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nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about
350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
mm wrote in
: I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks Yes even if they come loose they won't vibrate off and allow disconnection. Built a custom motorcycle when I was a kid. Would not use anything else but those. They were also used by the original manufacturer before I chopped it. in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Their lawyer assisted in instructions. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
mm wrote:
I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks To be really sure nothing will vibrate loose, use blue locktite along with the nylon insert nuts. Works like a charm especially in high vibration environments. -- PV |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
"mm" wrote in message ... I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks When I would build the shelving racks in my service vans, I always used split ring lock washers and lock-tite, but due to the constant vibration, it was a never ending battle to keep things tight. On the last two vans I set up, I had discovered the nylon lock nuts, and nothing has ever come loose since |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 2, 6:58*am, "RBM" wrote:
"mm" wrote in message ... I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. *From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. *I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks When I would build the shelving racks in my service vans, I always used split ring lock washers and *lock-tite, but due to the constant vibration, it was a never ending battle to keep things tight. On the last two vans I set up, I had discovered the nylon lock nuts, and nothing has ever come loose since I have heard from several authoritative sources that lock washers really don't do much more than a properly torqued nut and flat washer alone. The Nylocks are definitely an improvement. Anymore I only use the split washers where they were originally used to keep an original look but if I am building something from scratch I use either Loctite or Nylocks. nate |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
Nylon lock nuts came from the aircraft industry to solve the problem of nuts
loosening due to prop engine vibrations. Always used them when I made model airplanes. Painting the threads after the nut is tight with finger nail polish is a good idea as a backup as well or use a product such as locktite. "mm" wrote in message ... I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
mm wrote: I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks The key difference between the nylock nuts and a conventional nut with a lockwasher is that while either one may work loose from the tight state, after that point, the nylock will stay put on the bolt, while the conventional nut and lockwasher have no retention after the compression of the lockwasher is lost and will continue to turn with vibration until the nut completely falls off. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
SteveB wrote: "mm" wrote in message ... I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks My experience with Nylocks is this: They are good for some applications. They are not good for others. They are a one time use thing, as once they are run on and off one time, the holding power is diminished a lot. I know they make them in all sizes up to double jumbo, but for something I really want to know is going to stay put, I'd prefer personally to use lock washers or even double nutting with a jam nut. I have yet to have a jammed jam nut come loose. OTOH, like you, I have had new Nylocks loosen up soon after installation. IIRC, there is a nut called a castle nut that has a small crimp in it, and fits tight tight tight on installation and is dependable not to work loose, and if it does not loosen, it won't just vibrate off once it gets just so loose. The crimps keeps a grip on the bolt, and cannot be taken off without a wrench. Just my two pennies, your mileage may and probably does vary. Steve Castle nuts have notches in them and are used with cotter pins. You're thinking of an interference nut which is deformed by several crimps and produces a tight fit. These don't work any better or worse than the nylocks, both will have reduced friction with repeated installation-removal cycles, and both resist continued loosening if they do come loose since they have friction. Conventional nuts and lockwashers have no friction once they loosen past the point of compressing the lockwasher and will continue to loosen until they fall off. For positive locking use the castle nuts and cotter pins. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
mm wrote:
I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. On the nylon insert lock nuts I add a dab of bright colored paint across the thread and onto the nut in one small area. This will give a visual clue if the nut should move following installation. PS: If you are really into the belt and suspenders approach, there are castle nuts with nylon locking inserts as well. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
BobR wrote:
.... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. ... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
"mm" wrote in message
... I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks My experience with Nylocks is this: They are good for some applications. They are not good for others. They are a one time use thing, as once they are run on and off one time, the holding power is diminished a lot. I know they make them in all sizes up to double jumbo, but for something I really want to know is going to stay put, I'd prefer personally to use lock washers or even double nutting with a jam nut. I have yet to have a jammed jam nut come loose. OTOH, like you, I have had new Nylocks loosen up soon after installation. IIRC, there is a nut called a castle nut that has a small crimp in it, and fits tight tight tight on installation and is dependable not to work loose, and if it does not loosen, it won't just vibrate off once it gets just so loose. The crimps keeps a grip on the bolt, and cannot be taken off without a wrench. Just my two pennies, your mileage may and probably does vary. Steve |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 2, 11:13*am, "Pete C." wrote:
mm wrote: I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. *From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. *I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks The key difference between the nylock nuts and a conventional nut with a lockwasher is that while either one may work loose from the tight state, after that point, the nylock will stay put on the bolt, while the conventional nut and lockwasher have no retention after the compression of the lockwasher is lost and will continue to turn with vibration until the nut completely falls off.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another key application for nylock nuts is that they can be left slightly loose for those instances where you want to allow for movement such as at pivot points. You can obtain a snug fit so things aren't flopping around, but you can still move the parts. All steering assemblies and some brake assemblies on official All American Soap Box Derby cars use nylock nuts for this very purpose. In fact, by rule, the steering assemblies require *two* nylock nuts on the same bolt. Talk about overkill! |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
As long as the Nylocks do not have many cycles on them you can use them without fear of loosening. Loctite is not needed. The only thing that will loosen a Nylock is a wrench, not vibration. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
dpb wrote: BobR wrote: ... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. ... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- When building a plane, if the screw or bolt is important enough to have any lock washer it is important to make sure you use one that won't come loose. If you consider that silly, do your wife and all of us on the ground a favor and don't build yourself an airplane. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
BobR wrote:
dpb wrote: BobR wrote: ... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. ... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- When building a plane, if the screw or bolt is important enough to have any lock washer it is important to make sure you use one that won't come loose. If you consider that silly, do your wife and all of us on the ground a favor and don't build yourself an airplane. You obviously didn't _read_ or at least comprehend what I wrote... -- |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 2, 6:14*pm, dpb wrote:
BobR wrote: dpb wrote: BobR wrote: ... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. *I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. *... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- When building a plane, if the screw or bolt is important enough to have any lock washer it is important to make sure you use one that won't come loose. *If you consider that silly, do your wife and all of us on the ground a favor and don't build yourself an airplane. You obviously didn't _read_ or at least comprehend what I wrote... --- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I read it, understood it completely and really considered you rather silly for having written it. You had nothing useful to add so you wasted everyones time. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
BobR wrote:
.... I read it, understood it completely and really considered you rather silly for having written it. You had nothing useful to add so you wasted everyones time. No more than your silly comment aka "recommendation" ... You replace every lock washer on every piece of equipment you buy since they obviously are unsafe? -- |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On Thu, 01 May 2008 23:48:43 -0400, mm
wrote: I bought one of those little kit trailers, what you can get for about 350 dollars, with a 4x8' bed, for a one time use, and some little uses aftewrads. From Harbor Freight that carries 990 pounds they say. I only need to carry less than 100. Assembling it today, I noticed that they depend on nuts with nylon inserts to keep the nuts from coming all the way off. They depend on tightening them tighlly to keep them from coming loose. Is that enough or should I put split ring lock washers under each nut. Or would it be better, just as good, to put jamb nuts on the bolts that are long enough. IIRC the instructions say in one place to check that the nuts are tight after 100 miles, which seems like a good idea, but in another place I think it said every 100 miles!!!!! Thanks There is so much help here from many of you, rather than several replies, I'm going to thank everyone here -- Thank you -- and followup here. I'm very encouraged about the nylon inserts. My one concern still is that somehow they use a different kind of nylon in China that won't work as well? As it turns out, I bought the trailer 15 months ago and had it shipped to my brother. The instructions didn't show lock washers for any of the bolts I'd gotten to when I posted, but yesterday I got to the 4 square U-bolts that hold on the axle and the instructions said they used lock washers. But none were enclosed. I had downloaded the instructoins from Harbor Freight, and they have changed them in the last 15 months and the new instructions show NO lock washers. Surely this isn't to save money, so they must think it's as good or better. Yet after reading all your posts, I'm still going to use them under those 8 nuts, because it seems like it can't make it worse. ?? FTR, my instructions showed a mixture of English and metric bolts, but the only bolts enclosed were metric. The new online instructions now correct some slight mistakes and also match the bolts etc. that they enclosed, except that neither mention that I need a grease or a grease gun, maybe. There is some grease on the bearings, but after I put the hub and bearing on the axle, am I supposed to use the grease fitting to fill the whole chamber with wheel bearing grease? All it says it to fill the cap at the end with grease. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
"BobR" wrote in message ... On May 2, 6:14 pm, dpb wrote: BobR wrote: dpb wrote: BobR wrote: ... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. ... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- When building a plane, if the screw or bolt is important enough to have any lock washer it is important to make sure you use one that won't come loose. If you consider that silly, do your wife and all of us on the ground a favor and don't build yourself an airplane. You obviously didn't _read_ or at least comprehend what I wrote... --- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I read it, understood it completely and really considered you rather silly for having written it. You had nothing useful to add so you wasted everyones time. WOW. From now on when I go on a plane, I'm going to look to see what kind of system they use. I really don't think I've seen a lock washer yet. Most of the stuff I see has plastic push fasteners. I must be dense as a rock. I thought they would use all sorts of fasteners depending on the application. Now to find out they use only a few. Oh, dopey me. Steve |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 3, 7:33*am, dpb wrote:
BobR wrote: ... I read it, understood it completely and really considered you rather silly for having written it. *You had nothing useful to add so you wasted everyones time. No more than your silly comment aka "recommendation" ... You replace every lock washer on every piece of equipment you buy since they obviously are unsafe? -- Now is that what I said or did you take it out of context knowing full well that my comments were in reference to the aircraft? You knew but you just couldn't resist making a stupid comment since you had nothing constructive to add. Now take you stupid comments and put them where they belong. As for lock washers, no I would not use them any application where safety was an issue. I have had too many of the work loose to rely on them. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 3, 11:48*am, "SteveB" toquerville,utah@zionvistas wrote:
"BobR" wrote in message ... On May 2, 6:14 pm, dpb wrote: BobR wrote: dpb wrote: BobR wrote: ... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. ... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- When building a plane, if the screw or bolt is important enough to have any lock washer it is important to make sure you use one that won't come loose. If you consider that silly, do your wife and all of us on the ground a favor and don't build yourself an airplane. You obviously didn't _read_ or at least comprehend what I wrote... --- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I read it, understood it completely and really considered you rather silly for having written it. *You had nothing useful to add so you wasted everyones time. WOW. *From now on when I go on a plane, I'm going to look to see what kind of system they use. *I really don't think I've seen a lock washer yet. *Most of the stuff I see has plastic push fasteners. *I must be dense as a rock. I thought they would use all sorts of fasteners depending on the application. *Now to find out they use only a few. *Oh, dopey me. Steve- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well maybe you should look at what is used on aircraft instead making assumptions. While there are mil-spec lock washers that were used on some aircraft, they are never used in an area where safety could be compromised by them coming loose. In safety critical areas, either castle nuts and cotter pins are used or safety wire is used. Nylon insert nuts are now the preferred choice in all instances where castle nuts and/or safety wired is not required. My own feeling is that if it is important enough to need a lock washer, it is important enough to use a high quality nylon locking nut. If however you are talking about holding pieces of plastic together for cosmetic panels, you can use all the plastic push fastners you want. On another post you commented on the "single" use of the nylon insert nuts and this may be correct if you are using the common cheap Home- Depot made in China hardware. I have found that aircraft grade nylon insert nuts will still provide a firm tight hold after two or three cycles. I wouldn't recommend them for more than that though. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On Sat, 3 May 2008 17:53:40 -0700 (PDT), BobR
wrote: On another post you commented on the "single" use of the nylon insert nuts and this may be correct if you are using the common cheap Home- Depot made in China hardware. I have found that aircraft grade nylon insert nuts will still provide a firm tight hold after two or three cycles. I wouldn't recommend them for more than that though. I'm the OP and I would think a Harbor Freight trailer is even more cheaply made than most of Home Depot stuff. And on the box the trailer came in, it says Made in China. I hope my axle doesn't fall off!! They also say no more than 55 MPH. Can I take that to mean no more than 60? |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On Fri, 2 May 2008 11:12:29 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote: Another key application for nylock nuts is that they can be left slightly loose for those instances where you want to allow for movement such as at pivot points. You can obtain a snug fit so things aren't flopping around, but you can still move the parts. All steering assemblies and some brake assemblies on official All American Soap Box Derby cars use nylock nuts for this very purpose. In fact, by rule, the steering assemblies require *two* nylock nuts on the same bolt. Talk about overkill! Nothing is too safe for our kiddies. They should require 3! |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
mm wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2008 11:12:29 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: Another key application for nylock nuts is that they can be left slightly loose for those instances where you want to allow for movement such as at pivot points. You can obtain a snug fit so things aren't flopping around, but you can still move the parts. All steering assemblies and some brake assemblies on official All American Soap Box Derby cars use nylock nuts for this very purpose. In fact, by rule, the steering assemblies require *two* nylock nuts on the same bolt. Talk about overkill! Nothing is too safe for our kiddies. They should require 3! Hi, Overkill is better than underkill, LOL! |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
mm wrote:
-snip- They also say no more than 55 MPH. Can I take that to mean no more than 60? It won't blow apart at 56. or with 993 pounds in it. But if it does, it's your ass, not theirs. FWIW- mine has about 2 years and 5000 miles on it. Once I did some really bad math in my head and put 4000 pounds of cement blocks in it. I'm glad I only had 5 miles to go as it pulled like a wet rug--- but it didn't bend anything. Recently I made 16 trips of 80 miles one way. Empty one way- about 1000 pounds of pavers on the return. 65 miles an hour for most of the trip. I watched the bearings closely for the first 3 trips- but it was up to the job. Use *good* wheel bearing grease. Check it often. [I haven't had any luck finding 'bearing buddy' caps that fit the Harbor Freight trailer] I've checked the bolts a couple times. Haven't found a loose one yet. Jim |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 3, 10:08*pm, mm wrote:
On Sat, 3 May 2008 17:53:40 -0700 (PDT), BobR wrote: On another post you commented on the "single" use of the nylon insert nuts and this may be correct if you are using the common cheap Home- Depot made in China hardware. *I have found that aircraft grade nylon insert nuts will still provide a firm tight hold after two or three cycles. *I wouldn't recommend them for more than that though. I'm the OP and I would think a Harbor Freight trailer is even more cheaply made than most of Home Depot stuff. *And on the box the trailer came in, it says Made in China. I hope my axle doesn't fall off!! They also say no more than 55 MPH. *Can I take that to mean no more than 60? If it trails properly, you can probably push it a little beyond the 55 mph. It will probably do better when loaded than empty. An empty trailer can easily start to wag back and forth or start a serious bounce. I had that happen with an auto hauler trailer once (doing less than 55) and it ripped the ball off the hitch. (Thank heaven for a good safety chain.) PS: Not everything made in China is crap. I bought a tile saw made in China from Harbor Freight a couple of years ago and it has been a great buy. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 3, 11:09*pm, mm wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2008 11:12:29 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: Another key application for nylock nuts is that they can be left slightly loose for those instances where you want to allow for movement such as at pivot points. You can obtain a snug fit so things aren't flopping around, but you can still move the parts. All steering assemblies and some brake assemblies on official All American Soap Box Derby cars use nylock nuts for this very purpose. In fact, by rule, the steering assemblies require *two* nylock nuts on the same bolt. Talk about overkill! Nothing is too safe for our kiddies. *They should require 3! - Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Nothing is too safe for our kiddies. They should require 3! Right, and then put an 8 YO in a plastic car going up to 30 MPH with a 3 x 3 rubber pad that drags on the road as a brake. Trust me, 2, 3, or even 6 nylon nuts on the steering assembly kingpin will not make the car any safer since that part of the car has never, ever been the cause of an accident. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 3, 8:53*pm, BobR wrote:
On May 3, 11:48*am, "SteveB" toquerville,utah@zionvistas wrote: "BobR" wrote in message ... On May 2, 6:14 pm, dpb wrote: BobR wrote: dpb wrote: BobR wrote: ... Let me put it this way...I am building an airplane and using the nylon insert nuts for most applications with a few critical exceptions where only a castle nut and cotter pin is acceptable. I don't use and wouldn't even consider using lock washers on anything. ... I don't know airframe rules, but if you mean "anything" within the ordinary English meaning, that's simply silly... -- When building a plane, if the screw or bolt is important enough to have any lock washer it is important to make sure you use one that won't come loose. If you consider that silly, do your wife and all of us on the ground a favor and don't build yourself an airplane. You obviously didn't _read_ or at least comprehend what I wrote... --- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I read it, understood it completely and really considered you rather silly for having written it. *You had nothing useful to add so you wasted everyones time. WOW. *From now on when I go on a plane, I'm going to look to see what kind of system they use. *I really don't think I've seen a lock washer yet. *Most of the stuff I see has plastic push fasteners. *I must be dense as a rock. I thought they would use all sorts of fasteners depending on the application. *Now to find out they use only a few. *Oh, dopey me. Steve- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well maybe you should look at what is used on aircraft instead making assumptions. *While there are mil-spec lock washers that were used on some aircraft, they are never used in an area where safety could be compromised by them coming loose. *In safety critical areas, either castle nuts and cotter pins are used or safety wire is used. *Nylon insert nuts are now the preferred choice in all instances where castle nuts and/or safety wired is not required. *My own feeling is that if it is important enough to need a lock washer, it is important enough to use a high quality nylon locking nut. If however you are talking about holding pieces of plastic together for cosmetic panels, you can use all the plastic push fastners you want. On another post you commented on the "single" use of the nylon insert nuts and this may be correct if you are using the common cheap Home- Depot made in China hardware. *I have found that aircraft grade nylon insert nuts will still provide a firm tight hold after two or three cycles. *I wouldn't recommend them for more than that though.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - We use nylon insert nuts torqued to up to 168 inch pounds and loosen and tighten them on fairly regular basis. It takes many, many cycles before we can't tighten them anymore. On the other hand, we've had some that can't be torqued even once, but that's very rare. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On May 3, 11:08*pm, mm wrote:
On Sat, 3 May 2008 17:53:40 -0700 (PDT), BobR wrote: On another post you commented on the "single" use of the nylon insert nuts and this may be correct if you are using the common cheap Home- Depot made in China hardware. *I have found that aircraft grade nylon insert nuts will still provide a firm tight hold after two or three cycles. *I wouldn't recommend them for more than that though. I'm the OP and I would think a Harbor Freight trailer is even more cheaply made than most of Home Depot stuff. *And on the box the trailer came in, it says Made in China. I hope my axle doesn't fall off!! They also say no more than 55 MPH. *Can I take that to mean no more than 60? I used to use one of those "little red trailers" - the foldable style of the type sold at HF, although mine came from K-Mart. Many of the nuts on the trailer were nylocks, which made it pain to assemble, but it held up for a long time. I'd load it with 500 - 600 pounds stacked 6 feet high and towed it for hours at (at least) 65 MPH on a regular basis. Never had an issue. Kept the tires properly inflated and repacked the wheel bearings once a year, typically before the spring race season. I eventually got an enclosed trailer and sold the open one, with homemade side walls, for $25 more than I bought it for, after 4 years and thousands of miles. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On Sun, 4 May 2008 17:34:10 -0700 (PDT), BobR
wrote: On May 3, 10:08*pm, mm wrote: On Sat, 3 May 2008 17:53:40 -0700 (PDT), BobR wrote: On another post you commented on the "single" use of the nylon insert nuts and this may be correct if you are using the common cheap Home- Depot made in China hardware. *I have found that aircraft grade nylon insert nuts will still provide a firm tight hold after two or three cycles. *I wouldn't recommend them for more than that though. I'm the OP and I would think a Harbor Freight trailer is even more cheaply made than most of Home Depot stuff. *And on the box the trailer came in, it says Made in China. I hope my axle doesn't fall off!! They also say no more than 55 MPH. *Can I take that to mean no more than 60? If it trails properly, you can probably push it a little beyond the 55 mph. It will probably do better when loaded than empty. An empty trailer can easily start to wag back and forth or start a serious bounce. I had that happen with an auto hauler trailer once (doing Very important. Thanks a lot. less than 55) and it ripped the ball off the hitch. (Thank heaven for a good safety chain.) PS: Not everything made in China is crap. I bought a tile saw made in China from Harbor Freight a couple of years ago and it has been a great buy. I'll buy that. I sort of whined about how cheap it is to forestall others telling me how cheap it is. |
nuts with nylon inserts versus lock washers and jamb nuts
On Sun, 04 May 2008 07:18:00 -0400, Jim Elbrecht
wrote: mm wrote: -snip- They also say no more than 55 MPH. Can I take that to mean no more than 60? It won't blow apart at 56. or with 993 pounds in it. But if it does, it's your ass, not theirs. FWIW- mine has about 2 years and 5000 miles on it. Once I did some really bad math in my head and put 4000 pounds of cement blocks in it. LOL. I'm glad I only had 5 miles to go as it pulled like a wet rug--- but it didn't bend anything. Recently I made 16 trips of 80 miles one way. Empty one way- about 1000 pounds of pavers on the return. 65 miles an hour for most of the trip. I watched the bearings closely for the first 3 trips- but it was up to the job. Use *good* wheel bearing grease. Check it often. [I haven't had any luck finding 'bearing buddy' caps that fit the Harbor Freight trailer] I've checked the bolts a couple times. Haven't found a loose one yet. It didn't actually say to check after 200 miles like I think I said. It was after 20 miles. Somewhere it said every 20 miles -lol- but I haven't found that again. Jim |
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