Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless water heater? Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? Thanks.

On Feb 3, 11:25*am, "John" wrote:
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless water heater? *Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

I can't speak to the quality of any single brand, but I'm just to
checking to see if you thought about all the other factors involved
with tankless water heaters:

The flow rate, the electrical/gas upgrade costs, the maintenance
costs, etc.

I only mention this because we often hear of people extolling the
"cost savings" of these devices until someone points out the cost of
installation, flow rates, etc.

You can't always just rip out your old tank, pipe one of these bad
boys in and go. There are often many other factors to consider.

On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 11:25:26 -0500, John wrote:
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Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless =
water heater? Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? =
Thanks.
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Lose the MIME ****. Usenet isn't email. It isn't even the web.
When you first installed your newsreader, you were subscribed to the
new users newsgroups. Why didn't you read the FAQ so as not
to make an ass of yourself?

On Feb 3, 10:25*am, "John" wrote:
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless water heater? *Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

Ive had the Bosch 117000 btu unit for about 7 years and no problems,
its a one shower unit it, I know the larger Bosch is made by Takagi
and maybe the small unit as well. You have to do your homework like
using a Manometer before buying anything. It all has to be planned by
the numbers to see if it even might work, even measuring winter
incomming waters lows temp and temp drop to point of use, if you guess
likely you wont be happy so spend the time to run numbers and do
tests. I have a 4 yr payback, I installed it myself. There are quite a
few brands, so to get and honest answer you need to find someone that
has actualy dealt with them on a service level. If its multi use then
you will need one of the big dollar near 190,000 btu units, then it
gets very expensive. EF is how a water heater is rated, an AO Smith
tank Cyclone or Vertex is about 82-84EF and thats about as good as you
can get. You can go condensing tankless like the takagi TH1 thats over
91EF, Rinnai, Rheem and others make good units, but Rheem hasnt been
in tankless long. A real good AO can for many aplications be better,
I have a 190000 BTU AO Cyclone condensing tank in an apt building, the
Vertex is the residential model. Gas supply is critical for tankless,
you have to do a test with everything on thats takes gas, then
calculate in reduced winter pressure on the coldest days of record to
even get an idea if your shower will be warm on that coldest day, my
117000 btu at -15 with about 40f incomming works without being set on
full high for a hot shower. Now we will hear the bs from all the folks
that never owned or used one, but really know.

"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 11:25:26 -0500, John wrote:
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Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless =
water heater? Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? =
Thanks.
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Lose the MIME ****. Usenet isn't email. It isn't even the web.
When you first installed your newsreader, you were subscribed to the
new users newsgroups. Why didn't you read the FAQ so as not
to make an ass of yourself?



Must be just you..I didn't see that stuff till you re-posted it...FWIW....

On Feb 3, 2:38*pm, "benick" wrote:
"AZ Nomad" wrote in message

...





On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 11:25:26 -0500, John wrote:
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Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless =
water heater? *Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? *=
Thanks.
------=_NextPart_000_0055_01CAA4C3.95388E10
Content-Type: text/html;
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15px"=20

Lose the MIME ****. *Usenet isn't email. *It isn't even the web.
When you first installed your newsreader, you were subscribed to the
new users newsgroups. *Why didn't you read the FAQ so as not
to make an ass of yourself?

Must be just you..I didn't see that stuff till you re-posted it...FWIW.....- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Same here...but I'm stuck using Google Groups at work, so that may
make a difference.

It wasn't in the original post, but it showed up when I clicked the "-
Show quoted text -" link in AZ's post.

I've never seen it added to anyone else's post or quoted text, FWTW.

On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 09:43:04 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Feb 3, 11:25*am, "John" wrote:
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless water heater? *Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

I can't speak to the quality of any single brand, but I'm just to
checking to see if you thought about all the other factors involved
with tankless water heaters:

The flow rate, the electrical/gas upgrade costs, the maintenance
costs, etc.

I only mention this because we often hear of people extolling the
"cost savings" of these devices until someone points out the cost of
installation, flow rates, etc.

You can't always just rip out your old tank, pipe one of these bad
boys in and go. There are often many other factors to consider.

I think the OP left town.

He can at least look here for some good information*

http://www.tanklesswaterheaterguide.com/

I'll top post this just for you. Do you even know what HTML stands for?
Perhaps you should upgrade your reader or continue to post only on subjects
about guns that "shoot around corners" in the rec.arts.movies.past-films
group. I don't know what you are doing here but if you have any pertinent
info on reliable and problem free tankless heaters please post it.

"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 11:25:26 -0500, John wrote:
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Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless =
water heater? Are there any major pros and cons for other brands? =
Thanks.
------=_NextPart_000_0055_01CAA4C3.95388E10
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"
HTMLHEAD
META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type
META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.18882"/HEAD
BODY style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 10px; PADDING-RIGHT: 10px; PADDING-TOP: =
15px"=20

Lose the MIME ****. Usenet isn't email. It isn't even the web.
When you first installed your newsreader, you were subscribed to the
new users newsgroups. Why didn't you read the FAQ so as not
to make an ass of yourself?

On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 19:28:58 -0500, "John" wrote:

I'll top post this just for you. Do you even know what HTML stands for?
Perhaps you should upgrade your reader or continue to post only on subjects
about guns that "shoot around corners" in the rec.arts.movies.past-films
group. I don't know what you are doing here but if you have any pertinent
info on reliable and problem free tankless heaters please post it.

I don't know how "guns" got involved, but yes they CAN "shoot around
corners".

Regarding your tankless water heater: where do you live?

On Feb 3, 8:05*pm, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 19:28:58 -0500, "John" wrote:
I'll top post this just for you. Do you even know what HTML stands for?
Perhaps you should upgrade your reader or continue to post only on subjects
about guns that "shoot around corners" in the rec.arts.movies.past-films
group. *I don't know what you are doing here but if you have any pertinent
info on reliable and problem free tankless heaters please post it.


I don't know how "guns" got involved, but yes they CAN "shoot around
corners".

Regarding your tankless water heater: where do you live?

Right around the corner. ;-)

"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless water
heater? Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than for a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will be a
lot more than the tank style.


--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube, then
they come up with this striped stuff.

On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 19:28:58 -0500, John wrote:
I'll top post this just for you. Do you even know what HTML stands for?
Perhaps you should upgrade your reader or continue to post only on subjects
about guns that "shoot around corners" in the rec.arts.movies.past-films
group. I don't know what you are doing here but if you have any pertinent
info on reliable and problem free tankless heaters please post it.

You sound like the type that carries loud irrelevent conversations
during movies and then takes it as an afront when somebody tells you
to shut up.

You're a jerk. A complete kneebiter.
plonk

"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message
...

"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will be
a
lot more than the tank style.


Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world. On
top of that I have a dual day/night electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) only heats at
night.The night rate is only about 5 cents total per kw. A plus for the
Takagi is it does not use a pilot light and offers an attractive warranty. I
would opt for the remote temp/service status sensor. Additionally I already
have propane for my generator and I can do the install myself. I'm also
looking at solar now that there is a 30% tax credit on material and labor
with no upper dollar limit on the amount of the 2010 tax credit but I'd
probably still need a small electric backup.

On Feb 4, 8:56*am, "John" wrote:
"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message

...







"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? *Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. *That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will be
a
lot more than the tank style.

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world. On
top of that I have a dual day/night *electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) *only heats at
night.The night rate is only *about 5 cents total per kw.
\

With that low electric rate, and apparently expensive propane, I don't
see why you'd want to switch fuels. The largest part of the fuel
bill is for actually heating the water used. With a tankless, you
eliminate the standby losses, but it's likely that could not be enough
to put you ahead. Also factor in that electric water heaters have a
very long life, are 100% efficient, cost less, etc. and it sounds like
electric could be best.

"John" wrote in message
...
"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message
...

"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than
for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you
are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it
three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank
style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will
be
a
lot more than the tank style.


Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world.
On
top of that I have a dual day/night electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) only heats at
night.The night rate is only about 5 cents total per kw. A plus for the
Takagi is it does not use a pilot light and offers an attractive warranty.
I
would opt for the remote temp/service status sensor. Additionally I
already
have propane for my generator and I can do the install myself. I'm also
looking at solar now that there is a 30% tax credit on material and labor
with no upper dollar limit on the amount of the 2010 tax credit but I'd
probably still need a small electric backup.




I think if I were you I would opt to keep the electric hot water. You
perhaps could opt for a smaller water heater. The tankless sucks a whole
lot of gas while it is running, and your current electric rate for nighttime
usage seems to be so cheap that you would never recover the cost of the
tankless.

You might want to consider some preventive maintenance on the 31year old
water heater. You might never need to replace it if your anode is kept in
good shape and you are able to flush the sediment from the bottom of the
tank. This web site explains how: http://waterheaterrescue.com/


--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube, then
they come up with this striped stuff.

"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message
...

"John" wrote in message
...
"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message
...

"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than
for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you
are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it
three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so
I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank
style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less.
That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will
be
a
lot more than the tank style.


Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world.
On
top of that I have a dual day/night electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) only heats at
night.The night rate is only about 5 cents total per kw. A plus for the
Takagi is it does not use a pilot light and offers an attractive
warranty.
I
would opt for the remote temp/service status sensor. Additionally I
already
have propane for my generator and I can do the install myself. I'm also
looking at solar now that there is a 30% tax credit on material and labor
with no upper dollar limit on the amount of the 2010 tax credit but I'd
probably still need a small electric backup.




I think if I were you I would opt to keep the electric hot water. You
perhaps could opt for a smaller water heater. The tankless sucks a whole
lot of gas while it is running, and your current electric rate for
nighttime
usage seems to be so cheap that you would never recover the cost of the
tankless.

You might want to consider some preventive maintenance on the 31year old
water heater. You might never need to replace it if your anode is kept in
good shape and you are able to flush the sediment from the bottom of the
tank. This web site explains how: http://waterheaterrescue.com/


--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.


Thanks for all the inpt.

On Feb 4, 7:56*am, "John" wrote:
"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message

...







"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? *Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. *That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will be
a
lot more than the tank style.

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world. On
top of that I have a dual day/night *electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) *only heats at
night.The night rate is only *about 5 cents total per kw. *A plus for the
Takagi is it does not use a pilot light and offers an attractive warranty.. I
would opt for the remote temp/service status sensor. *Additionally I already
have propane for my generator and I can do the install myself. *I'm also
looking at solar now that there is a 30% tax credit on material and labor
with no upper dollar limit on the amount of the 2010 tax credit but I'd
probably still need a small electric backup.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I wish I had 5c a kwh, im at near 0.14. A tank on a timer is what I
would do, There are some super insulated electric tanks sold. At .05
kwh you may be below what you pay for propane or local Ng per BTU, you
should run numbers because night time home heating may be cheaper with
electric space heaters.

On Feb 5, 5:03*pm, ransley wrote:
On Feb 4, 7:56*am, "John" wrote:





"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message

...

"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? *Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. *That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will be
a
lot more than the tank style.

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world. On
top of that I have a dual day/night *electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) *only heats at
night.The night rate is only *about 5 cents total per kw. *A plus for the
Takagi is it does not use a pilot light and offers an attractive warranty. I
would opt for the remote temp/service status sensor. *Additionally I already
have propane for my generator and I can do the install myself. *I'm also
looking at solar now that there is a 30% tax credit on material and labor
with no upper dollar limit on the amount of the 2010 tax credit but I'd
probably still need a small electric backup.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I wish I had 5c a kwh, im at near 0.14. A tank on a timer is what I
would do,

On a new well insulated tank, how much do you think you're gonna save
with a timer? You won't save anything until the water cools down
below the point that it would have come on. And my bet is by that
time, the timer will be about ready to turn it back on anyway. The
bottom line is that especially with an electric tank, which is
completely insulated, the water cools so slowly when it's not being
used that it isn't going to make a difference big enough to make the
installation of a timer worthwhile. And if you have to pay an
electrician to do the install, I'd bet you come out a big loser.

As an experiment, you could measure the temp of water coming out of a
tap close the heater at night. Then shut it off and measure again in
the morning. I'm going to try it on my gas water heater.

Existing propane tank may need upgraded for higher tankless flow rate,
COLD incoing water temp in winter can cause grief, chilly showers

Standby losses of electric tanks is very low plus new tanks are far
better, better insulation and what losses do occur help keep the space
around the tank warm.

with such low electric rates theres no advantage to tankless

On Feb 6, 11:40*am, " wrote:
Existing propane tank may need upgraded for higher tankless flow rate,
COLD incoing water temp in winter can cause grief, chilly showers

Standby losses of electric tanks is very low plus new tanks are far
better, better insulation and what losses do occur help keep the space
around the tank warm.

with such low electric rates theres no advantage to tankless

I have a friend at work who is very much into GREEN. He added one in
conjunction with his solar water heater and he is pretty happy with
the combo. He has worked in shipyards most of his life so he was
capable of doing all the work himself.

Jimmie

wrote in message
...


On a new well insulated tank, how much do you think you're gonna save
with a timer? You won't save anything until the water cools down
below the point that it would have come on. And my bet is by that
time, the timer will be about ready to turn it back on anyway. The
bottom line is that especially with an electric tank, which is
completely insulated, the water cools so slowly when it's not being
used that it isn't going to make a difference big enough to make the
installation of a timer worthwhile. And if you have to pay an
electrician to do the install, I'd bet you come out a big loser.

I think the OP already has a timer.

The function of the timer is to limit the time that water is heated to
nighttime hours.

As an example lets say he and the Mrs. take showers in the morning (day
rates) the timer prevents the tank from heating the cold water in the bottom
of the tank. When they get home from work, hot water used is still reserve
until the rates change and now the water heats.

Without the timer the hot water consumed in the morning is heated with day
rates at probably three times the price. With a 140 gallon capacity and two
people living there you should never have to pay day rates for hot water.

--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube, then
they come up with this striped stuff.

On Feb 7, 9:29*pm, "Roger Shoaf" wrote:
wrote in message

...

On a new well insulated tank, how much do you think you're gonna save
with a timer? * *You won't save anything until the water cools down
below the point that it would have come on. * *And my bet is by that
time, the timer will be about ready to turn it back on anyway. *The
bottom line is that especially with an electric tank, which is
completely insulated, the water cools so slowly when it's not being
used that it isn't going to make a difference big enough to make the
installation of a timer worthwhile. *And if you have to pay an
electrician to do the install, I'd bet you come out a big loser.

I think the OP already has a timer.

The function of the timer is to limit the time that water is heated to
nighttime hours.

As an example lets say he and the Mrs. take showers in the morning (day
rates) the timer prevents the tank from heating the cold water in the bottom
of the tank. *When they get home from work, hot water used is still reserve
until the rates change and now the water heats.

Without the timer the hot water consumed in the morning is heated with day
rates at probably three times the price. *With a 140 gallon capacity and two
people living there you should never have to pay day rates for hot water.

--

Roger Shoaf



Yes, I agree. If you have lower off-peak electric rates then it would
make sense to have the water heater on a timer. At least in most
cases, where you're not going to pull so much water that you run
out. Back in the 60s my parents home had 2 electric meters, one for
the water heater which had it's own built-in timer and lower rate.

However, I didn't see the OP mention anything about off peak rate
advantages. Only that he was paying 5c KWH for electric. And I've
seen people here recently claiming that you can save significant $$ by
putting a timer on any water heater to turn it off at night, when
going out for the day, etc. I seriously doubt that with any decently
insulated tank that approach is going to be worth it.

On Feb 6, 10:26*am, wrote:
On Feb 5, 5:03*pm, ransley wrote:





On Feb 4, 7:56*am, "John" wrote:

"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message

...

"John" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have any knowledge of the quality of the Takagi tankless
water
heater? *Are there any
major pros and cons for other brands? *Thanks.

I have an AquaStar.

To install it I had to run a 3/4 inch gas line and a vent larger than for
a
tank water heater.

Mine is a standing pilot type and it does not throttle to well if you are
trying to take a shower while doing a load of wash or dishes.

The maintenance costs in parts is very high, I have had to repair it three
times in 15 years.

When I moved in I went from electric hot water to the tankless gas, so I
am
not too sure of the savings as I have nothing to compare.

I suspect if I was to do it all over again, I would go with a tank style.
The initial cost is less and the maintenance costs are a lot less. *That
would probably buy a lot of gas.

The up side is that you never run out of hot water.

The newer fancier ones have a few more BTUs and a better throttling
sustem,
but I suspect that the initial cost and the periodic cost of parts will be
a
lot more than the tank style.

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube,
then
they come up with this striped stuff.

Thanks for the input. I've been delaying a tankless install because the
volume of hot water I need is only for 2 people plus the cost of propane
here in extreme north NY state is out of line with the rest of the world. On
top of that I have a dual day/night *electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) *only heats at
night.The night rate is only *about 5 cents total per kw. *A plus for the
Takagi is it does not use a pilot light and offers an attractive warranty. I
would opt for the remote temp/service status sensor. *Additionally I already
have propane for my generator and I can do the install myself. *I'm also
looking at solar now that there is a 30% tax credit on material and labor
with no upper dollar limit on the amount of the 2010 tax credit but I'd
probably still need a small electric backup.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I wish I had 5c a kwh, im at near 0.14. A tank on a timer is what I
would do,

On a new well insulated tank, how much do you think you're gonna save
with a timer? * *You won't save anything until the water cools down
below the point that it would have come on. * *And my bet is by that
time, the timer will be about ready to turn it back on anyway. *The
bottom line is that especially with an electric tank, which is
completely insulated, the water cools so slowly when it's not being
used that it isn't going to make a difference big enough to make the
installation of a timer worthwhile. *And if you have to pay an
electrician to do the install, I'd bet you come out a big loser.

As an experiment, you could measure the temp of water coming out of a
tap close the heater at night. * Then shut it off and measure again in
the morning. * I'm going to try it on my gas water heater.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I meant at 5 cents a kwh at night run it, and maybe run it hotter if
possible. Im sure his daytime rate is near Tripple that amount, it
might not work with usage needed but its a thought depending on use
needed. My old electric kept warm for days also but his night time
rate is great for him, its probably below what he pays for propane so
electric heat at night is what I would consider

wrote in message
...
On Feb 7, 9:29 pm, "Roger Shoaf" wrote:
wrote in message

...


Yes, I agree. If you have lower off-peak electric rates then it would
make sense to have the water heater on a timer. At least in most
cases, where you're not going to pull so much water that you run
out. Back in the 60s my parents home had 2 electric meters, one for
the water heater which had it's own built-in timer and lower rate.

However, I didn't see the OP mention anything about off peak rate
advantages. Only that he was paying 5c KWH for electric.

"On top of that I have a dual day/night electric rate and the current 120
gallon tank (now 31 years old and is not leaking !!) only heats at
night. The night rate is only about 5 cents total per kw"

I wonder if the OP is correct about having a 120 gallon heater. I can't
imagine that in a residential application. Usually, if more than 40 or
50 gallons is needed/wanted, they will just use several resi sized
units. Larry

On Feb 8, 1:04�pm, (Lp1331 1p1331) wrote:
I wonder if the OP is correct about having a 120 gallon heater. I can't
imagine that in a residential application. Usually, if more than 40 or
50 gallons is needed/wanted, they will just use several resi sized
units. Larry

well OP only gets to heat water at off hours, like my dad in phoenix
who has a 100 gallon tank, for the same reason

Lp1331 1p1331 wrote:
I wonder if the OP is correct about having a 120 gallon heater. I can't
imagine that in a residential application. Usually, if more than 40 or
50 gallons is needed/wanted, they will just use several resi sized
units. Larry

The local Co-op around here would install a 105 gal electric water
heater for free. They had a remote control that would turn them on at
off-peak times (evening and weekends). If they leaked or failed, the
Co-op would replace them at no cost to the Homeowner.

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