On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:30:19 -0500, Randy wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 05:49:05 -0500, Cliff
wrote:


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...2.4bf5bf6.html
"Suspect in Virginia slayings of 8 surrenders after 18-hour manhunt"
[
A man suspected of shooting eight people to death has been charged with one
count of first-degree murder, but authorities said other charges were likely.

Christopher Bryan Speight, a 39-year-old security guard, surrendered to police
at daybreak Wednesday after leading authorities on an 18-hour manhunt after the
shootings at a house in rural central Virginia. He had no weapons when he
surrendered wearing a bulletproof vest over a black fleece jacket, camouflage
pants and mud-caked boots.

Bomb squads had found "multiple" explosives at Speight's home and were
detonating them into the night.
....
]


A security guard, AKA a government trained, licensed and endorsed
person. Infinitely more qualified to carry a gun more than you or me.

Thank You,
Randy

Some are ex-military and very highly qualified. Others can barely hit
a large silhouette at 7 yards. Training requirements vary from none
in some states to 40 hours in others. Training is conducted by
private individuals or firms, not the government.

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:42:23 -0600, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:30:19 -0500, Randy wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 05:49:05 -0500, Cliff
wrote:


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...2.4bf5bf6.html
"Suspect in Virginia slayings of 8 surrenders after 18-hour manhunt"
[
A man suspected of shooting eight people to death has been charged with one
count of first-degree murder, but authorities said other charges were likely.

Christopher Bryan Speight, a 39-year-old security guard, surrendered to police
at daybreak Wednesday after leading authorities on an 18-hour manhunt after the
shootings at a house in rural central Virginia. He had no weapons when he
surrendered wearing a bulletproof vest over a black fleece jacket, camouflage
pants and mud-caked boots.

Bomb squads had found "multiple" explosives at Speight's home and were
detonating them into the night.
....
]


A security guard, AKA a government trained, licensed and endorsed
person. Infinitely more qualified to carry a gun more than you or me.

Thank You,
Randy

Some are ex-military and very highly qualified. Others can barely hit
a large silhouette at 7 yards. Training requirements vary from none
in some states to 40 hours in others. Training is conducted by
private individuals or firms, not the government.

Indeed. California has very high standards for rentacops, with much
training, licensing and whatnot required. I ran the alarm end of a
security company for 18 yrs. and even in the 90s, the State had very
very strong requirements. They have tightened them up even more in the
last few years.

I teach shooting and occasionally will help out a company get their
guards qualified. They have good shooters and bad shooters. Just like
the California prison guard industry. though the prison guards get 5x
the salary for less work.

Gunner

The current Democratic party has lost its ideological basis for
existence.
- It is NOT fiscally responsible.
- It is NOT ethically honorable.
- It has started wars based on lies.
- It does not support the well-being of americans - only billionaires.
- It has suppresed constitutional guaranteed liberties.
- It has foisted a liar as president upon America.
- It has violated US national sovereignty in trade treaties.
- It has refused to enforce the national borders.

....It no longer has valid reasons to exist.
Lorad474

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message

snip
I teach shooting and occasionally will help out a company get their
guards qualified. They have good shooters and bad shooters. Just like
the California prison guard industry. though the prison guards get 5x
the salary for less work.

Gunner

Have you seen people that just can't shoot no mater how much training they
have? Have you seen people that can pick up a gun for the first time and
instantly be able to "dot the "i"s"?

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 18:01:16 -0500, "Buerste"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message

snip
I teach shooting and occasionally will help out a company get their
guards qualified. They have good shooters and bad shooters. Just like
the California prison guard industry. though the prison guards get 5x
the salary for less work.

Gunner

Have you seen people that just can't shoot no mater how much training they
have? Have you seen people that can pick up a gun for the first time and
instantly be able to "dot the "i"s"?

Yes. Most generally men with the occasional woman, who no matter what
sort of training..simply will not allow themselves to shoot accuracy.
Those afraid of the weapon run second most common, but they can..can be
usually worked with and while they still may not like weapons..can shoot
one accuretly enough to pass their tests.

As for those that are instant shooters..the crown nearly always goes to
women. In my experience..its been about 1 out of 150 woman shooters
that can pick up a handgun, be given directions, just a few minutes
worth of coaching and are slamming them into the 10 ring in nice tight
groups. Guys..tend to be bout 1 out of 300 for that type of shooter.

Now..nearly everyone as their learn and become more familiar with their
arms will become quite good...but the one Ive always wanted to get
strongly involved in competiton shooting was a 15 yr old deaf girl.
She had come with her mom from an abusive father and were staying with a
buddy of mine (her uncle) and his family. He signed if she would like
to get out of the house and come out to the range, and she agreed.
Never had even seen an actual firearm, let alone touched one. She was
timid, but interested..the little girl with a bunch of hairy legged old
farts. I introduced her to a Ruger Mark 2, showed her how it worked,
how to load one and drew her pictures (my sign lang is not very good) of
proper sight picture and loaded 1 round in the magazine, and stood her
up on the line. Standing beside her..showed her proper stance and grip
and a bit of dry firing, stuck in the mag and had her cycle the action.

Round went bout 6" to the left of the paper. She looked at the weapon,
smiled..indicated she had been expecting a big BANG. I loaded two in the
mag and she inserted and chambered first round. Round went about 1"
high left of bullseye (7 yrds) Second round was in the bullseye. After
a couple full magazines, taking out the center of the bull, I put her on
a 15 yrd target, then a 25 yrd one. Not all rounds were in the X
ring..but..enough to give her a big taste for it. Then I drug out a .38,
which she shot nearly as well as the .22. Then handed her my personal
45..and magic happened. She was a natural and deadly deadly shooter
with a 1911. She was shooting groups damned near as tight as I was, on
her first time to the range. Spread out some sillouettes...showed her
proper combat stance etc etc..and she blew out the x rings. I think her
last round was 6 sillouettes scattered over about 120 degrees from
ranges from 10' to 30 yrds..and she killed em all in about 4 seconds.

This was her FIRST day on the range, and her first firearms experience.
15 yrs old..and was shooting like a ****ing 5 yr shooter.

They moved on shortly after that...but I told her mom she should be
STRONGLY encouraged to get involved in shooting..as she was a natural..a
bloody born natural. All the guys who watched..were watching with their
mouths hanging open in shock..and then they put their guns up and
started humping targets around, doing range stuff to keep her shooting.

I think her uncle worked with her whenever she came visiting..I moved
shortly after that..shrug...but I hope she became involved in the
shooting sports...she was a trophy winner if Ive ever seen one.

There are just enough of those sorts..to keep it interesting whenever I
work with a class.

Gunner

The current Democratic party has lost its ideological basis for
existence.
- It is NOT fiscally responsible.
- It is NOT ethically honorable.
- It has started wars based on lies.
- It does not support the well-being of americans - only billionaires.
- It has suppresed constitutional guaranteed liberties.
- It has foisted a liar as president upon America.
- It has violated US national sovereignty in trade treaties.
- It has refused to enforce the national borders.

....It no longer has valid reasons to exist.
Lorad474

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:42:23 -0600, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:30:19 -0500, Randy wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 05:49:05 -0500, Cliff
wrote:


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...2.4bf5bf6.html
"Suspect in Virginia slayings of 8 surrenders after 18-hour manhunt"
[
A man suspected of shooting eight people to death has been charged with one
count of first-degree murder, but authorities said other charges were likely.

Christopher Bryan Speight, a 39-year-old security guard, surrendered to police
at daybreak Wednesday after leading authorities on an 18-hour manhunt after the
shootings at a house in rural central Virginia. He had no weapons when he
surrendered wearing a bulletproof vest over a black fleece jacket, camouflage
pants and mud-caked boots.

Bomb squads had found "multiple" explosives at Speight's home and were
detonating them into the night.
....
]


A security guard, AKA a government trained, licensed and endorsed
person. Infinitely more qualified to carry a gun more than you or me.

Thank You,
Randy

Some are ex-military and very highly qualified. Others can barely hit
a large silhouette at 7 yards. Training requirements vary from none
in some states to 40 hours in others. Training is conducted by
private individuals or firms, not the government.

This started as one of Cliff's anti-NRA posts. My point was: if not
for the NRA, this guy would be the only guy allowed to have a gun.
Anti gunners think security guards and Police are the only persons on
earth that should be allowed to have guns. For some reason they think
these people must be super human and could not, and would not, ever go
nuts or abuse their power, and for these reasons the rest of us have
no need to own a gun.

Thank You,
Randy

Remove 333 from email address to reply.

"Randy" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:42:23 -0600, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:30:19 -0500, Randy wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 05:49:05 -0500, Cliff
wrote:


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...2.4bf5bf6.html
"Suspect in Virginia slayings of 8 surrenders after 18-hour manhunt"
[
A man suspected of shooting eight people to death has been charged with
one
count of first-degree murder, but authorities said other charges were
likely.

Christopher Bryan Speight, a 39-year-old security guard, surrendered to
police
at daybreak Wednesday after leading authorities on an 18-hour manhunt
after the
shootings at a house in rural central Virginia. He had no weapons when
he
surrendered wearing a bulletproof vest over a black fleece jacket,
camouflage
pants and mud-caked boots.

Bomb squads had found "multiple" explosives at Speight's home and were
detonating them into the night.
....
]


A security guard, AKA a government trained, licensed and endorsed
person. Infinitely more qualified to carry a gun more than you or me.

Thank You,
Randy

Some are ex-military and very highly qualified. Others can barely hit
a large silhouette at 7 yards. Training requirements vary from none
in some states to 40 hours in others. Training is conducted by
private individuals or firms, not the government.

This started as one of Cliff's anti-NRA posts. My point was: if not
for the NRA, this guy would be the only guy allowed to have a gun.
Anti gunners think security guards and Police are the only persons on
earth that should be allowed to have guns. For some reason they think
these people must be super human and could not, and would not, ever go
nuts or abuse their power, and for these reasons the rest of us have
no need to own a gun.

Thank You,
Randy

Remove 333 from email address to reply.

You are responsible for your own safety, the cops are there to make chalk
outlines and do the paperwork.

On Fri, 22 Jan 2010 14:43:29 -0500, Randy wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:42:23 -0600, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:30:19 -0500, Randy wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 05:49:05 -0500, Cliff
wrote:


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...2.4bf5bf6.html
"Suspect in Virginia slayings of 8 surrenders after 18-hour manhunt"
[
A man suspected of shooting eight people to death has been charged with one
count of first-degree murder, but authorities said other charges were likely.

Christopher Bryan Speight, a 39-year-old security guard, surrendered to police
at daybreak Wednesday after leading authorities on an 18-hour manhunt after the
shootings at a house in rural central Virginia. He had no weapons when he
surrendered wearing a bulletproof vest over a black fleece jacket, camouflage
pants and mud-caked boots.

Bomb squads had found "multiple" explosives at Speight's home and were
detonating them into the night.
....
]


A security guard, AKA a government trained, licensed and endorsed
person. Infinitely more qualified to carry a gun more than you or me.

Thank You,
Randy

Some are ex-military and very highly qualified. Others can barely hit
a large silhouette at 7 yards. Training requirements vary from none
in some states to 40 hours in others. Training is conducted by
private individuals or firms, not the government.

This started as one of Cliff's anti-NRA posts. My point was: if not
for the NRA, this guy would be the only guy allowed to have a gun.
Anti gunners think security guards and Police are the only persons on
earth that should be allowed to have guns. For some reason they think
these people must be super human and could not, and would not, ever go
nuts or abuse their power, and for these reasons the rest of us have
no need to own a gun.

Thank You,
Randy

Point taken and respected, Randy. I'm not sure that's entirely or
even mostly attributable to the NRA, but they certainly do deserve
some credit.

I respect the fear of those that are anti-gun. It stems from ignorance
but it is real, and fear is a powerful shaper of opinion.

Not a single anti I have introduced to respect for guns, some at the
range, remains an anti. Not all have become shooters or owners, their
choice, but they seem to gain an appreciation for reciprocal respect
of rights. I respect their right to disdain firearms and I'd like them
to respect my right to own them responsibly as a non-criminal citizen.
I suppose being a vet doesn't hurt my credibility.

Bottom line: no anti I've had the opportunity to chat with one on one
has remained an anti. More than half continue to eschew firearms from
their lives, but they gain respect for those of us who choose
otherwise.