A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin

That happens just as you described. You did mention "outdoor box" if you are
referring to an outdoor weatherproof box such as type "FS" or Bell box, the
threaded knockouts must be sealed with suitable compound to exclude water
entry and by current code the covers should be "while in use" type, which
prevents water entry when something is plugged in


wrote in message
...
A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin

On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 07:08:10 -0400, "RBM" rbm2(remove
wrote:

That happens just as you described. You did mention "outdoor box" if you are
referring to an outdoor weatherproof box such as type "FS" or Bell box, the
threaded knockouts must be sealed with suitable compound to exclude water
entry and by current code the covers should be "while in use" type, which
prevents water entry when something is plugged in


Yes, it's a outdoor weatherproof box. I'm not sure what type, as in
"FS" or "bell box". Just the common ones made to be mounted outdoors
on the surface of the siding with screw in hole plugs. The water was
obviously leaking from the gasket under the cover plate which was
deteriorated from age. Those foam type gaskets are pretty weak if you
ask me. Thats why I applied a bead of silicone around the whole
cover. The cover I used is just the spring loaded snap shut type.
This outlet is only used to power lawn tools and nothing is ever left
plugged in during rain. The thing was installed years ago before they
even required GFIs outdoors. I used a GFI this time.

Alvin


wrote in message
.. .
A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin

On Sep 13, 6:31 am, wrote:
A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin

The breaker should have been a GFCI type breaker so yes, it should
have tripped immediately. Also if there was arcing and burning going
on the receptacle itself may have become shorted internally from a
contact falling against another when the plastic support burned away.

nate

On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 05:31:38 -0500, wrote:

A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin


I know that outdoor receptacles can deteriorate over time and needs
regular inspections. A guy I know had serious fire damage to the side
of his house. The electrical box to his hot tub corroded, shorted,
and caught fire. Gaskets, silicon, or other weather stripping can
fail.

I would recommend sealing the screw in plugs with silicone, as water goes
right through them


wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 07:08:10 -0400, "RBM" rbm2(remove
wrote:

That happens just as you described. You did mention "outdoor box" if you
are
referring to an outdoor weatherproof box such as type "FS" or Bell box,
the
threaded knockouts must be sealed with suitable compound to exclude water
entry and by current code the covers should be "while in use" type, which
prevents water entry when something is plugged in


Yes, it's a outdoor weatherproof box. I'm not sure what type, as in
"FS" or "bell box". Just the common ones made to be mounted outdoors
on the surface of the siding with screw in hole plugs. The water was
obviously leaking from the gasket under the cover plate which was
deteriorated from age. Those foam type gaskets are pretty weak if you
ask me. Thats why I applied a bead of silicone around the whole
cover. The cover I used is just the spring loaded snap shut type.
This outlet is only used to power lawn tools and nothing is ever left
plugged in during rain. The thing was installed years ago before they
even required GFIs outdoors. I used a GFI this time.

Alvin


wrote in message
. ..
A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin

Well my friend it is all depend how you use it
I have used silicon many times I also have
equipment that runs @ 160 deg. F and 95% RH (relative humidity)
been in service for years with no leaks
first of all, all silicones are not same two surface must be clean
wash in soap and water second if surface is glossy
it should be clean and prime with silicon primer
and silicon applied with minimum of 1/16th thickness
I can sure you it will hold

"RBM" rbm2(remove wrote in message
...
I would recommend sealing the screw in plugs with silicone, as water goes
right through them


wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 07:08:10 -0400, "RBM" rbm2(remove
wrote:

That happens just as you described. You did mention "outdoor box" if you
are
referring to an outdoor weatherproof box such as type "FS" or Bell box,
the
threaded knockouts must be sealed with suitable compound to exclude water
entry and by current code the covers should be "while in use" type, which
prevents water entry when something is plugged in


Yes, it's a outdoor weatherproof box. I'm not sure what type, as in
"FS" or "bell box". Just the common ones made to be mounted outdoors
on the surface of the siding with screw in hole plugs. The water was
obviously leaking from the gasket under the cover plate which was
deteriorated from age. Those foam type gaskets are pretty weak if you
ask me. Thats why I applied a bead of silicone around the whole
cover. The cover I used is just the spring loaded snap shut type.
This outlet is only used to power lawn tools and nothing is ever left
plugged in during rain. The thing was installed years ago before they
even required GFIs outdoors. I used a GFI this time.

Alvin


wrote in message
...
A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin

On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 15:55:30 GMT, Phisherman wrote:

On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 05:31:38 -0500, wrote:

A relative called me and said they had a breaker that kept tripping.
I went and looked and found an outdoor outlet that was in a suitable
outdoor box with a protective cover (that closes over the outlet).
The face of that cover was all black and charred, the foam in the
cover was burned on half of the cover as if it had burned. When I
opened the box I found the outlet was all charred from the side by the
hot wire to the cover plate. I could see that water had been entering
the box and corrosion on the screws. From what I was able to gather,
the corrosion allowed a certain amount of electricity to arc over the
box cover which in turn caused carbon tracking on the outlet itself,
and at one point it must have gotten quite hot to burn away the foam
on that side of the cover.

Does this seem to make sense as far as what happened? The breaker
would trip as soon as I turned it on as in a dead short, yet there was
no noticable direct short such as a bared wire touching the box.
Therefore it appears it was only the carbon on of the burned away
outlet and corrosion that formed the short to the box. I find this
hard to believe and it looks as if could have been a serious fire
hazzard. It sure looks like it actually burned under the cover.

I am just asking if anyone can explain how this occurred. Obviously
water was leaking into the box. I replaced the outlet with a new GFI
outlet and installed a new cover. The box itself was still ok.
Besides the gasket that came with the new cover, I applied silicone
around the top and sides of the cover to insure no more water leakage.
Those gaskets dont seem to be adaquate in my opinion.

Alvin


I know that outdoor receptacles can deteriorate over time and needs
regular inspections. A guy I know had serious fire damage to the side
of his house. The electrical box to his hot tub corroded, shorted,
and caught fire. Gaskets, silicon, or other weather stripping can
fail.

I do believe there was a small fire inside this box on my relative's
house, but fortunately it was encased in a metal box and went out.
This metal box was hooked to metal conduit so it was quite safe. If it
was a newer style plastic box it could have caused a fire.

It also tripped the breaker which in turn knocked out a few basement
lights. Those lights were what they called me to fix. At first I
thought there was a bad switch for those lights but soon discovered
there was no power. After opening several boxes in the basement, and
disconnecting things one by one, I discovered the problem was the
wires going to that outlet.