My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

I counted 111 coils of what seems to be 1/4 inch steel, with a set length
of 28.5 inches (but a broken untensioned total spring length of 26.75
inches).

Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.

I'm sure most will say "just pay someone" (i.e, too dangerous, too
difficult, too expensive, etc.); but that's not what this group is about.

I'll research what I can and report back but if you've actually done it
(I realize most people have NOT) ... it would be useful to get your
advice.

Note: I realize a torsion garage door spring DIY endeavor is like DIY car
alignment or like putting in automotive struts where most of the people
say it's just not worth it but almost all of those who say it's not worth
it actually have never even thought about what it really takes - nor have
they tried - and neither have they actually done it. So, their advice,
while well meant, is next to useless unless they've actually done it.

What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

Searching alt.home.repair, I find these of import:
2/14/04 by DIY Klutz, 117 posts
Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?

7/30/97 by David Buxton, 7 posts
garage door spring broken, is that DIY?

6/19/97 by md, 7 posts
Broken Garage Door Spring

7/13/99, by Neil W., 9 posts
Help Replace Garage Door Spring

9/6/99, by Fred and Jan Berman, 4 posts
Cost to replace garage door spring

I'll report back what I find when I read these.

On Sun, 4 Nov 2012 01:25:27 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

Searching alt.home.repair, I find these of import:
2/14/04 by DIY Klutz, 117 posts
Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?

7/30/97 by David Buxton, 7 posts
garage door spring broken, is that DIY?

6/19/97 by md, 7 posts
Broken Garage Door Spring

7/13/99, by Neil W., 9 posts
Help Replace Garage Door Spring

9/6/99, by Fred and Jan Berman, 4 posts
Cost to replace garage door spring

I'll report back what I find when I read these.

I have done it twice and lived.

Hardest part these days is finding replacements. You used to be able
to buy at any HW store or even the Borg, but no longer, at least
around here. (N. Ohio) And the garage repair places I called wouldn't
sell to a non-pro. I ended up ordering online, and they took a week
to get. Wasn't a show stopper for me but would be for many.

You should replace both.
Get new springs that are the same length, diameter, and wire gauge.
Count how many turns it takes to unwind the unbroken spring.
Wind the new ones up a few turns less and check balance, adjust if
needed. Wind them both the same.

Get proper winding bars, wear full face protection, and don't place
yourself where you will be injured if something slips and a bar gets
thrown. Always have one bar fully engaged and go slow. Make sure the
locking bolts on the non-winding side are really tight.

Check the wire ropes and pulleys, if they need replacing, now's the
time to do it. Make sure to check the end of the wire ropes that slip
over the pin at the bottom of the door. If it's going to rust
through, that's usually where it will happen.

Coat the new springs with oil every year or two to keep them from
rusting.

Good luck and be careful.

Paul F.

On Nov 3, 9:20*pm, Paul Franklin
wrote:
On Sun, 4 Nov 2012 01:25:27 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."





wrote:
On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

Searching alt.home.repair, I find these of import:
2/14/04 by DIY Klutz, 117 posts
Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?

7/30/97 by David Buxton, 7 posts
garage door spring broken, is that DIY?

6/19/97 by md, 7 posts
Broken Garage Door Spring

7/13/99, by Neil W., 9 posts
Help Replace Garage Door Spring

9/6/99, by Fred and Jan Berman, 4 posts
Cost to replace garage door spring

I'll report back what I find when I read these.

I have done it twice and lived.

Hardest part these days is finding replacements. *You used to be able
to buy at any HW store or even the Borg, but no longer, at least
around here. (N. Ohio) *And the garage repair places I called wouldn't
sell to a non-pro. *I ended up ordering online, and they took a week
to get. *Wasn't a show stopper for me but would be for many.

You should replace both.
Get new springs that are the same length, diameter, and wire gauge.
Count how many turns it takes to unwind the unbroken spring.
Wind the new ones up a few turns less and check balance, adjust if
needed. Wind them both the same.

Get proper winding bars, wear full face protection, and don't place
yourself where you will be injured if something slips and a bar gets
thrown. Always have one bar fully engaged and go slow. Make sure the
locking bolts on the non-winding side are really tight.

Check the wire ropes and pulleys, if they need replacing, now's the
time to do it. *Make sure to check the end of the wire ropes that slip
over the pin at the bottom of the door. *If it's going to rust
through, that's usually where it will happen.

Coat the new springs with oil every year or two to keep them from
rusting.

Good luck and be careful.

Paul F.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Do you have only 1 big spring, or do you have a pair, and only 1 of
the two has broken, your description was not clear.

First, find the manufacturer of the door and go to their web site to
see what information you can get.

Then tell us approximately where you live and maybe someone on the
group knows of a spring source near to where you live.

You will need sturdy bars to wind the new spring up to the right
tension. Get ones that fit the holes in the winder easily, but not so
small that they aren't strong enuf.

Glad to see you want to try it yourself, just be careful, and get the
car way away from the garage. If something goes wrong, the winding
bars can get thrown at least 100 feet.

On Sat, 03 Nov 2012 19:55:46 -0700, hr(bob) wrote:

Do you have only 1 big spring, or do you have a pair, and only 1 of the
two has broken, your description was not clear.

Only 1 spring.

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:25:27 +0000, Danny D. wrote:

I'll report back what I find when I read these.

These threads are 90% old wives tales and only 10% real data, so here's
the real data I found in the aforementioned threads.

Critical dimensions: http://www.glasscityspring.com/criticaldims.aspx
- Spring length = 28.5 inches
- Wire diameter = 0.250 inch
- Helix direction = right hand spring
- Spring ID = 2.0 inches
- Spring OD = 2 1/2 inches
- Torsion rod diameter = 1 inch OD
- Cable drum OK = 4"

Here is a DIY recommended in one of the alt.home.repair posts:
http://truetex.com/garage.htm
How I Replaced Deadly Garage Door Torsion Springs
And lived to tell the tale.
Richard J. Kinc

Torsion spring formulas:
http://www.srl.gatech.edu/education/...er/torsion.htm

Larger wire diameter lasts longer (aim is 10K cycles).
http://www.smihq.org/public/publicat...yclopedia.html

Door & Access Systems Manufacturers Association DASMA color code chart:
http://www.glasscityspring.com/dasmacolorchart.aspx

Recommended springs:
http://diygaragerepair.com/sectionalsprings.htm

Torsion springs:
http://www.garagedooropeners.net/door_springs.html
http://www.aaaremotes.com/garagedoorsprings.html
http://www.overheaddoorparts.com/Spring_chart.htm (800)829-6002
http://www.garage-door.com/SecSpring.htm
http://www.hurleyspring.com/quote/quote4.htm
http://www.jwsgaragedoor.com/springpage.htm
http://www.newcombspring.com/torsn.html
http://www.generalwirespring.com/
http://www.steelbuilding.com/doors/garage_doors.htm
http://centuryspringmfg.com/Springs/...n_springs.html

How to stretch the life of a torsion spring:
http://www.dasma.com/articles/tech/tips38.asp

How to measure a torsion spring:
http://www.dasma.com/articles/tech/tips25.asp

Special attention for single torsion spring systems:
http://www.dasma.com/articles/tech/tips33.asp

On 11/3/2012 11:52 PM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:25:27 +0000, Danny D. wrote:

I'll report back what I find when I read these.

These threads are 90% old wives tales and only 10% real data, so here's
the real data I found in the aforementioned threads.

Critical dimensions: http://www.glasscityspring.com/criticaldims.aspx
- Spring length = 28.5 inches
- Wire diameter = 0.250 inch
- Helix direction = right hand spring
- Spring ID = 2.0 inches
- Spring OD = 2 1/2 inches
- Torsion rod diameter = 1 inch OD
- Cable drum OK = 4"

Here is a DIY recommended in one of the alt.home.repair posts:
http://truetex.com/garage.htm
How I Replaced Deadly Garage Door Torsion Springs
And lived to tell the tale.
Richard J. Kinc

Torsion spring formulas:
http://www.srl.gatech.edu/education/...er/torsion.htm

Larger wire diameter lasts longer (aim is 10K cycles).
http://www.smihq.org/public/publicat...yclopedia.html

Door & Access Systems Manufacturers Association DASMA color code chart:
http://www.glasscityspring.com/dasmacolorchart.aspx

Recommended springs:
http://diygaragerepair.com/sectionalsprings.htm

Torsion springs:
http://www.garagedooropeners.net/door_springs.html
http://www.aaaremotes.com/garagedoorsprings.html
http://www.overheaddoorparts.com/Spring_chart.htm (800)829-6002
http://www.garage-door.com/SecSpring.htm
http://www.hurleyspring.com/quote/quote4.htm
http://www.jwsgaragedoor.com/springpage.htm
http://www.newcombspring.com/torsn.html
http://www.generalwirespring.com/
http://www.steelbuilding.com/doors/garage_doors.htm
http://centuryspringmfg.com/Springs/...n_springs.html

How to stretch the life of a torsion spring:
http://www.dasma.com/articles/tech/tips38.asp

How to measure a torsion spring:
http://www.dasma.com/articles/tech/tips25.asp

Special attention for single torsion spring systems:
http://www.dasma.com/articles/tech/tips33.asp

In my previous house I had 2 springs on a very heavy 2 car door. In the
36 years there, I can't even count the number of times the springs
broke. The 1st 3 or 4 times, I got someone to replace them. However,
for the majority of breaks, I did the replacement. I always was able to
get the springs from, of all places, Ace. The last one broke about 5 or
6 years ago and I had no problem, at that time, getting the spring at
one of the Ace stores. They are usually color coded. One of the ends
always had a spray splotch of a colored paint. I remember mine was
white. The other thing you need to know is CW or CCW winding. The 1s
time I did it it took 3 or 4 hours as I was discovering how to do it
safely. However, I think the last one took only about an hour ... it
took more time to find the spring. I would check Ace and if they don't
have them on the shelf, maybe they could order it.

What about if I replaced the torsion spring on my sister's garage door? Does that count?

Basically, the way the garage door works is that the weight of the door causes the torsion spring to wind up so that you have the force of the spring available to raise the door when needed. All the time the door is in the down position, the tension in the spring is a maximum. When you open the door, the tension in the spring is at a minimum, and when you lower the door back down again, the spring winds up again. So the force exerted by the spring should be ALMOST equal to the weight of the door. That means that you, or the garage door opener, have to supply very little force to raise the door. That's cuz the unwinding spring is providing most of the lifting force needed.

You have to disconnect the cables on each side from the garage door, and then take the whole assembly off from above your garage door. That means the torsion shaft, torsion spring and cable drums at each end all have to come off as an assembly. Since your torsion spring is broken, there won't be any tension on the cables that pull the door up, and so they should just unhook from the sides of the garage door.

Once the whole assembly is on the ground, you can replace the torsion spring. You have to take the cable drum off of one end, unbolt the torsion spring and slide it off the torsion shaft and then put the hardware from the old spring onto the new one. Now, be careful on this point because there are both left and right hand torsion springs and you have to buy the same kind of spring you had before. You can buy new torsion springs from any of the places listed under "Overhead Doors" in your yellow pages phone book. Or, contact the manufacturer of your door and find out who sells their products in your area now. That place would know who sells generic torsion springs locally. (Also, my understanding is that torsion springs are rated for a certain number of cycles, and so you can get both regular and longer lasting (or heavy duty) torsion springs.)

When I bought the torsion spring for my sister's garage door, I just took the old spring down to an overhead door place, and they just took the old hardware off the broken spring and put it on a new spring for me, and I'd suggest you do the same. If you buy the spring from them, moving the hardware over only takes them a minute, and they'll do it free. Apparantly, moving the hardware over can be quite hard to do unless you know how and have a strong vice available to you.

Once you install the new torsion spring, you mount the whole assembly above your door and you're gonna need some helpers to hold that assembly in place while you re-insert all the screws that held it in place before.

Then you wind the cable on each side of the door carefully onto the cable drums, connect the cable ends to the door and remove any slack in the cable by clamping a pair of Vice Grips onto the edge of the cable drum so that the weight of the Vice Grips applies a twisting force to the cable drum, thereby keeping the cables under a bit of tension. That ensures that both cables are taught to begin with, and so there will be the same upward lifting force on each side of the door. That'll avoid potential problems with the door binding because one side is lifting before the other side.

With the door in the down position, you then use a pair of bars (1/2 inch rebars each 18 to 24 inches long will work fine) to preload the torsion spring anywhere from 5 to 8 turns depending on your door. (The manufacturer's installation manual will tell you how many turns you need for each kind of door they make.) Once you've preloaded the torsion spring with the correct number of turns, you then tighten the bolts in the "knuckle" that screws into the end of the torsion spring. Those bolts act as set screws and transfer the twisting force in the spring to the hollow steel shaft that goes through the torsion spring. So, the twisting force in the torsion spring wants to turn the hollow steel torsion shaft that goes through the middle of the spring, and cable drums at each end of the torsion shaft transfer the twisting force in the torsion shaft into an upward pull on the cables attached to the door.

So, once you tighten the 4 bolts in that knuckle, and remove the bars from the holes in the knuckle, the full force of the spring is then pulling up on the door via the tension in the cables on each end of the torsion shaft.

Then, if you've preloaded the torsion spring the right number of turns, you should be able to open your garage door easily (cuz the spring is assisting).

It's more dangerous to unwind a torsion spring than to wind one up. That's because when you unwind a spring, you put one of the steel bars into a hole in the knuckle and loosen the set screws (set bolts actually) that transfer the torsion in the spring to the steel torsion shaft. Once those bolts are no longer clamped down tight on that torsion shaft, the only thing stopping that spring from unwinding uncontrolably is the fact that the steel bars you're holding are preventing the knuckle in the end of the torsion spring from turning. So, you feel the force of the spring applied suddenly to the bars you're holding, and if you're not expecting that, you could let go of the bar and have it swing and smack you on the head, face or shoulder.

But, in your case, your spring is broken, so there's no tension on it at all. You just have to disconnect the cables on each side of the door, take the whole assembly down, replace the torsion spring with a new one, put the assembly back up, wrap the cables around the drums and connect them to the door (and take any slack out of the cables by clamping a pair of Vice Grips to the cable drum on each end of the assembly), and then wind up the spring with a pair of bars, tighten the knuckle set screws, remove your bars, remove your Vice Grips and test the operation of your door.

You're best bet is to contact the manufacturer of your door and see if you can download the original installation instructions that came with your door. That will tell you how to install the assembly, including the number of turns of the torsion spring to preload it. Just follow those directions and you should be fine.

But, ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS, keep your head and face out of the plane those steel bars would swing in so that if they slip out of your hands and the spring swings them, you won't get seriously hurt. Remember, you'll be working from a step ladder, and if a swinging bar hit's you on the head and you fall from that ladder, you can be hurt by the bar, the fall or both. The force of the spring is not real strong, but a swinging steel bar would give you a real good bruise and could easily break the thin bone of the skull.

But, as long as you keep your head and face out of the swing plane of the winding bars while preloading the spring, you're avoiding most of the potential danger associated with replacing a garage door torsion spring.

PS:

I just looked at your picture and I notice you have a garage door opener connected to your garage door. So, the only change in the procedure would be to disconnect the garage door opener from the garage door before disconnecting the cables and taking the whole assembly down. Similarily, after you put the assembly back up and preload the torsion spring, then test the operation of the door manually, and reconnect the opener and test the operation of the door again.

"Danny D." wrote in message
...
My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

I counted 111 coils of what seems to be 1/4 inch steel, with a set length
of 28.5 inches (but a broken untensioned total spring length of 26.75
inches).

Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.

I'm sure most will say "just pay someone" (i.e, too dangerous, too
difficult, too expensive, etc.); but that's not what this group is about.

I'll research what I can and report back but if you've actually done it
(I realize most people have NOT) ... it would be useful to get your
advice.

Note: I realize a torsion garage door spring DIY endeavor is like DIY car
alignment or like putting in automotive struts where most of the people
say it's just not worth it but almost all of those who say it's not worth
it actually have never even thought about what it really takes - nor have
they tried - and neither have they actually done it. So, their advice,
while well meant, is next to useless unless they've actually done it.

What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

I'm with you. I changed one myself. But I could never get it adjusted
right. Finally I called out a guy from the garage door place. He adjusted
it in about five minutes, charged me $20. Said he would have replaced the
thing for $40 labor, and the spring would have been LESS than I paid. Said
he's seen people get busted teeth, fingers, etc, trying to do it. I'll
never do it again at that price. I charge $85 an hour for my work, and I
figure I had about $200 in my time tied up. Plus the $20. Plus the spring.

Never again.

Steve

On Sat, 3 Nov 2012 21:52:56 -0700, "Steve B" wrote:




I'm with you. I changed one myself. But I could never get it adjusted
right. Finally I called out a guy from the garage door place. He adjusted
it in about five minutes, charged me $20. Said he would have replaced the
thing for $40 labor, and the spring would have been LESS than I paid. Said
he's seen people get busted teeth, fingers, etc, trying to do it. I'll
never do it again at that price. I charge $85 an hour for my work, and I
figure I had about $200 in my time tied up. Plus the $20. Plus the spring.

Never again.

Steve


Yeah, I'd call a door guy out and maybe a couple more if I didn't like
the prices. I've adjusted them, and it's all common sense, but
finding the right replacement spring could be a hassle.
Then there's your time doing it right and safe.
Just as one data point, I had my old wood door (16' x 7', 4 section)
replaced with a metal one a few months ago. $900.
2 remotes, keypad and push button.
2 guys, maybe an hour and a half, old door hauled away.
Pow, pow, pow. New door is smooth as silk.

On 11/3/2012 11:52 PM, Steve B wrote:
"Danny D." wrote in message
...
My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

I counted 111 coils of what seems to be 1/4 inch steel, with a set length
of 28.5 inches (but a broken untensioned total spring length of 26.75
inches).

Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.

I'm sure most will say "just pay someone" (i.e, too dangerous, too
difficult, too expensive, etc.); but that's not what this group is about.

I'll research what I can and report back but if you've actually done it
(I realize most people have NOT) ... it would be useful to get your
advice.

Note: I realize a torsion garage door spring DIY endeavor is like DIY car
alignment or like putting in automotive struts where most of the people
say it's just not worth it but almost all of those who say it's not worth
it actually have never even thought about what it really takes - nor have
they tried - and neither have they actually done it. So, their advice,
while well meant, is next to useless unless they've actually done it.

What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

I'm with you. I changed one myself. But I could never get it adjusted
right. Finally I called out a guy from the garage door place. He adjusted
it in about five minutes, charged me $20. Said he would have replaced the
thing for $40 labor, and the spring would have been LESS than I paid. Said
he's seen people get busted teeth, fingers, etc, trying to do it. I'll
never do it again at that price. I charge $85 an hour for my work, and I
figure I had about $200 in my time tied up. Plus the $20. Plus the spring.

Never again.

Steve



That was about the same as my experience but I didn't even try to fix it.

Total cost $331. (Springs and install)

(Sorry about the email)

Danny D.

Looks like you've done the research. The write-up at truetex.com is the same one I used and it covers the process well.

I took the broken spring to a local garage door shop and they sold me a couple over the counter. If you have a Menards in your area they now carry a good selection of springs. You can get the right spring by taking measurements, bringing the spring in to compare or just weigh the door.

They also have a new system that allows you to adjust the tension with a drill. It's expensive to convert a door, but it takes much of the worry out of the process.

It's not rocket science, but it is dangerous. Make sure you have the right tools and a sturdy step ladder. Think ahead, go slow, and keep your body parts away from the plane of the rods. Inspect all the other parts and replace as needed so you only have to do it once.

In my case I had a 16-foot redwood door that weighed in at several hundred pounds. I had to dismantle the whole door just to get one of my cars out of the garage to go get the new springs. My neighbor once broke a spring and a guy was there an hour later to fix it.

I'm adding a new garage on to my house this month and will be reusing my current door. Regulations prohibit anyone other than the owner from reinstalling an old door so I'll be doing it again soon. I'm retired so my time is cheap.

Good luck and be careful.

dss

On 11/3/12 9:14 PM, Danny D. wrote:
My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

I counted 111 coils of what seems to be 1/4 inch steel, with a set length
of 28.5 inches (but a broken untensioned total spring length of 26.75
inches).

Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.

I'm sure most will say "just pay someone" (i.e, too dangerous, too
difficult, too expensive, etc.); but that's not what this group is about.

I'll research what I can and report back but if you've actually done it
(I realize most people have NOT) ... it would be useful to get your
advice.

Note: I realize a torsion garage door spring DIY endeavor is like DIY car
alignment or like putting in automotive struts where most of the people
say it's just not worth it but almost all of those who say it's not worth
it actually have never even thought about what it really takes - nor have
they tried - and neither have they actually done it. So, their advice,
while well meant, is next to useless unless they've actually done it.

What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).


If you know so little about replacing a set of garage door springs and
the dangers thereof that you're seeking advice in a newsgroup, you and
your family would definitely be better served by hiring a guy who knows
what he's doing.

However, if you're still of a mind to try it yourself, first make sure
you have very good health insurance that includes coverage for
prostheses and extended rehab. You'll also want to have a comprehensive
long term disability policy that covers loss of limb/eye-- and maybe
brain damage;-)

And finally, if you really screw the pooch while up on your rickety
ladder--have enough life insurance so that good lookin' widow of yours--
and the kids-- can survive long enough until she finds some other dude
to haul her ashes and take care of your family...


--
Don't forget to change your clocks on Saturday-- and your President on
Tuesday.
-- @deanlosal

"Danny D." wrote:

My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

I counted 111 coils of what seems to be 1/4 inch steel, with a set length
of 28.5 inches (but a broken untensioned total spring length of 26.75
inches).

Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.

I'm sure most will say "just pay someone" (i.e, too dangerous, too
difficult, too expensive, etc.); but that's not what this group is about.

I'll research what I can and report back but if you've actually done it
(I realize most people have NOT) ... it would be useful to get your
advice.

Note: I realize a torsion garage door spring DIY endeavor is like DIY car
alignment or like putting in automotive struts where most of the people
say it's just not worth it but almost all of those who say it's not worth
it actually have never even thought about what it really takes - nor have
they tried - and neither have they actually done it. So, their advice,
while well meant, is next to useless unless they've actually done it.

What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

As I said, I'll do some research also - but I figured I'd try to connect
with someone who has done this already (I already know what all the rest
will say).

You can get new springs at your local Overhead Door branch or other
commercial door place. You will not find then at the big box stores due
to the safety concerns.

As for replacing them, it's a pain changing them out since you have to
release the tension on the remaining spring, slide the shaft to one side
so you can get the old springs off and the new on, making sure you put
the correct one on each side since they are not the same, get the shaft
centered up again and then tension each side the proper amount evenly.
You'll need two 1/2" dia steel bars around 2'-3' long for the
untensioning and tensioning.

The tensioning and untensioning are not fun procedures and would be best
done with two people if possible. Ensure you are positioned to the side
out of the path of the bars in case you loose your grip, something
slips, etc. and the bar comes whizzing past. You need to count the
number of turns or 1/4 turns you put on each spring to keep them even.

If you count the turns on the intact spring as you untension it, that
will give you a target tension to aim for when tensioning the new ones.
Test the door manually to determine if it is properly balanced at that
point. If the door place will replace the springs for ~$100 in labor
it's probably worth it to avoid the hassle. When I replaced the springs
on my garage door I had to do it over a couple days since the tensioning
was doing a number on my carpal tunnel.

On Nov 4, 8:22*am, "Pete C." wrote:
"Danny D." wrote:

My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
*http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

I counted 111 coils of what seems to be 1/4 inch steel, with a set length
of 28.5 inches (but a broken untensioned total spring length of 26.75
inches).

Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.

I'm sure most will say "just pay someone" (i.e, too dangerous, too
difficult, too expensive, etc.); but that's not what this group is about.

In article ,
"Danny D." wrote:



Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.



I don't think there's a better "how to" on the topic than this one by
Richard Kinch.

http://www.truetex.com/garage.htm

Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
"Danny D." wrote:



Any suggestions for how to locate & install a new spring will be welcome.



I don't think there's a better "how to" on the topic than this one by
Richard Kinch.

http://www.truetex.com/garage.htm

Hi,
There are quite a few Youtube demo as well. After careful prep. I did it
in one week end evening replacing springs and new set of cables.
Now I spray Liquid wrench from now and then onto springs to extend the
life of them.

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 09:01:13 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

There are quite a few Youtube demo as well.

Thanks Tony.
I found a few YouTube videos which were helpful to understand what was a
bit obscure in the canonical Truetex DIY (see below).

Perhaps the most interesting was this video which showed
a spring breaking in front of our eyes and then repaired!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHu3J...eature=related

The better DIY videos seem to be he

DIYClinic - Garage Door Torsion Spring Replacement (Part 1)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luQR0KGgXgo

DIYClinic - Garage Door Torsion Spring Replacement (Part 2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYrEBvjHb5g

How to install Garage Door Torsion Springs Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dio-hYjXNzg

How to install Garage Door Torsion Springs Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mR4VA...feature=relmfu

Here is a Sears guy (apparently) installing a torsion spring:
How To Install Garage Torsion Springs - Torsion Spring Replacement
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CBkP...eature=related

On Sun, 4 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

Everything you need to know is in this link. (Includes photos)

http://truetex.com/garage.htm

Note that springs are color coded, so get the ones that match yours.

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 08:58:06 -0800, Oren wrote:

Everything you need to know is in this link. (Includes photos)
http://truetex.com/garage.htm
Note that springs are color coded, so get the ones that match yours.

Hi Oren,
I know you're a regular here so I appreciate the advice.
The Truetex article is great but it's a difficult read.
I prefer to read and understand everything in truetex, but, then to
follow one of the simpler DIYs to follow.

Richard wrote an engineering novella - so he deserves credit - but what
he doesn't really do is show a nice step-by-step DIY.

Luckily, those step-by-step DIYS seem to be all over the net, so I'll
watch a few dozen so that I have all the steps memorized in sequence.

One thing to be aware of though, is that the color coding is useless
according to the Truetex discussion - because they may not be following
standards.

So, I'll just trust in my mic and calipers instead of colors!

On Sun, 4 Nov 2012 20:11:06 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 08:58:06 -0800, Oren wrote:

Everything you need to know is in this link. (Includes photos)
http://truetex.com/garage.htm
Note that springs are color coded, so get the ones that match yours.

Hi Oren,
I know you're a regular here so I appreciate the advice.
The Truetex article is great but it's a difficult read.
I prefer to read and understand everything in truetex, but, then to
follow one of the simpler DIYs to follow.

Richard wrote an engineering novella - so he deserves credit - but what
he doesn't really do is show a nice step-by-step DIY.

Luckily, those step-by-step DIYS seem to be all over the net, so I'll
watch a few dozen so that I have all the steps memorized in sequence.

One thing to be aware of though, is that the color coding is useless
according to the Truetex discussion - because they may not be following
standards.

So, I'll just trust in my mic and calipers instead of colors!

I hear ya. I've read his pool plaster page*. I wish he had Cliff
Notes g

*before and after pictures - cost $502.00, a family project...

http://www.truetex.com/pool.htm

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 13:21:12 -0800, Oren wrote:

I hear ya. I've read his pool plaster page*.
Wow. What another novella!

I'm sure he covered EVERYTHING in there!

I could use it if/when I plaster 'my' pool - but for now, I'll stick with
the garage door spring.

BTW, it's funny that the count for 10, 20, 30 coils was consistent, but
then, on 40 coils, the count went bad.

I'm not sure why - maybe the angle of spring twist is taking effect?
http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11336134.jpg

On Mon, 5 Nov 2012 00:37:46 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 13:21:12 -0800, Oren wrote:

I hear ya. I've read his pool plaster page*.
Wow. What another novella!

I'm sure he covered EVERYTHING in there!

I could use it if/when I plaster 'my' pool - but for now, I'll stick with
the garage door spring.

BTW, it's funny that the count for 10, 20, 30 coils was consistent, but
then, on 40 coils, the count went bad.

I'm not sure why - maybe the angle of spring twist is taking effect?
http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11336134.jpg

I really don't know, sorry. Wouldn't the count change after a broken
spring - maybe?

Danny D. wrote:

Any suggestions for how to locate

I won't be telling you how to do it, but to source the spring:

Call Larry @ Windsor Door

(281) 820-5284

7801 N Shepherd Dr Ste 104, Houston, TX 77088

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:
What I'm looking for is advice from someone who actually replaced their
own garage door torsion spring.

OK. Thanks to you guys, I've done the preliminary research.
Now it's time to order a replacement (higher cycle) spring
and to make observations to help the next garage owner
who reads this in the future.

Since this is a replacement spring, the weight of the garage
door is not a critical factor (assuming the old spring worked).

The four replacement spring values of import a
1.Wire gauge == not measured directly!
2.Chirality
3.Unsprung length == measured in two parts
4.ID of the coils == not measured directly!

Interestingly, two of those measurements are not measured directly
because they shrink and expand over time.

See details as to what is "NOT" measured directly in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...B4JheBc#t=162s

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:

I'll research what I can and report back but if you've actually done it
(I realize most people have NOT) ... it would be useful to get your
advice.

HERE IS A KNOWLEDGE BASE UPDATE (as promised) for ALT.HOME.REPAIR:

Perhaps the best argument 'for' a DIY repair is that we, the
homeowner, should be able to select & install the best spring for
our needs at the best price available (about $75 to $100, all told).

For example, my old 15000 cycle torsion spring is $41 at prodoorparts:
Garage Door Tension Spring 2" x .234 x 26.5" Right Wind - $40.99

But a 35000 cycle replacement torsion spring is only 20% more at $49:
Garage Door Tension Spring 2" x .250 x 36" Right Wind - $48.99

I would think we typical homeowners would opt for the latter, while a
(presumably) typical installer would opt for the former (for reasons
other than getting us the best spring & best value for our money).

One GREAT argument against a DIY repair is that the job is dangerous.
It 'is' dangerous. That's why most homeowners opt to pay about $150
to $200 (out here in the Silicon Valley anyway) to have it done.

Another argument against a DIY repair is the knowledge needed.
Luckily, replacing a garage door torsion spring is relatively
simple (it has its moment of drama though).

Nowadays, excellent DIYs abound, but the mainstream is what
I'll reference here.

The canonical DIY (a must-read novella) is by Richard J. Kinch:
http://www.truetex.com/garage.htm

However (IMHO) the 'best' (most informative) site overall is DDM:
http://ddmgaragedoors.com

There are other excellent DIY-aware sites which are already listed
in this thread so I won't repeat them in this research summary.

A second key requirement for a DIY repair is the proper tools.
The good news is that there is only one tool needed that a
typical homeowner won't already have in his toolbox.

That special tool is a set of ~18" long 1/2" diameter winding bars.

I've found that two winding bars should be around $8 for a set;
but many companies charge more than twice that; so here's a
link to the company with the most reasonable winding bar prices:
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/parts/part/WB-18.html

Apparently these winding bars are often machined with a hexagonal
"grip" (reputedly so they don't easily fall out of your hand and/or
roll away on the floor) - but the ends are always circular.
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/parts/tools_support.html

For commercial you'd use larger and longer winding bars.
Residential = 18" long, 1/2" & 7/16"
Light commercial = 24" long, 1/2" & 5/8"
Heavy commercial = 36" long, 1/2" & 5/8"

Apparently 17" bars are sometimes substituted for 18"
bars merely to better accommodate shipping box sizes.

Commercial garage door torsion springs often don't come
with the cones but residential torsion springs almost
always are sold with the cones already attached.

All you really need is the following information:
1. Inside diameter (always embossed on the end cones, e.g., 2")
2. Untensioned length (you measure only the spring, not the cone)
3. Wire gauge (i.e., the diameter of the wire, e.g., 0.2343")
4. Wind direction (use the tried-and-true right-hand rule)
5. Cone type (most are 'standard' cones but oddballs exist)

There are other specifications which are important but which
are not necessary if you're simply replacing a broken spring.

I've found, by calling companies that some "salespeople" will
talk 'colors' painted on the springs and cones rather than
sizes and duty cycles when asking you for details. My advice
is to use paint color only as a doublecheck of your math
(e.g., right-wind cones are usually painted red and gold spray
on springs is sometimes an indication of the 0.250"wire gauge).

In my research, I found OLD threads where most of the thread
was from people saying it couldn't easily and safely be done as
a DIY repair. Those older threads imply it must have been harder
to come by information, springs, & calculation tools in the past.

But now it's easy to buy a single spring on the web.
It's easy to calculate alternative replacement sizes.
It's easy to buy the right tools.
And, it's easy to find excellent step-by-step DIYs on the web.

My conclusion: Times have changed!

You no longer have to impersonate a licensed technician in order
to have a single garage door torsion spring shipped to your home.

For example, here is a typical price list for a wide selection
of two inch residential garage door torsion springs to fit my door.
(remember to add about 10% CA sales tax & about $20 for shipping).
http://www.prodoorparts.com/garage-door-springs/2/

In summary, I'm looking forward to my spring arriving so that I
can attempt my very first garage door torsion spring DIY based on
the ample tutorials, suppliers, & videos extant on the web today.

That's why most homeowners opt to pay about $150 to
$200 (out here in the Silicon Valley anyway) to have it done.

Or more ...

By way of partial proof, here's a 'special' $200 deal for my area:
http://www.thegaragedoorstoresanjose...placement.html
"Your garage door is the largest moving object in your house and can
be dangerous? Make sure it isn't. When looking for expert garage
door repair service in San Jose, Santa Clara, Los Gatos, Campbell,
Saratoga, Milpitas, and Sunnyvale; call us today for our $199 spring
special! 408-281-7111"

I arbitrarily called about a dozen local (408 area code) garage door
repair outfits yesterday to obtain that $150 to $200 price range.

Incidentally, I MUST say, I had the most interested phone call yesterday
to "Tiffany" at 408-335-0145 when I was shopping for local repair costs
for my research summary to you guys at alt home repair.

That outfit literally called me back twice to get my business!

First, they called back to lower the price of the service call from
$50 (just for the estimate) to $30 and to offer to refund that lowered
price service call if I got their $150 to $250 service - and then -
when I still declined, Tiffany called back today saying the new manager
just authorized her to drop the service call fee altogether.

At that point, I 'could' have taken then up on their offer (just to
get a more specific estimate for you guys) ... but ... I didn't really
want to jerk them around so I politely declined (but thanked them
nonetheless).

I mention this because many people reading this will want to have
someone do the work for them - so it's good to know you still 'can'
get a free estimate in the Silicon Valley (but only if you play their
game).

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 15:54:12 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

That's why most homeowners opt to pay about $150 to
$200 (out here in the Silicon Valley anyway) to have it done.

Or more ...

By way of partial proof, here's a 'special' $200 deal for my area:
http://www.thegaragedoorstoresanjose...placement.html
"Your garage door is the largest moving object in your house and can
be dangerous? Make sure it isn't. When looking for expert garage
door repair service in San Jose, Santa Clara, Los Gatos, Campbell,
Saratoga, Milpitas, and Sunnyvale; call us today for our $199 spring
special! 408-281-7111"

I arbitrarily called about a dozen local (408 area code) garage door
repair outfits yesterday to obtain that $150 to $200 price range.

Incidentally, I MUST say, I had the most interested phone call yesterday
to "Tiffany" at 408-335-0145 when I was shopping for local repair costs
for my research summary to you guys at alt home repair.

That outfit literally called me back twice to get my business!

First, they called back to lower the price of the service call from
$50 (just for the estimate) to $30 and to offer to refund that lowered
price service call if I got their $150 to $250 service - and then -
when I still declined, Tiffany called back today saying the new manager
just authorized her to drop the service call fee altogether.

At that point, I 'could' have taken then up on their offer (just to
get a more specific estimate for you guys) ... but ... I didn't really
want to jerk them around so I politely declined (but thanked them
nonetheless).

I mention this because many people reading this will want to have
someone do the work for them - so it's good to know you still 'can'
get a free estimate in the Silicon Valley (but only if you play their
game).


Thanks for all the garage door spring info. Nice job.
Around here - north of Chicago suburbs - it seems most home repair
contractors do free estimates.
In fact, they PAY to give estimates if they use a referral service
like Service Magic.
They have mixed views about Service Magic, and so do I.
It does save the home owner time in finding contractors.
But in talking to some of the contractors, it works like this. If
they get the job, the SM referral fee is nothing to them, as it gets
paid out of job profit. If they don't, some resent the fee, others
just see it as a business cost. There's other issues I don't mention
now.
Anyway, although it probably pays to check around and get multiple
estimates, damn if I don't nearly always end up hiring the first guy
out. Maybe I've just been lucky, but it's worked out well.
More likely the first guy out is a hustler, does the most work, runs
his business the best, and can offer a good cost for good work.
Just guessing, but it seems to generally work that way.
Five out of six of the last jobs I contracted went to the first
bidder.
Keeping to garage doors, I was expecting to pay about $2k for a new
steel door - just going by what a workmate paid for a similar one
about 5 years ago - but the first guy I called was over here in an
hour, and bid $900. He's had a local business with a good rep for a
long time. Looked no further.
He was slow getting out to do the job, because he was busy.
But I told him up front there was no hurry, and do it by his schedule.
So $200 for a new spring sounds high to me, but as you say, you live
where you live.

Vic Smith wrote:

Keeping to garage doors, I was expecting to pay about $2k for a new
steel door - just going by what a workmate paid for a similar one
about 5 years ago - but the first guy I called was over here in an
hour, and bid $900. He's had a local business with a good rep for a
long time. Looked no further.


Must have been a nice insulated door. In Houston I'll (well, used to
before I got out of the business) install a 16 x 7 non-insulated door
complete with take-down and haul-off for about $500.

Our cost on the door is $300. It takes about 1.5 hours to do, and the
dump charges $30 to drop off the "dead door".

I'm not up to date on current prices, but I'm sure they have not changed
much with the ads I see.

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 12:24:59 -0600, G. Morgan
wrote:

Vic Smith wrote:

Keeping to garage doors, I was expecting to pay about $2k for a new
steel door - just going by what a workmate paid for a similar one
about 5 years ago - but the first guy I called was over here in an
hour, and bid $900. He's had a local business with a good rep for a
long time. Looked no further.


Must have been a nice insulated door. In Houston I'll (well, used to
before I got out of the business) install a 16 x 7 non-insulated door
complete with take-down and haul-off for about $500.


That's my size - 4 panel - but his garage is attached so he probably
got insulated. Pretty sure he got windows too. Might have an 18'.
Mine is plain-jane but much better looking than the old wood one.
I think I priced a similar door at about $400 at the big box when I
was thinking about doing it myself. Then add the opener.


Our cost on the door is $300. It takes about 1.5 hours to do, and the
dump charges $30 to drop off the "dead door".


About the time the 2-man crew took. I was glad to see that old door
hauled away on top of their van. Right there is what tipped the scale
for me early about doing it myself. Getting old.

I'm not up to date on current prices, but I'm sure they have not changed
much with the ads I see.


I'll never know, but no complaints from me.
Heh, just had a visitor. His dad paid $700 for a door at the big box
with 1/2" foam. Put it up himself.
4 times.

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 12:24:59 -0600, G. Morgan wrote:

Our cost on the door is $300. It takes about 1.5 hours to do, and the
dump charges $30 to drop off the "dead door".

Wow. You live on a different planet from California prices!

BTW, I just now weighed the 7' tall by 8' wide steel garage door,
and I was shocked it's 185 pounds (and not 135# which one installer
told me based on my description of the door).

http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11375189.jpg

Lesson: Don't trust what the installer says on the phone!

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 11:37:10 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 15:54:12 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

That's why most homeowners opt to pay about $150 to
$200 (out here in the Silicon Valley anyway) to have it done.

Or more ...

By way of partial proof, here's a 'special' $200 deal for my area:
http://www.thegaragedoorstoresanjose...placement.html
"Your garage door is the largest moving object in your house and can
be dangerous? Make sure it isn't. When looking for expert garage
door repair service in San Jose, Santa Clara, Los Gatos, Campbell,
Saratoga, Milpitas, and Sunnyvale; call us today for our $199 spring
special! 408-281-7111"

I arbitrarily called about a dozen local (408 area code) garage door
repair outfits yesterday to obtain that $150 to $200 price range.

Incidentally, I MUST say, I had the most interested phone call yesterday
to "Tiffany" at 408-335-0145 when I was shopping for local repair costs
for my research summary to you guys at alt home repair.

That outfit literally called me back twice to get my business!

First, they called back to lower the price of the service call from
$50 (just for the estimate) to $30 and to offer to refund that lowered
price service call if I got their $150 to $250 service - and then -
when I still declined, Tiffany called back today saying the new manager
just authorized her to drop the service call fee altogether.

At that point, I 'could' have taken then up on their offer (just to
get a more specific estimate for you guys) ... but ... I didn't really
want to jerk them around so I politely declined (but thanked them
nonetheless).

I mention this because many people reading this will want to have
someone do the work for them - so it's good to know you still 'can'
get a free estimate in the Silicon Valley (but only if you play their
game).


Thanks for all the garage door spring info. Nice job.
Around here - north of Chicago suburbs - it seems most home repair
contractors do free estimates.
In fact, they PAY to give estimates if they use a referral service
like Service Magic.
They have mixed views about Service Magic, and so do I.
It does save the home owner time in finding contractors.
But in talking to some of the contractors, it works like this. If
they get the job, the SM referral fee is nothing to them, as it gets
paid out of job profit. If they don't, some resent the fee, others
just see it as a business cost. There's other issues I don't mention
now.
Anyway, although it probably pays to check around and get multiple
estimates, damn if I don't nearly always end up hiring the first guy
out. Maybe I've just been lucky, but it's worked out well.
More likely the first guy out is a hustler, does the most work, runs
his business the best, and can offer a good cost for good work.
Just guessing, but it seems to generally work that way.
Five out of six of the last jobs I contracted went to the first
bidder.
Keeping to garage doors, I was expecting to pay about $2k for a new
steel door - just going by what a workmate paid for a similar one
about 5 years ago - but the first guy I called was over here in an
hour, and bid $900. He's had a local business with a good rep for a
long time. Looked no further.
He was slow getting out to do the job, because he was busy.
But I told him up front there was no hurry, and do it by his schedule.
So $200 for a new spring sounds high to me, but as you say, you live
where you live.

http://www.dyersgaragedoors.com/serv...do-valley.html

Pretty much typical for California

Gunner

--
""The Democratic constituency is just like a herd of cows. All you have
to do is lay out enough silage and they come running. That’s why I
became an operative working with Democrats. With Democrats all you
have to do is make a lot of noise, lay out the hay, and be ready to
use the ole cattle prod in case a few want to bolt the herd.

Eighty percent of the people who call themselves Democrats don’t have
a clue as to political reality.
What amazes me is that you could take a group of people who are hard
workers and convince them that they should support social programs
that were the exact opposite of their own personal convictions. Put a
little fear here and there and you can get people to vote any way you
want.

The voter is basically dumb and lazy. The reason I became a Democratic
operative instead of a Republican was because there were more
Democrats that didn’t have a clue than there were Republicans."
James Carvell, DNC operative

On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:
My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

FINAL UPDATE:
Here is a quick writeup for another person like I am who had never
replaced a garage door torsion spring before today.

First, it is helpful if you read this entire thread BEFORE your spring snaps
(and particularly notice the things that I WISH I had noticed before
the spring snapped). Namely ...
1. Check your hinges (mine were broken on my larger door)
2. Measure your spring (write the size on the wall)
3. Check your garage door level (mine was 1/4" tilted after the spring)
4. Check the balance (mine was 1/4 turn too tight after the new spring)
5. Lubricate moving parts (results in a more peaceful operation)
6. And, most important: Check your center bracket with the door up & down!
(Mine appears to have been improperly mounted.)

I won't go into the details of the issues above since they're already
well covered in the associated thread.

What I will say is my 'impression' of the job - now that I've joined the
ranks of those who have actually replaced a garage door torsion spring.

First off, you MUST read the Richard Kinch garage door torsion spring DIY!
http://www.truetex.com/garage.htm
His logic is impeccable.

But, do not follow Richard's DIY (it's too difficult a read); follow
Dan Musick's DIY over here (and buy the torsion springs from Dan also!):
ONE SPRING:
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/diy-instru...eplacement.php

TWO SPRINGS:
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/diy-instru...on-springs.php

Buying from Dan allows you to call him - and he always picks up the phone!
Buy the two solid steel bars from Dan also - he's cheaper than anyone else
other than a big box store - but you only save a buck or two by not using
Dan so I used him to ensure I had the right sized tools.

Now comes the big revelation (now that I've done it):
Replacing a torsion spring isn't hard at all.
In fact, unless something breaks or slips (or you do something stupid),
it's entirely trivial to replace a garage door torsion spring!

As you can tell, I read every DIY I could find, and I called Dan quite
a few times to ask questions. I upgraded my spring to a thicker spring
with more than double the original duty cycle. Total cost was around
$75 for the spring, cones, solid winding bars, and shipping. It would
have cost $150 to $200 to have someone else do it - although it would
have NOT taken the two weeks it took me to learn all that I learned.

Had I replaced with the original spring size, it would have saved me
only $10 or $15 ... so the cost of the spring is negligible.

The real cost (and satisfaction) of a DIY is the effort expended to
learn how a garage door really works.

For example, it was new to me that the tracks are pitched backward
the same amount that the hinges are graduated forward - in order to
wedge the door tightly against the elements.

Also, it was new to me that the hollow rod across the doorway
actually moved side to side, as the door opened and closed.

Likewise, it was news to me that the torsion spring is what lifts the
door - the opener simply provides direction (and a tiny pull or push).

Before this job, I didn't know how to maintain a garage door.
Before this job, I didn't know how to check for broken hinges.
I didn't even know how to look for proper garage door alignment.

All this (and more), you'll learn when you replace your first garage
door torsion spring!

In the end, after reading and doing, I would say this is an EASY job.
Almost a very easy job!

On a scale of 1 to 10, it's about a 2 on tools required (all you need
is a 9/16ths & 3/8ths inch open-end wrench, two large vise grips, and
two 18" long 1/2" diameter solid steel winding bars) and about a 2 or
3 on expertise required (assuming you read Richard's & Dan's DIYs).

HOWEVER YOU SHOULD NOT ATTEMPT THIS WITHOUT READING THOSE DIYs!

It's too easy to make a mistake - but - if you simply follow Dan's
DIY, you can't make a mistake unless you don't follow his directions!

The force you need was minimal. I would say every red-blooded American
male easily has the strength to wind a 0.250" thick two-inch ID torsion
spring 30 quarter turns as I just did.

At no point did I 'feel' threatened by the spring - although I took
all precaution that Dan recommended (safety glasses, safety zone, etc.).

Yes, something could go wrong. But, if you asked me, I'd say I'm more
afraid of operating a chain saw on a tree than replacing a torsion
spring. I'd be more afraid about removing a bee's nest. Or sliding
down a slippery slope on my back.

This job is really not as frightening as people make it out to be.
To be sure, I did read about all the broken bones (Dan had a few
stories of his own) and the impalements and the death that can
occur - but I have to say, I followed directions - and I never
felt an oh-shoot moment. It was actually undramatic.

So, in hindsight, I would recommend this job to anyone willing to
read the DIYs and willing to follow them and willing to doublecheck
each step. If you're willing to do that, you'll know your garage
door better - you'll have better springs - your door may be better
balanced - smoother operating - and your hinges will be in better
shape.

Thanks to everyone! Good luck to all.

"Danny D." wrote:
On Sun, 04 Nov 2012 01:14:17 +0000, Danny D. wrote:
My wife heard a big snap, and when I looked, I see what happened:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11326208.jpg

FINAL UPDATE:
Here is a quick writeup for another person like I am who had never
replaced a garage door torsion spring before today.

First, it is helpful if you read this entire thread BEFORE your spring snaps
(and particularly notice the things that I WISH I had noticed before
the spring snapped). Namely ...
1. Check your hinges (mine were broken on my larger door)
2. Measure your spring (write the size on the wall)
3. Check your garage door level (mine was 1/4" tilted after the spring)
4. Check the balance (mine was 1/4 turn too tight after the new spring)
5. Lubricate moving parts (results in a more peaceful operation)
6. And, most important: Check your center bracket with the door up & down!
(Mine appears to have been improperly mounted.)

I won't go into the details of the issues above since they're already
well covered in the associated thread.

What I will say is my 'impression' of the job - now that I've joined the
ranks of those who have actually replaced a garage door torsion spring.

First off, you MUST read the Richard Kinch garage door torsion spring DIY!
http://www.truetex.com/garage.htm
His logic is impeccable.

But, do not follow Richard's DIY (it's too difficult a read); follow
Dan Musick's DIY over here (and buy the torsion springs from Dan also!):
ONE SPRING:
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/diy-instru...eplacement.php

TWO SPRINGS:
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/diy-instru...on-springs.php

Buying from Dan allows you to call him - and he always picks up the phone!
Buy the two solid steel bars from Dan also - he's cheaper than anyone else
other than a big box store - but you only save a buck or two by not using
Dan so I used him to ensure I had the right sized tools.

Now comes the big revelation (now that I've done it):
Replacing a torsion spring isn't hard at all.
In fact, unless something breaks or slips (or you do something stupid),
it's entirely trivial to replace a garage door torsion spring!

As you can tell, I read every DIY I could find, and I called Dan quite
a few times to ask questions. I upgraded my spring to a thicker spring
with more than double the original duty cycle. Total cost was around
$75 for the spring, cones, solid winding bars, and shipping. It would
have cost $150 to $200 to have someone else do it - although it would
have NOT taken the two weeks it took me to learn all that I learned.

Had I replaced with the original spring size, it would have saved me
only $10 or $15 ... so the cost of the spring is negligible.

The real cost (and satisfaction) of a DIY is the effort expended to
learn how a garage door really works.

For example, it was new to me that the tracks are pitched backward
the same amount that the hinges are graduated forward - in order to
wedge the door tightly against the elements.

Also, it was new to me that the hollow rod across the doorway
actually moved side to side, as the door opened and closed.

Likewise, it was news to me that the torsion spring is what lifts the
door - the opener simply provides direction (and a tiny pull or push).

Before this job, I didn't know how to maintain a garage door.
Before this job, I didn't know how to check for broken hinges.
I didn't even know how to look for proper garage door alignment.

All this (and more), you'll learn when you replace your first garage
door torsion spring!

In the end, after reading and doing, I would say this is an EASY job.
Almost a very easy job!

On a scale of 1 to 10, it's about a 2 on tools required (all you need
is a 9/16ths & 3/8ths inch open-end wrench, two large vise grips, and
two 18" long 1/2" diameter solid steel winding bars) and about a 2 or
3 on expertise required (assuming you read Richard's & Dan's DIYs).

HOWEVER YOU SHOULD NOT ATTEMPT THIS WITHOUT READING THOSE DIYs!

It's too easy to make a mistake - but - if you simply follow Dan's
DIY, you can't make a mistake unless you don't follow his directions!

The force you need was minimal. I would say every red-blooded American
male easily has the strength to wind a 0.250" thick two-inch ID torsion
spring 30 quarter turns as I just did.

At no point did I 'feel' threatened by the spring - although I took
all precaution that Dan recommended (safety glasses, safety zone, etc.).

Yes, something could go wrong. But, if you asked me, I'd say I'm more
afraid of operating a chain saw on a tree than replacing a torsion
spring. I'd be more afraid about removing a bee's nest. Or sliding
down a slippery slope on my back.

This job is really not as frightening as people make it out to be.
To be sure, I did read about all the broken bones (Dan had a few
stories of his own) and the impalements and the death that can
occur - but I have to say, I followed directions - and I never
felt an oh-shoot moment. It was actually undramatic.

So, in hindsight, I would recommend this job to anyone willing to
read the DIYs and willing to follow them and willing to doublecheck
each step. If you're willing to do that, you'll know your garage
door better - you'll have better springs - your door may be better
balanced - smoother operating - and your hinges will be in better
shape.

Thanks to everyone! Good luck to all.

Might be nice to rewrite subject line to make it easy to search for on
usenet archives. But, I'm not sure what it currently says using my
abbreviated title using my usenet reader for iPad.

Greg

On Sun, 18 Nov 2012 01:09:46 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:



Thanks to everyone! Good luck to all.


Nice job. Don't know if you mentioned the option of going to 2
springs. Ran across it trying to understand the torsion forces.
http://ddmgaragedoors.com/diy-instru...conversion.php

On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 19:49:37 -0600, Vic Smith wrote:

Don't know if you mentioned the option of going
to 2 springs.

Thanks for the pointer.

That DDM 1-spring-to-2-springs page is fantastic.

I had opted for one spring with a very high duty cycle;
but, in hindsight, I SHOULD have opted for the more
balanced set of two springs (which wouldn't even have
cost any more).

It turns out that the one spring is twisting my
bearing plate off the wall!

DOOR CLOSED:
http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11430038.jpg
DOOR OPEN:
http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11430039.jpg

Two springs would not have twisted the plate because they
would cancel each other out. Sigh.

Lesson learned (too late) after the fact!

Danny D. wrote:

Two springs would not have twisted the plate because they
would cancel each other out. Sigh.


Nah, the same amount of force is distributed across the torsion bar.
That's why I told you to prepare to re-lag the bearing plate instead of
going back in the same holes @ the same angle. If you angle the lags in
to get more 'bite' in the header, it will hold better.

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 12:51:20 -0600, G. Morgan wrote:

Nah, the same amount of force is distributed across the torsion bar.
That's why I told you to prepare to re-lag the bearing plate instead of
going back in the same holes @ the same angle. If you angle the lags in
to get more 'bite' in the header, it will hold better.

I think you're right. A garage door isn't so simple anymore.

Dan at DDM Garage Doors says my real problem is that
the cable drum ends do not have the end bearing plate
securely fixed. He's gonna send me some angle iron
and 7/16ths head 3-inch lag screws to secure the sides.

He says the middle can't move unless the sides let it
move. I'm still trying to understand that - as it's not
intuitive at all to me that the ends are what is making
the middle bend.

Here is a picture of the gap on one end:
http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11445225.jpg

And, here's a picture of the gap on the other end:
http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11445226.jpg

Unfortunately, there is NO STUD beneath those ends!

Danny D. wrote:

At no point did I 'feel' threatened by the spring - although I took
all precaution that Dan recommended (safety glasses, safety zone, etc.).

You would love it when I go to replace a door and how I 'unwind' the old
springs. I just stick a winding bar in there and lift it a couple of
inches to let it rest on the door. Then I loosen the locking bolts, get
down from the ladder and put vise-grips on the winding bar - shake back
and fourth a couple of times and yank it out! Makes a hell of a racket,
but it's easier than unwinding it by hand.

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 12:47:50 -0600, G. Morgan wrote:

Then I loosen the locking bolts, get down from the ladder
and put vise-grips on the winding bar - shake back
and fourth a couple of times and yank it out!
Makes a hell of a racket,
but it's easier than unwinding it by hand.

I just tried that with the last quarter turn of
unwinding. I simply pulled the bar away - and it
spun back to the zero turn level on its own.

It was undramatic - but - of course, that was only the
last quarter turn.

I can see that it would work though - but it's just
as easy to unwind it 30 quarter turns, IMHO.