I'm re-routing and adding some phone jacks in the house and found an oddity.

Originally, the line came from the telco side of the demarc box over to my
side and was screwed down onto two terminals (red/green). The two cables
that feed the outlets in the house were tied down to these terminals as well
(white/blue pairs).

It appears that when the alarm system was installed, the installer lifted
the original cables and ran a new cable from the telco box to the alarm
control panel. The telco screw downs are tied to his cable (white/blue)
only and the pair goes straight down to the alarm box. It comes out of the
alarm box on his (white/orange) second pair back to the telco box and is
spliced to my original cables' (white/blue) pair. I'm guessing that if/when
the alarm box grabs the line on the inbound pair, it has the outbound pair
open so another phone can't come off hook.

If found the installation manual on the alarm box and what was done is
exactly "per the book". It tells the installer that the alarm system should
have the "first" shot at the phone line and that nothing should be between
the alarm box's connection and the telco interface. No way to fault the
installer, but I do have a couple of concerns.

Since the alarm was installed, we have added DSL. And in case anyone is
particularly knowledgeable, the alarm box is a DSC PC1555.

The alarm guy's wiring is not CAT5, it's CAT3 or some other kind of station
wire and because of the routing, the circuit runs through it and the alarm
box before coming back to the telco box where it's spliced to my inside
wiring. That's adding about 100' of lesser quality cable before I ever have
a chance to get it to my modem.

The DSL signals are high frequency, so that "noise" is getting shot straight
into the alarm box and I see no kind of filter outside the box and no
reference in the box's manual about it having any kind of high frequency
filter.

Occasionally, we have problems with the DSL and I wonder if the alarm box
occasionally grabs the line to report in or just test itself. There's no
sort of filter around the alarm box for this either. If the alarm box comes
off hook, it has to "look" like a telephone and therefore it's presenting a
600 ohm load to the line across the entire frequency band. It think that
this is what the the "store-bought" DSL filters are supposed to prevent.
Maybe this is happening and causing out intermittent "outages". If the
alarm box is grabbing the line and doing what I suspect, then the house
outlets are effectively "dead" when it happens.

Has anyone else ran into this before and did it cause any problems?

My first thought is to tap the alarm guy's cable and grab what is
effectively the "first" presence of the telco pair inside the house to run
my additional outlets and put the appropriate DSL filters on the new drops
that I run. Secondly, I'd like to find out if there is any need for some
other kind of high frequency filter between the line and the alarm box.

TIA-trebor

The CAT3 issue is not a big deal IMHO, as DSL is installed and working on
older quad wire. You are correct about the security panel needing to be
able to 'grab' a line, and you also are probably correct in assuming the
panel does a dial-out periodically to supervise its link with the monitoring
service.

If it was me, I would ask the telco to put your DSL on a second set of
copper from the street so it isn't sharing.

Short of that, if your DSC panel was connected through RJ11 or RJ31X jacks,
you can install one of the modular line filters before the panel - run your
panel and house phones through the phone side and a separate wire to the DSL
side for your modem.

HTH.

--
Regards,

Dwight Duckstein, MCP




"trebor4258" wrote in message
ink.net...
I'm re-routing and adding some phone jacks in the house and found an
oddity.

Originally, the line came from the telco side of the demarc box over to my
side and was screwed down onto two terminals (red/green). The two cables
that feed the outlets in the house were tied down to these terminals as
well
(white/blue pairs).

It appears that when the alarm system was installed, the installer lifted
the original cables and ran a new cable from the telco box to the alarm
control panel. The telco screw downs are tied to his cable (white/blue)
only and the pair goes straight down to the alarm box. It comes out of
the
alarm box on his (white/orange) second pair back to the telco box and is
spliced to my original cables' (white/blue) pair. I'm guessing that
if/when
the alarm box grabs the line on the inbound pair, it has the outbound pair
open so another phone can't come off hook.

If found the installation manual on the alarm box and what was done is
exactly "per the book". It tells the installer that the alarm system
should
have the "first" shot at the phone line and that nothing should be between
the alarm box's connection and the telco interface. No way to fault the
installer, but I do have a couple of concerns.

Since the alarm was installed, we have added DSL. And in case anyone is
particularly knowledgeable, the alarm box is a DSC PC1555.

The alarm guy's wiring is not CAT5, it's CAT3 or some other kind of
station
wire and because of the routing, the circuit runs through it and the alarm
box before coming back to the telco box where it's spliced to my inside
wiring. That's adding about 100' of lesser quality cable before I ever
have
a chance to get it to my modem.

The DSL signals are high frequency, so that "noise" is getting shot
straight
into the alarm box and I see no kind of filter outside the box and no
reference in the box's manual about it having any kind of high frequency
filter.

Occasionally, we have problems with the DSL and I wonder if the alarm box
occasionally grabs the line to report in or just test itself. There's no
sort of filter around the alarm box for this either. If the alarm box
comes
off hook, it has to "look" like a telephone and therefore it's presenting
a
600 ohm load to the line across the entire frequency band. It think that
this is what the the "store-bought" DSL filters are supposed to prevent.
Maybe this is happening and causing out intermittent "outages". If the
alarm box is grabbing the line and doing what I suspect, then the house
outlets are effectively "dead" when it happens.

Has anyone else ran into this before and did it cause any problems?

My first thought is to tap the alarm guy's cable and grab what is
effectively the "first" presence of the telco pair inside the house to run
my additional outlets and put the appropriate DSL filters on the new drops
that I run. Secondly, I'd like to find out if there is any need for some
other kind of high frequency filter between the line and the alarm box.

TIA-trebor

"trebor4258" wrote in message
ink.net...
I'm re-routing and adding some phone jacks in the house and found an
oddity.

Try this link, it has a good
schematic.http://home.earthlink.net/~gingerbarth/schematic.html

"trebor4258" writes:

I'm re-routing and adding some phone jacks in the house and found an oddity.


Since the alarm was installed, we have added DSL. And in case anyone is
particularly knowledgeable, the alarm box is a DSC PC1555.

[...]


The alarm guy's wiring is not CAT5, it's CAT3 or some other kind of station
wire and because of the routing, the circuit runs through it and the alarm
box before coming back to the telco box where it's spliced to my inside
wiring. That's adding about 100' of lesser quality cable before I ever have
a chance to get it to my modem.

The DSL signals are high frequency, so that "noise" is getting shot straight
into the alarm box and I see no kind of filter outside the box and no
reference in the box's manual about it having any kind of high frequency
filter.

Occasionally, we have problems with the DSL and I wonder if the alarm box
occasionally grabs the line to report in or just test itself. There's no
sort of filter around the alarm box for this either. If the alarm box comes
off hook, it has to "look" like a telephone and therefore it's presenting a
600 ohm load to the line across the entire frequency band. It think that
this is what the the "store-bought" DSL filters are supposed to prevent.
Maybe this is happening and causing out intermittent "outages". If the
alarm box is grabbing the line and doing what I suspect, then the house
outlets are effectively "dead" when it happens.

Has anyone else ran into this before and did it cause any problems?

Yes. I know some people who experienced periodic DSL dropouts due to
this.

My first thought is to tap the alarm guy's cable and grab what is
effectively the "first" presence of the telco pair inside the house to run
my additional outlets and put the appropriate DSL filters on the new drops
that I run. Secondly, I'd like to find out if there is any need for some
other kind of high frequency filter between the line and the alarm box.

The second best solution to the DSL problem is to run a separate loop
from the phone entrance to the DSL modem. That could mean moving the
modem to the entrance and running CAT5 to the computer/router. The
best solution is to get a "whole house DSL filter". The filter has one
"in" and a separate "out" for the DSL modem and a separate "out" for
the other phone stuff. Call whichever entity you think is most
responsible for the problem (alarm co IMO) and try to get them to fix
it for you. If that doesn't work, ask them where to buy an apropriate
whole house DSL filter.

Note that the whole house filter is a good idea anyway as it gets rid
of all the short wire stubs in the house and could conceivably improve
your DSL speed.

Bruce

"Bruce Walzer" wrote in message
...
"trebor4258" writes:

I'm re-routing and adding some phone jacks in the house and found an
oddity.


Since the alarm was installed, we have added DSL. And in case anyone is
particularly knowledgeable, the alarm box is a DSC PC1555.

[...]


The alarm guy's wiring is not CAT5, it's CAT3 or some other kind of
station
wire and because of the routing, the circuit runs through it and the
alarm
box before coming back to the telco box where it's spliced to my inside
wiring. That's adding about 100' of lesser quality cable before I ever
have
a chance to get it to my modem.

The DSL signals are high frequency, so that "noise" is getting shot
straight
into the alarm box and I see no kind of filter outside the box and no
reference in the box's manual about it having any kind of high frequency
filter.

Occasionally, we have problems with the DSL and I wonder if the alarm box
occasionally grabs the line to report in or just test itself. There's no
sort of filter around the alarm box for this either. If the alarm box
comes
off hook, it has to "look" like a telephone and therefore it's presenting
a
600 ohm load to the line across the entire frequency band. It think that
this is what the the "store-bought" DSL filters are supposed to prevent.
Maybe this is happening and causing out intermittent "outages". If the
alarm box is grabbing the line and doing what I suspect, then the house
outlets are effectively "dead" when it happens.

Has anyone else ran into this before and did it cause any problems?

Yes. I know some people who experienced periodic DSL dropouts due to
this.

My first thought is to tap the alarm guy's cable and grab what is
effectively the "first" presence of the telco pair inside the house to
run
my additional outlets and put the appropriate DSL filters on the new
drops
that I run. Secondly, I'd like to find out if there is any need for some
other kind of high frequency filter between the line and the alarm box.

The second best solution to the DSL problem is to run a separate loop
from the phone entrance to the DSL modem. That could mean moving the
modem to the entrance and running CAT5 to the computer/router. The
best solution is to get a "whole house DSL filter". The filter has one
"in" and a separate "out" for the DSL modem and a separate "out" for
the other phone stuff. Call whichever entity you think is most
responsible for the problem (alarm co IMO) and try to get them to fix
it for you. If that doesn't work, ask them where to buy an apropriate
whole house DSL filter.

Note that the whole house filter is a good idea anyway as it gets rid
of all the short wire stubs in the house and could conceivably improve
your DSL speed.

Bruce



I just used one of the provided filters. Split the incoming wire in the
basement. Ran the raw feed to the DSL modem and used one of those mini plug
in filters for the rest of the house. May not be the right way but it has
worked fine for 2+ years. Total cost was 10-15$ for the modular plugs
cables and a scrap of plywood to mount it all.

Be happy to share more details if you need them.


--
Colbyt
Remove " stopspam." from the email address to reply via email

"
I just used one of the provided filters. Split the incoming wire in the
basement. Ran the raw feed to the DSL modem and used one of those mini
plug
in filters for the rest of the house. May not be the right way but it has
worked fine for 2+ years. Total cost was 10-15$ for the modular plugs
cables and a scrap of plywood to mount it all.

Be happy to share more details if you need them.


--
Colbyt
Remove " stopspam." from the email address to reply via email


I did the same thing with the same good results. Been working for 1 1/2+
years. This really is the way to go -- avoids loading down the DSL with old
wiring, missed filters on an extension phone, etc.

"trebor4258" writes:


I'm re-routing and adding some phone jacks in the house and found
an oddity.




Since the alarm was installed, we have added DSL. And in case
anyone is
particularly knowledgeable, the alarm box is a DSC PC1555.



[...]



The alarm guy's wiring is not CAT5, it's CAT3 or some other kind of
station
wire and because of the routing, the circuit runs through it and
the alarm
box before coming back to the telco box where it's spliced to my inside
wiring. That's adding about 100' of lesser quality cable before I
ever have
a chance to get it to my modem.



The DSL signals are high frequency, so that "noise" is getting shot
straight
into the alarm box and I see no kind of filter outside the box and no
reference in the box's manual about it having any kind of high
frequency
filter.



Occasionally, we have problems with the DSL and I wonder if the
alarm box
occasionally grabs the line to report in or just test itself.
There's no
sort of filter around the alarm box for this either. If the alarm
box comes
off hook, it has to "look" like a telephone and therefore it's
presenting a
600 ohm load to the line across the entire frequency band. It
think that
this is what the the "store-bought" DSL filters are supposed to
prevent.
Maybe this is happening and causing out intermittent "outages". If the
alarm box is grabbing the line and doing what I suspect, then the house
outlets are effectively "dead" when it happens.



Has anyone else ran into this before and did it cause any problems?



Yes. I know some people who experienced periodic DSL dropouts due to
this.


My first thought is to tap the alarm guy's cable and grab what is
effectively the "first" presence of the telco pair inside the house
to run
my additional outlets and put the appropriate DSL filters on the
new drops
that I run. Secondly, I'd like to find out if there is any need
for some
other kind of high frequency filter between the line and the alarm box.



The second best solution to the DSL problem is to run a separate loop
from the phone entrance to the DSL modem. That could mean moving the
modem to the entrance and running CAT5 to the computer/router. The
best solution is to get a "whole house DSL filter". The filter has one
"in" and a separate "out" for the DSL modem and a separate "out" for
the other phone stuff. Call whichever entity you think is most
responsible for the problem (alarm co IMO) and try to get them to fix
it for you. If that doesn't work, ask them where to buy an apropriate
whole house DSL filter.

Note that the whole house filter is a good idea anyway as it gets rid
of all the short wire stubs in the house and could conceivably improve
your DSL speed.

Bruce


I am going to agree with Bruce in principal but suggest a good way to do
the same thing with the filter you already have. Buy a duplex phone
jack and wire it to the demarcation equipment. From one of it's jacks
run the pair to the DSL modem. From the other jack connect one filter
and run that pair to the alarm system terminals. From the alarm system
output terminals run your pair to a punch down or terminal block.
Connect all of the telephone jacks in the house to that block. With the
filter between the line and the alarm equipment it's periodic dial tone
checks will no longer dump the DSL signal.
--
Tom H