Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?

On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.

On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

--
Bod

On 30/03/2018 13:51, Bod wrote:
On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could
"route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

Uh oh! I think I missread about using your phone as a hotspot, my apologies.


--
Bod

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 8:51:18 AM UTC-4, Bod wrote:
On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

--
Bod

The discussion is about a TABLET, not phones. Apparently not all tablets
have GPS, the OP specifically said that he's sure his does not. If he
shared the make/model we could check.

On 30/03/2018 14:34, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 8:51:18 AM UTC-4, Bod wrote:
On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

--
Bod

The discussion is about a TABLET, not phones. Apparently not all tablets
have GPS, the OP specifically said that he's sure his does not. If he
shared the make/model we could check.

Yes, I corrected myself in another post.

--
Bod

trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 8:51:18 AM UTC-4, Bod wrote:
On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

--
Bod

The discussion is about a TABLET, not phones. Apparently not all tablets
have GPS, the OP specifically said that he's sure his does not. If he
shared the make/model we could check.

My iPad has no GPS and I can turn Off GPS on android. Location still works.

Greg

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 13:51:10 +0100, Bod wrote:

On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


** It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.


Lousy "Fruit" products. $1200 for the dang things and $200 worth of
features you can use and $1000 for the "snob factor"

On 30/03/2018 19:11, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 13:51:10 +0100, Bod wrote:

On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.


Lousy "Fruit" products. $1200 for the dang things and $200 worth of
features you can use and $1000 for the "snob factor"

Agreed.

--
Bod

On 3/30/2018 2:11 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 13:51:10 +0100, Bod wrote:

On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.


The only way I saw Bod's reply was through your response to him.
Therefore, I'm using it to tell the whining ****** to pay attention to
the topic. I wasn't discussing a phone nor was the OP. It's "tablet" or
in this case, iPAD.

Don't you have some other issue that doesn't concern you to worry about?

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 13:51:10 +0100, Bod wrote:

On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


** It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

ALL cell phones made in the last decade, or more, have GPS built in.
'Tis the law, at least in the US. Whether it's useful to any
particular app, is another question.

On 03/31/2018 10:30 AM, wrote:
ALL cell phones made in the last decade, or more, have GPS built in.
'Tis the law, at least in the US. Whether it's useful to any
particular app, is another question.

https://www.tomsguide.com/us/FCC-Mob...ews-12775.html

https://www.engadget.com/2011/10/05/...-for-improved/

That's the theory but we're talking about a US government agency. iirc
ten years ago or so they tried to force the chipset makers to include
GPS capability. Being good capitalists the chip people quickly realized
that paying fines for non-compliance was cheaper than including the
functionality.

It's like NextGen 911, which is a source of amusement in our company.
There are a lot of mirrors and much smoke but no progress.

On Saturday, March 31, 2018 at 12:31:00 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 13:51:10 +0100, Bod wrote:

On 30/03/2018 13:10, Meanie wrote:
On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, RagnusenÂ* Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet
definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the
road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline
maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically
connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


Â*Â* It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.

Then you must have either a very old or a cheap phone.
My phone is nearly 4 years old and has GPS built in.

ALL cell phones made in the last decade, or more, have GPS built in.
'Tis the law, at least in the US. Whether it's useful to any
particular app, is another question.


The thread and question is about tablets. Do try to pay attention.

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 08:10:21 -0400, Meanie wrote:

On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.


My error - I was wrong.

There - I said it!


LTE ipads have GPS - their useless ipad 2 (totally brain dead) and
other wifi pads appaerntly do not. I guess all my flying buddies
using Ipads for flight planning and navigationhave LTE units.

Another reason I HATE the "Fruit-pads" Even the lowliest Android, and
the bottom end BlackBery Playbook had a real GPS in them.

On 03/30/2018 12:09 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 08:10:21 -0400, Meanie wrote:

On 3/29/2018 7:55 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


It WILL have a gps in it. Over 99% of tablets today - and cell
phones - have GPS. I don't think Apple makes an I-Pad without GPS.


Then you might want to tell me where it is cause I can't find mine
within my WiFi only Apple iPad Air. In fact, I had to purchase a
separate GPS adapter in order to use mapping apps or use my phone as a
hotspot. Otherwise, there isn't any GPS in it.


My error - I was wrong.

There - I said it!


LTE ipads have GPS - their useless ipad 2 (totally brain dead) and
other wifi pads appaerntly do not. I guess all my flying buddies
using Ipads for flight planning and navigationhave LTE units.

Another reason I HATE the "Fruit-pads" Even the lowliest Android, and
the bottom end BlackBery Playbook had a real GPS in them.


Hey, it's Apple and they can do not wrong. The GPS circuitry is in the
phone module; no phone module, no GPS. Standalone GPS receivers are
inexpensive but if you buy the cheap iPad you're not going to get one.
Cough up the $150 clams.

I recently saw a cartoon where if Apple was selling chocolate Easter
rabbits, the head and ears would be extra cost options. The solid head
option would be $100 more than the hollow head.

On 03/29/2018 03:47 PM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?

An app can query the GPS in your tablet and plot the position using
local geodata that was downloaded when you were connected.

Am Thu, 29 Mar 2018 19:57:31 -0600, schrieb rbowman:

An app can query the GPS in your tablet and plot the position using
local geodata that was downloaded when you were connected.

This would make sense but I must have forgotten to mention this is a
WiFi-only tablet, in that there is neither GPS nor cellular capability.

So the location has to be by some other means than GPS.

In article , Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:


An app can query the GPS in your tablet and plot the position using
local geodata that was downloaded when you were connected.

This would make sense but I must have forgotten to mention this is a
WiFi-only tablet, in that there is neither GPS nor cellular capability.

So the location has to be by some other means than GPS.

you've been told how it works on many, many occasions.

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 17:52:41 -0400, schrieb nospam:

you've been told how it works on many, many occasions.

You just make everything up, like what you just said.

To prove that statement, simply point to the location where anyone was
"told this information", and especially to the "many occasions".

What's that?
You can't?

I know. You just made it up. Like you constantly do.

You just make everything up.
Have you no sense of credibility?

Anyway, you clearly don't know the answer even though this is a simple
technical question, so moving on, I turned off everything I could as the
starting point, where, under that specific circumstance, the Google Maps
app could not track the location.
https://cubeupload.com/im/8urJSE.gif

However, when I started turning stuff on, even without any GPS or cellular
functionality on the tablet,
https://cubeupload.com/im/ndWTJU.gif

So, the end result, for sms and anyone else contemplating purchasing this
128GB 9.7" WiFi-only tablet which I bought three of at Costco about a month
ago for $300, the Google Map app /does/ appear to be able to route even
though the table does not have a GPS or cellular functionality.

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 20:00:45 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 17:52:41 -0400, schrieb nospam:

you've been told how it works on many, many occasions.

You just make everything up, like what you just said.

To prove that statement, simply point to the location where anyone was
"told this information", and especially to the "many occasions".

What's that?
You can't?

I know. You just made it up. Like you constantly do.

You just make everything up.
Have you no sense of credibility?

Anyway, you clearly don't know the answer even though this is a simple
technical question, so moving on, I turned off everything I could as the
starting point, where, under that specific circumstance, the Google Maps
app could not track the location.
https://cubeupload.com/im/8urJSE.gif

However, when I started turning stuff on, even without any GPS or cellular
functionality on the tablet,
https://cubeupload.com/im/ndWTJU.gif

So, the end result, for sms and anyone else contemplating purchasing this
128GB 9.7" WiFi-only tablet which I bought three of at Costco about a month
ago for $300, the Google Map app /does/ appear to be able to route even
though the table does not have a GPS or cellular functionality.


Just try it 15 miles from town with no wifi nearby. It will be
TOTALLY lost.

In article , Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:


you've been told how it works on many, many occasions.

You just make everything up, like what you just said.

To prove that statement, simply point to the location where anyone was
"told this information", and especially to the "many occasions".

right over there ---

Ragnusen Ultred wrote:

I must have forgotten to mention this is a
WiFi-only tablet

You omit to say what O/S it is using.

in that there is neither GPS nor cellular capability.

It was explained to one of your alter-egos some time ago, how Google
uses wifi for coarse geolocation, it may have escaped your notice that
unless explicitly disabled, recent versions of android will do that even
when WiFi is "off".

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 22:56:27 +0100, schrieb Andy Burns:

You omit to say what O/S it is using.

I wasn't sure if it mattered which operating system the tablet is using
because I'm asking about Google Maps app location tracking without cellular
or GPS.
http://i.cubeupload.com/Prq1BQ.gif

But to answer your question clearly, this is an Apple iOS 11.2.6 tablet
bought only a month ago so I'm still in the setup and organization phase
where I was surprised that Google Maps routed and tracked fine without any
GPS or cellular existing.
http://i.cubeupload.com/PXDpGA.gif

Dne 31/03/2018 v 04:54 Ragnusen Ultred napsal(a):
Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 22:56:27 +0100, schrieb Andy Burns:

You omit to say what O/S it is using.

I wasn't sure if it mattered which operating system the tablet is using
because I'm asking about Google Maps app location tracking without cellular
or GPS.

Android applications and I suppose iOS ones as well
do not determine location on their own,
but ask the OS what the location is.

So OS does matter, as how it is done is the OS business.

I have few strange questions:

Does it track you only within ranges of supposed Wifis ?

or

Does it even track you without any wifi in the range ?

In case of the former,

Does it track you only at known locations,
where the device has been before ?

Does it track you even at new locations
with wifis unknown to the device ?

It seems to me not probable
to have pre-downloaded all wifi location database.
Perhaps, it may predownload the data for nearby area only.

I would rather believe the tablet does not behave
in the way you suppose it to behave.

Sometimes a particular HW is present,
but not available for the user rather for business reasons,
being either deactivated or just not used.

It is cheaper to produce 1 version
and selectively disable optional features.
Or, selectively disable it just for user applications,
but not for the OS.

E.g. Xiaomi MI A1 does have the FM radio chip,
( one can listen the radio via the service menu )
but it is not mentioned in manual
and there is no builtin nor downloadable FM application
that would work.


--
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )

A wise man guards words he says,
as they say about him more,
than he says about the subject.

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 5:48:42 PM UTC-4, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Thu, 29 Mar 2018 19:57:31 -0600, schrieb rbowman:

An app can query the GPS in your tablet and plot the position using
local geodata that was downloaded when you were connected.

This would make sense but I must have forgotten to mention this is a
WiFi-only tablet, in that there is neither GPS nor cellular capability.

So the location has to be by some other means than GPS.

You didn't forget, it was very clear. It's just that a lot of people
would rather answer some other question, not the one you actually asked.

On 3/30/2018 5:48 PM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Thu, 29 Mar 2018 19:57:31 -0600, schrieb rbowman:

An app can query the GPS in your tablet and plot the position using
local geodata that was downloaded when you were connected.

This would make sense but I must have forgotten to mention this is a
WiFi-only tablet, in that there is neither GPS nor cellular capability.

So the location has to be by some other means than GPS.

How about telling us the tablet brand and model...., contact the
manufacturer and ask them if it has GPS.

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 18:25:25 -0400, schrieb Meanie:

How about telling us the tablet brand and model...., contact the
manufacturer and ask them if it has GPS.

Just to confirm, the tablet is the cheapest recent Apple 9.7-inch 128GB
WiFi-only tablet, which I bought three of at Costco, where I gave two away
as gifts, and kept one to learn more about it and to help the others use
it. https://cubeupload.com/im/wnaHgc.gif

Currently I have only loaded the following freeware map apps for off trail
and on-road tracking and routing.
https://cubeupload.com/im/QLTUDM.gif

At that cheap price of only $300, the tablet doesn't have cellular or GPS
capabilities, so I had assumed that the tablet couldn't do map routing on
the road, but it turns out that it can do map routing on the road even
without GPS or cellular signal.
https://cubeupload.com/im/ndWTJU.gif

So I'm just asking a simple technical question of /how/ it does that.
https://cubeupload.com/im/ErUuG6.gif

Sometimes, it gives me the following error:
https://cubeupload.com/im/8urJSE.gif

At other times, it does only a preview but not an active route:
https://cubeupload.com/im/Prq1BQ.gif

And yet, it routes at other times.

So I'm just asking someone to explain how that happens, where all the
childish silly semantic games should be left for the Apple children to
play.

On 3/30/2018 8:08 PM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:


So I'm just asking someone to explain how that happens, where all the
childish silly semantic games should be left for the Apple children to
play.

A system that required connecting to random sites would be useless.
A while back, I experimented with the concept and was amazed
by how accurately my position could be determined without gps
or cell service. Google knows the exact location of almost
every access point. I don't know how it interpolates, but it appears to
do so.
You don't have to connect to the site to determine its location.
I don't have any experimental data to confirm. I assume that when
you download an offline google route, you must also get the map
of access points along the route. An interesting experiment
would be to go perpendicularly to the route and see how far you
get before it throws up its hands.

The problem happens when you are in an area between major population
areas and there are no access points within range.

I assert that 'knowing why' is overrated. Take the thing on a test
route and see what happens. Knowing why won't help you at all.
You already know that it's based on wifi.

If you just want to get there, a cheap used phone will very likely
have gps and you can use something like MapFactor Navigator to do the
routing.
That works very well until you get into an area where the crowd-sourced
information is missing or wrong.

A dedicated GPS is a more useful device, but the cheap ones you get
at garage sales and thrift stores have older maps. That turns some
people off. I just find a nearby location that is on an older road
and route to there. Perfection is overrated...

Ragnusen Ultred wrote:

the tablet doesn't have cellular or GPS
capabilities, so I had assumed that the tablet couldn't do map routing on
the road, but it turns out that it can do map routing on the road even
without GPS or cellular signal.
So I'm just asking a simple technical question of /how/ it does that.

iBeacons?

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 14:48:38 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Am Thu, 29 Mar 2018 19:57:31 -0600, schrieb rbowman:

An app can query the GPS in your tablet and plot the position using
local geodata that was downloaded when you were connected.

This would make sense but I must have forgotten to mention this is a
WiFi-only tablet, in that there is neither GPS nor cellular capability.

So the location has to be by some other means than GPS.


It is a "guestimate" derived from the presumed location of wifi in
the local area. No wifi - no location. Poor wifi, poor location.

Basically pretty useless for navigation, and dubvious even for
telling you what is "close by"

In comp.mobile.android, on Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen
Ultred wrote:

Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Check the rear of the car. There may be a long cord attached.

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?

Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
"tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
was telling someone about it, who asked this question:

Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?

My tablet will show me my position without GPS. I often connect to Xfinity
hot spots, but don't use it on the road.

Greg

On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
| Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
| "tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
| not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
| http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif


That screen shot is from an iPad. Notice the little arrow up in the top
right corner, next to the 18% battery indicator? That means GPS is
active.

I don't think Apple have ever made an iPad without a GPS chip.


| Since this was a surprise to me that a WiFi-only tablet could "route" on
| top of an offline (aka "OK MAPS") google map while driving on the road, I
| was telling someone about it, who asked this question:
|
| Q: Is Google using previously stored WiFi AP SSIDs in the offline maps to
| locate your position, or, is the tablet's Wi-Fi automatically connecting to
| open APs, and hence giving away the location by that method?


--
Reverend Paul Colquhoun, ULC. http://andor.dropbear.id.au/
Asking for technical help in newsgroups? Read this first:
http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#intro

On 3/30/2018 6:37 AM, Paul Colquhoun wrote:
On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:47 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
| Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
| "tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
| not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
| http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif


That screen shot is from an iPad. Notice the little arrow up in the top
right corner, next to the 18% battery indicator? That means GPS is
active.

I don't think Apple have ever made an iPad without a GPS chip.



Then someone better tell Apple support. According to them, the WiFi only
models have no GPS capabilities. I can attest to that since my WiFi only
iPad Air isn't capable of GPS connectivity on it's own.

In article , Paul
Colquhoun wrote:

| Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
| "tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
| not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
| http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

That screen shot is from an iPad. Notice the little arrow up in the top
right corner, next to the 18% battery indicator? That means GPS is
active.

nope. it means an app is using location services to obtain the user's
location, which can be done without a hardware gps (and even if there
is a hardware gps, it's not always used).

I don't think Apple have ever made an iPad without a GPS chip.

they did and still do.

wifi-only ipads do not have gps or cellular.

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 11:34:53 AM UTC-4, nospam wrote:
In article , Paul
Colquhoun wrote:

| Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
| "tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
| not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
| http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

That screen shot is from an iPad. Notice the little arrow up in the top
right corner, next to the 18% battery indicator? That means GPS is
active.

nope. it means an app is using location services to obtain the user's
location, which can be done without a hardware gps (and even if there
is a hardware gps, it's not always used).

I don't think Apple have ever made an iPad without a GPS chip.

they did and still do.

wifi-only ipads do not have gps or cellular.

So, the question remains. Assuming the OP is correct and he has a tablet
that does not have GPS or cell service, how is it showing him where he is
on maps while traveling?

trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 11:34:53 AM UTC-4, nospam wrote:
In article , Paul
Colquhoun wrote:

| Recently, I noticed that, on a WiFi-only tablet, the Google Map App was
| "tracking" me while on the road, where the WiFi-only tablet definitely does
| not have a GPS chip nor does it have a cellular capability.
| http://i.cubeupload.com/jOw0fO.gif

That screen shot is from an iPad. Notice the little arrow up in the top
right corner, next to the 18% battery indicator? That means GPS is
active.

nope. it means an app is using location services to obtain the user's
location, which can be done without a hardware gps (and even if there
is a hardware gps, it's not always used).

I don't think Apple have ever made an iPad without a GPS chip.

they did and still do.

wifi-only ipads do not have gps or cellular.

So, the question remains. Assuming the OP is correct and he has a tablet
that does not have GPS or cell service, how is it showing him where he is
on maps while traveling?

Might be a built database of IP locations. I'm not sure if it can
distinguish movement away from set location.

Greg

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 11:34:48 -0400, schrieb nospam:

nope. it means an app is using location services to obtain the user's
location, which can be done without a hardware gps (and even if there
is a hardware gps, it's not always used)

Even though nospam always just guesses so he has a hit rate of about a 33%
(or an F in any classroom), he's actually right, by sheer luck, on this
guess of his.

The tablet /can/ route and track even without having any GPS or cellular
capability.

You have to turn location services on in the Google Map settings.
https://cubeupload.com/im/ErUuG6.gif

In addition, it helps to turn notifications on for the Google Map app.
https://cubeupload.com/im/ndWTJU.gif

At that point, even with no GPS and no cellular capability, the tablet can
actually route and track and do previews, as long as you've previously
downloaded the offline Google Maps of the desired area.
https://cubeupload.com/im/Prq1BQ.gif

The only technical question here is how Google does this, where it's clear
that WiFi is involved.
https://cubeupload.com/im/S79QqL.gif

Because without WiFi, Google can't seem to figure anything out.
https://cubeupload.com/im/8urJSE.gif

So, even after the Apple children have buzzed the picnic like an annoying
set of miserable gnats, the question remains which of the two methods
Google Maps is using for the location services.

1. Is Google using the geolocation of the *connected* WiFi access point?
2. Or is Google using the geolocation of the *unconnected* Wi-Fi APs?

NOTE: When you're on the road, you won't be connected to anything but
wide-open access points, so that's why the answer to the question matters.

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 20:15:09 -0700, Ragnusen Ultred
wrote:

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 11:34:48 -0400, schrieb nospam:

nope. it means an app is using location services to obtain the user's
location, which can be done without a hardware gps (and even if there
is a hardware gps, it's not always used)

Even though nospam always just guesses so he has a hit rate of about a 33%
(or an F in any classroom), he's actually right, by sheer luck, on this
guess of his.

The tablet /can/ route and track even without having any GPS or cellular
capability.

You have to turn location services on in the Google Map settings.
https://cubeupload.com/im/ErUuG6.gif

In addition, it helps to turn notifications on for the Google Map app.
https://cubeupload.com/im/ndWTJU.gif

At that point, even with no GPS and no cellular capability, the tablet can
actually route and track and do previews, as long as you've previously
downloaded the offline Google Maps of the desired area.
https://cubeupload.com/im/Prq1BQ.gif

The only technical question here is how Google does this, where it's clear
that WiFi is involved.
https://cubeupload.com/im/S79QqL.gif

Because without WiFi, Google can't seem to figure anything out.
https://cubeupload.com/im/8urJSE.gif

So, even after the Apple children have buzzed the picnic like an annoying
set of miserable gnats, the question remains which of the two methods
Google Maps is using for the location services.

1. Is Google using the geolocation of the *connected* WiFi access point?
2. Or is Google using the geolocation of the *unconnected* Wi-Fi APs?

NOTE: When you're on the road, you won't be connected to anything but
wide-open access points, so that's why the answer to the question matters.



It works with the unconnected wifi points in the local area - whiuch
means outside built-up wifi intense areas it is TOTALLY USELESS.

As a navigation device it is a BAD JOKE