My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
I'm in a shared mortgage/home ownership situation where in the
relationship with the co-mortgager/co-owner has gone sour. She says she's going to buy me out, yet I know she has not the means to do this. I've had enough of what I consider to be this person's game playing, and I've decided to go forward with steps to force sale of the house if necessary, in order to free myself of this whole shared home mortgage/ownership 'mistake'. However, my copy of the mortgage agreement has mysteriously gone missing from my filing cabinet (which I never thought to lock, until now) while the co-mortgager/co-owner refuses have photocopied for me (let alone let me see), her copy of the mortgage agreement. When I went to the bank (which the mortgage is with) to ask for a replacement copy of the mortgage agreement, they promised they would get it to me the next day. Then they stalled and dragged their feet and it looked to me that they just weren't very motivated in getting this to me. (Note it just so happens that the co-mortgager/co-owner is on cozy terms with the senior loans officer at the bank.) Then after pressing them, they finally handed me a mere two page mortgage balance statement with the co-mortgager's and my signatures on it and tried to tell me that this was a complete photocopy of the original mortgage agreement. Not wanting to argue then and there, I took what they gave me and consulted with a real estate lawyer. The lawyer promptly informed me that the bank has no legal obligation to provide me with a replacement copy of my original mortgage agreement. When I asked him, "How then can I go about obtaining a copy of my original mortgage agreement?", he briefly mumblied something about "I'd start with the Land Title Office, see what happens, and then go from there...". Basically in a round about way he basically made it clear that he wasn't going to tell me exactly how to go about this just so I could then go about the process of getting it on my own. Unfortunately I don't have gobs and gobs of money just lying around to pay him thousands of dollars to run legal errands for me. As such, I'm in somewhat of a bind. Therefore I'm requesting here any info or guidance anyone might be willing and able to provide me, as to how I might go about securing a replacment copy of my mortgage agreement. Thanks in advance. Ken |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
"Ken" writes:
I'm in a shared mortgage/home ownership situation where in the relationship with the co-mortgager/co-owner has gone sour. She says she's going to buy me out, yet I know she has not the means to do this. I've had enough of what I consider to be this person's game playing, and I've decided to go forward with steps to force sale of the house if necessary, in order to free myself of this whole shared home mortgage/ownership 'mistake'. However, my copy of the mortgage agreement has mysteriously gone missing from my filing cabinet (which I never thought to lock, until now) while the co-mortgager/co-owner refuses have photocopied for me (let alone let me see), her copy of the mortgage agreement. When I went to the bank (which the mortgage is with) to ask for a replacement copy of the mortgage agreement, they promised they would get it to me the next day. Then they stalled and dragged their feet and it looked to me that they just weren't very motivated in getting this to me. (Note it just so happens that the co-mortgager/co-owner is on cozy terms with the senior loans officer at the bank.) Then after pressing them, they finally handed me a mere two page mortgage balance statement with the co-mortgager's and my signatures on it and tried to tell me that this was a complete photocopy of the original mortgage agreement. Not wanting to argue then and there, I took what they gave me and consulted with a real estate lawyer. The lawyer promptly informed me that the bank has no legal obligation to provide me with a replacement copy of my original mortgage agreement. When I asked him, "How then can I go about obtaining a copy of my original mortgage agreement?", he briefly mumblied something about "I'd start with the Land Title Office, see what happens, and then go from there...". Basically in a round about way he basically made it clear that he wasn't going to tell me exactly how to go about this just so I could then go about the process of getting it on my own. Unfortunately I don't have gobs and gobs of money just lying around to pay him thousands of dollars to run legal errands for me. Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, then that's where to go. Or you could tell the president of the bank what's going on and how the senior loadn officers aren't providing you information you need and you're not sure if you can keep repaying the loan without it. Or you could tell you ex that you need a copy of the agreement or you'll have to suspend payment and have a nice friggin life. You'll have to be prepared to take a credit rating hit if she decides to join you in non-payment. Here in the US at least, the mortgage which documents the bank's lien against the property and their right to foreclose on it in case of loan default, is a separate document from the Note which outlines the terms of the loan repayment, payments, due dates, parties owning against the loan. The Note typically isn't a matter of recorded public record and would be something you'd need to get from the bank anyway. -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/ |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
On Apr 13, 7:21 am, (Todd H.) wrote:
"Ken" writes: I'm in a shared mortgage/home ownership situation where in the relationship with the co-mortgager/co-owner has gone sour. She says she's going to buy me out, yet I know she has not the means to do this. I've had enough of what I consider to be this person's game playing, and I've decided to go forward with steps to force sale of the house if necessary, in order to free myself of this whole shared home mortgage/ownership 'mistake'. However, my copy of the mortgage agreement has mysteriously gone missing from my filing cabinet (which I never thought to lock, until now) while the co-mortgager/co-owner refuses have photocopied for me (let alone let me see), her copy of the mortgage agreement. When I went to the bank (which the mortgage is with) to ask for a replacement copy of the mortgage agreement, they promised they would get it to me the next day. Then they stalled and dragged their feet and it looked to me that they just weren't very motivated in getting this to me. (Note it just so happens that the co-mortgager/co-owner is on cozy terms with the senior loans officer at the bank.) Then after pressing them, they finally handed me a mere two page mortgage balance statement with the co-mortgager's and my signatures on it and tried to tell me that this was a complete photocopy of the original mortgage agreement. Not wanting to argue then and there, I took what they gave me and consulted with a real estate lawyer. The lawyer promptly informed me that the bank has no legal obligation to provide me with a replacement copy of my original mortgage agreement. When I asked him, "How then can I go about obtaining a copy of my original mortgage agreement?", he briefly mumblied something about "I'd start with the Land Title Office, see what happens, and then go from there...". Basically in a round about way he basically made it clear that he wasn't going to tell me exactly how to go about this just so I could then go about the process of getting it on my own. Unfortunately I don't have gobs and gobs of money just lying around to pay him thousands of dollars to run legal errands for me. Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, then that's where to go. Or you could tell the president of the bank what's going on and how the senior loadn officers aren't providing you information you need and you're not sure if you can keep repaying the loan without it. Or you could tell you ex that you need a copy of the agreement or you'll have to suspend payment and have a nice friggin life. You'll have to be prepared to take a credit rating hit if she decides to join you in non-payment. Here in the US at least, the mortgage which documents the bank's lien against the property and their right to foreclose on it in case of loan default, is a separate document from the Note which outlines the terms of the loan repayment, payments, due dates, parties owning against the loan. The Note typically isn't a matter of recorded public record and would be something you'd need to get from the bank anyway. -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - That's what I was thinking too. I think here in NJ what's recorded at the Hall of Records or similar is the existence of the mortgage lien on the property and basic information, not the entire loan document. But I have to wonder, why the big panic over the loan document itself? The most important things to know are the balance and if there is any penalty or fees for early pay off. You already know the balance and the fact that both your signatures are on the document, making you both responsible for the debt. If you really want the actual full document, then I'd go back to the bank and continue to press them. Surely, somewhere, they have the full document. They may charge you to retrieve it though. Before you go the forced sale route, I'd do everything possible to get it resolved reasonably. If they won't agree to that directly, then I'd try to get them into mediation, which might be a face saving alternative for them. If you go the forced sale route, it'd going to be more costly for both of you. |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
wrote in message oups.com... [...] But I have to wonder, why the big panic over the loan document itself? The most important things to know are the balance and if there is any penalty or fees for early pay off. You already know the balance and the fact that both your signatures are on the document, making you both responsible for the debt. Well this is where my ignorance must be showing I guess, but it seems to me that when I signed the mortgage agreement I signed a legal contract, complete with clauses, conditions, and other fine print. My co-mortgager was the go getter in all of this while I was kind of just passively going along. There may very well be stuff in there that I need to be aware of in order to proceed without finding myself confronted with some unpleasant surprises. She seems pretty smug these days, giving me the impression that she's received counsel and she has something up her sleeve I'm just not aware of. Plus the fact that my copy of the mortgage agreement has gone missing from my filing cabinet, with no likely explanation other than that somebody purposely removed it, has me quite eager to get my copy back into my own hands so I can study it, asap. If you really want the actual full document, then I'd go back to the bank and continue to press them. Surely, somewhere, they have the full document. They may charge you to retrieve it though. I wouldn't expect to not be charged something for it. But being that they (like my co-mortgager) know I happen to be in the midst of a cash crunch these days, I just hope they don't try to make it hard for me by inflating their rate. g [If I being a tad paranoid here, it's only 'cause I sooo don't want to get blind-sided or taken advantage of in some way (as has occurred in the recent past to do with this individual) in this matter.] Before you go the forced sale route, I'd do everything possible to get it resolved reasonably. If they won't agree to that directly, then I'd try to get them into mediation, which might be a face saving alternative for them. If you go the forced sale route, it'd going to be more costly for both of you. Yes, mediation is something I thought of and even suggested. But with this individual, she just will not cooperate unless and until it is somehow made overwhelmingly and painfully self-evident to her to be in her self interest to do so. To oversimplify a long story, she's a power tripper. As such she is blinded to 'seeing the forest for the trees'. At this point I see no hope of anyone or anything pursuading her to be reasonable; until after the fact, which of course, will then be only too late to do her (and me) any good in this matter. Ken On Apr 13, 7:21 am, (Todd H.) wrote: Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, then that's where to go. Or you could tell the president of the bank what's going on and how the senior loadn officers aren't providing you information you need and you're not sure if you can keep repaying the loan without it. Or you could tell you ex that you need a copy of the agreement or you'll have to suspend payment and have a nice friggin life. You'll have to be prepared to take a credit rating hit if she decides to join you in non-payment. Here in the US at least, the mortgage which documents the bank's lien against the property and their right to foreclose on it in case of loan default, is a separate document from the Note which outlines the terms of the loan repayment, payments, due dates, parties owning against the loan. The Note typically isn't a matter of recorded public record and would be something you'd need to get from the bank anyway. -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/- Hide quoted text - "Ken" writes: I'm in a shared mortgage/home ownership situation where in the relationship with the co-mortgager/co-owner has gone sour. She says she's going to buy me out, yet I know she has not the means to do this. I've had enough of what I consider to be this person's game playing, and I've decided to go forward with steps to force sale of the house if necessary, in order to free myself of this whole shared home mortgage/ownership 'mistake'. However, my copy of the mortgage agreement has mysteriously gone missing from my filing cabinet (which I never thought to lock, until now) while the co-mortgager/co-owner refuses have photocopied for me (let alone let me see), her copy of the mortgage agreement. When I went to the bank (which the mortgage is with) to ask for a replacement copy of the mortgage agreement, they promised they would get it to me the next day. Then they stalled and dragged their feet and it looked to me that they just weren't very motivated in getting this to me. (Note it just so happens that the co-mortgager/co-owner is on cozy terms with the senior loans officer at the bank.) Then after pressing them, they finally handed me a mere two page mortgage balance statement with the co-mortgager's and my signatures on it and tried to tell me that this was a complete photocopy of the original mortgage agreement. Not wanting to argue then and there, I took what they gave me and consulted with a real estate lawyer. The lawyer promptly informed me that the bank has no legal obligation to provide me with a replacement copy of my original mortgage agreement. When I asked him, "How then can I go about obtaining a copy of my original mortgage agreement?", he briefly mumblied something about "I'd start with the Land Title Office, see what happens, and then go from there...". Basically in a round about way he basically made it clear that he wasn't going to tell me exactly how to go about this just so I could then go about the process of getting it on my own. Unfortunately I don't have gobs and gobs of money just lying around to pay him thousands of dollars to run legal errands for me. |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
"Todd H." wrote in message ... Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, Well, this is what it is I'm trying to find out. (FYI, I forgot to mention, I'm in B.C, Canada.) then that's where to go. Or you could tell the president of the bank what's going on and how the senior loadn officers aren't providing you information you need and you're not sure if you can keep repaying the loan without it. Or you could tell you ex that you need a copy of the agreement or you'll have to suspend payment and have a nice friggin life. You'll have to be prepared to take a credit rating hit if she decides to join you in non-payment. Well this person I'm Here in the US at least, the mortgage which documents the bank's lien against the property and their right to foreclose on it in case of loan default, is a separate document from the Note which outlines the terms of the loan repayment, payments, due dates, parties owning against the loan. The Note typically isn't a matter of recorded public record and would be something you'd need to get from the bank anyway. Yes, now that you mention it, the idea of the Land Title Office, a public records repository, holding a copy of one's mortgage agreement wouldn't seem to make a lot of sense, would it. I have been planning on going back to the bank to insist they give me what they've so far evaded providing. But I have to bear in mind what that lawyer told me, in that the bank DOES NOT HAVE TO give me a replacement copy of my mortgage agreement. Such would be completely voluntary on their part. So I have to press for what I want without being perceived as any way objectionable or annoying in any way. So this time I will ask to see the most senior loans officer (the one that I sense my co-mortgager is 'cozy' with...). However, in case I continue to get the run around yet again, I first want to get as many of my "ducks in order" as possible. Maybe if I can go in there armed with more knowledge and awareness pertinent to what I'm requesting, they won't feel quite so at liberty to underestimate and insult my intelligence this time. Ken -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/ "Ken" writes: I'm in a shared mortgage/home ownership situation where in the relationship with the co-mortgager/co-owner has gone sour. She says she's going to buy me out, yet I know she has not the means to do this. I've had enough of what I consider to be this person's game playing, and I've decided to go forward with steps to force sale of the house if necessary, in order to free myself of this whole shared home mortgage/ownership 'mistake'. However, my copy of the mortgage agreement has mysteriously gone missing from my filing cabinet (which I never thought to lock, until now) while the co-mortgager/co-owner refuses have photocopied for me (let alone let me see), her copy of the mortgage agreement. When I went to the bank (which the mortgage is with) to ask for a replacement copy of the mortgage agreement, they promised they would get it to me the next day. Then they stalled and dragged their feet and it looked to me that they just weren't very motivated in getting this to me. (Note it just so happens that the co-mortgager/co-owner is on cozy terms with the senior loans officer at the bank.) Then after pressing them, they finally handed me a mere two page mortgage balance statement with the co-mortgager's and my signatures on it and tried to tell me that this was a complete photocopy of the original mortgage agreement. Not wanting to argue then and there, I took what they gave me and consulted with a real estate lawyer. The lawyer promptly informed me that the bank has no legal obligation to provide me with a replacement copy of my original mortgage agreement. When I asked him, "How then can I go about obtaining a copy of my original mortgage agreement?", he briefly mumblied something about "I'd start with the Land Title Office, see what happens, and then go from there...". Basically in a round about way he basically made it clear that he wasn't going to tell me exactly how to go about this just so I could then go about the process of getting it on my own. Unfortunately I don't have gobs and gobs of money just lying around to pay him thousands of dollars to run legal errands for me. |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
"Ken Moiarty" writes:
"Todd H." wrote in message ... Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, Well, this is what it is I'm trying to find out. (FYI, I forgot to mention, I'm in B.C, Canada.) Here's a group that might tell you your rights to a copy of your agreement: http://www.fcac-acfc.gc.ca/eng/default.asp THese folks in BC may be able to tell you more or be a place to lodge a complaint against the professional conduct of a mortgage lender, asking for the Ministry of Finance: http://www.gov.bc.ca/bvprd/bc/channe...hannelID=-8353 Or, http://www.fic.gov.bc.ca/responsibil...e/overview.htm Or submit a complaint against the institution directly. Banks really hate it when their regulators contact them about such issues. http://www.fic.gov.bc.ca/Complaintfo...ries_form.aspx Be succcinct and simply indicate your desire for a copy of your mortgage agreement because it has been lost and that your lender has not been cooperative in providing you a copy of your full mortgage agreement. Leave all the drama out of it. Good luck! -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/ |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
Good stuff. Thanks.
Ken -- ---------------------------------------------------- This mailbox protected from junk email by MailFrontier Desktop from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com "Todd H." wrote in message ... "Ken Moiarty" writes: "Todd H." wrote in message ... Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, Well, this is what it is I'm trying to find out. (FYI, I forgot to mention, I'm in B.C, Canada.) Here's a group that might tell you your rights to a copy of your agreement: http://www.fcac-acfc.gc.ca/eng/default.asp THese folks in BC may be able to tell you more or be a place to lodge a complaint against the professional conduct of a mortgage lender, asking for the Ministry of Finance: http://www.gov.bc.ca/bvprd/bc/channe...hannelID=-8353 Or, http://www.fic.gov.bc.ca/responsibil...e/overview.htm Or submit a complaint against the institution directly. Banks really hate it when their regulators contact them about such issues. http://www.fic.gov.bc.ca/Complaintfo...ries_form.aspx Be succcinct and simply indicate your desire for a copy of your mortgage agreement because it has been lost and that your lender has not been cooperative in providing you a copy of your full mortgage agreement. Leave all the drama out of it. Good luck! -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/ |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
On Apr 13, 10:18 pm, "Ken Moiarty" wrote:
Good stuff. Thanks. Ken -- ---------------------------------------------------- This mailbox protected from junk email by MailFrontier Desktop from MailFrontier, Inc.http://info.mailfrontier.com "Todd H." wrote in ... "Ken Moiarty" writes: "Todd H." wrote in ... Sounds like a ****ty situation. Sorry to hear it! If the Land Title Office is where they record mortgages as a matter of public record, Well, this is what it is I'm trying to find out. (FYI, I forgot to mention, I'm in B.C, Canada.) Here's a group that might tell you your rights to a copy of your agreement: http://www.fcac-acfc.gc.ca/eng/default.asp THese folks in BC may be able to tell you more or be a place to lodge a complaint against the professional conduct of a mortgage lender, asking for the Ministry of Finance: http://www.gov.bc.ca/bvprd/bc/channe...hannelID=-8353 Or, http://www.fic.gov.bc.ca/responsibil...e/overview.htm Or submit a complaint against the institution directly. Banks really hate it when their regulators contact them about such issues. http://www.fic.gov.bc.ca/Complaintfo...ries_form.aspx Be succcinct and simply indicate your desire for a copy of your mortgage agreement because it has been lost and that your lender has not been cooperative in providing you a copy of your full mortgage agreement. Leave all the drama out of it. Good luck! -- Todd H. http://toddh.net/- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - One more suggestion, but this might be most important of all. Get a new lawyer. The lawyer is likely correct on the law. Barring some special banking consumer rights law or similar, I wouldn't think the bank would have to give you a copy. However, virtually all would just as a matter of reasonable fairness. But, are you paying this lawyer to give you rulings on law favorable to the other party, or are you paying him to solve YOUR problem? If the guy was any decent lawyer, he would have written a short 2 minute letter to the bank telling them he is representing you on a legal matter and he needs a copy of the document. And I agree, you should get the mortgage to be absolutely sure of what it says. But, in my experience, it would be very unusual for a mortgage with both parties signatures to treat one differently than the other. The bank wants to be able to go after either one of you equally to recover the loan. Doing anything other than that would change the std documents, make in non-conforming and create quite a headache for the lender, so they wouldn't do it on a simple home mortgage. |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
On Fri, 13 Apr 2007 19:32:14 -0700, someone wrote:
.....But with this individual, she just will not cooperate unless and until it is somehow made overwhelmingly and painfully self-evident to her to be in her self interest to do so.... You sound like a pathetic ****ing whiner to me. And you "top post" too, so there. What kind of mysterious clauses do you think you are gong to find? You acknowledge that you signed it (so are on the hook for the debt) and you should easily be able to find out the balance. So what's the mystery? Reply to NG only - this e.mail address goes to a kill file. |
My Copy of Mortgage has gone missing: How/where do I get a new copy of the original?
On 14 Apr 2007 07:27:30 -0700, someone wrote:
.....But, are you paying this lawyer to give you rulings on law favorable to the other party, or are you paying him to solve YOUR problem? Or, is he paying the lawyer at all, or just some whiner calling up trying to get free advice???? Reply to NG only - this e.mail address goes to a kill file. |
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