PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned. The cold water pressure is great,
which is the driving force of our faucet water pressure. When hot
water only is on ... it takes 3 minutes to fill up a gallon jug (no
joke) and about 40 seconds of that water to start getting hot. Typical
is running the shower for 3-5 minutes before being able to jump in.
Money down the drain, literally. (one thing that works is turning up
the hot water temp so the little water that comes out warms the strong
cold water pressure to where it is usable ... just FYI for people with
similar problem)

What to do?? Now I checked this when the furnace is not actually on,
so the water flow should be dedicated to normal hot water use. Also,
there is a faucet just as the pipes come out of the furnace. Figured
if the flow was strong, the pipes would be full of mineral deposits.
BUT, the flow is the same (not to mention the faucet is leaking because
I disturbed it). So it must be the furnace hot water output, no?? Or
how / is it possible to get more hot water pressure? Would love to
change to a smaller furnace and reclaim my basement, but I heard these
old ones are work horses that I should run until it dies. And the bank
account likes to hear that, so ...

Is there anything I can do to increase my hot water pressure???

Thank you very much in advance ... and my water bill can use a break
)

Jim

In article om,
says...
PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned.

This isn't unusual even for newer construction. My house, built in
'86, also has a domestic hot water coil for hot water. It works
well enough, though the boiler has to run all year (not necessarily
a bad thing).

The cold water pressure is great,
which is the driving force of our faucet water pressure. When hot
water only is on ... it takes 3 minutes to fill up a gallon jug (no
joke) and about 40 seconds of that water to start getting hot. Typical
is running the shower for 3-5 minutes before being able to jump in.

Sounds like the boiler is a ways form the shower (we also have this
problem).

Money down the drain, literally. (one thing that works is turning up
the hot water temp so the little water that comes out warms the strong
cold water pressure to where it is usable ... just FYI for people with
similar problem)

What to do?? Now I checked this when the furnace is not actually on,
so the water flow should be dedicated to normal hot water use. Also,
there is a faucet just as the pipes come out of the furnace. Figured
if the flow was strong, the pipes would be full of mineral deposits.
BUT, the flow is the same (not to mention the faucet is leaking because
I disturbed it). So it must be the furnace hot water output, no?? Or
how / is it possible to get more hot water pressure? Would love to
change to a smaller furnace and reclaim my basement, but I heard these
old ones are work horses that I should run until it dies. And the bank
account likes to hear that, so ...

The domestic coil may be plugged with calcium (and other slime).
You can have it "boiled out" by your boiler service tech. They use
an acid to dissolve the built-up sluge. Another alternative is to
add a hot water tank and put it on a separate heat zone, bypassing
the domestic hot water coil.

Is there anything I can do to increase my hot water pressure???

Thank you very much in advance ... and my water bill can use a break
)

--
Keith

wrote in message
ps.com...
PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned.

First, lets talk the right terminology. You don't have a furnace, you have a
boiler. Furnace heat air, boilers heat water.

Inside of that boiler, you have a coil that heats up the water for domestic
use. They can become clogged over time. It may have to be replaced.

Slim chance, but the valve to the hot water feed may be partly turned off
too. My guess is that it is not and you checked that already, but if not,
give it a look.

As for that workhorse, it is probably very low efficiency. Are there any
slips from the service on it? It may show what the efficiency was read by a
meter. Not long ago, 75% to 80% was normal, but new models are better. You
may be blowing a lot of heat up the chimney.

Most of the heat in the basement is going to travel up, but some will be
lost to the walls and floor. If you like it that warm, do nothing, but if
you'd rather have it a bit cooler, insulate the pipes in the basement.

http://home.howstuffworks.com/how-to...ion-system.htm


On Jan 23, 9:12 pm, wrote:
PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned. The cold water pressure is great,
which is the driving force of our faucet water pressure. When hot
water only is on ... it takes 3 minutes to fill up a gallon jug (no
joke) and about 40 seconds of that water to start getting hot. Typical
is running the shower for 3-5 minutes before being able to jump in.
Money down the drain, literally. (one thing that works is turning up
the hot water temp so the little water that comes out warms the strong
cold water pressure to where it is usable ... just FYI for people with
similar problem)

What to do?? Now I checked this when the furnace is not actually on,
so the water flow should be dedicated to normal hot water use. Also,
there is a faucet just as the pipes come out of the furnace. Figured
if the flow was strong, the pipes would be full of mineral deposits.
BUT, the flow is the same (not to mention the faucet is leaking because
I disturbed it). So it must be the furnace hot water output, no?? Or
how / is it possible to get more hot water pressure? Would love to
change to a smaller furnace and reclaim my basement, but I heard these
old ones are work horses that I should run until it dies. And the bank
account likes to hear that, so ...

Is there anything I can do to increase my hot water pressure???

Thank you very much in advance ... and my water bill can use a break
)

Jim

On Jan 23, 9:52 pm, krw wrote:
In article om,
says...

PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned.This isn't unusual even for newer construction. My house, built in
'86, also has a domestic hot water coil for hot water. It works
well enough, though the boiler has to run all year (not necessarily
a bad thing).

The cold water pressure is great,
which is the driving force of our faucet water pressure. When hot
water only is on ... it takes 3 minutes to fill up a gallon jug (no
joke) and about 40 seconds of that water to start getting hot. Typical
is running the shower for 3-5 minutes before being able to jump in.Sounds like the boiler is a ways form the shower (we also have this
problem).

Money down the drain, literally. (one thing that works is turning up
the hot water temp so the little water that comes out warms the strong
cold water pressure to where it is usable ... just FYI for people with
similar problem)

What to do?? Now I checked this when the furnace is not actually on,
so the water flow should be dedicated to normal hot water use. Also,
there is a faucet just as the pipes come out of the furnace. Figured
if the flow was strong, the pipes would be full of mineral deposits.
BUT, the flow is the same (not to mention the faucet is leaking because
I disturbed it). So it must be the furnace hot water output, no?? Or
how / is it possible to get more hot water pressure? Would love to
change to a smaller furnace and reclaim my basement, but I heard these
old ones are work horses that I should run until it dies. And the bank
account likes to hear that, so ...The domestic coil may be plugged with calcium (and other slime).
You can have it "boiled out" by your boiler service tech. They use
an acid to dissolve the built-up sluge. Another alternative is to
add a hot water tank and put it on a separate heat zone, bypassing
the domestic hot water coil.

Is there anything I can do to increase my hot water pressure???

Thank you very much in advance ... and my water bill can use a break
)--
Keith

Thank you so much for your input. Sounds like first step is getting
the coil cleaned, and a trust worthy guy will tell me if it needs
replaced. Good idea on a separate heater, seeing when this boiler
finally goes, I would do the two separate units anyway. Would spread
out the cost anyway over two installs.

Thanks again.

first. Thanks for setting me straight. I did check all the valves on
the boiler, and are all currently open. Sounds like the coil could be
the first wave of attack. And in searching the maintenance records,
looks like last service was 2002!! Woman we bought the house from was
only here for a few years, so looks like she did nothing. Will get on
the horn asap for an efficiency rating. As I replied to Keith above,
going with the separate hot water heater in the very near future might
be good, seeing as when this thing finally goes, I will have the two
units anyway. Do you suggest doing both a new furnace and hot water
heater at the same time? Any advantages/disadvantages??

Thanks Edwin, I appreciate your input


On Jan 23, 9:54 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
wrote in glegroups.com...

PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned.First, lets talk the right terminology. You don't have a furnace, you have a
boiler. Furnace heat air, boilers heat water.

Inside of that boiler, you have a coil that heats up the water for domestic
use. They can become clogged over time. It may have to be replaced.

Slim chance, but the valve to the hot water feed may be partly turned off
too. My guess is that it is not and you checked that already, but if not,
give it a look.

As for that workhorse, it is probably very low efficiency. Are there any
slips from the service on it? It may show what the efficiency was read by a
meter. Not long ago, 75% to 80% was normal, but new models are better. You
may be blowing a lot of heat up the chimney.

Most of the heat in the basement is going to travel up, but some will be
lost to the walls and floor. If you like it that warm, do nothing, but if
you'd rather have it a bit cooler, insulate the pipes in the basement.

Buffalobill. THANK YOU for the link!!! it is nice to have a diagram to
see what the heck I am looking at in the first place. Actually shedded
some bright light on a few things. Thanks again for the reply!!!!

On Jan 24, 5:06 am, "buffalobill" wrote:
http://home.howstuffworks.com/how-to...-water-and-ste...

On Jan 23, 9:12 pm, wrote:



PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned. The cold water pressure is great,
which is the driving force of our faucet water pressure. When hot
water only is on ... it takes 3 minutes to fill up a gallon jug (no
joke) and about 40 seconds of that water to start getting hot. Typical
is running the shower for 3-5 minutes before being able to jump in.
Money down the drain, literally. (one thing that works is turning up
the hot water temp so the little water that comes out warms the strong
cold water pressure to where it is usable ... just FYI for people with
similar problem)

What to do?? Now I checked this when the furnace is not actually on,
so the water flow should be dedicated to normal hot water use. Also,
there is a faucet just as the pipes come out of the furnace. Figured
if the flow was strong, the pipes would be full of mineral deposits.
BUT, the flow is the same (not to mention the faucet is leaking because
I disturbed it). So it must be the furnace hot water output, no?? Or
how / is it possible to get more hot water pressure? Would love to
change to a smaller furnace and reclaim my basement, but I heard these
old ones are work horses that I should run until it dies. And the bank
account likes to hear that, so ...

Is there anything I can do to increase my hot water pressure???

Thank you very much in advance ... and my water bill can use a break
)

Jim- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -

one other question please, Edwin. Coming off the pressure relief
valve, there is a drain hose. Seems to be filling up the bucket under
it every two days. Is this a "sympthom" of any foreseeable problems?

On Jan 23, 9:54 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
wrote in glegroups.com...

PLEASE HELP!!

Background ... Just bought a house, so I do not know the history. What
I do know is I have a Freddy Krueger oil furnace in the basement
handling the hot water and heating duties (Huge ... 54"w x 30"d x 54"h)
Found documents from furnace .. 1952 original with house!! The heat
works great, not to mention heating the basement nice and toasty.
Problem is with the hot water. No hot water heater, so it is coming
from the furnace, as i mentioned.

First, lets talk the right terminology. You don't have a furnace, you
have a
boiler. Furnace heat air, boilers heat water.

Inside of that boiler, you have a coil that heats up the water for domestic
use. They can become clogged over time. It may have to be replaced.

Slim chance, but the valve to the hot water feed may be partly turned off
too. My guess is that it is not and you checked that already, but if not,
give it a look.

As for that workhorse, it is probably very low efficiency. Are there any
slips from the service on it? It may show what the efficiency was read by a
meter. Not long ago, 75% to 80% was normal, but new models are better. You
may be blowing a lot of heat up the chimney.

Most of the heat in the basement is going to travel up, but some will be
lost to the walls and floor. If you like it that warm, do nothing, but if
you'd rather have it a bit cooler, insulate the pipes in the basement.

wrote in message
ps.com...
one other question please, Edwin. Coming off the pressure relief
valve, there is a drain hose. Seems to be filling up the bucket under
it every two days. Is this a "sympthom" of any foreseeable problems?


Yes, it is. You either have too much pressure, a defective valve, or both.

Pressure relief valves often go bad and start to leak. They get worse, they
sometimes go and let a lot of water flow. I'd replace it ASAP. If it is a
typical Watts fill and relief combo, you may have to replace both at hte
same time. About $75

Great help again. Coil being cleaned today, see if it does the trick
for the hot water. Found service records, last entry is 2002 with 75%
efficiency (I hope it has been serviced since then!!!) So they are
coming out on tuesday for service/pressure valve. Everytime the boiler
kicks on, I have to go down and check the water level on the pressure
release. Of course on the coldest weekend in our northeast.

Thanks again Edwin. You da man!!

On Jan 25, 3:14 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
wrote in glegroups.com...

one other question please, Edwin. Coming off the pressure relief
valve, there is a drain hose. Seems to be filling up the bucket under
it every two days. Is this a "sympthom" of any foreseeable problems?Yes, it is. You either have too much pressure, a defective valve, or both.

Pressure relief valves often go bad and start to leak. They get worse, they
sometimes go and let a lot of water flow. I'd replace it ASAP. If it is a
typical Watts fill and relief combo, you may have to replace both at hte
same time. About $75

Hello All. figured I would post the results of my week long
excitement concerning my old boiler, in hopes that it may help someone
in the future.

First problem was very little hot water pressure. In the town I live
in, this water quality is pretty bad, and managed to gum up the
coils. After the coil was cleaned (btw, not sure if this is the norm,
but they use citric acid .. the power of an orange, i guess) it
restored the pressure. Glad it was not the old piping system ... by
opening the drain valve closest to the boiler, and seeing that the
flow was slow, good sign it was in the coil. VERY HAPPY. Thanks to
those that suggested that cure.

Next was the pressure relief valve leaking, to where it was filling up
a large bucket with water every two days. Edwin mentioned there was
too much pressure in the system, causing water to be discharged. He
suggested the pressure release valve might be coming to its end, and
it would be good to replace both (if applicable) at the same time.
Prior I had mentioned that the last record on maintenance papers dated
2002. I couldn't believe someone would let the annual service lapse
when the boiler is 54 years old!!. Sure enough, it had not been
serviced in 4.5 years, and the poor guy worked on it for 3.5 hours.
Turns out the expansion tank was waterlogged, and all gummed up as
well. (Did i mention the poor water quality). He had mentioned that
with so much water in the expansion tank, the pressure increases, and
hence the valve discharge. Hopefully this is it, even though the
boiler is on borrowed time, kind of attached to the behemoth.
Especially after we have been through so much, haha. And the
efficiency test showed ... 76.2%. Actually more efficient that 2002.
Getting better with age. So in the year 2077, we are back up to
90%.

So ... I would think it wise to have annual service on your boiler,
especially when it's in the Golden years.

Thank you for all your help guys. Keith, Edwin, and Buffalobill.

On Jan 26, 9:17 am, wrote:
Great help again. Coil being cleaned today, see if it does the trick
for the hot water. Found service records, last entry is 2002 with 75%
efficiency (I hope it has been serviced since then!!!) So they are
coming out on tuesday for service/pressure valve. Everytime the boiler
kicks on, I have to go down and check the water level on the pressure
release. Of course on the coldest weekend in our northeast.

Thanks again Edwin. You da man!!

On Jan 25, 3:14 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:



wrote in glegroups.com...

one other question please, Edwin. Coming off the pressure relief
valve, there is a drain hose. Seems to be filling up the bucket under
it every two days. Is this a "sympthom" of any foreseeable problems?Yes, it is. You either have too much pressure, a defective valve, or both.

Pressure relief valves often go bad and start to leak. They get worse, they
sometimes go and let a lot of water flow. I'd replace it ASAP. If it is a
typical Watts fill and relief combo, you may have to replace both at hte
same time. About $75- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

wrote in message

Thank you for all your help guys. Keith, Edwin, and Buffalobill.


You're welcome. Glad it had a happy, even if expensive, ending.