|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
Can someone please enlighten me:
I already have 100 amps and copper wire. The house is 55 years old. Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500) Thanks, Wilson |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
I already have 100 amps and copper wire. The house is 55 years old.
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500) What is prompting you to ask this question after 55 years? Breakers offer more convenience/safety than fuses. How often do you cut power to a circuit? How often do you blow a (literal) fuse? Does your setup meet local/national codes? Personally, I would just grumble about it rather than spend the money to upgrade, unless it was costing me significant time/money or if it was required by law. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
If you are thinking about selling the house anytime soon, then get
breakers. Also make sure that you get a panel that is big enough to accomidate any future circuits or other upgrades. Most likely if you have fuses you also have way too many things on the same circuit. I'm reasonably sure that fuses will turn off some buyers. I'm not sure if there are homeowners insurance ramifications to having fuses, but I know that they do ask which type you have. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
Well if it works, don't fix it!
However if you are having problems with circuits being overloaded and fuses blowing, then you would need to replace the fuse panel with a breaker panel so you could add additional circuits. And when doing this work, it would need to be installed properly to code. If it is not installed to code and inspected, and there is a fire because of this, then your insurance company does not have to pay for damages! Other than that, modern electrical wiring is more safe than old wiring. I prefer new up to code wiring in my house. wrote in message Can someone please enlighten me: I already have 100 amps and copper wire. The house is 55 years old. Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500) Thanks, Wilson |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (andspend$1000-$1500)
CJT wrote:
Pete C. wrote: wrote: If you are thinking about selling the house anytime soon, then get breakers. Also make sure that you get a panel that is big enough to accomidate any future circuits or other upgrades. Most likely if you have fuses you also have way too many things on the same circuit. I'm reasonably sure that fuses will turn off some buyers. I'm not sure if there are homeowners insurance ramifications to having fuses, but I know that they do ask which type you have. I know when a friend bought a house a few years back that had 60A fuse service, his insurance company required him to upgrade it within six months. I gave him the service upgrade 101 course, he pulled the permit and did the job himself with no problems and at a cost of a few hundred dollars in materials. Pete C. I think I'd find another insurer. -- The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to minimize spam. Our true address is of the form . He tried a number of insurers, that was the only one that would write a policy. They were fine with everything but the electrical and at least they were willing to write a policy with that condition. Certainly the upgrade project was no big deal and not expensive. As it was an upgrade was on his agenda anyway to properly support the basement wood shop, it was just on a faster timetable due to the insurance issue. Pete C. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
Insurance safety and resale value.
whats the overall condition of the service entrance cable? fuses are regarded by home inspectors and insurance and mortage companies to be inferior to breakers, and there are no arc fault fuses for bedroom and other circuits. have any old K&T in your home? how many fuses do you have and how many for expansion? just a upgraded kitchen takes about 7 to meet current code with all the common appliances. Why do people think you paint every 7 years but assume wiring should last FOREVER? |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
I know insurance might make them do it, but personally I'd trust 55
year old fuses over 55 year old breakers. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
On 3 Jan 2007 05:26:52 -0800, wrote:
Can someone please enlighten me: I already have 100 amps and copper wire. The house is 55 years old. Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500) Thanks, Wilson imho: Contact your insurance company, you might find they charge you a little extra since you have fuses. Also check with your accountant if there are any rebate, or tax benifits to upgrading your homes equipment. Just some ideas..... tom @ www.Consolidated-Loans.info |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
Primarily because paint is exposed to the air and dirty hands of
kiddies, sunlight for UV fading, etc., etc., etc., and so suffers direct damage that needs repair. Wiring, otoh, sits there undisturbed in the dark doing nothing and has very little, if any, reason for needing renewing unless disturbed or other factors cause need for it. Main service entrance cables detoriate, fuse boxes rust, fuse blocks detoriate, stuff getws overloaded and often needd upgrades are put off. Lots of stuff like fridges and freezers should be on a dedicated breaker K&T in a 1950's-built house???? Aww, come off it. K&T went out at least 20 years before then... :( NOT in all areas of the country The questions of present service adequacy are ok, but unless there's expansion on the horizon or an existing indication of overloading, so what about expandability? It's not an issue until there is an issue. Same thing w/ insurance and/or resale. If no plans, no problem. His premiums undoubtedly will not be reduced if makes the change. had a friend whos insurance company got sold, new insurance company demanded he rebuild his porch and upgrade his wiring, and fix sidewalks and add handrails to steps. I think its better to keep up with troubles than wait and have a monumental bill at one inconvenient time |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
wrote:
On 3 Jan 2007 11:54:51 -0800, wrote: I know insurance might make them do it, but personally I'd trust 55 year old fuses over 55 year old breakers. That is the real point. Fuses are a whole lot safer than breakers, all else being equal. Fuses always fail "open". Breakers can fail shorted. Take a look at the CPSC articles on Federal Pacific. If you have a capacity problem and you are blowing fuses you may need better load balancing or an upgrade but if you are not blowing, properly sized fuses, I do not see the problem. I can't imagine any insurance company refusing insurance on a home with fuses and type S adapters (that prevent overfusing) since it is code legal in the NEC 2005 to install that panel in a new house today. In case you haven't noticed, insurance companies pay no attention to accepted codes and just make whatever arbitrary rules they want to, with no government agency stepping in to correct their overreaching. Pete C. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (andspend$1000-$1500)
CJT wrote:
wrote: Primarily because paint is exposed to the air and dirty hands of kiddies, sunlight for UV fading, etc., etc., etc., and so suffers direct damage that needs repair. Wiring, otoh, sits there undisturbed in the dark doing nothing and has very little, if any, reason for needing renewing unless disturbed or other factors cause need for it. Main service entrance cables detoriate, fuse boxes rust, fuse blocks detoriate, stuff getws overloaded and often needd upgrades are put off. Lots of stuff like fridges and freezers should be on a dedicated breaker snip Then why don't we see people here recommending changing breaker boxes after 20 years? -- The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to minimize spam. Our true address is of the form . I don't know, but I have personally read insurance documents noting higher premiums for electrical older than 30 years regardless of the type. Pete C. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
My insurance agent (allstate) is 200 miles away and has never seem my house. Where does this stuff come from? my friend will had his insurance company sold and the new company checked every home. currently a good friends main power line is in poor shape the cables out covering is falling apart from age and the head looks bad too. he is to cheap to replace it and upgrade.......... of course he has K&T wiring too/ just the other day he admitted his home is a wreck. it doesnt belong to him its tied up till his death in a 30 year estate thingy..... since it really belongsa to no one none want to spend money on repairs or upgrades. its a wierd situation |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
"CJT" wrote in message ... wrote: Can someone please enlighten me: I already have 100 amps and copper wire. The house is 55 years old. Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500) Thanks, Wilson Why do you THINK you should? I agree with the others -- if it ain't broken, don't fix it. Well, we have a 30 year old rental property with fuses. We are "fixing it up" because our tenant moved on after about 8 years. We didn't "upgrade" before because we were short of cash (we used our extra cash to get into a bigger house while keeping the old one as an investment.) But now we have the time and money. Why "upgrade?" Our fusebox was on the small size with 12 single pole circuits plus two pole circuits for the AC, stove, and clothes dryer. The two pole circuits have two cartridge fuses in a holder. The "upgrade" gets us: 1) MUCH better protection on the 240 volt circuits whereby a fault will completely clear the circuit rather than leaving it "half hot." In the 10 years we lived there we only blew a fuse on the 240 volts circuits once; it was from a loose wire inside the stove. 2) The potential to "un share" circuits as we can. Right now, for example, the dishwasher shares a circuit with a counter outlet (or two or ??). 3) The ability to add circuits. We want to put in an "over the oven" microwave. Without the upgrade we would have to "share" an existing circuit. 4) Too much on one circuit: the house was wired with one fuse controlling the "inner bath" lights AND the "sink outlet" AND the master bedroom ceiling AND the bedroom outlets. 5) NO spares. 6) Temptation to overfuse. Most of the wires I looked at (at the outlet/J-box) appear to be a lot of #14. The tenant doesn't have just 15 amp fuses in the box! 7) Occasional difficulty in restoring service after a fault. If you blow a cartridge fuse, it can be hard to get what you want. And you never seem to have the fuse you really want. The bonus is the extra features you can get. The GFCI capability has been mentioned. (Although I tend to prefer GFCIs on individual outlets.) The "arc fault" breaker seems to me to offer some safety advantages. I noted, however, that the kitchen counter GFCI seems to have been messed up by crumbs from the toaster (or something?). Anyway, it didn't trip on the test switch. (It didn't "Fail Safe.") But that's a different topic. Also, at least one make has provisions for a "dual feed" to the main bus whereby you have TWO "main" breakers. There is a mechanical interlock so that only one breaker can be "ON" at any time. Basically, you have a VERY high capacity transfer switch as part of your installation. Since my rental is "in town" that's not so important as power there is reliable. Among our "upgrades" will be the removal of the crappy "paneling" used in a basement remodel. The junk wasn't rated for below grade use and it SHOWED. I will have all the walls in the basement exposed before the electrician comes for the upgrade. It will almost be like "New Work." Often remodeling isn't cost effective. It's cheaper to sell you house and buy another with better "stuff" than to upgrade your own home. But beyond some point, the lack of upgrades will be such that no matter how well your home "shows," it's basically a "fixer upper." |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
when its time to SELL
you either take a really low price selling as is or are then forced to spend big bucks upgrading all the stuff you avoided spending money on. so you styill spend it and probably more since inflation keeps on driving up prices and sadly you still spend the money but get zip use of it, if your finally fioxing up to sell. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
dpb wrote: wrote: when its time to SELL you either take a really low price selling as is or are then forced to spend big bucks upgrading all the stuff you avoided spending money on. so you styill spend it and probably more since inflation keeps on driving up prices and sadly you still spend the money but get zip use of it, if your finally fioxing up to sell. That is a flawed logic over-generalization, too. The money not spent on something unneeded was available for investment (or even other discretionary use) for that period of time and very may well have brought an equivalent or even higher return in the market than the differential on the house. The point is, while there are valid reasons for upgrading service, "just because" isn't one of them. at home sale time fuses will be a big turn off, lack arc fault, and even if your home is otherwise perfect your sale price will likely be less |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
at home sale time fuses will be a big turn off, lack arc fault, and even if your home is otherwise perfect your sale price will likely be less I think that's questionable. The price shouldn't change by more than the cost of an upgrade, which shouldn't be all that large. You dont understand I recently sold a home about 90% of todays buyers want move in turn key homes with no issues. probably not true of most posters here, but we like home repairs. elminate 90% of shoppers makes selling a LOT HARDER do you really want fewer peoiple interested in your home ecause it appears obsolete? |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
wrote: dpb wrote: wrote: when its time to SELL you either take a really low price selling as is or are then forced to spend big bucks upgrading all the stuff you avoided spending money on. so you styill spend it and probably more since inflation keeps on driving up prices and sadly you still spend the money but get zip use of it, if your finally fioxing up to sell. That is a flawed logic over-generalization, too. The money not spent on something unneeded was available for investment (or even other discretionary use) for that period of time and very may well have brought an equivalent or even higher return in the market than the differential on the house. The point is, while there are valid reasons for upgrading service, "just because" isn't one of them. at home sale time fuses will be a big turn off, lack arc fault, and even if your home is otherwise perfect your sale price will likely be less Maybe, maybe not. Easy enough to rectify at the time if so. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
at home sale time fuses will be a big turn off, lack arc fault, and even if your home is otherwise perfect your sale price will likely be less Maybe, maybe not. Easy enough to rectify at the time if so. its really not a good idea to put off too much for time of sale you might not have the bucks needed to do all that needs done you might not have lots of time to do the upgrades its often easy to avoid fixing or upgrading stuff, but some day you have to pay the piper. odd people think nothing of buying a new car every 6 years at maybe 15 grand a shot but get all distraught about spending a grand upgrading their homes electrical system. heck atr ;least homes appreciate, vehicles just go down in value |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
HeyBub wrote:
wrote: odd people think nothing of buying a new car every 6 years at maybe 15 grand a shot but get all distraught about spending a grand upgrading their homes electrical system. heck atr ;least homes appreciate, vehicles just go down in value Question: How can you make it last an hour? Oh, wait, wrong question. Start over. Question: Where can you get a new car for $15,000? I think any of the Korean brands have some decent cars around that price. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
HeyBub wrote: wrote: odd people think nothing of buying a new car every 6 years at maybe 15 grand a shot but get all distraught about spending a grand upgrading their homes electrical system. heck atr ;least homes appreciate, vehicles just go down in value Question: How can you make it last an hour? Oh, wait, wrong question. Start over. Question: Where can you get a new car for $15,000? My wifes cobalt was under that but my real point is most folks buy and trade, so the actual lowball cost might be 15 grand a pop. like I said think of ALL the stuff you spend money on in a lifetime why should your homes electrical system be starved? it because its hidden and you cant see it...... if it was the focal point of your living room you wouldnt object to spending big bucks.... or sitting in your driveway, again its a display thing. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
wrote:
HeyBub wrote: wrote: odd people think nothing of buying a new car every 6 years at maybe 15 grand a shot but get all distraught about spending a grand upgrading their homes electrical system. heck atr ;least homes appreciate, vehicles just go down in value Question: How can you make it last an hour? Oh, wait, wrong question. Start over. Question: Where can you get a new car for $15,000? My wifes cobalt was under that but my real point is most folks buy and trade, so the actual lowball cost might be 15 grand a pop. like I said think of ALL the stuff you spend money on in a lifetime why should your homes electrical system be starved? it because its hidden and you cant see it...... if it was the focal point of your living room you wouldnt object to spending big bucks.... or sitting in your driveway, again its a display thing. Again I reiterate -- no, this is a false analogy. I have items in my living room I look at every day that are 100 years old and are not going to be replaced (in fact, for some of them, their inherent value is tied directly to both that age and would be almost completely destroyed if they were to be "upgraded" and/or modified. The point is that _UNLESS_ there is an actual reason other than "because" there are more cost-effective places to put the investment and most people recognize that. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
On Thu, 04 Jan 2007 22:53:42 -0600, Pete C. wrote:
HeyBub wrote: wrote: odd people think nothing of buying a new car every 6 years at maybe 15 grand a shot but get all distraught about spending a grand upgrading their homes electrical system. heck atr ;least homes appreciate, vehicles just go down in value Question: How can you make it last an hour? Oh, wait, wrong question. Start over. Question: Where can you get a new car for $15,000? I think any of the Korean brands have some decent cars around that price. The trick is to not crash a car every 6 months. If you have something worth trading in then it doesn't cost $30K/yr. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
well arc fault breakers can prevent fires..... is that not another reason to upgrade? safety? i know folks who buy new cars to get air bags and other safety equiptement. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
|
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend$1000-$1500)
dpb wrote:
wrote: well arc fault breakers can prevent fires..... is that not another reason to upgrade? safety? i know folks who buy new cars to get air bags and other safety equiptement. Possibly. What fraction of household electrical fires are fuse-panel-related/caused to begin with? What fraction would replacement of the fuse panel w/ a circuit breaker panel prevent? What fraction of those would a arc-fault breaker of those prevent that? How many fires have been caused by replacing fused panels with circuit breaker panels? I feel confident it has happened; all construction activities carry some risk of incidents either during or as a result of them. I don't have statistics, but I'd venture the relative risk of the automobile being involved in an accident is multiple times that of the fire risk that a replacement fuse panel would have prevented so the differential benefit is heavily weighted on the side of the car vis a vis the panel. -- The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to minimize spam. Our true address is of the form . |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
Contact your insurance company, you might find they charge you a little extra since you have fuses. Also check with your accountant if there are any rebate, or tax benifits to upgrading your homes equipment. I have NEVER had an insurance company ask about whether there were CBs or fuses. Perhaps if a company had some bad experience with fuses they might get particular but folks who can "live with" fuses don't tend to stress the power system in the first place. |
Why should I upgrade from fuses to circuit breakers? (and spend $1000-$1500)
John Gilmer wrote: Contact your insurance company, you might find they charge you a little extra since you have fuses. Also check with your accountant if there are any rebate, or tax benifits to upgrading your homes equipment. I have NEVER had an insurance company ask about whether there were CBs or fuses. Perhaps if a company had some bad experience with fuses they might get particular but folks who can "live with" fuses don't tend to stress the power system in the first place. Ahh google fuses and insurance. it tlks of insurance hassles mostly for new customers people with fuses do sress them, mostly by overfusing installing heavier uses than sae to minimize them blowing. just living stresses electrical systems, at the time fuses boxes were popualr we didnt have nearly so many electrical appliances, most entrances were 60 amp 4 fuses. heck today you need more than that just for the kitchen |
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:59 PM. |
|
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 DIYbanter