My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors disappear.
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides, they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 20:17:23 -0500, "Cory" wrote:

My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors disappear.
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides, they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks


Have your state use reflective tape. Skip the reflectors. Tape rails
and be done with it for a few years.

Reflective tape can be bought inter agency in the state, maybe. Made
by prisoners?

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 20:17:23 -0500, "Cory" wrote:

My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted
on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one
coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head.
The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on
dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors
disappear.
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is
a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides,
they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people
hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks


Have your state use reflective tape. Skip the reflectors. Tape rails
and be done with it for a few years.

Reflective tape can be bought inter agency in the state, maybe. Made
by prisoners?


Retro reflective tape is what is used on the 4"x8" aluminum. Just putting
the tape on the guardrail will not do it. On the end of the guardrail,
there is retro reflective tape. Back side of reflector has red, front side
either has white or yellow, depending which side of the road they are to be
placed. They must be facing traffic for the tape to be effective. These are
made in house. The prisoners put the bodies on the new dump trucks, and set
up the plow units.

The idea is to delineate the travel lanes, in "hopes" of keeping the
traveling motorists on the highway. The lane & edge lines are already
painted with highly reflective epoxy.

Personally, I think the state is going overboard to help keep people on the
road. Some people should not be driving, period.

On Nov 22, 8:17*pm, "Cory" wrote:
My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors disappear..
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides, they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks


LOL... Its called Mig-Welding... Make sure the fasteners are of
the same material -- in this case aluminum -- and then when the
assembly is put together tack everything into place with beads of
mig-welding on all the fasteners to prevent them from being removed...

Those guard rail things are meant to stay assembled when they get
put together, so if little aluminum add-on posts are being unbolted
weld the damn bolts in place after you put them on so no one with
a pair of pliers can unbolt them...

Someone who is stealing these sort of things will need a vehicle
with a lot of cargo capacity -- so you should suggest that the state
troopers review traffic camera footage looking at pick up trucks
that enter the highway empty but leave with a lot of stuff in the
back...

~~ Evan

On 11/23/2010 3:08 AM, Evan wrote:
On Nov 22, 8:17 pm, wrote:
My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors disappear.
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides, they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks


LOL... Its called Mig-Welding... Make sure the fasteners are of
the same material -- in this case aluminum -- and then when the
assembly is put together tack everything into place with beads of
mig-welding on all the fasteners to prevent them from being removed...

Those guard rail things are meant to stay assembled when they get
put together, so if little aluminum add-on posts are being unbolted
weld the damn bolts in place after you put them on so no one with
a pair of pliers can unbolt them...

Someone who is stealing these sort of things will need a vehicle
with a lot of cargo capacity -- so you should suggest that the state
troopers review traffic camera footage looking at pick up trucks
that enter the highway empty but leave with a lot of stuff in the
back...

~~ Evan

Dunno where OP is from, but outside east/west coasts and major urban
areas, traffic cams are rare. Around here, they would get stolen, like
the security camera on my regular recycle site was. (said site to be
closed 31 Dec to to slobs contaminating it...)

--
aem sends...

On Nov 23, 1:17*am, "Cory" wrote:
My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors disappear..
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides, they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks

If they are secured to a flat surface, glue them on and additional
security screws or snap rivets. You can get bolts with heads that can
be snapped off leaving a hemispherical head that can't be gripped.
The corresponding nuts are similar.
The problem with all these things except the glue is the existance of
battery powered angle grinders.
You're lucky that's all they steal. Here in the UK is copper cable.
Regardless of the voltage.

After reading the others replies, I think the longest term solution is
to take a couple troopers, and go visit the local scrap yards. When
the scrap yards stop buying, the thieves will stop, we hope.

Are the guard rails metal, or concrete?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Cory" wrote in message
...
My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with
what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new
reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors
mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one
coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16"
head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on
dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors
disappear.
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this
is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top
wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the
lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the
lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides,
they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people
hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks

In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:

After reading the others replies, I think the longest term solution is
to take a couple troopers, and go visit the local scrap yards. When
the scrap yards stop buying, the thieves will stop, we hope.


We should all be happy we don't live in Beijing. My friend there says
people steal the manhole covers all the time, and it can be months
before they're replaced. In the meantime, no effort is made to cordon
off the hole.

On Nov 23, 11:33*am, Smitty Two wrote:

We should all be happy we don't live in Beijing. My friend there says
people steal the manhole covers all the time, and it can be months
before they're replaced. In the meantime, no effort is made to cordon
off the hole.

Cheap way to start a subway.

R

On Nov 23, 8:41*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
After reading the others replies, I think the longest term solution is
to take a couple troopers, and go visit the local scrap yards. When
the scrap yards stop buying, the thieves will stop, we hope.

Are the guard rails metal, or concrete?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org


That will only work in that one state... A determined and organized
thief will continue to steal and simply take them to a less strict
scrap yard or will shred the metal first and sell it bulk in
containers
where it is unrecognizable as something which is stolen and should
not be recycled...

Taking the time to weld the fasteners in place to retain the
reflectors
to the guard rail will require the thieves to carry additional
equipment
which will demonstrate a clear intent to steal as they would need a
grinder or a torch to remove the welded fasteners... This will make
finding the thieves easier in the long run as it isn't something which
can be done out of a little Honda hatchback...

~~ Evan

On Tue, 23 Nov 2010 12:28:29 -0800 (PST), Evan
wrote:

On Nov 23, 8:41Â*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
After reading the others replies, I think the longest term solution is
to take a couple troopers, and go visit the local scrap yards. When
the scrap yards stop buying, the thieves will stop, we hope.

Are the guard rails metal, or concrete?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
Â*www.lds.org


That will only work in that one state... A determined and organized
thief will continue to steal and simply take them to a less strict
scrap yard or will shred the metal first and sell it bulk in
containers
where it is unrecognizable as something which is stolen and should
not be recycled...

Taking the time to weld the fasteners in place to retain the
reflectors
to the guard rail will require the thieves to carry additional
equipment
which will demonstrate a clear intent to steal as they would need a
grinder or a torch to remove the welded fasteners... This will make
finding the thieves easier in the long run as it isn't something which
can be done out of a little Honda hatchback...

~~ Evan
Or a Harley

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 20:17:23 -0500, "Cory" wrote:

My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with what
they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new reflectors
going up on their routes. The workers are putting up reflectors mounted on
the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem is, the reflectors are
mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top should've seen this one coming,
especially with the economy being the way it is.

The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16" head. The
thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders, or on dangerous
curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the reflectors disappear.
Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably what is making them
disappear.

Presuming you have some extra thread left over or use slightly longer
lag bolts. Purchase or have specially made, some reverse threaded
7/16" nuts.

Install reflector using normal lag bolt, washer and nut.
Then install second reverse threaded nut after first.

When two nuts.. meet.. Tack weld them together..
No mater which way they turn the double nut assembly it won't move.

To remove, grind off tack weld, back off each nut appropriately.
Lag threads will remain intact and undamaged. .


Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember, this is a
State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at the top wants
this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the lags
after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out the lags.

Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas? Besides, they
have better things to do, like responding to accidents from people hitting
unmarked guardrails!

Thanks

In article ,
T. Keating wrote:
...snipped...
Presuming you have some extra thread left over or use slightly longer
lag bolts. Purchase or have specially made, some reverse threaded
7/16" nuts.

Install reflector using normal lag bolt, washer and nut.
Then install second reverse threaded nut after first.

When two nuts.. meet.. Tack weld them together..
No mater which way they turn the double nut assembly it won't move.

To remove, grind off tack weld, back off each nut appropriately.
Lag threads will remain intact and undamaged. .

Not that funny.



--
Make it as simple as possible, but no simpler.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

Cory wrote:
My problem, trying to save taxpayers $ by discouraging thieves.

I know what I would do, but working for a State, I have to work with
what they give me.

Our guardrails have reflectors. The State is implementing new
reflectors going up on their routes. The workers are putting up
reflectors mounted on the blocks or posts for the guardrail. Problem
is, the reflectors are mounted on aluminum! Ok, someone at the top
should've seen this one coming, especially with the economy being the
way it is.
The reflectors are installed using 2, 3/8" x 2" lags with a 7/16"
head. The thieves will not bother the reflectors on narrow shoulders,
or on dangerous curves. But, where a full width shoulder exists, the
reflectors disappear. Besides being pretty, the aluminum is probably
what is making them disappear.

Changing material from aluminum is out of the question. Remember,
this is a State Agency, and come hell or high water, some nitwit at
the top wants this to work.

My initial thought is to have the workers dab PL on the heads of the
lags after installing. But, a set of vice grips would still back out
the lags.
Aside from having the State Troopers sit and wait, any ideas?
Besides, they have better things to do, like responding to accidents
from people hitting unmarked guardrails!

Here's the fix:

Obviously the use of bolted-on Aluminum is the result of a political
decision. Steel would be cheaper and (obviously) last longer.

Without question the Aluminum-post-provider is a relative of the highway
purchasing agent.

So, then, the fix is to approach the supplier and convince him to promote
steel posts to his brother-in-law. He can sell them for more on than the
current Aluminum post for the reason that they won't be stolen!

I know the whole idea is spooky, but that's the way the world works.

In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Without question the Aluminum-post-provider is a relative of the highway
purchasing agent.

The posts, AIUI, are not aluminum, but wood. Else why would the
reflectors be mounted with 2" long lag screws?

Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Without question the Aluminum-post-provider is a relative of the
highway purchasing agent.

The posts, AIUI, are not aluminum, but wood. Else why would the
reflectors be mounted with 2" long lag screws?

1. That's all they had.
2. The screw supplier is related to the highway department's purchasing
agent.
3. To a man with a wrench, every problem can be solved with a screw.

On Nov 27, 5:06*am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Without question the Aluminum-post-provider is a relative of the
highway purchasing agent.

The posts, AIUI, are not aluminum, but wood. Else why would the
reflectors be mounted with 2" long lag screws?

1. That's all they had.
2. The screw supplier is related to the highway department's purchasing
agent.
3. To a man with a wrench, every problem can be solved with a screw.

Any man will select a screw if one is available.

Harry K

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 10:14:54 -0800 (PST), Harry K
wrote:

On Nov 27, 5:06*am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:

Without question the Aluminum-post-provider is a relative of the
highway purchasing agent.

The posts, AIUI, are not aluminum, but wood. Else why would the
reflectors be mounted with 2" long lag screws?

1. That's all they had.
2. The screw supplier is related to the highway department's purchasing
agent.
3. To a man with a wrench, every problem can be solved with a screw.

Any man will select a screw if one is available.

It's not men who do the selection.