OK, the Big Question that hangs over the heads of so many of us. I have a large
(for a basement shop anyway) stash of all kinds of stuff. Supplies, fasteners,
parts, equipment, whatever. My problem isn't storage per se (so recommending
Vidmar cabinets won't help in this case), because I have vast ranks of shelves,
cabinets, and boxes with everything in them, but the fact that my neat storage
is occupying most of the spatial volume. Running out of room for people and
tools.

What kind of tactics do you guys take to maintaining stashes of things without
it getting out of hand? I'm not talking just junk here--mostly good stuff that
now and then I find myself dipping into. Lots of boxes of switches, oddball
screws, whatever. What kind of "supply line" do you keep? How much backstocked
stuff? What do you do when it's time to thin out the flock?

Sorry for asking such a broad question, but it's a lot easier to work through
this kind of thing with outside input. Or rather outside input that doesn't say
"well why don't you just toss all this out" while looking and your drill press
and bandsaw. You guys must have developed methods to deal with the madness.

GTO(John)

I have put alot of this kind of stuff above my head, I have bins that fit
between the 2 x 10s holding the floor above. I just put plywood up, paint it
white and have lots of room for these bins. I have cleared up a bunch of
floor space while keeping it neat and clean. I just label each bin and slide
it in.

I face this all the time. Too Much Stuff. There is only one real solution:
use it or lose it! In my shop I have machinery, tooling, tools, supplies,
stock, and projects underway. I took a bit of space and built some shelves
and got a bunch of big boxes and now when I get a project underway and then
it gets put on hold for some time (i.e. waiting on a Mcmaster order or waiting
for another project) it goes into a box on those shelves. That helped a lot.
I also gulped hard and deprioritized some bigger stuff like my pressure washer,
a diesel-fired Landa hot water attachment that went with it, some great cast
iron crane wheels, my salmon smoker and my welding rod ovens, and sold them
off. From that I got an entire room which is now used for band practice. Yes,
sometimes I miss my pressure washer! But 4 people in my house use the music
studio *all the time*, so it has a higher priority. I also sold my 10 ton
boom truck. Out she goes. Got me a huge piece of driveway back.

I am pretty ruthless when it comes to stuff like boxes of switches or oddball
stuff. I got one of those sets of plastic drawers back in the mid-80s and I
put a bunch of stuff like that in those boxes. I carted them around for 20
years and then pitched most of it and regretted keeping them that long. I
keep now what I might use in projects I'm currently envisioning, or items
that are hard to find and can always be sold (e.g. Square D start/stop buttons
in enclosures) but basically there is another principle that really applies
he let the store store. Buy what you need.

My dad had a thing about nails. In one of our kitchen pantry cupboards were
jars full of nails. I never once saw one of them go out and into the house,
but by God he never let anyone touch those jars of nails. How much is a whole
cupboard worth of space in a kitchen pantry worth over 40 years? Jeez.

You need to be ruthlessly honest with yourself. (I believe that some of us
have found our way to this hobby just because our subconscious minds have
guided us here just to learn this lesson!) Do you USE any of those switches
or miscellaneous on projects? Do you really?

Grant Erwin
Kirkland, Washington


GTO69RA4 wrote:
OK, the Big Question that hangs over the heads of so many of us. I have a large
(for a basement shop anyway) stash of all kinds of stuff. Supplies, fasteners,
parts, equipment, whatever. My problem isn't storage per se (so recommending
Vidmar cabinets won't help in this case), because I have vast ranks of shelves,
cabinets, and boxes with everything in them, but the fact that my neat storage
is occupying most of the spatial volume. Running out of room for people and
tools.

What kind of tactics do you guys take to maintaining stashes of things without
it getting out of hand? I'm not talking just junk here--mostly good stuff that
now and then I find myself dipping into. Lots of boxes of switches, oddball
screws, whatever. What kind of "supply line" do you keep? How much backstocked
stuff? What do you do when it's time to thin out the flock?

Sorry for asking such a broad question, but it's a lot easier to work through
this kind of thing with outside input. Or rather outside input that doesn't say
"well why don't you just toss all this out" while looking and your drill press
and bandsaw. You guys must have developed methods to deal with the madness.

GTO(John)

Welcome to the club...it is good to hear that I am not the only one
with this continuing problem. )

This is my approach...

First, find a moment or two where you can sit down and actually THINK
about what you "need to keep" versus "want to keep". The definition
changes as your interests and activities change. While some will argue
that you need to keep EVERYTHING, the reality of space and time
dictates otherwise. One needs to remember that your storage space and
what you store both cost you money and time. If you do not use the
item or cannot find the item, the space and time it has used up has
been wasted no matter how important or how valuable the item is to
you.

The frequency that you use something should dictate how important it
is to you. The small box of screws that you reach for every day is
more important than the fill-in-the-blank that you use once every
year even though the difference in their dollar value may be ten
thousand fold. With that said, there are still items that you use once
in a blue moon that allow you to perform a function that nothing else
will...they too should be placed on the "keep" list. The frequency of
use should also dictate how accessible the item is. The wrench you use
daily should be at your fingertips, the jig that you use once a year
can be stored in a very out of the way location.

The cost in time and money to replace an item is a factor to consider.
If you can go to the local hardware store and buy the item at a
reasonable price, this item has little reason to be taking space up in
your shop unless you use it EVERY DAY. Again this is a changing
consideration. The increasing price of steel and its availability has
suddenly made those dropoffs I walk around look alot more important.

Another "tough love" approach is to assume that you have to move your
shop and its storage. An old saying states that three moves equal a
fire. Try playing the "what-if" game of "If I had to move next month,
what would I take with me?". While it is emotionally distressing, the
space that one can free up following through on this apporach can be
eye opening. I would also note that if one does have to move (and we
ALL do sooner or later), your move will likely be to a smaller shop
and storage area because of life's demands in regards to changing
jobs, health and increasing real estate prices. The bottom line is
that you do not want to move (or store) one more item than you have
to.

Another related approach as to determine what to really keep is to
consider renting space to store your items. When one actually sees the
monthly cost of storing the material, it many times shines an
unwelcome but realistic light on how "valuable" the items in question
really are. You are presently paying this cost in your current
storage, it is just a hidden cost.

Efficient use of space is another issue that one always needs to
address. My storage areas were FULL according to my neighbor but I was
able to place another Bridgeport, a forklift and a rolling toolbox in
the storage area in short order. Different preceptions by different
people. Then again, he still doesn't understand why anybody would use
their garage for anything but parking their cars in (*Sigh*...Show me
a man with an empty garage and I will show you a man with no dreams).

Now on to the subject of efficient storage. Since you are limited by
the cubic volume of your storage area, you need to realize that ANY
space that doesn't contain storage or machinery is wasted space (that
also includes the space you take up in the traffic areas of the
shop/storage area). Areas under, over, around, inside machines that
don't contain storage are wasted space. ALL workbenchs, machine stands
and cabinets should have storage built in. Any drawer or cabinet that
is not constructed to hold parts, tools or supplies to its total cubic
volume is wasting space. All floor, wall and ceiling space is fair
game for storage capability. A friend of mine stores all his bar stock
under the traffic areas in his shop in a false floor that he walks on.
He has storage cabinets hanging from the ceiling. His walls have
multlayered cabinets that can be accessed on a moment's notice for
very dense storage of small parts.

Another point is to really LOOK at your current storage and see how
you are using it. Are ALL the shelves, drawers and boxes FULL or are
some of them only partly used? I would guess an overall shuffling of
storage so you FILL all the areas of storage completely will find you
a sizable amount of space. Note that to have efficient storage it
takes considerable time and effort on your part so again make sure
what you are storing is worth what you are willing to invest.

One big help in using shop space is to put certain tools on wheels.
While the biggest gains are in the area of woodworking where the
materials tend to be large and bulky, the same concept pretains to
metalworking. When one can roll the tool to use and then return it to
its storage location, one can reuse the same floor space for a number
of tools. The savings in floor space can be used for more storage.

I also find that standardizing on the storage
cabinets/drawers/containers has helped me alot. We all tend to spend
our money on the machines and supplies and leave the storage to the
haphazard approach of using whatever we find. I found that when I
started to standardize on different types of storage (SAME SIZE filing
cabinets, card files, flat files, small parts cabinets), my storage
was much more efficient in time and money. The catch is that it can
and will take time and money to do the standardization. That is why
Vidmar cabinets are so popular. For us mere mortals who need to
justify the cost of the hobby to the spouse, file cabinets, card
files, flat files and small parts cabinets are the way to go. I tend
to not use shelving units because they tend to waste space unless you
are using uniform containers that fit them. Also remember that the
wall behine storage units allows one to store sheet goods and rod
stock very efficiently.

Have you considered storing some of the items (parts, machines, etc.)
outside of your current area? I have never been a great fan of this
because outside storage tends to be less than optimal for the
conditions (theft, water, sun, vermin damage) it offers. You may also
have some neighbors who will be less than thrilled at looking at your
valuable "junk" and keeping the neighbors happy ranks right up there
with keeping the spouse happy. Get on their bad side and you and your
hobby will suffer.

I hesitate to mention this because I have seen marriages end because
of it but is there any chance that you can relocate some of the
"valuables" to the living space that your spouse uses. If so, be
thankful for having a very special and understanding spouse.

Finally one can study how storage is used in an environment like a
submarine to find ideas as to how to use storage space more
efficiently. I have always been amazed as to how they find a place for
everything and still function efficiently.

To help the group offer more advice, I would suggest describing in
detail how your present storage setup is configured. Pictures would be
especially helpful.

TMT









(GTO69RA4) wrote in message ...
OK, the Big Question that hangs over the heads of so many of us. I have a large
(for a basement shop anyway) stash of all kinds of stuff. Supplies, fasteners,
parts, equipment, whatever. My problem isn't storage per se (so recommending
Vidmar cabinets won't help in this case), because I have vast ranks of shelves,
cabinets, and boxes with everything in them, but the fact that my neat storage
is occupying most of the spatial volume. Running out of room for people and
tools.

What kind of tactics do you guys take to maintaining stashes of things without
it getting out of hand? I'm not talking just junk here--mostly good stuff that
now and then I find myself dipping into. Lots of boxes of switches, oddball
screws, whatever. What kind of "supply line" do you keep? How much backstocked
stuff? What do you do when it's time to thin out the flock?

Sorry for asking such a broad question, but it's a lot easier to work through
this kind of thing with outside input. Or rather outside input that doesn't say
"well why don't you just toss all this out" while looking and your drill press
and bandsaw. You guys must have developed methods to deal with the madness.

GTO(John)

GTO69RA4 wrote:

What kind of tactics do you guys take to maintaining stashes of things without
it getting out of hand?

I subscribe to the theory that if it's not out of hand, my junk pile
is depleted.

Thanks for the advice. We could run a daytime self-help show for HSMs.

Anyway, most of my stuff storage is in a long basement room next to the shop.
Multiple 24x48" (shelf size) Wilson industrial shelf units going up to the low
ceiling. On the shelves are gray plastic storage boxes of a couple different
sizes. They fit very well and use all the available space. In the shop itself
are 12x36 shelves with small quipment like meters, portable welder, etc. Also
have four file cabinents and more shelves with paperwork, but that's for
another discussion.

The big problem with me is the mental handling of the stuff I have that's
already sorted. It doesn't make sense to keep thousands of 1/4-20 bolts that I
can buy if I need more than a dozen. Accordingly, I've gotten rid of lots of
items like that. On the other hand, I have lots of things that I never use but
might need to (where on a Sunday afternoon do you get metric hardened
socket-head capscrews or 1/4-24 bolts with wiring holes?).

As far as actual storing goes, I'll be adding more large shelves and making
better under-the-bench tool space. Most of my stationary tools (geared towards
woodworking) will be going on casters soon. Between-the-joists stock racks are
impractical because of the design. And loading equipment into the yard or
kitchen could be dangerous to my health.

Thanks a lot. As odd as it sounds, getting things in shape is easier with
outside input. Just need to find a decent small lathe and I'll be in good
shape.

GTO(John)

Hi John,

I am surprised that you have not received more responses to this
subject.

Maybe no one else has a space problem :)...Yeah right.

Come guys, how do you work this issue...enquiring minds want to know.

A subject for discussion...how does everyone store items discretely
outside to gain inside floor space so items in question are still
under the radar of the spouse, the neighbors and the zoning board?

Too_Many_Tools (who is resuffling the shop yet again for another mill)


(GTO69RA4) wrote in message ...
OK, the Big Question that hangs over the heads of so many of us. I have a large
(for a basement shop anyway) stash of all kinds of stuff. Supplies, fasteners,
parts, equipment, whatever. My problem isn't storage per se (so recommending
Vidmar cabinets won't help in this case), because I have vast ranks of shelves,
cabinets, and boxes with everything in them, but the fact that my neat storage
is occupying most of the spatial volume. Running out of room for people and
tools.

What kind of tactics do you guys take to maintaining stashes of things without
it getting out of hand? I'm not talking just junk here--mostly good stuff that
now and then I find myself dipping into. Lots of boxes of switches, oddball
screws, whatever. What kind of "supply line" do you keep? How much backstocked
stuff? What do you do when it's time to thin out the flock?

Sorry for asking such a broad question, but it's a lot easier to work through
this kind of thing with outside input. Or rather outside input that doesn't say
"well why don't you just toss all this out" while looking and your drill press
and bandsaw. You guys must have developed methods to deal with the madness.

GTO(John)

I store "Stuff" in plastic totes in metal shelves. Shelves are adjusted so the
totes just fit, 2 per shelf.
In addition, I've picked up a few bakers racks, the SS racks on casters, I
have bought plastic boxes that fit the rails. On some I have made wood shelves
to hold specific items. These are "task-oriented" as they can be moved to the
work - car or machine. For example, one is for battery maintenance. It holds
a booster charger, various battery testers & tools, plus holddowns, cables, ends
etc.

On 2 Apr 2004 07:25:56 -0800, (Too_Many_Tools) wrote:

||Hi John,
||
||I am surprised that you have not received more responses to this
||subject.
||
||Maybe no one else has a space problem :)...Yeah right.
||
||Come guys, how do you work this issue...enquiring minds want to know.
||
||A subject for discussion...how does everyone store items discretely
||outside to gain inside floor space so items in question are still
||under the radar of the spouse, the neighbors and the zoning board?
||
||Too_Many_Tools (who is resuffling the shop yet again for another mill)
||
||
(GTO69RA4) wrote in message
...
|| OK, the Big Question that hangs over the heads of so many of us. I have a
large
|| (for a basement shop anyway) stash of all kinds of stuff. Supplies,
fasteners,
|| parts, equipment, whatever. My problem isn't storage per se (so recommending
|| Vidmar cabinets won't help in this case), because I have vast ranks of
shelves,
|| cabinets, and boxes with everything in them, but the fact that my neat
storage
|| is occupying most of the spatial volume. Running out of room for people and
|| tools.
||
|| What kind of tactics do you guys take to maintaining stashes of things
without
|| it getting out of hand? I'm not talking just junk here--mostly good stuff
that
|| now and then I find myself dipping into. Lots of boxes of switches, oddball
|| screws, whatever. What kind of "supply line" do you keep? How much
backstocked
|| stuff? What do you do when it's time to thin out the flock?
||
|| Sorry for asking such a broad question, but it's a lot easier to work
through
|| this kind of thing with outside input. Or rather outside input that doesn't
say
|| "well why don't you just toss all this out" while looking and your drill
press
|| and bandsaw. You guys must have developed methods to deal with the madness.
||
|| GTO(John)

Rex in Fort Worth

"Grant Erwin" wrote

You need to be ruthlessly honest with yourself. (I believe that some of us
have found our way to this hobby just because our subconscious minds have
guided us here just to learn this lesson!) Do you USE any of those
switches
or miscellaneous on projects? Do you really?

Grant Erwin

Good post. I have gotten rid of a lot of stuff.... including big
tools..... over the last few years. The rule is, if you haven't touched it
in 5 years, out it goes!

Mark