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Central heating continuously runs
3 Attachment(s)
Hi
We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat? (Pictures attached) Thanks Daren |
OK I've just checked again and it seems that the heating comes on even if the room stat is set below the current room tempreture.
Does that help? Thanks Daren |
Central heating continuously runs
Most likely, two wires is how it was designed. Third wire could be anything,
but probably a common. It's possible the thermostat isn't the problem. I'll copy in the alt hvac group, they field this question often. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... Hi We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat? (Pictures attached) Thanks Daren +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Filename: Boiler.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6606| |Filename: Stat.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6607| |Filename: Timer.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6608| +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- Daren Friday |
Central heating continuously runs
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message . .. Most likely, two wires is how it was designed. Third wire could be anything, but probably a common. It's possible the thermostat isn't the problem. I'll copy in the alt hvac group, they field this question often. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... Hi We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat? The stat should only need 2 wires if its got batteries in it. The pictures are of such small size and poor quality, I can't tell much else. Its possible that you have been having this problem since you put the new stat in.... most likely because the anticipator setting isn't correct, or the temperature delta isn't set correctly, or both. |
Quote:
I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? |
Central heating continuously runs
I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- Daren Friday |
Central heating continuously runs
Does tstat control a relay on furnace that is sticking?
On 8/5/2012 11:22 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote: Most likely, two wires is how it was designed. Third wire could be anything, but probably a common. It's possible the thermostat isn't the problem. I'll copy in the alt hvac group, they field this question often. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... Hi We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat? (Pictures attached) Thanks Daren +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Filename: Boiler.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6606| |Filename: Stat.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6607| |Filename: Timer.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6608| +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ |
Central heating continuously runs
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. |
Central heating continuously runs
On Aug 5, 11:21*pm, Bennett wrote:
Does tstat control a relay on furnace that is sticking? Yes, or a short in the wiring. Should only take 2 wires to do the control. A third wire is typically used to provide additional functionality, like power so the thermostat can be lit up, etc. And what is the history? Did it ever work? Was it working and then something was changed? Also the overall settup isn't clear. In these parts we usually don't have seperate timer and thermostat. We have a programmable thermostat that combines temp settings for various periods with a clock. |
Central heating continuously runs
Steve wrote:
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Not everyone has an instant-gratification fixation. I'm sure you could troubleshoot it faster, but as long as he is being safe, give the man a little credit for trying! I do! |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/5/2012 6:41 AM, Daren Friday wrote:
Hi We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat? (Pictures attached) Thanks Daren +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Filename: Boiler.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6606| |Filename: Stat.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6607| |Filename: Timer.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6608| +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ My condolences, I've never heard of one, but a Google search seems to indicate it's the lemon of all boilers. Do a search, there are plenty of help sites, as it seems that everyone that owns one of them has problems |
Central heating continuously runs
"Bill" wrote in message ... Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Not everyone has an instant-gratification fixation. I'm sure you could troubleshoot it faster, but as long as he is being safe, give the man a little credit for trying! I do! He changed something, and now its not working.... then while trying to "fix" it, he fried a motorized valve... Whats he going to fry next?? How much more is his attempts going to cost in time and money to replace componants that he destroys in the process?? He's already in way over his head if he can't figure out simple controls. |
Central heating continuously runs
On Aug 5, 4:51*pm, Daren Friday
wrote: 'Steve[_24_ Wrote: ;2904456']"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ...- Most likely, two wires is how it was designed. Third wire could be anything, but probably a common. It's possible the thermostat isn't the problem. I'll copy in the alt hvac group, they field this question often. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus 'The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints' (http://www.lds.org) . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... Hi We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? *And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat?- The stat should only need 2 wires if its got batteries in it. The pictures are of such small size and poor quality, I can't tell much else. Its possible that you have been having this problem since you put the new stat in.... most likely because the anticipator setting isn't correct, or the temperature delta isn't set correctly, or both. I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. *If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. *See how we go? +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- Daren Friday- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You need to stop randomly replacing things and focus on how the thing works and then proceed in a logical fashion. A basic thermostat is nothing more than a switch. You could just connect the two wires together that control the valve, furnace, whatever and create the same action. If it continues to operate with the wires disconnected, then whatever is on the other end is the problem or the wires are shorted between here and the other end. |
Central heating continuously runs
Steve wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message ... Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Not everyone has an instant-gratification fixation. I'm sure you could troubleshoot it faster, but as long as he is being safe, give the man a little credit for trying! I do! He changed something, and now its not working.... then while trying to "fix" it, he fried a motorized valve... Whats he going to fry next?? How much more is his attempts going to cost in time and money to replace componants that he destroys in the process?? Probably not much compared to the cost of an hour or two of a techs time. If the owner can swap a few components and it works half of the time, the owner is probably way ahead--at least financially, and surely from the point of view of understanding his or her system. I think I am way ahead because I have made the effort to learn more about how these systems. The industry would seem to prefer for people to be scared and ignorant. The outlook seems good. I would just caution those that will try to "work safe", and to make sure to know what that means in any context in which one is working--for instance in operating a table saw. He's already in way over his head if he can't figure out simple controls. |
Central heating continuously runs
On Aug 7, 1:21*pm, Bill wrote:
Steve wrote: "Bill" wrote in message ... Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message . com... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus * *www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. *If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. *See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Not everyone has an instant-gratification fixation. I'm sure you could troubleshoot it faster, but as long as he is being safe, give the man a little credit for trying! I do! He changed something, and now its not working.... then while trying to "fix" it, he fried a motorized valve... Whats he going to fry next?? How much more is his attempts going to cost in time and money to replace componants that he destroys in the process?? * *Probably not much compared to the cost of an hour or two of a techs time. If the owner can swap a few components and it works half of the time, the owner is probably way ahead--at least financially, and surely from the point of view of understanding his or her system. I think I am way ahead because I have made the effort to learn more about how these systems. Learning how the system works and then correctly diagnosing what's wrong is different than just buying and changing parts without knowing what you're doing. I think that is what he was referring to. If the thing was heating when the thermstat should not be calling for heat, wouldn't you just disconnect the thermostat wires first and see if it stopped? The industry would seem to prefer for people to be scared and ignorant. The outlook seems good. I would just caution those that will try to "work safe", and to make sure to know what that means in any context in which one is working--for instance in operating a table saw. He's already in way over his head if he can't figure out simple controls.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote:
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD |
Central heating continuously runs
The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? We always wore out the dials--we were quick! : ) |
Central heating continuously runs
Bill writes:
The Daring Dufas wrote: On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? A good repairman would, given the schematics and a VOM, be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). scott |
Central heating continuously runs
"Scott Lurndal" wrote in message . .. Bill writes: The Daring Dufas wrote: On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? A good repairman would, given the schematics and a VOM, be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. Thats been my point all along for HVAC systems... A good tech can diagnose the system, show you what the problem(s) is/are, correct those problems with parts from his well stocked service truck, and warranty those repairs ..... usually for 1 year. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). scott |
Central heating continuously runs
On 08 Aug 2012 14:22:34 GMT, (Scott Lurndal) wrote:
Bill writes: The Daring Dufas wrote: On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? A good repairman would, given the schematics and a VOM, be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. Ha! A good repairman could take the make, model, and symptom, and tell you exactly which part failed and it's value or tube number. I worked for a guy like that. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). There's nothing wrong with the technique. |
Central heating continuously runs
On Wed, 8 Aug 2012 09:47:24 -0500, "Steve"
wrote: "Scott Lurndal" wrote in message ... Bill writes: I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. I worked TV repair in the late 50's. My recollections: People tried to save money fixing their own TV sets by using those drug store tube testers. Trouble was those tube testers often said a good tube was bad thus wasting the money the customer was trying to save by not calling a TV repairman. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? Tube changing (that is trying a new tube in place of a suspected bad tube in a working TV) was the quickest and most reliable way to see if that was the problem. There were specific tubes that did specific things so you didn't have to change out the whole TV's tube set. For example if the vertical hold wasn't locking there were just a few tubes that could cause that and you tried only them. A good repairman would, given the schematics We didn't carry schematics for all TV models in the shop. They came in a packet with other info on the particular set and were expensive. A good tech could fix most TV problems without one. Tube TV's were incredibly simple and easy to work on compared to today's electronics. If we couldn't fix it without a schematic, then of course we ordered one (at the customers expense of course) and then put it in our library for future use. and a VOM, We mostly used a VTVM (vacuum tube voltmeter) and a scope in the shop. For service calls we carried VOMs (volt ohm meter) and a picture tube tester along with a case of replacement tubes. be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. The majority of sets were fixed in the customers house. (Most TVs were very large and heavy in those days so we usually went to the customers house.) If the set couldn't be fixed by tube swapping then it went to the shop to fix. When repaired we delivered it back to the home. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). Yes we swapped boards in mainframes at GE in the 60s also. Like tubes swapping out was a quick method of troubleshooting. |
Central heating continuously runs
Steve wrote:
"Scott Lurndal" wrote in message . .. Bill writes: The Daring Dufas wrote: On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? A good repairman would, given the schematics and a VOM, be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. Thats been my point all along for HVAC systems... A good tech can diagnose the system, show you what the problem(s) is/are, correct those problems with parts from his well stocked service truck, and warranty those repairs ..... usually for 1 year. You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). scott |
Central heating continuously runs
AaronL writes:
On Wed, 8 Aug 2012 09:47:24 -0500, "Steve" wrote: "Scott Lurndal" wrote in message m... Bill writes: I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. I worked TV repair in the late 50's. My recollections: People tried to save money fixing their own TV sets by using those drug store tube testers. Trouble was those tube testers often said a good tube was bad thus wasting the money the customer was trying to save by not calling a TV repairman. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? Tube changing (that is trying a new tube in place of a suspected bad tube in a working TV) was the quickest and most reliable way to see if that was the problem. There were specific tubes that did specific things so you didn't have to change out the whole TV's tube set. For example if the vertical hold wasn't locking there were just a few tubes that could cause that and you tried only them. A good repairman would, given the schematics We didn't carry schematics for all TV models in the shop. Hmm. A number of sets that I worked on in the 70's had the schematics glued to the inside of the case. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). Yes we swapped boards in mainframes at GE in the 60s also. Like tubes swapping out was a quick method of troubleshooting. In this case it was past midnight, testing a completely new firmware and OS on a working customer mainframe and the FE had gone home hours ago. Given the failure was in a Load Index Register instruction, which was handled by the Fetch module, I tried to swap the two (20"x30") fetch cards with the on-site spares kit. The new OS still faulted. Tried the two Execute Module cards. Still faulted. Eventually got around to swapping out the MCW (Memory Controller Write) card which fixed the problem. All night, alone in the datacenter of one of Belgiums larger banks. Probably wouldn't happen nowadays. |
Central heating continuously runs
|
Central heating continuously runs
Thats been my point all along for HVAC systems... A good tech can diagnose the system, show you what the problem(s) is/are, correct those problems with parts from his well stocked service truck, and warranty those repairs ..... usually for 1 year. You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! The waters are even more treacherous when looking for a tech to hire and train for an employee. |
Central heating continuously runs
C'mon, Steve. I keep telling you I didn't steal all that stuff.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Steve" wrote in message ... You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! The waters are even more treacherous when looking for a tech to hire and train for an employee. |
Central heating continuously runs
AaronL writes:
On 08 Aug 2012 19:07:06 GMT, (Scott Lurndal) wrote: In this case it was past midnight, testing a completely new firmware and OS on a working customer mainframe and the FE had gone home hours ago. Given the failure was in a Load Index Register instruction, which was handled by the Fetch module, I tried to swap the two (20"x30") fetch cards with the on-site spares kit. The new OS still faulted. Tried the two Execute Module cards. Still faulted. Eventually got around to swapping out the MCW (Memory Controller Write) card which fixed the problem. All night, alone in the datacenter of one of Belgiums larger banks. Probably wouldn't happen nowadays. In the middle 60s I worked testing newly manufactured GE mainframes. You would have thought board testing would have caught all board problems but often when a machine had a problem it was caused by a (new) bad board. So board swapping was a still valid troubleshooting method even when testing at the new system level. Company I co-founded in 2004 built an ASIC (distributed node controller). A very complicated part. When we got the first (untested) samples from the fab, we plugged one into a test board and ... nothing. I would have spent hours trying to figure out why it wasn't working, but the ASIC architect just swapped it for the next one in the tray and it came right up. We never did find a bug in the part that required a re-spin or metal layer change by the fab. scott |
Hey Chaps
What should the thermostat control switch on and off to control the heating? Is it the valve or the pump. It's a MegaFlo system if that helps. I've replaced the programmer and the motorised valve and I'm back to square one... The heating comes on with the time but wont go off acording to the room stat If I take the stat off the wall I have 2 wires, one red and one yellow. It looks like someone has cut off a blue wire and there is an earth that looks like it has also been cut I assume the red is the live and the yellow is a switch wire? So the red goes to terminal 1 in the stat and the yellow to terminal 2. Does that sound right? Thanks Quote:
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Hey Chaps
What should the thermostat control switch on and off to control the heating? Is it the valve or the pump. It's a MegaFlo system if that helps. I've replaced the programmer and the motorised valve and I'm back to square one... The heating comes on with the time but wont go off acording to the room stat If I take the stat off the wall I have 2 wires, one red and one yellow. It looks like someone has cut off a blue wire and there is an earth that looks like it has also been cut I assume the red is the live and the yellow is a switch wire? So the red goes to terminal 1 in the stat and the yellow to terminal 2. Does that sound right? Thanks |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/7/2012 12:21 PM, Bill wrote:
Steve wrote: "Bill" wrote in message ... Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Not everyone has an instant-gratification fixation. I'm sure you could troubleshoot it faster, but as long as he is being safe, give the man a little credit for trying! I do! He changed something, and now its not working.... then while trying to "fix" it, he fried a motorized valve... Whats he going to fry next?? How much more is his attempts going to cost in time and money to replace componants that he destroys in the process?? Probably not much compared to the cost of an hour or two of a techs time. If the owner can swap a few components and it works half of the time, the owner is probably way ahead--at least financially, and surely from the point of view of understanding his or her system. I think I am way ahead because I have made the effort to learn more about how these systems. The industry would seem to prefer for people to be scared and ignorant. The outlook seems good. I would just caution those that will try to "work safe", and to make sure to know what that means in any context in which one is working--for instance in operating a table saw. I am not sure, but I think the flamethrower was invented by screw ups trying to fix something. Or maybe it was the Hand Grenade! He's already in way over his head if he can't figure out simple controls. |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/8/2012 2:07 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
writes: On Wed, 8 Aug 2012 09:47:24 -0500, wrote: "Scott wrote in message . .. writes: I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. I worked TV repair in the late 50's. My recollections: People tried to save money fixing their own TV sets by using those drug store tube testers. Trouble was those tube testers often said a good tube was bad thus wasting the money the customer was trying to save by not calling a TV repairman. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? Tube changing (that is trying a new tube in place of a suspected bad tube in a working TV) was the quickest and most reliable way to see if that was the problem. There were specific tubes that did specific things so you didn't have to change out the whole TV's tube set. For example if the vertical hold wasn't locking there were just a few tubes that could cause that and you tried only them. A good repairman would, given the schematics We didn't carry schematics for all TV models in the shop. Hmm. A number of sets that I worked on in the 70's had the schematics glued to the inside of the case. Howard Sam's made full schematics and parts list along with layouts of every TV made in those days. In later years you could buy each years sets on Cd or DVD. https://www.samswebsite.com/ http://theschematicman.com/?gclid=CI...FYVrKgodjUwAuQ (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). Yes we swapped boards in mainframes at GE in the 60s also. Like tubes swapping out was a quick method of troubleshooting. In this case it was past midnight, testing a completely new firmware and OS on a working customer mainframe and the FE had gone home hours ago. Given the failure was in a Load Index Register instruction, which was handled by the Fetch module, I tried to swap the two (20"x30") fetch cards with the on-site spares kit. The new OS still faulted. Tried the two Execute Module cards. Still faulted. Eventually got around to swapping out the MCW (Memory Controller Write) card which fixed the problem. All night, alone in the datacenter of one of Belgiums larger banks. Probably wouldn't happen nowadays. |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/8/2012 1:59 PM, Bill wrote:
Steve wrote: "Scott Lurndal" wrote in message . .. Bill writes: The Daring Dufas wrote: On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? A good repairman would, given the schematics and a VOM, be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. Thats been my point all along for HVAC systems... A good tech can diagnose the system, show you what the problem(s) is/are, correct those problems with parts from his well stocked service truck, and warranty those repairs ..... usually for 1 year. You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! Only when you are trying to shark HVAC companies for a cheap or a free fix. If all these companies were crooked...They would be put out of business for lack of Bonding. I for one am damned tired of working my ass off and then seeing some dip**** here ****ing on our industry. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). scott |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/8/2012 5:58 PM, Steve wrote:
Thats been my point all along for HVAC systems... A good tech can diagnose the system, show you what the problem(s) is/are, correct those problems with parts from his well stocked service truck, and warranty those repairs ..... usually for 1 year. You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! The waters are even more treacherous when looking for a tech to hire and train for an employee. For a fact! |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/8/2012 6:10 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
C'mon, Steve. I keep telling you I didn't steal all that stuff. Just some of it! ;=p Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . wrote in message ... You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! The waters are even more treacherous when looking for a tech to hire and train for an employee. |
Central heating continuously runs
On 8/9/2012 5:42 PM, PaxPerPoten wrote
A good repairman would, given the schematics We didn't carry schematics for all TV models in the shop. Hmm. A number of sets that I worked on in the 70's had the schematics glued to the inside of the case. Howard Sam's made full schematics and parts list along with layouts of every TV made in those days. In later years you could buy each years sets on Cd or DVD. https://www.samswebsite.com/ http://theschematicman.com/?gclid=CI...FYVrKgodjUwAuQ Sam's Photofacts were thankfully purchased by our local library and, like Chiltons auto manuals, were readily available without cost. They were always a few years behind, but the TV sets I repaired in the 50s and 60s were always many years old by the time they needed schematics to repair. The library must have had an incredibly big budget or a lot of requests or both to provide this free service. Their service manuals in general were fabulous for people like me (young kids) who would otherwise never be able to buy these items but still wanted to learn the information they contained. |
Central heating continuously runs
PaxPerPoten wrote:
On 8/8/2012 1:59 PM, Bill wrote: Steve wrote: "Scott Lurndal" wrote in message . .. Bill writes: The Daring Dufas wrote: On 8/6/2012 7:15 AM, Steve wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I'm sure the professionals on alt havoc will help. Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Daren Friday" wrote in message ... I've tried 2 other types of stats and all have the same result, the heating ignores them when room reaches temp. I've just changed the stat for a Honeywell CM900 and again I get exactly the same result. If I move the slider to off on the EP3002 everything closes fine. I thought maybe I'd wired the stat wrong so I rewired it and now I've popped the motorised valve (Myson Power Extra MPE228). I've ordered a replacement valve and EP3002. See how we go? Keep playing with it, keep breaking and changing parts... you'll eventually change something and accitentally "fix" it, *OR* you can call you local Master Tech and get the problem corrected the first time and be done with it. Years ago in the TV repair business we called them "Tube Changers". ^_^ TDD I recall a tube tester at my local drug store, but I am a little young to remember the big picture. Was "Tube Changing" frowned upon back then (mid-late 60's?)? A good repairman would, given the schematics and a VOM, be able to determine _which_ tube to change a priori, rather than just swapping out tubes until the TV works again. Thats been my point all along for HVAC systems... A good tech can diagnose the system, show you what the problem(s) is/are, correct those problems with parts from his well stocked service truck, and warranty those repairs ..... usually for 1 year. You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! Only when you are trying to shark HVAC companies for a cheap or a free fix. Certainly no sharking going on at this end. In my 3 years of home ownership and 3 HVAC calls, I promise you that I have never been given a cheap or free fix. And frankly, I never expected one. If all these companies were crooked...They would be put out of business for lack of Bonding. I for one am damned tired of working my ass off and then seeing some dip**** here ****ing on our industry. I'm not doing that, maybe it's just trickling down? I think it's fair to say that the industry will reap what it sows. I sense a greater need for regulation, and I'm rather conservative. I bought a new multi-meter (/capacitor tester) today. (although I will admit to using the swap technique to fix a mainframe once in Brussels). scott |
Central heating continuously runs
You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! Only when you are trying to shark HVAC companies for a cheap or a free fix. Certainly no sharking going on at this end. In my 3 years of home ownership and 3 HVAC calls, I promise you that I have never been given a cheap or free fix. And frankly, I never expected one. If all these companies were crooked...They would be put out of business for lack of Bonding. I for one am damned tired of working my ass off and then seeing some dip**** here ****ing on our industry. I'm not doing that, maybe it's just trickling down? I think it's fair to say that the industry will reap what it sows. I sense a greater need for regulation, and I'm rather conservative. I bought a new multi-meter (/capacitor tester) today. So you bought a new meter to check capacitors.... that was a real good use of your time and money... The cost of a decent meter that you *might* need tocheck a $20 capacitor... is as much as the cost of a service call and capacitor replacement. I am missing the part where you are saving anything here. |
Central heating continuously runs
Steve wrote:
You are fortunate that you can do the work for yourself, and don't have to rely on locating a good tech. As we have discussed before, the waters are treacherous! Only when you are trying to shark HVAC companies for a cheap or a free fix. Certainly no sharking going on at this end. In my 3 years of home ownership and 3 HVAC calls, I promise you that I have never been given a cheap or free fix. And frankly, I never expected one. If all these companies were crooked...They would be put out of business for lack of Bonding. I for one am damned tired of working my ass off and then seeing some dip**** here ****ing on our industry. I'm not doing that, maybe it's just trickling down? I think it's fair to say that the industry will reap what it sows. I sense a greater need for regulation, and I'm rather conservative. I bought a new multi-meter (/capacitor tester) today. So you bought a new meter to check capacitors.... that was a real good use of your time and money... The cost of a decent meter that you *might* need tocheck a $20 capacitor... is as much as the cost of a service call and capacitor replacement. I am missing the part where you are saving anything here. The unit, Sperry DM6450 - 9 function, was on sale for $45 at Menards. An AC service call is $89, and my last capacitor (installed) cost $280. I thought we (almost) agreed that 10P was the absolute minimum! : ) And, having my own unit, I won't even need to wait two days for someone to check it. You think this is a poor investment of time and money? It was only 2 miles to the store, so for the dollar value of my time, it makes sense for me maybe not for you. As someone who enjoys using his hands, I'm sure I'll find other uses for the multimeter too. It's a nice improvement from the Radio Shack cheapie I bought for myself for about $8 in 1978, which eats batteries as long as you leave them in. I'm sure I'll also learn something from the new tool as I experiment with it as I'm interested in electronics. As far as the "might need" part, as you may have pointed out, it's really just a matter of "when". If I could start over with my $280 capacitor, I would handle it differently. Live and learn. $280 capacitors are fine for people who can afford them I guess. At this point, I don't see how a homeowner can afford not to be able to check a capacitor on his or her own. As you have said, the cooling unit is the most expensive appliance in the house. Last week I suggested to a friend to check his (dual) capacitor, and he was able to repair his AC unit for $17.50. THAT was actually the tipping point which made me decide to own a better multimeter. I'm a "tool guy" anyway so $45 is not a huge amount of money to me for a good tool. I paid almost as much for a torque wrench which doesn't see much duty, and twice as much for a Starrett combination square, and I have no regrets. But I see the potential of paying $280 a second time for a bad capacitor as just a waste of a tech's valuable time. I can't even make myself pay $185 for a Veritas router plane, and I really would like one of those! : ) It actually probably makes sense for many people (those that won't hurt themselves) to have extra capacitors (one for the fan motor and one for the compressor motor) on the shelf and ready to go--don't you think? Together they would cost less than a tank of gas, and they they would have very little down time when a capacitor goes bad. It seems like cheap insurance. If they buy the multimeter ($45) and both capacitors (for say $35) and ever use either capacitor then they would come out $200 ahead, and still have a multimeter and a capacitor on hand! Are you still sticking with your hyperbole about my use of time and money? : ) I know how to use a torch too, but I'm not going there today...lol. Cheers, Bill |
Central heating continuously runs
On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 10:41:51 +0000, Daren Friday
wrote: Hi We have a Potterton Suprema boiler, a Potterton EP3002 wall timer and a Wickes wall thermostat. The heating switches on OK according to the timer schedule but fails to switch off when it reaches the right room temp set on the thermostat so we just get hotter. I had to have a new thermostat for some reason but I seem to remember there being 3 wires into the stat but there appears to be only 2. Is that right? And would the missing wire be the one to turn off the heat? (Pictures attached) Thanks Daren +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Filename: Boiler.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6606| |Filename: Stat.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6607| |Filename: Timer.JPG | |Download: http://www.diybanter.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6608| +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ If this was my problem, I'd go to a local heating contractor, and ask them for advice. Most places will try to be helpful, knowing you may be back to buy parts or hire them to do the repair. Try to find someone who works on these boilers. Call around and just ask them if they work on them. That way you'll know where to go. One thing to remember, is that a thermostat is nothing more than an on-off switch. It just cycles on-off according to room temperatures. Remove the thermostat wires from the boiler completely. Jump across the terminals with a simple wire with alligator clips on the end. With the wire connected, it should turn on, with wire removed, it should turn off. If that dont work, there is likely a bad control. There should be a 24v transformer somewhere nearby, and some sort of relay that turns on and off via the thermostat sending that 24v to that relay. Make sure you got 24 AC volts. Then check for that relay and see if it contacts (moves) when the 24v is applied. (unless this is a new boiler with electronic controls). Either way, it seems like you have a problem with the controls, not the boiler itself, and likely not the thermostat. |
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