I have water entering my sump pit at a point 8" below the basement
floor. The flow of this water is relatively strong after a heavy rain
and typically takes at least five days to reach a point where it no
longer seeps in at this point. I might note the water table is
unnaturally high in this area due to much above average precipitation
over the last four months.

The perimeter drain at my house sits on top of the footers and I have
been advised by the builder this positioning places the perforated
drain tile 4" below the basement floor. This drain tile is connected
to a hard PVC drain pipe and drains to daylight behind my house.

My question...theoretically speaking as I am reticent to unplug my
sump pump and test this particular theory... if my sump pump were not
working and the water level rose-- would the water level rise across
(under) the entire basement floor area and find its way into the
perimeter drain before attempting to enter into the floor, under the
walls, etc.?

I find that rain water near my house not removed by gutter downspouts
and the exterior grading is finding its way under my footers,
bypassing the perimeter drain, and eventually into the sump pit. I
understand the perimeter drain is there to primarily capture rising
ground water, but I was surprised recently during a heavy rainfall
that no water was exiting the aforementioned drain pipe. I dug down
where it is connected to the perimeter drain, rain a hose onto that
area, and the water ran down the drain pipe. Why rain water is not
entering the perimeter drain initially is somewhat confusing, but
perhaps the chosen positioning of this drain tile (on top of the
footers vs. along side) might have something to do with the fact rain
water seems to be aggregating into the water table and finding its way
under my basement.

Sorry for the digression... and thanks for your thoughts regarding
what should happen if my sump were not functioning relative to the
water level rising and potentially finding the perimeter drain before
finding my basement.
--Howie

Very likely you are correct, especially if you have porous soil that the
water can easily travel through. In most areas that I am familiar with the
perimeter drain empties into the sump, and then is pumped out. If your
perimeter drain exits to an area below the foundation, why was there a need
for the sump.

An other thought, does it really drain to below the foundation or is water
standing at the exit and is deep enough to run back up the pipe to flood
your sump (or possibly the same water being circulated). Or possibly the
exit pipe is blocked with an animal nest or dead animal preventing the water
from leaving. You should not have an open pipe, check to ensure it is
screened or that the screen is still in place.

"Howie" wrote in message
...
I have water entering my sump pit at a point 8" below the basement
floor. The flow of this water is relatively strong after a heavy rain
and typically takes at least five days to reach a point where it no
longer seeps in at this point. I might note the water table is
unnaturally high in this area due to much above average precipitation
over the last four months.

The perimeter drain at my house sits on top of the footers and I have
been advised by the builder this positioning places the perforated
drain tile 4" below the basement floor. This drain tile is connected
to a hard PVC drain pipe and drains to daylight behind my house.

My question...theoretically speaking as I am reticent to unplug my
sump pump and test this particular theory... if my sump pump were not
working and the water level rose-- would the water level rise across
(under) the entire basement floor area and find its way into the
perimeter drain before attempting to enter into the floor, under the
walls, etc.?

I find that rain water near my house not removed by gutter downspouts
and the exterior grading is finding its way under my footers,
bypassing the perimeter drain, and eventually into the sump pit. I
understand the perimeter drain is there to primarily capture rising
ground water, but I was surprised recently during a heavy rainfall
that no water was exiting the aforementioned drain pipe. I dug down
where it is connected to the perimeter drain, rain a hose onto that
area, and the water ran down the drain pipe. Why rain water is not
entering the perimeter drain initially is somewhat confusing, but
perhaps the chosen positioning of this drain tile (on top of the
footers vs. along side) might have something to do with the fact rain
water seems to be aggregating into the water table and finding its way
under my basement.

Sorry for the digression... and thanks for your thoughts regarding
what should happen if my sump were not functioning relative to the
water level rising and potentially finding the perimeter drain before
finding my basement.
--Howie

Thanks for the comments.

The sump was installed as it was actually a requirement of the
developer that all homes in this particular subdivision- with a
basement- have a sump pump installed.

The drain pipe (the one attached to the perimeter drain and running to
daylight) has a gate-type device near the end to prevent critters from
getting in. I checked the entire length of the drain pipe and it was
clear of any obstruction.


On Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:48:33 -0500, "EXT"
wrote:

Very likely you are correct, especially if you have porous soil that the
water can easily travel through. In most areas that I am familiar with the
perimeter drain empties into the sump, and then is pumped out. If your
perimeter drain exits to an area below the foundation, why was there a need
for the sump.

An other thought, does it really drain to below the foundation or is water
standing at the exit and is deep enough to run back up the pipe to flood
your sump (or possibly the same water being circulated). Or possibly the
exit pipe is blocked with an animal nest or dead animal preventing the water
from leaving. You should not have an open pipe, check to ensure it is
screened or that the screen is still in place.

"Howie" wrote in message
.. .
I have water entering my sump pit at a point 8" below the basement
floor. The flow of this water is relatively strong after a heavy rain
and typically takes at least five days to reach a point where it no
longer seeps in at this point. I might note the water table is
unnaturally high in this area due to much above average precipitation
over the last four months.

The perimeter drain at my house sits on top of the footers and I have
been advised by the builder this positioning places the perforated
drain tile 4" below the basement floor. This drain tile is connected
to a hard PVC drain pipe and drains to daylight behind my house.

My question...theoretically speaking as I am reticent to unplug my
sump pump and test this particular theory... if my sump pump were not
working and the water level rose-- would the water level rise across
(under) the entire basement floor area and find its way into the
perimeter drain before attempting to enter into the floor, under the
walls, etc.?

I find that rain water near my house not removed by gutter downspouts
and the exterior grading is finding its way under my footers,
bypassing the perimeter drain, and eventually into the sump pit. I
understand the perimeter drain is there to primarily capture rising
ground water, but I was surprised recently during a heavy rainfall
that no water was exiting the aforementioned drain pipe. I dug down
where it is connected to the perimeter drain, rain a hose onto that
area, and the water ran down the drain pipe. Why rain water is not
entering the perimeter drain initially is somewhat confusing, but
perhaps the chosen positioning of this drain tile (on top of the
footers vs. along side) might have something to do with the fact rain
water seems to be aggregating into the water table and finding its way
under my basement.

Sorry for the digression... and thanks for your thoughts regarding
what should happen if my sump were not functioning relative to the
water level rising and potentially finding the perimeter drain before
finding my basement.
--Howie

My question...theoretically speaking as I am reticent to unplug my
sump pump and test this particular theory... if my sump pump were not
working and the water level rose-- would the water level rise across
(under) the entire basement floor area and find its way into the
perimeter drain before attempting to enter into the floor, under the
walls, etc.?

It all depends.
My old house did just that; it rose evenly until it reached the floor level.
Until we had an actual flood, and then everything changed for the worse. It
would actually flood one corner while it was still low at the sump corner.
I had to put a second sump pump in at the second corner.
I thought the drains were clogged, but called the original owner and found
out there were no drains! The basement flooded at every rain, so they
installed a sump pump but no drains.

So, my experience may not be useful to you.
A couple months ago we had so much rain that I actually got water in the
bottom of my sump for the first time ever at my new house. Not enough to
trigger the pump, but some water. I am much happier at the new house.

"Howie" wrote in message
...
I have water entering my sump pit at a point 8" below the basement
floor. The flow of this water is relatively strong after a heavy rain
and typically takes at least five days to reach a point where it no
longer seeps in at this point. I might note the water table is
unnaturally high in this area due to much above average precipitation
over the last four months.

Two things, but only one is practical.

The practical one is to make your downspouts run as far away from the house
as possible. I have one that extends out about 8 feet. I took it off just to
see if I really needed it. It rained pretty good after that and I ended up
with an inches-deep puddle right there, so that answered that question. No
more puddle now. If necessary, dig up the dirt & install some 4" PVC pipe.
The downspouts would go directly into the PVC, and the plastic pipe drains
to some place far away. Looks better but can become plugged with leaves.

The other one isn't practical - how far out do the eaves on your roof
extend? Mine extend out nearly two feet so they keep the foundation pretty
dry. Mom & dad's place has NO eaves so their sump pump gets a lot of work.
This is a problem inherent in the design of the house and is not easily
fixable.