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OT a bit - Propane prices
Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our
1,200 sq. ft. shop with propane fired high efficiency furnaces. Normally we contract the winter supply in the fall but this year they wanted $1.699/gallon so we gambled that it would not go up and possibly go down and did not contract. Well, we just got our first winter fill (approx. 300 gallons) and the price was $1.699 thus so far nothing has changed. OTOH, the real cold weather is not here yet so there is definitely a chance it will go up in the near future. :-( For some reason unknown to me propane is usually less expensive in this immediate area than it is in other parts of the country. Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? Happy Holidays, Don |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote the following:
Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our 1,200 sq. ft. shop with propane fired high efficiency furnaces. Normally we contract the winter supply in the fall but this year they wanted $1.699/gallon so we gambled that it would not go up and possibly go down and did not contract. Well, we just got our first winter fill (approx. 300 gallons) and the price was $1.699 thus so far nothing has changed. OTOH, the real cold weather is not here yet so there is definitely a chance it will go up in the near future. :-( For some reason unknown to me propane is usually less expensive in this immediate area than it is in other parts of the country. Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? Happy Holidays, Don Consider yourself lucky. My last propane bill (November) was $141.01 for 43.4 gallons. That's $3.249 a gallon. -- Bill In Hamptonburgh, NY In the original Orange County. Est. 1683 To email, remove the double zeroes after @ |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Mon, 13 Dec 2010 13:40:05 -0600, IGot2P wrote:
For some reason unknown to me propane is usually less expensive in this immediate area than it is in other parts of the country. Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? I think ours was $1.85/gal around this time *last* year up here in northern MN. We'll be ordering more in about 2 weeks' time so I'm not sure what it's at right now. It's frustrating how much the prices do fluctuate though, even in the same region - I hate playing the "gamble on when best to buy" game. About half of our house heating is electric baseboard, and prices for that are a lot more stable (and generally competitive with propane costs for the season) cheers Jules |
OT a bit - Propane prices
willshak wrote:
IGot2P wrote the following: Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our -snip- Well, we just got our first winter fill (approx. 300 gallons) and the price was $1.699 thus so far nothing has changed. OTOH, the real cold weather is not here yet so there is definitely a chance it will go up in the near future. :-( -snip- Consider yourself lucky. My last propane bill (November) was $141.01 for 43.4 gallons. That's $3.249 a gallon. Will is in Hamptonburg, NY. I'm a couple hours north of him, near Schenectady, NY. My delivery last week was $4.19 - up $.66 from Nov- and up $1.15 from last Dec. Jim |
OT a bit - Propane prices
DA wrote the following:
responding to http://www.homeownershub.com/mainten...es-609497-.htm DA wrote: willshak wrote: Consider yourself lucky. My last propane bill (November) was $141.01 for 43.4 gallons. That's $3.249 a gallon. Lucky indeed. I paid $3.20 about a month ago and, according to US E.I.A. 1-week old data, average residential propane was at $2.598 on 12/06/2010, 26% up from this time last year ( http://www.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/hopu/hopu.asp ) . Slightly off-topic though: they delivered only 43.4 gallons? Automatic delivery. They just top it off every other month or so whether I need it or not.. -- Bill In Hamptonburgh, NY In the original Orange County. Est. 1683 To email, remove the double zeroes after @ |
OT a bit - Propane prices
DA wrote the following:
responding to http://www.homeownershub.com/mainten...es-609497-.htm DA wrote: willshak wrote: Automatic delivery. They just top it off every other month or so whether I need it or not.. I see... I actually have automatic delivery, too, but they will never come until they are very extra sure they can fill 300+ gallons. Every bill I had so far with this company was for $800+ and edging more towards $1,100 this year ... I only use LP for the counter top range (wall ovens are electric), water heating, and the clothes dryer. I use fuel oil for house heating. -- Bill In Hamptonburgh, NY In the original Orange County. Est. 1683 To email, remove the double zeroes after @ |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On 12/13/2010 3:58 PM, willshak wrote:
DA wrote the following: responding to http://www.homeownershub.com/mainten...es-609497-.htm DA wrote: willshak wrote: Consider yourself lucky. My last propane bill (November) was $141.01 for 43.4 gallons. That's $3.249 a gallon. Lucky indeed. I paid $3.20 about a month ago and, according to US E.I.A. 1-week old data, average residential propane was at $2.598 on 12/06/2010, 26% up from this time last year ( http://www.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/hopu/hopu.asp ) . Slightly off-topic though: they delivered only 43.4 gallons? Automatic delivery. They just top it off every other month or so whether I need it or not.. We also have automatic delivery (the supplier calls it a "keep full" agreement) but they don't deliver until it gets down pretty low. I actually have two tanks, 1 - 500 gallon for the house and 1 - 250 gallon for the shop. Fortunately in the winter I am not in the shop that often thus the thermostat is normally set on 48 degrees F. In short, the shop does not use much LP. When the "organized half" gets home I will have her see if you can find what we paid the last few years when we contracted it. I must say that these Midwest prices are great compared to the NE. Don |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On 2010-12-13, IGot2P wrote:
price was $1.699 thus so far nothing has changed. OTOH, the real cold I jes paid $2 per. It was $1.5 something last year and almost $3 a couple yrs ago. It's like gas, all over the map. I'm jes glad I don't use kerosene. EIGHT DOLLARS A GALLON!! nb |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote in
: I must say that these Midwest prices are great compared to the NE. The commodity's prices are the same everywhere. Any differences will be due to local taxes (very high in the NE), and delivery policies. -- Tegger |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Tegger wrote:
IGot2P wrote in : I must say that these Midwest prices are great compared to the NE. The commodity's prices are the same everywhere. Any differences will be due to local taxes (very high in the NE), and delivery policies. and transportation and labor and warehousing costs. and perhaps the company owner's boat payment schedule. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Tegger wrote in
: IGot2P wrote in : I must say that these Midwest prices are great compared to the NE. The commodity's prices are the same everywhere. Any differences will be due to local taxes (very high in the NE), and delivery policies. And possibly local safety regulations. -- Tegger |
OT a bit - Propane prices
The Homeowners Hub site is not a help forum.
It's an *advertising* forum that invades real forums (like "alt.home.repair", part of "usenet") parasitically in order to generate free advertising for itself, which continually advances its search engine placement, thereby increasing its own revenue through its click- through advertising commissions. So the first thing you should do is write them an email and tell them to quit spamming. Then try to find your way here through proper channels. Please do a google search on "Usenet" and post the regular way. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "DA" wrote in message oups.com... responding to http://www.homeownershub.com/mainten...es-609497-.htm |
OT a bit - Propane prices
I've been told that cooking gas and heating gas are priced
differently. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "willshak" wrote in message ... I only use LP for the counter top range (wall ovens are electric), water heating, and the clothes dryer. I use fuel oil for house heating. -- Bill In Hamptonburgh, NY In the original Orange County. Est. 1683 To email, remove the double zeroes after @ |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote:
Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? You may find this Dept of Energy website interesting. http://www.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/hopu/hopu.asp |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Tegger wrote:
The commodity's prices are the same everywhere. Any differences will be due to local taxes (very high in the NE), and delivery policies. No, they aren't. Propane prices are influenced by a number of factors, including regional demand (ie crop drying), what the dominate energy source in the region is, how easy it is for industrial users to switch energy sources, whether the propane (actually LPG as the blend varianies depending on the region) comes from LNG tankers or local refineries, domestic wells, etc. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Jules Richardson wrote:
It's frustrating how much the prices do fluctuate though, even in the same region - I hate playing the "gamble on when best to buy" game. About half of our house heating is electric baseboard, and prices for that are a lot more stable (and generally competitive with propane costs for the season) A few years ago, the breakeven between electricity and propane for heat in this area was about $2/gal. Summer and fall fills were running between $1.75 and $1.85, deep winter fills were peaking around $2.40/gal, delivered on an autro fill contract. In the last couple of years the local electricity prices have jumped up about 25%, so the breakeven is a lot higher now. There are web based calculators around that compute the actual number. I've debated replacing my 500 gal tank that needs 3-4 refills a year with a 1000 gal tank, but the savings for my relatively low use hasn't been enough to get me to do it. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Stormin Mormon wrote:
I've been told that cooking gas and heating gas are priced differently. ??????????? Here (nl) we have only one sort of gas, for heating and cooking. Of course we can buy butane or propane for a motorhome or ship, or in our car, but those are not used for normal home consumption. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Mon, 13 Dec 2010 16:58:25 -0500, willshak wrote:
DA wrote the following: responding to http://www.homeownershub.com/mainten...es-609497-.htm DA wrote: willshak wrote: Consider yourself lucky. My last propane bill (November) was $141.01 for 43.4 gallons. That's $3.249 a gallon. Lucky indeed. I paid $3.20 about a month ago and, according to US E.I.A. 1-week old data, average residential propane was at $2.598 on 12/06/2010, 26% up from this time last year ( http://www.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/hopu/hopu.asp ) . Slightly off-topic though: they delivered only 43.4 gallons? Automatic delivery. They just top it off every other month or so whether I need it or not.. I have automatic delivery too. I had 25 gallons when they stopped by and decided that I had enough (it's just for a gas fireplace, but...). :-( Really strange. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Robert Neville wrote in
: Tegger wrote: The commodity's prices are the same everywhere. Any differences will be due to local taxes (very high in the NE), and delivery policies. No, they aren't. Propane prices are influenced by a number of factors, including regional demand (ie crop drying), I hadn't considered that. There's a lot more agriculture in the midwest than in NYS. what the dominate energy source in the region is, how easy it is for industrial users to switch energy sources, whether the propane (actually LPG as the blend varianies depending on the region) comes from LNG tankers or local refineries, domestic wells, etc. More I hadn't thought of. Sounds to me like the price differences between regions are quite legitimate and reasonable. -- Tegger |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Tue, 14 Dec 2010 02:11:01 +0100, Sjouke Burry
wrote: Stormin Mormon wrote: I've been told that cooking gas and heating gas are priced differently. ??????????? Here (nl) we have only one sort of gas, for heating and cooking. Of course we can buy butane or propane for a motorhome or ship, or in our car, but those are not used for normal home consumption. Quantity? It costs almost the same to deliver 500gal as it does 50. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Mon, 13 Dec 2010 23:49:22 +0000 (UTC), Tegger
wrote: IGot2P wrote in m: I must say that these Midwest prices are great compared to the NE. The commodity's prices are the same everywhere. Any differences will be due to local taxes (very high in the NE), and delivery policies. Oh- I forgot the taxes and fees-- They bring my $4.19/gal up to $4.56. but who's counting? And each outfit gets to set it own profit margin. My guy is in the middle for this area- but a couple years ago when I was shopping around, there was over $1.00/gallon difference in price. Same taxes- same automatic delivery. Same 100gallon tank. Jim |
OT a bit - Propane prices
"Sjouke Burry" wrote in message ... Stormin Mormon wrote: I've been told that cooking gas and heating gas are priced differently. ??????????? Here (nl) we have only one sort of gas, for heating and cooking. Of course we can buy butane or propane for a motorhome or ship, or in our car, but those are not used for normal home consumption. The gas is the same, but most of us that use it for cooking have two 100# tanks versus the larger 1000# and up for heating. Yes, they gauge us on price. I get a fillup only once a year so you pay for the smaller quantities. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote in
: Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our 1,200 sq. ft. shop with propane fired high efficiency furnaces. Normally we contract the winter supply in the fall but this year they wanted $1.699/gallon so we gambled that it would not go up and possibly go down and did not contract. In South central Iowa I contracted for $1.57, up 28¢ from last year. I've contracted for 20 years and have never been beaten by lower prices late in the season. YMMV. Steve southiowa -- There is no such thing as a silly question; just silly people asking questions. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote: The Homeowners Hub site is not a help forum. snip I think you and I are both killfiled at the hub, stormy. Someone else will have to spread the news over there. This DA guy has turned into an a.h.r. regular and never responds to my appeals to ditch the spam portal and tune in to usenet. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On 12/14/2010 4:40 AM, Steve.IA wrote:
wrote in : Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our 1,200 sq. ft. shop with propane fired high efficiency furnaces. Normally we contract the winter supply in the fall but this year they wanted $1.699/gallon so we gambled that it would not go up and possibly go down and did not contract. In South central Iowa I contracted for $1.57, up 28¢ from last year. I've contracted for 20 years and have never been beaten by lower prices late in the season. YMMV. Steve southiowa Steve, I am in Farmington, IA (20 miles from IL and 3 miles from MO), how far west of me are you? Don |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote in
: Steve, I am in Farmington, IA (20 miles from IL and 3 miles from MO), how far west of me are you? Don Outside Osceola, Clarke County. Steve -- There is no such thing as a silly question; just silly people asking questions. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Dec 13, 9:23*pm, Jules Richardson
wrote: On Mon, 13 Dec 2010 13:40:05 -0600, IGot2P wrote: For some reason unknown to me propane is usually less expensive in this immediate area than it is in other parts of the country. Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? I think ours was $1.85/gal around this time *last* year up here in northern MN. We'll be ordering more in about 2 weeks' time so I'm not sure what it's at right now. It's frustrating how much the prices do fluctuate though, even in the same region - I hate playing the "gamble on when best to buy" game. About half of our house heating is electric baseboard, and prices for that are a lot more stable (and generally competitive with propane costs for the season) cheers Jules In general all fuel prices will go up. With any delivered fuel (ie tanker) the price will go up in periods of peak demand. This is because the supplier wants to encourage you to buy in the non- busy season (so that his tankers are not stood about idle). And they know in cold weather, they have you by the ********. So, to hit a cost valley, buy in the warm season. And get several quotes. And arrange things so as to give the biggest possible drop off. (ie run the tank down as low as you dare). |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Dec 13, 9:38*pm, Jim Elbrecht wrote:
willshak wrote: IGot2P wrote the following: Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our -snip- Well, we just got our first winter fill (approx. 300 gallons) and the price was $1.699 thus so far nothing has changed. OTOH, the real cold weather is not here yet so there is definitely a chance it will go up in the near future. :-( -snip- Consider yourself lucky. My last propane bill (November) was $141.01 for 43.4 gallons. That's $3.249 a gallon. Will is in Hamptonburg, NY. * I'm a couple hours north of him, near Schenectady, NY. My delivery last week was $4.19 - up $.66 from Nov- and up $1.15 from last Dec. Jim If you have a propane tank and a large petrol vehicle(s), you could consider getting the vehicle converted to run on propane. Very common here in the UK. Engines run really sweet on propane. Start a lot easier too. Dunno if feasible in the US. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On 12/14/2010 1:06 PM, Steve.IA wrote:
wrote in : Steve, I am in Farmington, IA (20 miles from IL and 3 miles from MO), how far west of me are you? Don Outside Osceola, Clarke County. Steve Okay, we used to always take the long way home from Des Moines and stop at the Casino back before they changed owners and name. Don |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote:
Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? I just got 350 gallons today from the local ag co-op. If I pay within 10 days, it will cost $1.90/gallon. This is in southern Wisconsin. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On 12/13/2010 1:40 PM, IGot2P wrote:
Here in extreme SE Iowa we heat both our newish two story home and our 1,200 sq. ft. shop with propane fired high efficiency furnaces. Normally we contract the winter supply in the fall but this year they wanted $1.699/gallon so we gambled that it would not go up and possibly go down and did not contract. Well, we just got our first winter fill (approx. 300 gallons) and the price was $1.699 thus so far nothing has changed. OTOH, the real cold weather is not here yet so there is definitely a chance it will go up in the near future. :-( For some reason unknown to me propane is usually less expensive in this immediate area than it is in other parts of the country. Anyone else got any current prices from around the US? Happy Holidays, Don $2.19 here in the rural south of KC -- Steve Barker remove the "not" from my address to email |
OT a bit - Propane prices
IGot2P wrote
Steve, I am in Farmington, IA (20 miles from IL and 3 miles from MO), how far west of me are you? Don Many years ago I had a dorm neighbor at Central College who was from Farmington. Don't remember his name, but do where he was from! 6' red headed kid. The list things I can't remember is growing daily. Now where did I put that list? Steve -- There is no such thing as a silly question; just silly people asking questions. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
harry wrote:
If you have a propane tank and a large petrol vehicle(s), you could consider getting the vehicle converted to run on propane. Very common here in the UK. Engines run really sweet on propane. Start a lot easier too. Dunno if feasible in the US. Feasible yes. Practical? Probably not for many people. I live in a rural area. Some farmers I know did run their pickups on propane. They also use propane for grain drying and to run irrigation power units. A very few also had propane burning farm tractors years ago. That didn't catch on due in part to the inconvenience of propane compared to gasoline or diesel fuel. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Dean Hoffman wrote in
: harry wrote: If you have a propane tank and a large petrol vehicle(s), you could consider getting the vehicle converted to run on propane. Very common here in the UK. Engines run really sweet on propane. Start a lot easier too. Dunno if feasible in the US. Feasible yes. Practical? Probably not for many people. I live in a rural area. Some farmers I know did run their pickups on propane. They also use propane for grain drying and to run irrigation power units. A very few also had propane burning farm tractors years ago. That didn't catch on due in part to the inconvenience of propane compared to gasoline or diesel fuel. how does an multi-port electronic fuel injected motor convert to propane? Do they have gaseous injectors that can be controlled by a reprogrammed ECU? so they retain the emissions control mandated in the US. or does the conversion forgo all that electronics and go back to uncontrolled carburetion? -- Jim Yanik jyanik at localnet dot com |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On 12/15/2010 5:45 AM, Steve.IA wrote:
wrote Steve, I am in Farmington, IA (20 miles from IL and 3 miles from MO), how far west of me are you? Don Many years ago I had a dorm neighbor at Central College who was from Farmington. Don't remember his name, but do where he was from! 6' red headed kid. The list things I can't remember is growing daily. Now where did I put that list? Steve You must be mistaken, NO ONE from Farmington, except me, EVER went to college! :-) Don |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Jim Yanik wrote:
how does an multi-port electronic fuel injected motor convert to propane? Do they have gaseous injectors that can be controlled by a reprogrammed ECU? so they retain the emissions control mandated in the US. or does the conversion forgo all that electronics and go back to uncontrolled carburetion? The engines I mentioned earlier were all carburetored. I haven't paid much attention lately to the propane fueled irrigation engines. They're still using carburetors, I think. I did find this though: http://www.technocarb.com/ Farm equipment is pretty much all diesel powered with the exception irrigation engines and the older, smaller equipment. These engines don't have all the pollution control crap that vehicles have. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Dean Hoffman wrote:
Feasible yes. Practical? Probably not for many people. I live in a rural area. Some farmers I know did run their pickups on propane. They also use propane for grain drying and to run irrigation power units. A very few also had propane burning farm tractors years ago. That didn't catch on due in part to the inconvenience of propane compared to gasoline or diesel fuel. I was thinking about this recently and realized it's probably a lot hard to do coversions on modern vehicles than it used to be in the days of float carburators. You used to be able to put a propane "collar" under the carb that would feed the vapor into the intake and all you needed to do was remove power to the fuel pump or close the fuel line. On modern vehicles with computer controlled direct or throttle body injection, I would think it becomes a huge task to chage fuels. |
OT a bit - Propane prices
Robert Neville wrote in
: Dean Hoffman wrote: Feasible yes. Practical? Probably not for many people. I live in a rural area. Some farmers I know did run their pickups on propane. They also use propane for grain drying and to run irrigation power units. A very few also had propane burning farm tractors years ago. That didn't catch on due in part to the inconvenience of propane compared to gasoline or diesel fuel. I was thinking about this recently and realized it's probably a lot hard to do coversions on modern vehicles than it used to be in the days of float carburators. You used to be able to put a propane "collar" under the carb that would feed the vapor into the intake and all you needed to do was remove power to the fuel pump or close the fuel line. On modern vehicles with computer controlled direct or throttle body injection, I would think it becomes a huge task to chage fuels. I believe most cars today use multi-port injection for better emissions control. -- Jim Yanik jyanik at localnet dot com |
OT a bit - Propane prices
On Dec 15, 11:24*pm, Robert Neville wrote:
Dean Hoffman wrote: * *Feasible yes. *Practical? *Probably not for many people. * *I live in a rural area. *Some farmers I know did run their pickups on propane. * They also use propane for grain drying and to run irrigation power units. *A very few also had propane burning farm tractors years ago. * *That didn't catch on due in part to the inconvenience of propane compared to gasoline or diesel fuel. I was thinking about this recently and realized it's probably a lot hard to do coversions on modern vehicles than it used to be in the days of float carburators. You used to be able to put a propane "collar" under the carb that would feed the vapor into the intake and all you needed to do was remove power to the fuel pump or close the fuel line. On modern vehicles with computer controlled direct or throttle body injection, I would think it becomes a huge task to chage fuels. The injector bit is just left there, They put in the coversion "collar" as before. In the carburretor cars the carburretor wasn't actually used. Niether is it in the injection cars. So whichever it is, carb. or injection, it makes no difference at all. The petrol gear is left for emergency, ie if you can't get propane. It's just a switch on the panel to change over. The main snag being two fuel tanks. |
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