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Mounting timer & outlet in a box
Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel
bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 7:56*am, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? You're putting the box on the end of a cord? Yes, connect the metal box and all ground wires together. I beleive I've seen those timers in lowes btw. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
"jamesgangnc" wrote in message
... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? You're putting the box on the end of a cord? Yes, connect the metal box and all ground wires together. I beleive I've seen those timers in lowes btw. =========== I bought the shortest big fat extension cord I could find which was appropriate for the wattage of the heater, and made sure there was a place in town where I could buy a grommet/strain relief thing that would fit around the cord as it entered the box. A friend has the proper tool for installing the grommet. I'm going to cut the cord down so there's about 3 feet sticking out of the box. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
For grounding purposes, should the
green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Yes. ---MIKE--- In the White Mountains of New Hampshire (44° 15' N - Elevation 1580') |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 8:21*am, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message ... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? You're putting the box on the end of a cord? *Yes, connect the metal box and all ground wires together. *I beleive I've seen those timers in lowes btw. =========== I bought the shortest big fat extension cord I could find which was appropriate for the wattage of the heater, and made sure there was a place in town where I could buy a grommet/strain relief thing that would fit around the cord as it entered the box. A friend has the proper tool for installing the grommet. I'm going to cut the cord down so there's about 3 feet sticking out of the box. I've seen that done before. As long as you have strain relief and tie all the grounds to the box it's perfectly safe. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
"jamesgangnc" wrote in message
... On Mar 29, 8:21 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message ... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? You're putting the box on the end of a cord? Yes, connect the metal box and all ground wires together. I beleive I've seen those timers in lowes btw. =========== I bought the shortest big fat extension cord I could find which was appropriate for the wattage of the heater, and made sure there was a place in town where I could buy a grommet/strain relief thing that would fit around the cord as it entered the box. A friend has the proper tool for installing the grommet. I'm going to cut the cord down so there's about 3 feet sticking out of the box. I've seen that done before. As long as you have strain relief and tie all the grounds to the box it's perfectly safe. ============ I'm really adverse to burning my house down. It's one of my little quirks. So, yes. It'll be done that way. :-) |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 8:54*am, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message ... On Mar 29, 8:21 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message .... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? You're putting the box on the end of a cord? Yes, connect the metal box and all ground wires together. I beleive I've seen those timers in lowes btw. =========== I bought the shortest big fat extension cord I could find which was appropriate for the wattage of the heater, and made sure there was a place in town where I could buy a grommet/strain relief thing that would fit around the cord as it entered the box. A friend has the proper tool for installing the grommet. I'm going to cut the cord down so there's about 3 feet sticking out of the box. I've seen that done before. *As long as you have strain relief and tie all the grounds to the box it's perfectly safe. ============ I'm really adverse to burning my house down. It's one of my little quirks.. So, yes. It'll be done that way. :-)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - We all have our little foibles. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 7:56*am, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Is this a regular 4" square metal box you are considering using ? I have made extension cords using these before but you have to be careful where they will be used (normal 4" square metal boxes are full of holes which will let any water or liquid spilled near it into the box AND the knock-outs can become damaged and push inward contacting live electrical parts inside) as water and physical/mechanical damage can be a problem... Find a water tight rated box... Those boxes have MUCH fewer holes in them and use threaded knock-outs so they are more durable... Wrap all devices with several layers of electrical tape after making up the connections... IF anything got damaged or loosened it is better to have metal touching electrical tape and hear it rattle around inside the box than have metal on metal contact and blow a breaker... ~~ Evan |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
"Evan" wrote in message
... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Is this a regular 4" square metal box you are considering using ? I have made extension cords using these before but you have to be careful where they will be used (normal 4" square metal boxes are full of holes which will let any water or liquid spilled near it into the box AND the knock-outs can become damaged and push inward contacting live electrical parts inside) as water and physical/mechanical damage can be a problem... Find a water tight rated box... Those boxes have MUCH fewer holes in them and use threaded knock-outs so they are more durable... Wrap all devices with several layers of electrical tape after making up the connections... IF anything got damaged or loosened it is better to have metal touching electrical tape and hear it rattle around inside the box than have metal on metal contact and blow a breaker... ~~ Evan ================ For my birthday many years ago, 3 unrelated people gave me the same gift: The Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbook. They knew how I think. So, I'm purposely keeping the cord short to guarantee that this box won't allow the heater to go anywhere near moisture, unless my 2 year old roof caves in during a thunderstorm, in which case all bets are off. It's a heavy duty "hobby box" from a local electronics supply place. I wanted heavy enough metal so that the front wouldn't flex when we plugged or unplugged the heater. Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 10:08*am, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote: "Evan" wrote in message ... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Is this a regular 4" square metal box you are considering using ? I have made extension cords using these before but you have to be careful where they will be used (normal 4" square metal boxes are full of holes which will let any water or liquid spilled near it into the box AND the knock-outs can become damaged and push inward contacting live electrical parts inside) as water and physical/mechanical damage can be a problem... Find a water tight rated box... *Those boxes have MUCH fewer holes in them and use threaded knock-outs so they are more durable... Wrap all devices with several layers of electrical tape after making up the connections... *IF anything got damaged or loosened it is better to have metal touching electrical tape and hear it rattle around inside the box than have metal on metal contact and blow a breaker... ~~ Evan ================ For my birthday many years ago, 3 unrelated people gave me the same gift: The Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbook. They knew how I think. So, I'm purposely keeping the cord short to guarantee that this box won't allow the heater to go anywhere near moisture, unless my 2 year old roof caves in during a thunderstorm, in which case all bets are off. It's a heavy duty "hobby box" from a local electronics supply place. I wanted heavy enough metal so that the front wouldn't flex when we plugged or unplugged the heater. Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them.. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) I have used those outdoor boxes for similar purposes myself and do prefer them over the regular metal old work box. But I agree about the electricat tape, not fond of it either. I just use wirenuts but don't have any problems with them as long as they are nice and tight. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
"jamesgangnc" wrote in message
... On Mar 29, 10:08 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: "Evan" wrote in message ... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Is this a regular 4" square metal box you are considering using ? I have made extension cords using these before but you have to be careful where they will be used (normal 4" square metal boxes are full of holes which will let any water or liquid spilled near it into the box AND the knock-outs can become damaged and push inward contacting live electrical parts inside) as water and physical/mechanical damage can be a problem... Find a water tight rated box... Those boxes have MUCH fewer holes in them and use threaded knock-outs so they are more durable... Wrap all devices with several layers of electrical tape after making up the connections... IF anything got damaged or loosened it is better to have metal touching electrical tape and hear it rattle around inside the box than have metal on metal contact and blow a breaker... ~~ Evan ================ For my birthday many years ago, 3 unrelated people gave me the same gift: The Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbook. They knew how I think. So, I'm purposely keeping the cord short to guarantee that this box won't allow the heater to go anywhere near moisture, unless my 2 year old roof caves in during a thunderstorm, in which case all bets are off. It's a heavy duty "hobby box" from a local electronics supply place. I wanted heavy enough metal so that the front wouldn't flex when we plugged or unplugged the heater. Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) I have used those outdoor boxes for similar purposes myself and do prefer them over the regular metal old work box. But I agree about the electricat tape, not fond of it either. I just use wirenuts but don't have any problems with them as long as they are nice and tight. =========== I'm not adverse to using wire nuts. But I refreshed my supply of crimp connectors a few years ago. With the right tool, they're a pleasure to use, and the results are rock solid. Sadly, it's almost impossible to find a correctly designed crimp tool at the big box stores, so a lot of people have had bad experiences with the connectors. I'll still use wire nuts anyplace where I (or the next homeowner) might need to make changes to the wiring. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
wrote in message
... On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 07:56:13 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Done safely this will be OK but it is not really legal. These devices are only listed for mounting in a box fastened to the wall. Impact would be the concern, either to the operating knob or just "G" shock to the internal parts. As long as you never are in a situation where the OSHA inspector is looking, I doubt it will ever come up. I have seen people on job sites written up for the ubiquitous "handy box on a cord". Oh crap. Maybe I should embed the box in cement on the bottom & sides. And pump it full of non-conductive potting epoxy. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 07:29:15 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc
wrote: Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) I have used those outdoor boxes for similar purposes myself and do prefer them over the regular metal old work box. But I agree about the electricat tape, not fond of it either. I just use wirenuts but don't have any problems with them as long as they are nice and tight. Since we're on the subject, I'll again mention silicon tape, or stretch tape, or I forget the favored name. Hard to find, expensive, but you stretch a piece three times its length, then wrap it and it sticks like crazy and within a couple days merges into one blob, waterproof except perhaps where it touches the work. The rolls I've seen have a white plastic roll in the center, instead of cardboard like vinyl or real (cloth) electric tape. |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 10:29*am, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Mar 29, 10:08*am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: "Evan" wrote in message ... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Is this a regular 4" square metal box you are considering using ? I have made extension cords using these before but you have to be careful where they will be used (normal 4" square metal boxes are full of holes which will let any water or liquid spilled near it into the box AND the knock-outs can become damaged and push inward contacting live electrical parts inside) as water and physical/mechanical damage can be a problem... Find a water tight rated box... *Those boxes have MUCH fewer holes in them and use threaded knock-outs so they are more durable... Wrap all devices with several layers of electrical tape after making up the connections... *IF anything got damaged or loosened it is better to have metal touching electrical tape and hear it rattle around inside the box than have metal on metal contact and blow a breaker... ~~ Evan ================ For my birthday many years ago, 3 unrelated people gave me the same gift: The Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbook. They knew how I think. So, I'm purposely keeping the cord short to guarantee that this box won't allow the heater to go anywhere near moisture, unless my 2 year old roof caves in during a thunderstorm, in which case all bets are off. It's a heavy duty "hobby box" from a local electronics supply place. I wanted heavy enough metal so that the front wouldn't flex when we plugged or unplugged the heater. Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) I have used those outdoor boxes for similar purposes myself and do prefer them over the regular metal old work box. *But I agree about the electricat tape, not fond of it either. *I just use wirenuts but don't have any problems with them as long as they are nice and tight.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I think they were suggesting a wrap of electrical tape around the recep itself after connections have been made so that nothing can contact the screws which will be live. I do that myself whenever installing a device in a box with which I've used Madison hangers, better safe than sorry. nate |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 4:48*pm, N8N wrote:
On Mar 29, 10:29*am, jamesgangnc wrote: On Mar 29, 10:08*am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: "Evan" wrote in message .... On Mar 29, 7:56 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Is this a regular 4" square metal box you are considering using ? I have made extension cords using these before but you have to be careful where they will be used (normal 4" square metal boxes are full of holes which will let any water or liquid spilled near it into the box AND the knock-outs can become damaged and push inward contacting live electrical parts inside) as water and physical/mechanical damage can be a problem... Find a water tight rated box... *Those boxes have MUCH fewer holes in them and use threaded knock-outs so they are more durable... Wrap all devices with several layers of electrical tape after making up the connections... *IF anything got damaged or loosened it is better to have metal touching electrical tape and hear it rattle around inside the box than have metal on metal contact and blow a breaker... ~~ Evan ================ For my birthday many years ago, 3 unrelated people gave me the same gift: The Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbook. They knew how I think. So, I'm purposely keeping the cord short to guarantee that this box won't allow the heater to go anywhere near moisture, unless my 2 year old roof caves in during a thunderstorm, in which case all bets are off. It's a heavy duty "hobby box" from a local electronics supply place. I wanted heavy enough metal so that the front wouldn't flex when we plugged or unplugged the heater. Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) I have used those outdoor boxes for similar purposes myself and do prefer them over the regular metal old work box. *But I agree about the electricat tape, not fond of it either. *I just use wirenuts but don't have any problems with them as long as they are nice and tight.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I think they were suggesting a wrap of electrical tape around the recep itself after connections have been made so that nothing can contact the screws which will be live. *I do that myself whenever installing a device in a box with which I've used Madison hangers, better safe than sorry. nate +1 Nate... It is not the connections themselves you are protecting but against a ground fault short if one of the knock-outs was pushed in against the live terminal screws... ~~ Evan |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 7:56*am, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Make sure the timer can handle the current drawn by the heater. I have one that is rated at 1KW, that would be too small for most electric heaters. Most of the little plug in heaters ar rated at 1500W.....timer should handle at least that preferably more. JImmie |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 1:45*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 07:56:13 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote: Ya know those wind-up timers you sometimes (or used to) see in hotel bathrooms for the heat lamps? I need to mount one of those, and an outlet in a metal box. It'll be used for a portable electric heater which we regularly forget to turn off. For grounding purposes, should the green from the outlet, timer and cord all be attached to the box itself? Done safely this will be OK but it is not really legal. These devices are only listed for mounting in a box fastened to the wall. Impact would be the concern, either to the operating knob or just "G" shock to the internal parts. *As long as you never are in a situation where the OSHA inspector is looking, I doubt it will ever come up. I have seen people on job sites written up for the ubiquitous "handy box on a cord". Yeah I have an extension cord made up with two duplex outlets in a cast aluminum box and braided strain relief. I use it for camping and sometimes at work ........looks professionallly built but illegal as hell if the electrical police come around. Jimmie |
Mounting timer & outlet in a box
On Mar 29, 2:26*pm, mm wrote:
On Tue, 29 Mar 2011 07:29:15 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: Electrical tape is sloppy. No connections will come loose. I use top quality (Panduit) crimps connectors and the correct (Panduit) tool to attach them. All possible scary scenarios have been pondered and crushed. :-) I have used those outdoor boxes for similar purposes myself and do prefer them over the regular metal old work box. *But I agree about the electricat tape, not fond of it either. *I just use wirenuts but don't have any problems with them as long as they are nice and tight. Since we're on the subject, I'll again mention silicon tape, or stretch tape, or I forget the favored name. *Hard to find, expensive, but you stretch a piece three times its length, then wrap it and it sticks like crazy and within a couple days merges into one blob, waterproof except perhaps where it touches the work. The rolls I've seen have a white plastic roll in the center, instead of cardboard like vinyl or real (cloth) electric tape. self amalgamating tape...call it that though and the guy at the parts store probably won't have a clue. Jimmie |
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