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OT - Hybrid Cars Gas Mileage Calculator [was:] Global Warming Revisited
On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 23:31:48 GMT, "Gary H. Lucas"
wrote: wrote in message roups.com... John Scheldroup wrote: Hybrid Cars Gas Mileage Impact Calculator Interesting Site, but it has easily identifiable flaws. I put in my Astro Van vrses Prius. Sure, the prius won, but that was because they listed the Astro at 15mpg, verses Prius at 56mpg. The Flaw here is my Astro does NOT get that low ball 15MPG on the highway. The Prius reference of 56MPG IS their Highway MPG's, and is supported by discussions in Newsgroups (actually, I have only seen 55 mentioned as a high) I make 400 mile trips a few times a year with that Van. Running anywhere from Chicago traffic to 85MPH, Air Conditioning on and with a slight tailwind, I will get 24-25MPG. The Van will NOT get better mileage at slower speeds. It has 253,000 miles on and climbing. Run those numbers and the perspective changes. Next, I load my Wifes Late model Monte Carlo. I had to Chuckle as again, the Prius MPG was up at 56, and they placed the Monte at 22MPG. HA ! I have NOT gotten less than 30MPG on the highway doing the same trip above ! Finally, the references to the Cadillac are inaccurate as well. I KNOW owners... You can find casual data in other newsgroups, heres one comment: Our experience echos this, we routinely get 18.5+ mpg around town and upwards of 27-30 on the highway when cruising at 70 mph... So they have that wrong as well. Looks like the Prius is always given the highway MPG numbers, but they do not use highay MPG for other cars. I did a couple others as well in which I know what they really get. Myself, I guess I would expect exactly that from a calculator on a webpage called Hybrid.com, where the uno numero priority objective is to make hybrids look really really impressive. Too bad a lot of people fall all over crap like that without getting accurate data. Grummy I also drove an Astro for 140,000 miles and the second one for 40,00 before someone wrecked me. In the family electrical business we had our own gas pump, and CAREFULLY logged every fill up and every mile for years and years of data on all kinds of vehicles, from a Ford Escort and Datsun pickup to an all wheel drive digger derrick. The Datsun pickup got 25 Mpg, and the digger got 2.1mpg. Yeah you had to fill the 30 gallon tank on that sucker at about every gas station you passed! I can honestly tell you I don't believe your mileage figures, because the numbers we have gotten on well maintained vehicles is far less than what everyone else has claimed. Also back in the gas crunch of the seventies the truck drivers all claimed their trucks were more efficient at 65 than 55 because they were geared for that speed. Basic physics says that wind drag and efficiency will be less as you go faster. In test after test with the truck driver driving his own truck, using a calibrated cylinder of diesel no truck driver ever got better mileage. Gary H. Lucas Gary, You seem to have missed the "slight tailwind" used in the Astrovan calcs. I think a 30 mph tailwind is slight. I mean, it could be. Though some people might consider a 50 mph tailwind slight. Besides, he was probably drafting semi trucks. I tried that on my bike years ago. Really saves on gas. Eric |
Nissan Avenir (Sentra) with CD20 diesel motor - gets 50mpg (thats Imperial
gallons - convert to US gallons yourself) of diesel. It has done this for the last 180,000km I have been driving my car. This is a station wagon that will take 5 people, and has enough space in the back that I can sleep in it with the back seat folded away. Why buy an expensive little hatchback, with expensive batteries? |
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Cliff wrote: Is the AC on or off? That can be almost 5 MPG. I am sure he was definately running the Air when he turned those numbers because as you know all too well, Global Warming is so darn hot you would risk heat exhaustion without it. I disagree with the 5Mpg difference on any recent vehicle. Older vehicles used to just about croak when the pump kicked in if the "up idle" device was not functioning. Recent vehicles don't seem to take such a "dive" because they are smaller. You might want to consider selling your '64 Plymouth Valiant and move up to something more efficient to back up your proclaimed "Green-ness" All that said, my Monte always turns 30 (open road), and I don't recall ever getting 35, but I always have the air on in the summer. I doubt it will turn 35 at least routinely..... Lots of variables. Sure. Some of those could be made a whole lot better though to minimize the effect. One, put a switch on the dash to control whether the cruise control should gas it for every hill and let off for every downhill or not. A "Throttle LOCK" of sorts will turn better mileage in most cases. Next, some AC pumps run continuously, others kick in and out. Kick in and out makes more sense to me, but it seems few new cars do that. Regarding that, a vacuum switch should come from the factory to kick out the AC pump on harder acceleration. It should even be adjustable by the owner. Last, Cars should come with a digital throttle position display. You well know that you can just barely press the accelerator down, hold it there, and you will be going faster than you imagined. We ALL seem to overfeed in order to get up to speed. When your not in the way of anyone, an "indicator" of sorts would let you press down just what it takes to go, say, 55mph on flat and level ground. Doing so will eventually get you there. Now for those that did't believe what I said I get with my Astro, I do practice a wierd hobby whenever no one is behind me. My Van seems to Roll like crazy on its own, so, I routinely try to guess how soon to get off the gas and still get to an upcoming turn... I know, wierd, but it is amazing how far you actually can get when you let off the gas. Of course when you "run out of gas", you never seem to coast far enough. Grummy |
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Cliff wrote: You probably don't have a rather precise MPG indicator that can be set & reset as you drive (on level highway, First off, I always check the odometer to the highway markers..... And I am NOT quoting "computer" statistics on my vehicles, I am talking Fill and do the math. I had an Audi that the computer was way way off (no suprise really), but My Monte is/has been dead on. 55 MPH Who the heck goes THAT slow for any period of time ?? Like I said, Better sell your '57 Belvedere Wagon and step up to something a little better for the environment. Grummy |
jimmy wrote: At 65 MPH, mileage was 52 MPG. At 55 MPH, mileage was 57 MPG. At 45 MPH, mileage was 72 MPG. Bought a 4 door 5spd new in '93. Came back from a 1000 mile round trip (500 miles), doing as high as 85mph in 95 degree heat. 2 fillups as I recall, and well over 50mpg IIRC. (I've owned another used one since, maybe two.....hard to remember - I have had near 300 different cars over the years - if it was made, I likely had one for at least a while G) Car costed me just under $7000 for that kind of mileage ( I think I had some discounts). Was not all that doggy really... Drove like a go-Cart. People who bought the "Miser" model reported highs of 58-59mpg. (for those confused, this is the Highest observed highway mpg, NOT average over many years) Not bad for a inexpensive car under $8000.... Whats a Prius Cost again ?? Suzuki 3 bangers sure produced mpg's for a little outlay ! (for those who jump to say they were junk, I had one with close to 200,000 miles on it, and have seen a running original with 340,000 on it - not bad for a "piece of junk") Please dont bother with the "ya but that was not a real car" or "I wouldnt want to get in an accident with one" comments..... This is soley an MPG discussion, thats all. Grummy |
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On Sat, 01 Oct 2005 18:25:52 GMT, (DaveB) wrote:
On Sat, 01 Oct 2005 10:31:21 -0400, Cliff wrote: On 30 Sep 2005 21:56:56 -0700, wrote: But that does not appear to be the case with that "hybrid" website, and THAT is my point. It lists the Prius in particular, at 56mpg. I know it does not get 56mpg on average. What I do know is what people are reporting that it gets, and that is UP TO 55mpg on the highway. Some early owners indicated they only could get 40-45 on the highway. Is that a 55 MPH or a 70 MPH highway? -- Cliff Data from independent product-testing organization Consumer Reports indicates that hybrid cars get less than 60 percent of EPA estimates while navigating city streets. In Consumer Reports' real-world driving test, the Civic Hybrid averaged 26 mpg in the city, while the Toyota Prius averaged 35 mpg, much less than their respective EPA estimates of 47 and 60 mpg. Hybrid cars performed much closer to EPA estimates in Consumer Reports' highway test. Regards Daveb In the meantime, my Geezermobile ( '05 Echo w/ auto tranny, AC ) has been getting 40+ mpg on mostly city driving. Gerry :-)} London, Canada |
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Cliff wrote: I mentioned no such odometer. I Know you didn't. I figured somebody should tell you that if you want halfways accurate calculations figuring MPG's, you better FIRST make sure your odometer logs 1 mile when 1 mile is driven. Maybe that is why your '61 Stude Lark doesn't turn the MPG's you wish it did ?? Grummy |
Cliff wrote: On 30 Sep 2005 21:56:56 -0700, wrote: got lost Understandable, I expect. Funny thing is, I can blame it on the tree huggers ! For Real ! There is a big fight near a marsh area to BAN a company from putting up Wind generators. The fight was once to not build a dirty old power plant. Now that we are literally out of power (strangely enough, those who opposed it still want their new gadgets to work) So, when they try to do windpower, suddenly the birds in the marsh are too stupid to fly around, and they are all worried that they will get killed by the props. Not that they have any EVIDENCE that birds are that dumb, just that they like to oppose everything. In any event, there had been a whole lot of opposition, including people knocking down traffic signs. There were no signs marking crossroads and such for a state highway. Think what you will, but I know those doing so are not referred to as "righties".... H'mmmm. and you wonder why your side is looked upon as a little kooky. Yep, I got lost. "understandable" - for you ? Were YOU knocking signs over Cliff ?? |
Cliff wrote: Keep begging G. For you to "Get a Grip" ???? I think it is way to late for that to happen. There is an obvious loss of brain matter for anything to sink in on your end. Your "BENT" for the side of real hatred. Grummy |
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