 PM UTC-8, wrote:
I attempted different ways of cutting .042 phosphor-Bronze into strips and concluded that the only way to do this quickly and consistently with the tools I have is to create some sort of a jig that would hold the work on my lathe bed and then use a slitting saw. Why not just blue the sheet, scribe an accurate line, and follow it with hand shears? Or buy an inexpensive guillotine shear if you need a big stack of strips... http://www.harborfreight.com/30-inch-shear-press-brake-and-slip-roll-5907.html I've also seen good results from photographic patterning with resist, and etching (look for 'electrochemical machining' in the yellow pages). |
#5
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
"whit3rd" wrote in message ... On Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:19:44 PM UTC-8, wrote: I attempted different ways of cutting .042 phosphor-Bronze into strips and concluded that the only way to do this quickly and consistently with the tools I have is to create some sort of a jig that would hold the work on my lathe bed and then use a slitting saw. Why not just blue the sheet, scribe an accurate line, and follow it with hand shears? Or buy an inexpensive guillotine shear if you need a big stack of strips... http://www.harborfreight.com/30-inch-shear-press-brake-and-slip-roll-5907.html ============ The cut-off strip will be slightly bent. -jsw |
#6
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
Brakes, paper cutters, snips, and etching have already been considered.
First, I need to be able to do this myself because I'll need hundreds of these strips, and that is just in the beginning. And I need *repeatable* results. Like I said I'm aiming for a consistent width of 0.156". So I was thinking I'll need the use of my mini-lather or mini-mill for this. I'll of course have to deburr each strip after they are cut. And then I'll need a jig for bending them to the desired shape. Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#7
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
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#8
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
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#9
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
So it seems as though this cannot be done with spending a lot of money or outsourcing.
But I can't give up. :-) I was thinking that there should be a way I can use my milling table for indexing to get repeatable results. (The range of thicknesses are actually from .004 to .042). Then perhaps I can continue to use a box cutter and some sort of guide-jig. Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#10
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
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#11
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sunday, December 7, 2014 8:18:44 AM UTC-5, Baron wrote:
prodded the keyboard So it seems as though this cannot be done with spending a lot of money or outsourcing. But I can't give up. :-) I was thinking that there should be a way I can use my milling table for indexing to get repeatable results. (The range of thicknesses are actually from .004 to .042). Then perhaps I can continue to use a box cutter and some sort of guide-jig. Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. You've got a lathe & mill ! Make a forming punch and cut and shape in the same operation. -- Best Regards: Baron. I wouldn't begin to know how to go about doing that. Do you have a pointer to similar projects? Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#13
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Saturday, December 6, 2014 1:10:10 PM UTC-8, wrote:
So it seems as though this cannot be done with spending a lot of money or outsourcing. I was thinking that there should be a way I can use my milling table for indexing to get repeatable results. (The range of thicknesses are actually from .004 to .042). Already mentioned, but: apply lacquer to the sheet, use the milling table to scribe accurately through the lacquer, and etch (probably with warmed ferric chloride solution). The thing is, you do NOT want the ferric chloride near any good machine tools or electronics. |
#14
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Monday, December 8, 2014 6:48:42 PM UTC-5, whit3rd wrote:
On Saturday, December 6, 2014 1:10:10 PM UTC-8, wrote: So it seems as though this cannot be done with spending a lot of money or outsourcing. I was thinking that there should be a way I can use my milling table for indexing to get repeatable results. (The range of thicknesses are actually from .004 to .042). Already mentioned, but: apply lacquer to the sheet, use the milling table to scribe accurately through the lacquer, and etch (probably with warmed ferric chloride solution). The thing is, you do NOT want the ferric chloride near any good machine tools or electronics. Unfortunately, strong chemicals like that are out. I have to stick to the hardware I have, which is in a limited space. As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). I wish there was a decent free app that allow me to illustrate my projects to show for clarification. (Words can only do so much). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#15
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On 2014-12-11, wrote:
On Monday, December 8, 2014 6:48:42 PM UTC-5, whit3rd wrote: On Saturday, December 6, 2014 1:10:10 PM UTC-8, wrote: So it seems as though this cannot be done with spending a lot of money or outsourcing. I was thinking that there should be a way I can use my milling table for indexing to get repeatable results. (The range of thicknesses are actually from .004 to .042). Already mentioned, but: apply lacquer to the sheet, use the milling table to scribe accurately through the lacquer, and etch (probably with warmed ferric chloride solution). The thing is, you do NOT want the ferric chloride near any good machine tools or electronics. [ ... ] I wish there was a decent free app that allow me to illustrate my projects to show for clarification. (Words can only do so much). There are various free CAD (Computer Aided Design -- e.g. drawing programs) which could do that. Which ones depends on which OS you are running. You're probably running windows, and the ones which I use are for unix, so I won't bother to name them. And there is a steep learning curve for most of these. But getting images in a format which will not offend some when you post it (the images are large, and often not welcome in usenet postings) is a different matter. You *could* put the images on a private web site, and just post URLS to them in the articles. Enjoy, DoN -- Remove oil spill source from e-mail Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- |
#16
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:19:44 AM UTC+1, wrote:
I attempted different ways of cutting .042 phosphor-Bronze into strips and concluded that the only way to do this quickly and consistently with the tools I have is to create some sort of a jig that would hold the work on my lathe bed and then use a slitting saw. The strips I need to cut will have to be about 0.156 pitch.(Wide). Can I get advice/ideas on the best way to go about doing this? Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Do you have a table saw? Make a cross-slide table for it and cut away! |
#17
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
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#18
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Wednesday, December 10, 2014 9:28:40 PM UTC-5, DoN. Nichols wrote:
On 2014-12-11, wrote: On Monday, December 8, 2014 6:48:42 PM UTC-5, whit3rd wrote: On Saturday, December 6, 2014 1:10:10 PM UTC-8, wrote: So it seems as though this cannot be done with spending a lot of money or outsourcing. I was thinking that there should be a way I can use my milling table for indexing to get repeatable results. (The range of thicknesses are actually from .004 to .042). Already mentioned, but: apply lacquer to the sheet, use the milling table to scribe accurately through the lacquer, and etch (probably with warmed ferric chloride solution). The thing is, you do NOT want the ferric chloride near any good machine tools or electronics. [ ... ] I wish there was a decent free app that allow me to illustrate my projects to show for clarification. (Words can only do so much). There are various free CAD (Computer Aided Design -- e.g. drawing programs) which could do that. Which ones depends on which OS you are running. You're probably running windows, and the ones which I use are for unix, so I won't bother to name them. And there is a steep learning curve for most of these. But getting images in a format which will not offend some when you post it (the images are large, and often not welcome in usenet postings) is a different matter. You *could* put the images on a private web site, and just post URLS to them in the articles. Enjoy, DoN -- Remove oil spill source from e-mail Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- Out of what is said to be free I've downloaded or tried to download about a dozen different apps and hoping one would have promise. I access the internet at the local library and I have no internet service for my home PC where I do most of my work. Many apps require one just to download and/or install. What's left out of anything portable that I can download to my flash drive and then install on my home PC tends not to be what I need. That is a simple 3D drawing app. So I'm forced to stay with MS Paint, which limits me to 2D drawings. Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#19
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote:
prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Darren Harris Staten Island, New York |
#20
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Thursday, December 11, 2014 10:35:43 AM UTC-5, robobass wrote:
On Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:19:44 AM UTC+1, wrote: I attempted different ways of cutting .042 phosphor-Bronze into strips and concluded that the only way to do this quickly and consistently with the tools I have is to create some sort of a jig that would hold the work on my lathe bed and then use a slitting saw. The strips I need to cut will have to be about 0.156 pitch.(Wide). Can I get advice/ideas on the best way to go about doing this? Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Do you have a table saw? Make a cross-slide table for it and cut away! Not an option. My table saw is way too noisy to use where I'm no at and it would probably waste 50% of the stock any way. (The TS blade is probably as thick as the pieces I'll need to make). Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#21
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On 2014-12-14, wrote:
I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. -- Remove oil spill source from e-mail Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- |
#22
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
DoN. Nichols prodded the keyboard
On 2014-12-14, wrote: I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. Good advice ! If you have'nt a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" get one. It's very worthwhile. Gauge Plate. This is special in so much as the steel is intended to be able to easily be hardened after machining. It mills quite well and is very useful for all manner of tooling. -- Best Regards: Baron. |
#23
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 15:10:44 +0000, Baron
wrote: DoN. Nichols prodded the keyboard On 2014-12-14, wrote: I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. Good advice ! If you have'nt a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" get one. It's very worthwhile. Gauge Plate. This is special in so much as the steel is intended to be able to easily be hardened after machining. It mills quite well and is very useful for all manner of tooling. Gauge Plate is so-called because it is ground to specific gauge dimensions -- generally quite close ones. It's usually the equivalent of US tool steel grade 01: basic oil-hardening tool steel. But it can be other alloy grades. It's the grinding to specific dimensions that makes it "gauge plate." Most US suppliers would be more likely to recognize "ground flat stock, 01." It's expensive these days. -- Ed Huntress |
#24
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
"Baron" wrote in message
... DoN. Nichols prodded the keyboard On 2014-12-14, wrote: I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. Good advice ! If you have'nt a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" get one. It's very worthwhile. Gauge Plate. This is special in so much as the steel is intended to be able to easily be hardened after machining. It mills quite well and is very useful for all manner of tooling. -- Best Regards: Baron. https://www.onlinemetals.com/merchan...2&top_cat=1354 |
#25
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
Ed Huntress prodded the keyboard
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 15:10:44 +0000, Baron wrote: DoN. Nichols prodded the keyboard On 2014-12-14, wrote: I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. Good advice ! If you have'nt a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" get one. It's very worthwhile. Gauge Plate. This is special in so much as the steel is intended to be able to easily be hardened after machining. It mills quite well and is very useful for all manner of tooling. Gauge Plate is so-called because it is ground to specific gauge dimensions -- generally quite close ones. It's usually the equivalent of US tool steel grade 01: basic oil-hardening tool steel. But it can be other alloy grades. It's the grinding to specific dimensions that makes it "gauge plate." Most US suppliers would be more likely to recognize "ground flat stock, 01." It's expensive these days. -- Ed Huntress Yes it is expensive compared to, say five years ago. I just looked at a packet of 1/4" X 1" X 13" that I bought in 2009 and paid £6 + vat for, and was supplied by http://www.saxonsteels.com/ in Shefield UK. The packet also has data printed on it about how to harden and details the composition of the steel. Todays price for the nearest 6mm X 25mm X 304mm was listed at £10.11p + vat. More than double in price. -- Best Regards: Baron. |
#26
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On 14/12/14 20:50, Baron wrote:
Ed Huntress prodded the keyboard On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 15:10:44 +0000, Baron wrote: DoN. Nichols prodded the keyboard On 2014-12-14, wrote: I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. Good advice ! If you have'nt a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" get one. It's very worthwhile. Gauge Plate. This is special in so much as the steel is intended to be able to easily be hardened after machining. It mills quite well and is very useful for all manner of tooling. Gauge Plate is so-called because it is ground to specific gauge dimensions -- generally quite close ones. It's usually the equivalent of US tool steel grade 01: basic oil-hardening tool steel. But it can be other alloy grades. It's the grinding to specific dimensions that makes it "gauge plate." Most US suppliers would be more likely to recognize "ground flat stock, 01." It's expensive these days. -- Ed Huntress Yes it is expensive compared to, say five years ago. I just looked at a packet of 1/4" X 1" X 13" that I bought in 2009 and paid £6 + vat for, and was supplied by http://www.saxonsteels.com/ in Shefield UK. The packet also has data printed on it about how to harden and details the composition of the steel. Todays price for the nearest 6mm X 25mm X 304mm was listed at £10.11p + vat. More than double in price. MSC UK has it for £15.16 + VAT and that for an 18" length and MSC aren't the cheapest but have it on sale from time to time. I'm used to the round silver steel being in 13" lengths but the ground flat stock always seemed to be in 18" lengths for inch sizes and 500mm for metric sizes. It may depend on the supplier. For the application of punching out blanks from a sheet it would seem easy to do a rectangular punch and die for the OPs job and I've done non rectangular shapes in the past where I've milled to the profile by eye and then hand stoned to get the punch and die to fit and then all went well. I do have a fly press, (screw press US?) to run these tools in though. |
#27
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Saturday, December 13, 2014 9:49:41 PM UTC-5, DoN. Nichols wrote:
If you have a copy of _Machinery's Handbook_, look under "punch press". You will find formulas to translate the thickness, and the full circumference of the item being punched into the force needed. Good Luck, DoN. Thanks. I'll do that. | Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#28
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:10:46 AM UTC-5, Baron wrote:
Good advice ! If you have'nt a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" get one. It's very worthwhile. Gauge Plate. This is special in so much as the steel is intended to be able to easily be hardened after machining. It mills quite well and is very useful for all manner of tooling. -- Best Regards: Baron. Thanks. I still would need to determine the best way to get it to shape. I assume I would mill it to rough dimensions with the proper end mill, but grinding those rows into the points I mentioned would be more of a mystery. I'd then have to figure out a way to use my milling table as an index jig to work with a press punch. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York |
#29
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#30
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST),
wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. In an earlier post you said that the stock was up to .042" thick. And you want to shear this into strips .0156 wide? Do you really mean ..156" wide? If the latter then I think I know a way to cut your strips on the lathe. The explanation is kinda long because I can't show you a picture so let me know if wide strips will work. Eric |
#31
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST),
wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. You can with SOME shears..but Im not sure you will be able with a HF shear. Spend the bucks and give us a review will ya? (Grin) Gunner "At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child, miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats." PJ O'Rourke |
#32
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
... You can with SOME shears..but Im not sure you will be able with a HF shear. Spend the bucks and give us a review will ya? (Grin) Gunner I have a Central Machinery 30" 3-in-1 and an 8" Enco bench shear. Both are OK for a hobbyist but fussier than I would put up with for any sort of production, especially when used near their capacity. The original owner of the 30" gave up on it. Both distort narrow strips, the 30" slightly and the 8" considerably. -jsw |
#33
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST),
wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. Oh, sorry. I could have sworn it said 0.156, which should be easily doable. 42 thou thick and fifteen thou wide? WTF,O? They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. This is a Good Thing(tm). You Gnu Yawkahs need good tools. gd&r -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#34
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 16:38:06 -0800, wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. In an earlier post you said that the stock was up to .042" thick. And you want to shear this into strips .0156 wide? Do you really mean .156" wide? If the latter then I think I know a way to cut your strips on the lathe. The explanation is kinda long because I can't show you a picture so let me know if wide strips will work. Yeah, the deeper we get, the more it sounds like he's actually looking for a microtome. g -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#35
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sunday, December 14, 2014 7:32:47 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. In an earlier post you said that the stock was up to .042" thick. And you want to shear this into strips .0156 wide? Do you really mean .156" wide? If the latter then I think I know a way to cut your strips on the lathe. The explanation is kinda long because I can't show you a picture so let me know if wide strips will work. Eric My mistake. As I said in my first post the strips have to be no more than .156" wide.(Not .0156). But yes, I did say the thickest will be .042" Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. |
#36
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 16:34:13 -0800 (PST),
wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 7:32:47 PM UTC-5, wrote: On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: prodded the keyboard As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. HTH. -- Best Regards: Baron. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. In an earlier post you said that the stock was up to .042" thick. And you want to shear this into strips .0156 wide? Do you really mean .156" wide? If the latter then I think I know a way to cut your strips on the lathe. The explanation is kinda long because I can't show you a picture so let me know if wide strips will work. Eric My mistake. As I said in my first post the strips have to be no more than .156" wide.(Not .0156). But yes, I did say the thickest will be .042" Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Greetings Darren, So I guess you need lots of these strips and this tooling suggestion is for doing lots of strips. You will need a plate, steel would be best but aluminum or brass would work, just not last as long. I seem to recall that the strips are 4 inches long. So you would need to start with shim stock that was 4 inches wide and some convenient length, say 4 to six inches. The shim stock should be stacked so that it is about .25 thick, maybe even up to .375 thick. The pieces must be stacked carefully because you are going to cut through the whole stack at once. This is for two reasons, for production and to minimize burrs. It would be best if the stock is cleaned of oil at one end so that all the pieces in the stack can be glued together. This gluing just needs to be at the end of the stack farthest from the cutter. The glue should be something that easily dissolves in some sort of solvent. Super glue would work and acetone will dissolve it. The reason for the gluing is so that when the stack is moved into the cutting zone all the pieces will move together. When I have done stuff like this I apply the glue and then clamp or weigh down so that the glue is spread very thin, maybe .001" or .002" thick. Now that you have your stack of glued up pieces you need to put them in the cutting fixture. Which I had better explain how to make. There are three basic pieces and several screws. The first piece is the base plate. It needs to be of some substantial thickness, at least .500". Even better would be .75". You will need to come up with some way to affix it to the cross slide on your lathe. Since I don't know what your lathe looks like I can't say exactly how you will do this.Maybe you can drill and counterbore some holes and then run screws through the plate into the top of the cross slide. Or maybe, if the compound needs to be removed to make room for the plate, you can use the nuts that hold the compound to the cross slide. The plate should be about 5.00" x 6.00" to support the stock and for a couple tapped holes for a clamp. Machine the plate so that the sides are square to each other. Now for the other two pieces. The first is just a rectangular piece made from steel. It should measure 5.0 by .500 by .25 thick. Drill two 1/4 inch holes centered on the bar and 4.300 apart. After the bar is all machined it should be gently curved through the .25 thick direction. This can be done easily in a vise. Lay the bar in the vise with the bar spaced away from the fixed jaw using any convenient spacers. A couple pieces of keystock for example. Now use a third spacer that touches the bar in the middle and close the vise on the assembly. You will need to bend the bar a little at a time until you get about .04 inches of bend. This bar will be one of the clamps. The gentle curve is so that when tightened onto the shim stock it will contact the center of the stock first and then flatten as the screws are tightened so that the bar will tend to clamp all along the shim stock, not just at the ends. The third part is the other clamp. It should be milled from steel. It should be 4.00" long, .875 high, and .400" thick. A step needs to be milled in the .400 thickness direction that is .150 deep by .750 wide and runs the complete length of the part. So in cross section the part will be L shaped. Now drill 3 holes .375 diameter through the .250" thickness. The two holes closest to the ends should be .375 from the ends and the third hole should be centered. Then drill two more holes .290 (letter L drill) diameter each centered between the center .375 hole and an outer .375 hole. All 5 holes should be drilled .230 from the bottom of the bar. Now drill and tap 5 each 1/4-20 holes in the end of the base plate that will match the holes you drilled in the clamp bar. The screws going into these holes are socket head cap screws. Next, for three 1/4-20 screws, put them in the lathe in a 4 jaw chuck and adjust for .040 TIR runout. Turn until they clean up. All three screw heads should be the same diameter, about .335. Screw the three eccentric head screws into the base plate until they bottom out and then back off until all three screw heads are in the high position. Assemble the clamp bar to the base plate with two 1/4-20 screws that go through the two .290 holes. Use a flat washer between the screw head and the bar. Use Loctite on the screws and adjust so that the clamp bar moves with slight pressure. Now you should be able to slide your stack of shim stock under the clamp bars and use the eccentric screws to clamp the stock that will be cut off and the other clamp bar to hold the stock yet to be cut. You should use a saw blade that is about as small in diameter that will work. This is because you will be climb cutting with the saw blade. You want to climb cut because this will direct the cutting force down into the cross slide and pushing the shim stock against the base plate. The drawback is that the cutting forces will want to draw the saw into the work and pull the work out of the clamping fixture. Using a smaller daimeter saw blade will lessen the tendency of the saw to pull the work form the fixture. When cutting you will want to adjust the gib screws so that there is a little drag when turning the feed handle. This is to prevent the cross slide from being pulled into the saw blade. Run the saw as fast as you can for the material being cut, use the proper cutting fluid, and use a fairly slow feed. Using this cutting technique will lessen the burrs. The first cut made with the setup will also be cutting into the base plate so if it is steel make sure your saw RPM is slow enough so that it is not damaged. The first cut should be deeper than all the rest of the cuts so that the saw blade won't be touching the steel when running at high speed. The same thickness saw blade should always be used. If a wider slot is cut into the base plate this will leave room for burrs to form. You could cut a slot in the base plate that is deeper than the gullets between the saw teeth by about 30%. Then the slot can help guide the saw blade. Make sure the carriage is locked in place when using this fixture. Whew! I sure hoped this helped. A picture in this case surely would have been worth a thousand word. Cheers, Eric |
#37
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
wrote in message
... My mistake. As I said in my first post the strips have to be no more than .156" wide.(Not .0156). But yes, I did say the thickest will be .042" Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. 0.042" could be troublesome to shear on a 30" 3-in-1, if the material's hardness is anywhere close to steel's. |
#38
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Slitting Metal Sheets on a Lathe
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 16:38:06 -0800, etpm wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 14:32:02 -0800 (PST), [Darren Harris] wrote: On Sunday, December 14, 2014 10:28:11 AM UTC-5, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 13 Dec 2014 17:40:48 -0800 (PST), [Darren Harris] wrote: On Thursday, December 11, 2014 12:41:09 PM UTC-5, Baron wrote: [Darren Harris wrote:] As for Baron's idea. I'll have to search for "gauge plates". It would seem that one would only have to mill out one face of the gauge plate which would be flat in between straight rows that rise up into points. (I then wouldn't need to deburr the finished strips). Hi Darren, Here in the UK "Gauge Plate" is an easily machined, high carbon steel that is acurately ground to be flat and to the marked dimensions. It is usually marked as "Oil" hardening but can be water hardened. I have used it many times to make press tools and punches. I think that in the USA it may be described differently. I think Gauge Plate is basically bar stock of specific geometrical dimensions. If I were able to figure out how to use my mini-milling machine to grind it to the needed dimensions I'd still have to find someone to harden it. (The width of the strips cannot be wider than .0156", though erring on the narrow side is no big deal). (I don't think I'd need a heavy duty press to punch out the pieces though). Put Beverly to work with it. Jig up a guide and go to town. http://www.lowbucktools.com/beverly.html http://www.harborfreight.com/throatl...ear-38413.html I'm not sure if I can cut .0156" wide strips off of Phosphor-Bronze stock with a shear. They did however just open up a new Harbor Freight here on Staten Island. Located it on the block in between the two blocks that have a Lowes and Home Depot. In an earlier post you said that the stock was up to .042" thick. And you want to shear this into strips .0156 wide? Do you really mean .156" wide? If the latter then I think I know a way to cut your strips on the lathe. The explanation is kinda long because I can't show you a picture so let me know if wide strips will work. In previous incarnations of this thread, 0.156" has been the usually-mentioned width, reflecting the 0.156" on center spacing of 56-pin (28x2) edge connectors used in various arcade game consoles. Eg, in https://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=7920.0, (in 3rd post from the end of the page) Harris wrote: "The only thing left to do is to find the best way to make my own electrical contacts out of Phosphor-Bronze for the zero-insertion-force "connectors" I have to make. This is because there are no connectors out there that offer no resistance when put together and pulled apart, *and* also will consistently come together perfectly and without bending the pins. So therefore, I will be using flat strips of the Phosphor-Bronze as contact surfaces." https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.woodworking/zAgHNZ0xbrA is his former rec.woodworking thread about making 30-wide sets of grooves on 0.156" centers to hold sets of springy contacts. http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Rec/rec.crafts.metalworking/2008-03/msg02476.html is his former rec.crafts.metalworking thread about making a gangsaw for cutting strips of 0.032 phosphor-bronze sheet to widths of about 0.08" to use as contacts. http://www.homeownershub.com/woodworking/help-how-to-make-a-gang-saw-450287-1.htm is his former rec.woodworking thread about the subject, and there's a picture and description near the middle of the page (in the post dated February 12, 2009, 12:18 am) with the following explanation: "I will need phosphor-bronze strips in the same width because I will be soldering them to the traces on fingerboards like that shown. The other end of these phosphor-bronze strips will run over a wood or nylon housing similar to the black JAMMA housing pictured, but it will not be hollow. Instead it will just have a slit that the fingerboard will fit into. So I'm effectively separating the proximity of the traces on both side of the fingerboard and wrapping them around the housing that holds the fingerboard. The (wood/nylon) housing's thickness will be 3/8" of an inch and the phosphor-bronze strips will wrap around it just short of meeting at the other side." *** Returning to the present, it would be easier to give useful advice if Harris were to explain the big picture, and say what he is trying to do (which I think might be trying to make something than can connect different game boards into a single console assembly, without damaging the game boards when changing them in and out; or it might be something about making a way to select one of several boards inside a console; etc) instead of asking how to cut off strips that are 0.156" wide from a phosphor-bronze sheet. If I correctly understand the application, maybe one of the next several methods could be adapted to solve the actual problem: 1. Buy some 28x2 pin, 0.156" spacing, edge connectors like at http://www.electronicsurplus.com/amp-inc-2-530664-6-connector-pcb-edge (or whatever size of connector is appropriate) and with a slitting saw cut it from the back into two long pieces, each with 28 springy contacts still attached and hanging out ready to use, analogous to a leaf battery connector. (Leaf battery connectors are available at several pitches, eg 3.9 mm is close to the 3.96 mm of 0.156", but they usually have not more than 4 to 6 leaves.) 2. Make a 5"x0.5" printed circuit board to hold 28 pogo pins on 0.156" centers. The board would need an attached backbone to stiffen it, or two boards could be used separated by spacers (see http://dangerousprototypes.com/2013/02/11/another-diy-icsp-pogo-pin-connector/ eg) to form a beam. (At google images, put pogo pin board in the search box to see other arrangements.) Using pogo pins probably would give the best reliability and be the most professional approach, if the application has room for pogo pins. A 5"x0.5" PCB would cost about $4.17 ea Q3 (ie, $12.50 for 3 boards) from https://oshpark.com/ and pogo pins cost 8 to 80 cents each, depending on style and quantity. Eg, see 50 ea spear-point pogo pins for $4.49 on ebay at http://goo.gl/IH8bjA. 3. Use a jeweler's wire-rolling press (see pictures of examples at http://www.ebay.com/bhp/jewelry-rolling-mill) to roll phosphor- bronze wire to desired thickness/width. Starting with half-hard wire, eg http://theringlord.com/cart/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=134 #14 AWG / #12 SWG / 2mm, roll it down to 0.031" thick, when it will be 0.156" wide if I calculated right. By trial and error with a few feet of wire, one may be able to find a rolling sequence that work-hardens it to desired hardness. Without a wire-rolling press, experiment with the wire using an anvil and small hammer. A few rolls of alloy C510 phosphor bronze round or square wire of several sizes would run $20 to $40 total and provide a few hundred feet to experiment with. 4. Contact some of the small-quantity phosphor-bronze wire sellers that show up when you google, and see what they'd charge to supply hard flat wire that's 0.03 to 0.04" thick in the desired width. Small-quantity sellers include http://theringlord.com mentioned above and http://www.artfire.com/ext/shop/product_view/WickwireJewelry/8060867/phosphor_bronze_jewelry_wire-16_gauge_round_dead_soft-8_feet/indie_supplies/jewelry_supplies/jewelry_tools/wire http://www.wire-sculpture.com/ has (or had) bronze half-round wire. Also see http://www.supermetalind.com/bronze-wires.html but they are in India and I don't know if they sell small amounts. http://www.fortepiano.com/wire/PhosBronze/phosbronze_003.htm sells small-diameter (possibly too small) alloy 510 phosphor bronze wire in small quantities and sells spring brass likewise, and does custom drawing for $500. https://www.etsy.com/listing/207812117/bare-phosphor-bronze-artistic-wire-solid has phosphor bronze wire in gauges 10, 12, 14, 16, 18, 20, 22, 24, 26, 28, 30, 32, 34 in small lots, mostly dead soft instead of half hard. http://www.amazon.com/Gauge-Half-Round-Hard-Bronze/dp/B007FTTA4Q http://www.amazon.com/Beadalon-20-Gauge-Artistic-4-Pound-Phosphor/dp/B00LJ5WD4G -- jiw |
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