On Dec 25, 8:55�pm, Drew Cutter wrote:
Is it worth the money to use a integrated heat pump water heater ? Any
mfg. you can recommend on both the heat pump and water heater . Thanks.

heat pumps work best in areas with moderate temperatures, air heat
pumps in northern freezing areas use back up electric resistance heat.
thats costly.

what part of the country are you in and how do you currently heat your
home and water?

On Dec 26, 7:06Â*am, Drew Cutter wrote:
wrote:
On Dec 25, 8:55�pm, Drew Cutter wrote:
Is it worth the money to use a integrated heat pump water heater ? Any
mfg. you can recommend on both the heat pump and water heater . Thanks.

heat pumps work best in areas with moderate temperatures, air heat
pumps in northern freezing areas use back up electric resistance heat.
thats costly.

what part of the country are you in and how do you currently heat your
home and water?

I'm using gas water heater . From the web page as long as the basement
or furnace room stays above 40 degree i'm ok. This heat pump is not out
side. Â*http://www.nyletherm.com/waterheating.htm

The manufacturer says that tests show it reduced ELECTRIC water
heating bills by an average of 50%. Three things worth noting
there. One is that it's compared to electric which is costs
significantly more to operate in most parts of the country than a gas
water heater, which you have. Second, whatever average use was for
their test in terms of water amounts could be very different from your
personal situation. Third, manufacturers use situations that put
their product in the most favorable light for stated numbers like
this. So, you may not save anywhere near 50% off your gas bill.

So, can you recover the $1100+ upfront cost for the unit, plus install
cost, over the expected life of the unit? Do you have 240V available
at the gas water heater location, free breaker panel space for a
circuit, etc? What is the expected life? It has a 2 year
warranty, which doesn't sound very good to me for a heat pump based
device. If you bought a heat pump HVAC system, or a refrigeratior,
it would have a longer warranty than that.

It also says it's for electric hot water heaters and to contact the
manufacturer if you want to adapt it for gas. That wouldn't make me
very comfortable.

wrote:
On Dec 26, 7:06 am, Drew Cutter wrote:
wrote:
On Dec 25, 8:55�pm, Drew Cutter wrote:
Is it worth the money to use a integrated heat pump water heater ? Any
mfg. you can recommend on both the heat pump and water heater . Thanks.
heat pumps work best in areas with moderate temperatures, air heat
pumps in northern freezing areas use back up electric resistance heat.
thats costly.
what part of the country are you in and how do you currently heat your
home and water?
I'm using gas water heater . From the web page as long as the basement
or furnace room stays above 40 degree i'm ok. This heat pump is not out
side. http://www.nyletherm.com/waterheating.htm

The manufacturer says that tests show it reduced ELECTRIC water
heating bills by an average of 50%. Three things worth noting
there. One is that it's compared to electric which is costs
significantly more to operate in most parts of the country than a gas
water heater, which you have. Second, whatever average use was for
their test in terms of water amounts could be very different from your
personal situation. Third, manufacturers use situations that put
their product in the most favorable light for stated numbers like
this. So, you may not save anywhere near 50% off your gas bill.

So, can you recover the $1100+ upfront cost for the unit, plus install
cost, over the expected life of the unit? Do you have 240V available
at the gas water heater location, free breaker panel space for a
circuit, etc? What is the expected life? It has a 2 year
warranty, which doesn't sound very good to me for a heat pump based
device. If you bought a heat pump HVAC system, or a refrigeratior,
it would have a longer warranty than that.

It also says it's for electric hot water heaters and to contact the
manufacturer if you want to adapt it for gas. That wouldn't make me
very comfortable.
Looks like a nice unit. But, besides
all the other comments, this unit will
probably cool the area where the heater
is located. If it is on the back
porch, that might be ok, but in a used
basement, I wouldn't want it to be
cooled. Even in the summer, my Chicago
area basement is cold in the
summer just from being below grade and
having the central air evaporator
and air handler there. The one basement
register is closed and the only
cool air from the AC system is coming
from leaks and the cold uninsulated
ducts taking on some heat. I certainly
wouldn't want it any colder.

I would only consider such a unit if it were part of a geothermal heat
pump, not an air type.

I just found out that i have to buy a
new furnace next year. Another negative is maintenance. Something like
every three months it has to be clean. What are the thought on tankless
water heater ?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


regular tanks standby losses helps heat the home in the winter

while some crow about tankless they often introduce more troubles
than
they solve. slow arrival of hot water upon turn on, unit must detect
water being used, turn on burner and get hot before you get any hot
water, no hot water in low flow like valve open just a little to wash
hands, cool hot water in areas where incoming water is cold in
winter,
no hot water at all during power failures, need upgraded gas lines
and
possibly flue for proper operation, and standby losses of regular
tank
are really lost during heating season they help heat your home,
although during AC use they can add to the heat load some. plus the
energy you save will never exceed the higher initial cost of the
tankless, espically considering they need regular service.


normal tanks are very reliable and tend to not have technical troubles
till they leak.

What are the thought on tankless water heater?

I have a tankless WH at my home, my office and at 3 of our rental, and
I see then doing home inspections here in Chicago. They can work well,
but we encountered a LOT of issues when installing them. I have a web
page up where I discuss some of the problems we have encountered, and
how to avoid them. It also has a link to an OA Smith white paper on
calculating the payback of tankless heaters:

http://paragoninspects.com/home-insp...blems-faq.html

On Dec 27, 7:02 pm, Drew Cutter wrote:
Michael Thomas, Paragon Property Services,

http://www.paragoninspects.comwrote:
What are the thought on tankless water heater?

I have a tankless WH at my home, my office and at 3 of our rental, and
I see then doing home inspections here in Chicago. They can work well,
but we encountered a LOT of issues when installing them. I have a web
page up where I discuss some of the problems we have encountered, and
how to avoid them. It also has a link to an OA Smith white paper on
calculating the payback of tankless heaters:

http://paragoninspects.com/home-insp...er-heater-inst...

Michael ,

I'm having problems with the numbers supplied by rinnai and rheem .
Seems that they purposely use different numbers. How do you compare the
numbers to see which is better. Rinnai has better warranties. I will be
using a gas tankless system for 2 bathrooms (downstair bathroom is very
small , no tub) , upstairs bathroom is a walk-in shower - soaker tub .
Their are times during the year when their are allot people in the
house. Right now i'm looking for a system that is capable of handling up
to 6 people (kids , wife). Love your web page.

I'd start with by calculating your maximum demand, measure your
incoming water temperature after a week of cold winter weather, then
look at the various manufacturer's charts of gal/min for the required
temp rise to size your unit.
-
I'm partial to Takagi as I've have excellent reliability to date as
well as utstanding tech support form their field reps, but it's a case
of "The devil i know..." - one thing about the Takagis - if you want
anything other than 122-124F output, you need to purchase a separate
controller.

Michael Thomas
Paragon Property Services Inc / Home Inspections, Chicago IL
http://www/paragoninspects.com
847-475-0468