Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Sat, 5 Aug 2017 17:34:59 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 8/5/2017 4:50 PM, Uncle Monster wrote:

thanks. Some of the younger ones here probably don't know what a Corvair
is.

Heck, I think VW Beetles have liquid cooled engines now. I'm unsafe at any speed. ?(?)?

[8~{} Uncle Airy Monster

Even some motorcycles are liquid cooled now.


"Unsafe At Any Speed" I guess you missed my historical reference? ?(?)?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

[8~{} Uncle Unsafe Monster


I take issue with Nader. I had a '62 Monza with 7.00 x 13 tires and it
handled very well. With snow tires I could go anywhere in winter too.
It ws one of my all time fun crs to drive.
and from 1965 up, they were FANTASTIC!

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Sat, 5 Aug 2017 22:06:51 +0000 (UTC), Bram van den Heuvel
wrote:

Given ,
wrote:

What's the boiling point of unpressurized 50:50 coolant?
About 225F at .96 bar

Thanks Clare and Ed, for those numbers (where Ed said 223F which is close
enough to 225 that I'll use the 225 figure).


The difference is likely the difference between 50-50 glycol/water
and 50-50 commercial antifreeze and water. My number was based on 50%
glycol, Ed's number was 50/50 antifreeze/water.
So, with the cap off, the 50:50 coolant boils at 225 degrees.
With a pressurized system, Ed says we can go to 250 before boiling.
The thermostat has a 180 degree opening point.

If I assume that the coolant is designed to be at around 200 degrees, plus
or minus 10 degrees, that means an unpressurized system should work just
fine for light loads since the coolant stays below the boiling point of
water, at least on average.

I think what was happening was that locally, in hotspots, the coolant was
boiling since it was no longer pressurized.

Does that logic make sense?

could well be. Could also be air bubbles. Pressure helps both.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 5 Aug 2017 14:00:33 +0000 (UTC), Bram van
den Heuvel wrote:

Given aweb.com, Jess
Guessing wrote:

What caused it to crack? Excess pressure, flexing or just old age?

The radiator is the OEM radiator on a 1990's vintage Toyota.

If they didn't make the top plastic, it would still be working, but two
decades is a decent amount of time for a $200 radiator.

Unfortunately, the whack-a-mole game failed in that it still lost pressure
this morning when I tested the epoxy temporary repair (until the parts
arrive).
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...uretestkit.jpg

The question is how far can you drive on an unpressurized system?

You can drive as far as you want if you turn it off and let it cool
every time it gets hot.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 5 Aug 2017 14:55:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski
wrote:

On 8/5/2017 2:33 PM, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 5 Aug 2017 13:49:38 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

I had a Corvair that I drove with no water at all and it never overheated.

Good one, Ed.


thanks. Some of the younger ones here probably don't know what a Corvair
is.

Isn't that some kind of a ship?

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 5 Aug 2017 05:35:28 +0000 (UTC), Bram van
den Heuvel wrote:

Given , Oren
wrote:

I didn't want to mention a blown head gasket. That would likely
introduce some oil into the cooling system.

OP: Remove the radiator cap when the engine is cold. Crank the engine
to see if water is circulating through the radiator (if not the T-stat
needs attention if the water pump is not leaking below the shaft).

Is there oil in the water?

Will you be back to discuss this thread?

This is the color of the fluid which is supposed to be Toyota red.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...r_of_fluid.jpg

I saw water moving when the engine was running and the radiator cap was
removed but is there a good way to test the operation of the water pump?

Don't you believe what you saw?

If it takes quite a while to get too hot, the water pump is working.



---
??E???????? ?????????????????????????
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 05 Aug 2017 16:19:07 -0400,
wrote:



What I just don't know is how much danger there is in driving an
unpressurized system?
As long as it doesn't overheat, there is no danger. I have often
driven a LONG ways with a pinhole in a hose, for instance, by simply
putting the cap on loose and leaving 1n inch or 2 of headroom in the
rad to get home for a repair. All the pressurization does is allow you
to run hotter than 210-212F, and keeps the coolant from evaporating.

Good point. When there's a leak, I think it better not to tighten the
cap, so the pressure doens't increase and it forces the coolant out.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 5 Aug 2017 05:35:23 +0000 (UTC), Bram van
den Heuvel wrote:

pinhole hairline crack

Is it a pinhole or a hairline crack?. I don't think it can be both.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

Given ,
wrote:

As long as it doesn't overheat, there is no danger. I have often
driven a LONG ways with a pinhole in a hose, for instance, by simply
putting the cap on loose and leaving 1n inch or 2 of headroom in the
rad to get home for a repair. All the pressurization does is allow you
to run hotter than 210-212F, and keeps the coolant from evaporating.

Thank you Clare for your helpful hints which I very much am thankful for.

I decided not to risk engine damage. I swallowed my pride to buy a new
radiator at the local dealer (for twice what the online charges were).

I was very livid that the new radiator MUST come with the transmission
cooler, even though mine is a manual. No choice. The dealer only sells
one-size-fits-all radiators which they insist they work as well even though
a portion of the radiator is useless.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...e_radiator.jpg

I replaced the 3 alternator-fan, compressor, & power steering belts.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ange_belts.jpg

When I removed the battery to clean it up, I found this rust!
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ompartment.jpg

Not knowing what to do, I hosed & brushed & put on naval jelly acid.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...aval_jelly.jpg

What do you suggest to fix the battery acid damage on the painted metal?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...h_and_hose.jpg

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Sun, 6 Aug 2017 14:55:32 +0000 (UTC), Bram van den Heuvel
wrote:

When I removed the battery to clean it up, I found this rust!
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ompartment.jpg

Not knowing what to do, I hosed & brushed & put on naval jelly acid.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...aval_jelly.jpg

What do you suggest to fix the battery acid damage on the painted metal?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...h_and_hose.jpg

This product works well.

Loctite® Extend Rust Neutralizer:

http://www.loctiteproducts.com/p/s_trmt_extend/directions/Loctite-Extend-Rust-Neutralizer.htm

Pour some into a small container, brush it on. Do not contaminate to
original bottle by dipping the brush.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Sun, 6 Aug 2017 14:55:32 +0000 (UTC), Bram van den Heuvel
wrote:

Given ,
wrote:

As long as it doesn't overheat, there is no danger. I have often
driven a LONG ways with a pinhole in a hose, for instance, by simply
putting the cap on loose and leaving 1n inch or 2 of headroom in the
rad to get home for a repair. All the pressurization does is allow you
to run hotter than 210-212F, and keeps the coolant from evaporating.

Thank you Clare for your helpful hints which I very much am thankful for.

I decided not to risk engine damage. I swallowed my pride to buy a new
radiator at the local dealer (for twice what the online charges were).

I was very livid that the new radiator MUST come with the transmission
cooler, even though mine is a manual. No choice. The dealer only sells
one-size-fits-all radiators which they insist they work as well even though
a portion of the radiator is useless.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...e_radiator.jpg

I replaced the 3 alternator-fan, compressor, & power steering belts.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ange_belts.jpg

When I removed the battery to clean it up, I found this rust!
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ompartment.jpg

Not knowing what to do, I hosed & brushed & put on naval jelly acid.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...aval_jelly.jpg

What do you suggest to fix the battery acid damage on the painted metal?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...h_and_hose.jpg
Clean up well and coat with a polyurethane or epoxy cahssis paint. I
like the POR15 product for stuff like that. Being protected from UV
under the hood topcoating is not required.
Coating it afterwards with a rubberized rocker guard sure wouldn't
hurt, and would be better than nothing if you can't find POR15 or
equivalent. Even some heavy chassis grease would be better than
nothing.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Sat, 05 Aug 2017 23:17:48 -0400, micky
wrote:

I saw water moving when the engine was running and the radiator cap was
removed but is there a good way to test the operation of the water pump?

Don't you believe what you saw?

+1 The water pump impeller is working. Doesn't mean some radiator
cores are not clogged.

Pool pump impellers circulate water, or not.

OP's pump is okay if it isn't leaking below the shaft. Or a bad
bearing. Good to change it though, while your in there.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Sunday, August 6, 2017 at 9:55:41 AM UTC-5, Bram van den Heuvel wrote:
Given ,
wrote:

As long as it doesn't overheat, there is no danger. I have often
driven a LONG ways with a pinhole in a hose, for instance, by simply
putting the cap on loose and leaving 1n inch or 2 of headroom in the
rad to get home for a repair. All the pressurization does is allow you
to run hotter than 210-212F, and keeps the coolant from evaporating.

Thank you Clare for your helpful hints which I very much am thankful for.

I decided not to risk engine damage. I swallowed my pride to buy a new
radiator at the local dealer (for twice what the online charges were).

I was very livid that the new radiator MUST come with the transmission
cooler, even though mine is a manual. No choice. The dealer only sells
one-size-fits-all radiators which they insist they work as well even though
a portion of the radiator is useless.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...e_radiator.jpg

I replaced the 3 alternator-fan, compressor, & power steering belts.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ange_belts.jpg

When I removed the battery to clean it up, I found this rust!
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ompartment.jpg

Not knowing what to do, I hosed & brushed & put on naval jelly acid.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...aval_jelly.jpg

What do you suggest to fix the battery acid damage on the painted metal?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...h_and_hose.jpg


After you cleanup the battery tray, try spaying it with rubberized undercoating. Spray a couple of coats. It shouldn't hurt anything and will prevent further rusting of the metal. A lot of people servicing battery operated carts use the stuff to prevent further damage to battery trays.ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Tray Monster

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

Given ,
wrote:

Clean up well and coat with a polyurethane or epoxy cahssis paint. I
like the POR15 product for stuff like that. Being protected from UV
under the hood topcoating is not required.
Coating it afterwards with a rubberized rocker guard sure wouldn't
hurt, and would be better than nothing if you can't find POR15 or
equivalent. Even some heavy chassis grease would be better than
nothing.

Thanks for that advice.

I didn't have all the flexibility I would have liked since I had to hitch a
ride to get the paint so here's what it looks like before putting the
battery back (after filling it with distilled water & charging it while I
was working on the vehicle).
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...atterytray.jpg

At the moment, the radiator is in, and I replaced the 1.5 gallons of red
coolant with 1.5 gallons of tap water (for now) until I get the rest of the
parts (hoses, thermostat, gasket) so for a few days, the tap water will
serve as a "flush" of the system.

I ran two cans of OReillys engine cleaner to get rid of the grease and
hosed it all down, and then I noticed that a lot of the vacuum hoses are
cracked, so, I just wonder if there is a metric supply of generic vacuum
hoses?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_cracked.jpg

OReillys seemed to have only US sizes and the dealer will obviously have
the hoses at a hundred times the true cost. But it looks like I should
replace them all.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...cked_hoses.jpg

The hoses are about 20 years old so they're past their prime.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ks_in_hose.jpg

Is the only answer the dealer, or is there a way to get good quality
generic metric vacuum hoses so that I can do the entire engine bay?

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

Given ,
wrote:

The question is how far can you drive on an unpressurized system?
As long as it doesn't het over about 210F, forever.

I didn't want to risk it so I went to the dealer to buy a radiator out of
their stock. It's all in now, where I'll have to do the rest of the job
when the parts come in later this week (hoses and thermostat and gasket).

Right now, it's got tap water in it, since I'm opening it up later anyway,
so this is a "flush" of sorts.

The Toyota guys all say use "red" coolant but I already have "green"
concentrate in stock, and when I read the bottles, they all seem to make
wild claims at the same time they say they work for all makes of cars.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_peak.jpg

For example, does an "Asian" engine really need different coolant?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_asian.jpg

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spillcoolant?)
 

On 8/7/2017 2:57 AM, Bram van den Heuvel wrote:

For example, does an "Asian" engine really need different coolant?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_asian.jpg


I've not had to change coolant for years so I'm not up on the latest
products I did find this though, about Zerex

ZEREX„¢ Asian Vehicle has been designed to meet the requirements of Asian
manufacturers, which specify a silicate free HOAT formula with a
phosphate additive to protect their cooling systems from rust and
corrosion. Available in both red and blue formulas to better match your
Asian vehicles specific requirements.

FYI:
Hybrid Organic Additive Technology
HOAT

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Mon, 7 Aug 2017 06:50:14 +0000 (UTC), Bram van den Heuvel
wrote:

Given ,
wrote:

Clean up well and coat with a polyurethane or epoxy cahssis paint. I
like the POR15 product for stuff like that. Being protected from UV
under the hood topcoating is not required.
Coating it afterwards with a rubberized rocker guard sure wouldn't
hurt, and would be better than nothing if you can't find POR15 or
equivalent. Even some heavy chassis grease would be better than
nothing.

Thanks for that advice.

I didn't have all the flexibility I would have liked since I had to hitch a
ride to get the paint so here's what it looks like before putting the
battery back (after filling it with distilled water & charging it while I
was working on the vehicle).
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...atterytray.jpg

Looks pretty good

At the moment, the radiator is in, and I replaced the 1.5 gallons of red
coolant with 1.5 gallons of tap water (for now) until I get the rest of the
parts (hoses, thermostat, gasket) so for a few days, the tap water will
serve as a "flush" of the system.

I ran two cans of OReillys engine cleaner to get rid of the grease and
hosed it all down, and then I noticed that a lot of the vacuum hoses are
cracked, so, I just wonder if there is a metric supply of generic vacuum
hoses?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_cracked.jpg

The tiny vacuum hoses look pretty good, but the larger hoses are
getting pretty rough. Fuel and emission hose is stocked by your local
NAPA, likely O'Reily and Ktagen etc as well. Up here, Canadian Tire
stocks it

OReillys seemed to have only US sizes and the dealer will obviously have
the hoses at a hundred times the true cost. But it looks like I should
replace them all.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...cked_hoses.jpg

Might get away with cutting back the split ends if the hose is long
enough. Another source is auto wreckers - strip hoses from newer
vehicles.

The hoses are about 20 years old so they're past their prime.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?i...ks_in_hose.jpg

Is the only answer the dealer, or is there a way to get good quality
generic metric vacuum hoses so that I can do the entire engine bay?

Try NAPA since OReilys struck out.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

On Mon, 7 Aug 2017 06:57:04 +0000 (UTC), Bram van den Heuvel
wrote:

Given ,
wrote:

The question is how far can you drive on an unpressurized system?
As long as it doesn't het over about 210F, forever.

I didn't want to risk it so I went to the dealer to buy a radiator out of
their stock. It's all in now, where I'll have to do the rest of the job
when the parts come in later this week (hoses and thermostat and gasket).

Right now, it's got tap water in it, since I'm opening it up later anyway,
so this is a "flush" of sorts.

The Toyota guys all say use "red" coolant but I already have "green"
concentrate in stock, and when I read the bottles, they all seem to make
wild claims at the same time they say they work for all makes of cars.
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_peak.jpg

For example, does an "Asian" engine really need different coolant?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=16_asian.jpg
Just don't mix them and you should be OK. With the green stuff change
evrty 2 or 3 years. The original red is a longer life coolant.

Why would an engine "gurgle" only after turning it off (and spill coolant?)
 

Uncle Monster posted for all of us...



On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 1:55:46 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 8/5/2017 2:33 PM, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 5 Aug 2017 13:49:38 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

I had a Corvair that I drove with no water at all and it never overheated.

Good one, Ed.

thanks. Some of the younger ones here probably don't know what a Corvair
is.


Heck, I think VW Beetles have liquid cooled engines now. I'm unsafe at any speed. ?(?)?

[8~{} Uncle Airy Monster

Who are you? Ralph Nader?

--
Tekkie