A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

On Nov 18, 7:45 am, al wrote:
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

Not that I've ever heard about. All TV's that are HD capable will
also display std def signals without wavy, serious distortion. There
are only 2 issues AFAIK, The first is that when people buy an HDTV,
they tend to get a much larger screen. The larger the screen, the
worse the std def picture will look because of the lack of resolution
in the signal source. What looks OK on a 27" TV will look much worse
on a 55". The other issue is that HDTV's are 16:9 screen size. When
you put a std def source up, you have 2 choices, either black bars on
the sides, or to stretch the pic to fit the screen. Stretching leads
to people and things looking fat. TV's have various algorithims and
choices of how to deal with this, varying from stretching everything
equally, to stretching more at the side, less in the middle to try to
make it less noticeable. It's possible something of this nature is
set wrong on the new TV and you could try looking there. I'd try
putting a std def broadcast source up with black bars and see what
happens. Also, does the problem exist with both std DVD and
broadcast?

On my HDTV, there are a couple of choices using he remote to stretch a
nonHDTV picture to fill the screen.
This is done to avoid the black sections on either side of a nonHDTV
picture.
One choice is "wide". This provides a uniform stretch that makes everybody
in the picture look fat.
The other choice is "panoramic". this leaves the center of the picture alone
but stretches the side to fill the screen. This choice will give you the
kind of distortion that it sounds like your friend is getting.

Check the remote for these settings.

Charlie

"al" wrote in message
...
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

On Sun, 18 Nov 2007 04:45:13 -0800 (PST), al
wrote:

Any truth to this?

Absolutely. It depends on the TV's ability to upconvert properly.
Some do it well, some don't.

Thanks for the comments.

It is a large TV, over 50" and the distortion is indeed like
stretching the picture on the sides, much like the impression of
panoramic video. Don't know whether they've played a DVD yet so I
don' know whether the distortions the same.

Anyway, thanks again.

"al" wrote in message
...
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

Hi def tv requires a hi def box. It's that simple. After that, RTFM!

Steve

On Nov 18, 12:07 pm, "SteveB" wrote:
"al" wrote in message

...

A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

Hi def tv requires a hi def box. It's that simple. After that, RTFM!

Steve

No. Any HDTV that you buy today has a built-in ATSC tuner. You can
receive HD over the air with just an antenna and no seperate "box".

But that doesn't have anything to do with the question which is about
std def viewed on an HDTV.

"SteveB" wrote in message
...

"al" wrote in message
...
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

Hi def tv requires a hi def box. It's that simple. After that, RTFM!

Steve




No it does not. My HDTV displays analog TV just fine without any additional
stuff.

If he is using standard cable or satellitte thru rf cable or svideo
the picture will not be impressive. Have him use an OTA antenna as
most areas have numerous stations in HD. Then you will tell if the tv
is the problem or the signal quality is.


On Nov 18, 7:45 am, al wrote:
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

al wrote:
It is a large TV, over 50" and the distortion is indeed like
stretching the picture on the sides, much like the impression of
panoramic video. Don't know whether they've played a DVD yet so I
don' know whether the distortions the same.

The ratio of width to height ("aspect ratio") for standard non-HD TV is
4:3. On wide-screen HDTV sets with different aspect ratios, there are two
ways of displaying non-HD: one is to stretch the width to fit the screen,
which most seem to do by default, the other is to display it properly and
have black areas on the sides of the picture, which at least some should
be capable of doing.

--
Angry American flags attack Hillary Clinton!

I have cable. HDTV is just fine.
I get my ABC affiliate 3 ways: analog 3x4 480lines, digital 3x4 480 lines
and Hi Def 16x9 720p
Other channels may be 1080i.

Trust me. The HDTV pic is impressive even on my smaller TV.

Charlie

wrote in message
...
If he is using standard cable or satellitte thru rf cable or svideo
the picture will not be impressive. Have him use an OTA antenna as
most areas have numerous stations in HD. Then you will tell if the tv
is the problem or the signal quality is.


On Nov 18, 7:45 am, al wrote:
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

al wrote:
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

It's because it's a widescreen TV, he's using a non-HD signal, and
likely the TV is set to stretch the non-widescreen image to fit. The
stretch mode is mainly meant for use with DVD players which can be set
to a widescreen mode so that the image will actually look correct,
though lots of people end up using for normal non-HDTV and end up with a
picture that looks like crap..

--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from
Home Page: http://www.roberthancock.com/

Cycle through the available format options on the HD TV. There should be an
option for 4:3 ratio which would eliminate the TV's attempt to make an HD
picture out of a SD signal.


"Robert Hancock" wrote in message
news:RVN2j.53748$PE.31893@pd7urf1no...
al wrote:
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

It's because it's a widescreen TV, he's using a non-HD signal, and likely
the TV is set to stretch the non-widescreen image to fit. The stretch mode
is mainly meant for use with DVD players which can be set to a widescreen
mode so that the image will actually look correct, though lots of people
end up using for normal non-HDTV and end up with a picture that looks like
crap..

--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from
Home Page: http://www.roberthancock.com/

On Nov 27, 10:46 am, "jch" wrote:
Cycle through the available format options on the HD TV. There should be an
option for 4:3 ratio which would eliminate the TV's attempt to make an HD
picture out of a SD signal.

"Robert Hancock" wrote in message

news:RVN2j.53748$PE.31893@pd7urf1no...



al wrote:
A friend's new hi definition TV, I think he said it's a dlp, has
pretty serious distortion. Where the image kind of waves as the
picture pans, with most distortion at the edges. He asked the store
where he bought it about this and was told that it was because he
needs to get hi definition service from his cable or satellite
provider; that the distortion comes from the hi def tv compensating
for the lack of hi def signal and will not work properly without
that.

Any truth to this?

Thanks.

It's because it's a widescreen TV, he's using a non-HD signal, and likely
the TV is set to stretch the non-widescreen image to fit. The stretch mode
is mainly meant for use with DVD players which can be set to a widescreen
mode so that the image will actually look correct, though lots of people
end up using for normal non-HDTV and end up with a picture that looks like
crap..

--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from
Home Page:http://www.roberthancock.com/- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Is not buying an HDTV and then using it on any old (analog?) TV signal
rather like buying a sporty car and then wondering why it doesn't
handle very well when driven on country lanes with a bale of straw in
the trunk and a crate of chickens in the passernger seat?
i.e. It doesn't work very well!
More technically; Hi Def is not as 'Backward compatible' as when
colour TV programming first came out and the colour TV signals were
'Required' (By the FCC and other regulatory agencies) to be compatible
with the existing Black and White TV sets.
Unfortunately it looks like Hi Def is going to force a lot of people
to buy new (more expensive) digital TVs. Just wait until John Q Public
realises that; we might have another revolution? Since most of the
programing is cr*p think we will just not bother.
After all our 10+ year old used TV bought some six years or more ago
for $25 and fixed for less than $4 has been working fine.
Don't feel like shelling out hundreds of dollars!
Ah well! Maybe used Hi Def ones will be on the market eventually.
Possibly pick up one at a flea market or yard sale!
Oh. Gee; then there is a monthly fee for cable or satellite. One would
think with all the advertising (only about 18 minutes of actual
programming per half hour) it should be free!

"terry" wrote in message
...

Is not buying an HDTV and then using it on any old (analog?) TV signal
rather like buying a sporty car and then wondering why it doesn't
handle very well when driven on country lanes with a bale of straw in
the trunk and a crate of chickens in the passernger seat?
i.e. It doesn't work very well!
More technically; Hi Def is not as 'Backward compatible' as when
colour TV programming first came out and the colour TV signals were
'Required' (By the FCC and other regulatory agencies) to be compatible
with the existing Black and White TV sets.

Not true. My HDTV works fine on analog cable. It's completely backwards
compatible.

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 12:15:34 -0700, Bob M. wrote:


"terry" wrote in message
...

Is not buying an HDTV and then using it on any old (analog?) TV signal
rather like buying a sporty car and then wondering why it doesn't
handle very well when driven on country lanes with a bale of straw in
the trunk and a crate of chickens in the passernger seat?
i.e. It doesn't work very well!
More technically; Hi Def is not as 'Backward compatible' as when
colour TV programming first came out and the colour TV signals were
'Required' (By the FCC and other regulatory agencies) to be compatible
with the existing Black and White TV sets.

Not true. My HDTV works fine on analog cable. It's completely backwards
compatible.

Irrelevent. It is the hidef *signal* that isn't backward compatible.

When NTSC got color, black and white TV weren't bothered. They didn't need a
new tuner.

When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.

In article ,
AZ Nomad wrote:

When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.

Technically, digital will be only one transmitted. I don't beleive
there is any regulatory requirement to go to HD, just digital. At least
according to the feds (http://www.dtv.gov/whatisdtv.html) . There are
digital TVs out there that aren't HD but will work. Probably not really
relevant to anyone not as anal-retentive as I am (g).

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:07:21 -0500, Kurt Ullman wrote:


In article ,
AZ Nomad wrote:

When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.

Technically, digital will be only one transmitted. I don't beleive
there is any regulatory requirement to go to HD, just digital. At least
according to the feds (http://www.dtv.gov/whatisdtv.html) . There are
digital TVs out there that aren't HD but will work. Probably not really
relevant to anyone not as anal-retentive as I am (g).

Point taken. I meant to compare analog with digital, not analog to HDTV, a
subset of digital.

On Nov 27, 3:21 pm, AZ Nomad wrote:
On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:07:21 -0500, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
AZ Nomad wrote:
When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analogTVis going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.
Technically, digital will be only one transmitted. I don't beleive
there is any regulatory requirement to go to HD, just digital. At least
according to the feds (http://www.dtv.gov/whatisdtv.html) . There are
digital TVs out there that aren't HD but will work. Probably not really
relevant to anyone not as anal-retentive as I am (g).

Point taken. I meant to compare analog with digital, not analog to HDTV, a
subset of digital.

I have a similar question. I bought a 37" LCD and have hi-def digital
cable box, and when watching the channels that are true hi-def, the
picture is practically flawless. But when watching other channels,
the picture is disappointing, and actually looks better on our 15 year-
old 32" tube TV (with a digital cable box). Is that because like the
other poster said, the bigger the tv the more you will notice the
flaws of a mediocre transmission?

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:07:21 -0500, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
AZ Nomad wrote:

When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.

Technically, digital will be only one transmitted. I don't beleive
there is any regulatory requirement to go to HD, just digital. At least
according to the feds (http://www.dtv.gov/whatisdtv.html) . There are
digital TVs out there that aren't HD but will work.

I see some for sale around here. They call them EDTV (non-NTSC input,
usually ATSC/QAM tuner, 480-line resolution).

Probably not really
relevant to anyone not as anal-retentive as I am (g).
--
28 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups"

"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...


When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is
going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.


Still not true! All TV's sold today are required to have NTSC -and- ATSC
tuners, built-in. FCC mandate from a few years ago.

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 16:06:08 -0700, Bob M. wrote:


"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...


When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is
going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.


Still not true! All TV's sold today are required to have NTSC -and- ATSC
tuners, built-in. FCC mandate from a few years ago.

STILL IRRELEVENT. Having both tuners doesn't make ATSC backward compatible.

I see why you snipped out what I was replying to so that you could take it
out of context.

Jeffy3 wrote:
I have a similar question. I bought a 37" LCD and have hi-def digital
cable box, and when watching the channels that are true hi-def, the
picture is practically flawless. But when watching other channels,
the picture is disappointing, and actually looks better on our 15
year- old 32" tube TV (with a digital cable box). Is that because
like the other poster said, the bigger the tv the more you will
notice the flaws of a mediocre transmission?

There are differences in how well hi-def monitors display non-hi-def content.
It is not merely a question of stretching the image to the wider format. I read
many reviews of hd sets before I bought mine and the reviewer frequently would
comment on how some sets were better at displaying non-hi-def content than
others were.

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 16:06:08 -0700, "Bob M." wrote:

"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...


When NTSC is phased out and only HDTV is transmitted, no analog TV is
going
to be able to receive the new signal without an outboard tuner.


Still not true!

Besides the (incomplete) fact below, they are requiring OTA broadcasts
to be in ATSC. Many will be 480-line (not HDTV).

All TV's sold today are required to have NTSC -and- ATSC
tuners, built-in.

IF they have any tuners at all.

FCC mandate from a few years ago.
--
27 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups"

" All TV's sold today are required to have NTSC -and- ATSC
tuners, built-in.

IF they have any tuners at all.

Nitpicking: If they have no tuners, they're not TVs -- they're monitors.
So all TVs sold today ARE required to have NTSC and ATSC tuners.

"Rick Brandt" writes:

I read
many reviews of hd sets before I bought mine and the reviewer frequently would
comment on how some sets were better at displaying non-hi-def content than
others were.

Our local BestBuy has an interesting demo set up. There are a couple of
toy cars and figures on a small turntable rotating in front of two Sony
camcorders, one SD and one HD. Their video outputs are fed to a Sony
HDTV via a selector that lets the viewer select either camcorder.
You're supposed to switch between them and see how much better the HD
image looks, so you'll buy a HD camcorder instead of an SD one (or to
replace your existing SD one).

However, the SD image looks really really awful, not just lower
resolution than the HD one, but with all sorts of upsampling
artifacts. It looks much worse than a normal SD TV set displaying SD
video. What the demo *really* shows is how badly the Sony HDTV handles
upsampling the SD content. It shouts to me "don't buy this Sony TV
set". Unfortunately, that's probably not the message that most people
will get - they'll think the TV is fine and SD is just naturally far
inferior to HD.

Dave

On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:29:59 -0700, "DonC"
wrote:


" All TV's sold today are required to have NTSC -and- ATSC
tuners, built-in.

IF they have any tuners at all.

Nitpicking: If they have no tuners, they're not TVs -- they're monitors.
So all TVs sold today ARE required to have NTSC and ATSC tuners.



And TV isn't the right word here either, DVRs and DVD recorders have
the same requirements (regarding tuners).

And what about all that non-HDTV ATSC broadcast? And DVDs too (they're
not HD, and not NTSC)?
--
27 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups"