Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

Typically coils last alot longer then that.
Call another tech.

Sally wrote:
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

Typically coils last alot longer then that.
Call another tech.

Sally wrote:
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 01:40:06 GMT, "Sally" wrote:

Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.


He's bending you over, bigtime. Don't let him in the house.


--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
Free demo now available online http://pmilligan.net/palm/

Dear Sally,
I suggest another opinion from a different company. Frozen coil
could be one of several problems. Including dirty filter, low air
flow, low on freon, or some other causes. But at this point, I'd
wonder if the coil really needed replacing. Maybe, but not sure yet.
Can't see the application from here, but 1800 sounds high priced.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Sally" wrote in message
news:W1bCg.17759$Qu4.8953@trnddc04...
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago
and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be
expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it
true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but
then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight
because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning.
I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

Sally wrote:
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

The coil is frozen? As in "full of ice"?
There's nothing wrong with the coil--it's chilling just fine.
Air flow maybe? Clogged filters? The coil itself is just dirty?

I"d get a second opinion for that kind of money, especially when his
comments don't add up. Even if he's right, he owes you an explanation.
Take notes, and ask around.

Also for what it's worth, if the unit is 9 years old, it's likely not
nearly as efficient as something you could invest in today. If you run
it a lot, getting a higher SEER rating could pay you back in a few
years.

wrote

The coil is frozen? As in "full of ice"?
There's nothing wrong with the coil--it's chilling just fine.


Maybe not.
I had one yesterday. Frozen solid.
Nine year old Carrier coil with a leak and severe corrosoin.
I'm replacing it tomorrow.


--
Respectfully, Bob

Sally wrote:

Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years.

Don't let my 20 year old unit hear that.

I know that A/C repairs tend to be expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.




--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form .

"Sally" wrote in message
news:W1bCg.17759$Qu4.8953@trnddc04...
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little
while ago and said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and
that coils typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to
be expensive, but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48)
and is it true that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long
to me, but then I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the
work tonight because the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back
tomorrow morning. I'd appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things
can give me their opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

Post some pics of your tits!

CJT wrote:

Sally wrote:

Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years.



Don't let my 20 year old unit hear that.


Mine was almost 30 yrs old when it gave up - and the complete
replacement cost only $1100 (2 ton).

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 03:15:54 GMT, "Bob (but not THAT Bob)"
wrote:

CJT wrote:

Sally wrote:

Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years.



Don't let my 20 year old unit hear that.


Mine was almost 30 yrs old when it gave up -

They have pills for that now, you know .....



and the complete
replacement cost only $1100 (2 ton).

--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
Free demo now available online http://pmilligan.net/palm/

First of all, I'd like to thank everyone for their feedback and would
welcome any additional thoughts / opinions.

Regarding the ice, all I saw was a ball of it around some kind of hose
coming out of the compressor (?). Despite having an appointment for 2:30, he
didn't arrive here until 8:00 in the evening so it's possible that the ice
wasn't the real reason he wanted to wait until tomorrow. That's just as
well, though, since this has given me time to ask you folks for your
opinions, for which I'm grateful.

I should add that he didn't say that the coil definitely needed to be
replaced -- he simply listed that as one of the possibilites. He did mention
other possibilities such as the coil simply being dirty or having a minor
leak that could be fixed relatively cheaply. The part that concerned me was
his claim that coils normally only last 5-7 years, although the consensus
here seems to be that that's not true.

They only last 5-7 years when they were incorrectly installed in the first
place. And without seeing the installation, there is no way I can even guess
as to what a reasonable cost is.

"Sally" wrote in message
news:W1bCg.17759$Qu4.8953@trnddc04...
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little
while ago and said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and
that coils typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to
be expensive, but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48)
and is it true that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long
to me, but then I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the
work tonight because the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back
tomorrow morning. I'd appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things
can give me their opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 05:46:42 GMT, wrote:

"Sally" wrote:

First of all, I'd like to thank everyone for their feedback and would
welcome any additional thoughts / opinions.

Regarding the ice, all I saw was a ball of it around some kind of hose
coming out of the compressor (?). Despite having an appointment for 2:30, he
didn't arrive here until 8:00 in the evening so it's possible that the ice
wasn't the real reason he wanted to wait until tomorrow. That's just as
well, though, since this has given me time to ask you folks for your
opinions, for which I'm grateful.

I should add that he didn't say that the coil definitely needed to be
replaced -- he simply listed that as one of the possibilites. He did mention
other possibilities such as the coil simply being dirty or having a minor
leak that could be fixed relatively cheaply. The part that concerned me was
his claim that coils normally only last 5-7 years, although the consensus
here seems to be that that's not true.


Sally I typically work on commercial and residential ac systems up to
30 years old that have never leaked a measuarable amount of freon.

He works mainly on ammonia systems :-)

( sorry, couldn't resist )




Ask your friends and neighbors how often they replace their coils.

--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
Free demo now available online http://pmilligan.net/palm/

Sally writes:

A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years.

The part will cost him about $300.

The labor will likely take less than a full day.

The AC trade considers $1500/day profit reasonable. They whine about how
much it costs to run a pickup truck and pay some high-school graduate ...
as if you didn't need transportation to get to your $20/hour job.

This is what you get by allowing politicians to license tradesmen and
legalize the restraint of trade.

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 04:02:28 -0500, Richard J Kinch
wrote:

Sally writes:

A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years.

The part will cost him about $300.

The labor will likely take less than a full day.

The AC trade considers $1500/day profit reasonable. They whine about how
much it costs to run a pickup truck and pay some high-school graduate ...
as if you didn't need transportation to get to your $20/hour job.

This is what you get by allowing politicians to license tradesmen and
legalize the restraint of trade.

Poor Richard. It sounds like you got ****ed real hard by a serviceman
because you were too stupid to change your own dirty filter. Life must
suck to be you.

Sally, I have seen many many many coils now lasting only 2, 3 , 5
years and then leaking. Sad but true. Ive replaced 3 so far this week.
If your system is 30 years old you probably dont know what a leaky
coil is. The older ones were made differently. Check out the weight of
the older ones versus the new ones and you will understand. Your coil
could very well be leaking. It could also be several other things.
Electronic leak checking just isnt hard. If you dont like the opinion
you got, get another.
Now, how about posting that pic of your tits.
Bubba

Sally wrote:
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a
little while ago and said that the coil may need to be replaced (for
$1,800) and that coils typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C
repairs tend to be expensive, but is that a reasonable price (the
unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it true that coils only last 5-7
years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but then I don't know much
about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight because the coil
was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning. I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me
their opinion based on what I described.
Thanks in advance.

He really means he can't sell new coils to someone if they are more than
5-7 years old. He is only looking at his income not your cool.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

"Sally" wrote




The part
that concerned me was his claim that coils normally only last 5-7
years, although the consensus here seems to be that that's not true.


They SHOULD last 20 years, but do they always?
No.
Carrier had a rash of bad coils in the 90's. I'm replacing one today, only
9 years old.
Your tech should be able to narrow things down for you as to roughly, if
not specifically, where the leak is.
He should be able to ascertain whether or not the coil is dirty by
measuring the air flow across it.
As for the cost to replace it, it's fairly labour intensive if done
correctly, and coils aren't cheap.
Go with someone you trust, not necessarily the cheapest guy.
--
Respectfully, Bob

Paul, you're slipping. (read on near the bottom)

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 01:40:06 GMT, "Sally" wrote:

Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner
has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to be
expensive,
but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48) and is it
true
that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long to me, but
then
I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the work tonight
because
the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back tomorrow morning.
I'd
appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things can give me their
opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.


He's bending you over, bigtime. Don't let him in the house.


1) You didn't yell about crossposting.
2) You were almost polite.

Is something wrong?

--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
Free demo now available online http://pmilligan.net/palm/

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 13:38:22 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:



Sally, I have seen many many many coils now lasting only 2, 3 , 5
years and then leaking. Sad but true. Ive replaced 3 so far this week.

and of the three you've replaced, were they of the cheaper
constructed, thinner variety that typically last 2, 3 or 5 years?

besides lining your pockets with cash, are you solving the problem?

replacing leaky coils with other potentially leaky coils isnt the
answer, however it does provide us with job security..... :-))

Okay "fish". I'll bite.
YES, the ones Ive replaced are the newer ****. In particular, Lennox,
Goodman and Carrier this past week. None newer than 6 yrs old.
Am I solving a problem you ask? I am solving the customers problem at
present. Can I solve the manufacturers problem of making a coil that
last longer? Hell No. I wont even try. I install what's available. I
dont make the ****. I just sell and install it.
Soooooo, that being said, What are you doing? Manufacturing your own
coils?
Installing a contrapction that auto feeds refrigerant to a leaky coil?
Holding the customers handkerchief while they sob controllably to you?
I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and doesnt
line your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

Bubba wrote:

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 13:38:22 GMT, wrote:


Bubba wrote:



Sally, I have seen many many many coils now lasting only 2, 3 , 5
years and then leaking. Sad but true. Ive replaced 3 so far this week.

and of the three you've replaced, were they of the cheaper
constructed, thinner variety that typically last 2, 3 or 5 years?

besides lining your pockets with cash, are you solving the problem?

replacing leaky coils with other potentially leaky coils isnt the
answer, however it does provide us with job security..... :-))


Okay "fish". I'll bite.
YES, the ones Ive replaced are the newer ****. In particular, Lennox,
Goodman and Carrier this past week. None newer than 6 yrs old.
Am I solving a problem you ask? I am solving the customers problem at
present. Can I solve the manufacturers problem of making a coil that
last longer? Hell No. I wont even try. I install what's available. I
dont make the ****. I just sell and install it.
Soooooo, that being said, What are you doing? Manufacturing your own
coils?
Installing a contrapction that auto feeds refrigerant to a leaky coil?
Holding the customers handkerchief while they sob controllably to you?
I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and doesnt
line your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

If they're all cr*p, the cheapest one wins.

--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form .

hi sally,
i recently went on a call to give a second opinion on an evap coil
replacement. the tenant was getting water on the floor and the last service
company told them the drain pan was rusted through and it would be $1200 to
replace it. it ended up that the PLASTIC drain pan wasnt rusted at
all.......the drain line was plugged and a $10 shot of nitrogen (plus the
cost of the service call - $70) fixed it right up. know your service
company.

--
Nathan W. Collier
http://UtilityOffRoad.com
http://7SlotGrille.com
http://InlineDiesel.com
http://BighornRefrigeration.com
http://ConcealedCarryForum.com
http://1911Carry.com
http://GlockCarry.com


"Sally" wrote in message
news:W1bCg.17759$Qu4.8953@trnddc04...
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a little
while ago and said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and
that coils typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs tend to
be expensive, but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox 10AB48)
and is it true that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem very long
to me, but then I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do the
work tonight because the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come back
tomorrow morning. I'd appreciate it if anyone who knows about these things
can give me their opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

The supplier with the cheapest junk wins? Sounds like Made in China
rules the game.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"CJT" wrote in message
...

If they're all cr*p, the cheapest one wins.

--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form .

You think Milligan has been doing double shots of nitrogen? With a
carbon dioxide chaser?

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Nathan W. Collier" wrote in message
...
hi sally,
i recently went on a call to give a second opinion on an evap coil
replacement. the tenant was getting water on the floor and the last
service
company told them the drain pan was rusted through and it would be
$1200 to
replace it. it ended up that the PLASTIC drain pan wasnt rusted at
all.......the drain line was plugged and a $10 shot of nitrogen (plus
the
cost of the service call - $70) fixed it right up. know your service
company.

--
Nathan W. Collier
http://UtilityOffRoad.com
http://7SlotGrille.com
http://InlineDiesel.com
http://BighornRefrigeration.com
http://ConcealedCarryForum.com
http://1911Carry.com
http://GlockCarry.com


"Sally" wrote in message
news:W1bCg.17759$Qu4.8953@trnddc04...
Hi,

I moved into this (new) house just under 9 years ago and the air
conditioner has stopped blowing cold air. A repairman came out a
little
while ago and said that the coil may need to be replaced (for
$1,800) and
that coils typically only last 5-7 years. I know that A/C repairs
tend to
be expensive, but is that a reasonable price (the unit is a Lennox
10AB48)
and is it true that coils only last 5-7 years? That doesn't seem
very long
to me, but then I don't know much about it. Anyway, he couldn't do
the
work tonight because the coil was frozen (?) but is planning to come
back
tomorrow morning. I'd appreciate it if anyone who knows about these
things
can give me their opinion based on what I described.

Thanks in advance.

Bob_Loblaw wrote:
wrote

The coil is frozen? As in "full of ice"?
There's nothing wrong with the coil--it's chilling just fine.


Maybe not.
I had one yesterday. Frozen solid.
Nine year old Carrier coil with a leak and severe corrosoin.
I'm replacing it tomorrow.


--
Respectfully, Bob

OK, I'll have to trust you on that one. But if it's leaking
refrigerant, how can it be working well enough to ice up? Maybe the
leak is real new and most refrigerant is still in there? My admittedly
limited knowledge would indicate that if the system is leaking
refrigerant it will burn up compressors, not ice up coils.

Also, the OP said the ice was in a ball on one of the pipe connections.
That makes sense--I see it a lot in systems at work. The moisture
condenses there where it is very cold, not much air blows across to
melt the ice, and the ball forms. I expect that this would be
independent of any leakage. It would also indicate that some
insulation might be in order.

But if it's leaking
refrigerant, how can it be working well enough to ice up?

Oddly, a low charge makes it run colder and ice up:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...20eda678cc180f

Don't confuse temperature with heat. The fact that part of your evaporator
is below freezing temperature doesn't mean that it is moving much heat.

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 03:42:35 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:


Okay "fish". I'll bite.

bad news dood...you just munched on my **** filled twinkie
:-)

I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and
lines your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

your wish is my command

until you've tried it yourself, you dont have a leg to stand on.
so dont even try. http://www.cliplight.com/hvacr/

coil changeouts can be problematic, and not huge profit centers
way too much labor

drop this stuff in at 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new coil and viola!
problem solved, happy campers, and you with serious coin.

you'd crap your pants if i told you how much i charge for this stuff,
installed.


So what do you charge after you drop a can of this stuff in a system
and it clogs up a txv, or flowrater, or cap tube?

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 03:42:35 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:


Okay "fish". I'll bite.

bad news dood...you just munched on my **** filled twinkie
:-)

I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and
lines your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

your wish is my command

until you've tried it yourself, you dont have a leg to stand on.
so dont even try. http://www.cliplight.com/hvacr/

coil changeouts can be problematic, and not huge profit centers
way too much labor

drop this stuff in at 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new coil and viola!
problem solved, happy campers, and you with serious coin.

you'd crap your pants if i told you how much i charge for this stuff,
installed.

So you're pumping "smoke and mirror" crap into a system and charging
$600 for a can that cost you $40.
You've just proved yourself the worst of all theives. I'll stick with
replacing the coils. You can stick with looking over your shoulder for
that one customer that catches on to what you're doing and chases you
down with a gun.
Have a nice life, fish.
Bubba

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 03:42:35 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:


Okay "fish". I'll bite.

bad news dood...you just munched on my **** filled twinkie
:-)

I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and
lines your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

your wish is my command

until you've tried it yourself, you dont have a leg to stand on.
so dont even try. http://www.cliplight.com/hvacr/

coil changeouts can be problematic, and not huge profit centers
way too much labor

drop this stuff in at 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new coil and viola!
problem solved, happy campers, and you with serious coin.

you'd crap your pants if i told you how much i charge for this stuff,
installed.

and further more fish, I just gotta ask...................
What does your customer say when you show them that little can and
tell them you are going to charge them $400 - $600 to install it in 5
mins?
What? You dont show them the can? What? You make up some story about
what you are going to do that will cost half the price of a new coil
and work just as well?
Shame on you fish. I'll bet you have those old folks lined up waiting
for you to come over and **** em hard!
Nothing wrong with it if you are explaining that it is new/newer and
there isnt any long term studies on it yet and you are charging a
reasonable price but I dont think you are doing any of that.
Okay, Im done. I could go on forever but you live in your little world
and I'll stay in mine. I like to sleep well at night.
Bubba

I would play it safe and get another opinion. My a/c is still running
after 15 years and it was not top of the line.....nothing has been
replaced. It's checked yearly...

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 14:45:27 GMT, wrote:

Al Moran wrote:

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 03:42:35 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:


Okay "fish". I'll bite.

bad news dood...you just munched on my **** filled twinkie
:-)

I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and
lines your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

your wish is my command

until you've tried it yourself, you dont have a leg to stand on.
so dont even try. http://www.cliplight.com/hvacr/

coil changeouts can be problematic, and not huge profit centers
way too much labor

drop this stuff in at 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new coil and viola!
problem solved, happy campers, and you with serious coin.

you'd crap your pants if i told you how much i charge for this stuff,
installed.


So what do you charge after you drop a can of this stuff in a system
and it clogs up a txv, or flowrater, or cap tube?


If ya did your homework, you would have discovered the fact that this
product solidifies ONLY as it leaks thru an opening and is exposed to
AIR. It mixes with refrigerant OIL, and goes wherever that oil
goes.

Hell yes, I've seen evap coils with oil-vapor locked feeder tubes, but
the addition of a suction P-trap eliminated those situations....

Actually I did do the homework. Took the test. Read all the info
(actually a couple weeks ago) and then even found my local supplier
has it. They have a box of them there at the counter. Dont believe one
can has been sold in a couple weeks yet.
To me, it seems as though it acts as a glue when it finds a leak.
Something like epoxy or maybe? To me, that isnt a fix for a leak.
Copper leaks need to be brazed and Im not brazing a bunch of
microscopic formicary corrosion leaks.
Im just going to leave it as..........
Im not sold yet. Maybe its a good product but I'll wait till the
verdict comes in.
I guess I might add one thing further. You say its great. You also
imply that anyone installing a new coil knows its going to leak well
before its time (I believe that too)
BUT,
does that mean since you think this stuff works so well that when you
do install a new system with a new coil, do you automatically add this
stuff to your new installs?
Remember, you asked me what I am doing to correct the coil problems so
Im now asking you the same thing.
Bubba

Richard J Kinch wrote:
But if it's leaking
refrigerant, how can it be working well enough to ice up?

Oddly, a low charge makes it run colder and ice up:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...20eda678cc180f

Don't confuse temperature with heat. The fact that part of your evaporator
is below freezing temperature doesn't mean that it is moving much heat

That was interesting. I never knew that. Dang, learned something
today, and the week isn't even over yet.

Thanks.

On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 02:45:51 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 14:45:27 GMT, wrote:

Al Moran wrote:

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 03:42:35 GMT, wrote:

Bubba wrote:


Okay "fish". I'll bite.

bad news dood...you just munched on my **** filled twinkie
:-)

I give, "fish". What magic are you performing that makes your customer
happy, makes coils last forever, takes away job security and
lines your pocket with cash?
Speak Oh wonderous one.
Bubba

your wish is my command

until you've tried it yourself, you dont have a leg to stand on.
so dont even try. http://www.cliplight.com/hvacr/

coil changeouts can be problematic, and not huge profit centers
way too much labor

drop this stuff in at 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new coil and viola!
problem solved, happy campers, and you with serious coin.

you'd crap your pants if i told you how much i charge for this stuff,
installed.


So what do you charge after you drop a can of this stuff in a system
and it clogs up a txv, or flowrater, or cap tube?


If ya did your homework, you would have discovered the fact that this
product solidifies ONLY as it leaks thru an opening and is exposed to
AIR. It mixes with refrigerant OIL, and goes wherever that oil
goes.

Hell yes, I've seen evap coils with oil-vapor locked feeder tubes, but
the addition of a suction P-trap eliminated those situations....

Actually I did do the homework. Took the test. Read all the info
(actually a couple weeks ago) and then even found my local supplier
has it. They have a box of them there at the counter. Dont believe one
can has been sold in a couple weeks yet.
To me, it seems as though it acts as a glue when it finds a leak.
Something like epoxy or maybe? To me, that isnt a fix for a leak.
Copper leaks need to be brazed and Im not brazing a bunch of
microscopic formicary corrosion leaks.
Im just going to leave it as..........
Im not sold yet. Maybe its a good product but I'll wait till the
verdict comes in.
I guess I might add one thing further. You say its great. You also
imply that anyone installing a new coil knows its going to leak well
before its time (I believe that too)
BUT,
does that mean since you think this stuff works so well that when you
do install a new system with a new coil, do you automatically add this
stuff to your new installs?
Remember, you asked me what I am doing to correct the coil problems so
Im now asking you the same thing.
Bubba


Bubba, first & foremost, I have the highest respect for you, your
trade knowledge and your business ethics & integrity. We both know
formicary corrosion is like ****, it happens. It wasnt my intent to
attack your business practices, more at being able to offer your coil
replacement customers a choice.

Two yrs ago I too was as skeptic as all hell about the product. The
local j-stones guy said he couldnt keep the product in stock. I
broke down & purchased one can. Awhile later on a svc call 40 miles
out in the boonies I had to re-charge a unit I gassed up exactly one
yr before, 20 yr old 3 ton pkg hp. carrier aluminum condenser coil.
I thought what the hell, I'll give it a try. I've used it 7-8 times
now. splits & packages, 2.5 tons to 30+. No callbacks. Cows died.


As for choices, Mrs Smith would you like to try a new coil for $1900
that may or may not leak in the next 2-7 years, or would you like to
try this new stop leak product that the manufacturer claims will stop
current & future leaks, installed for $799.95? That includes any
refrigerant to bring your system up to a factory recommended charge,
new pleated filter at the air handler, condenser coil cleaning, and
how many more bells & whistles can you list?

Mrs Smith says, well wait a minute Fish, I know you paid $79.95 for
that product, and now you want to sell it to me for $799.95???

No Mrs Smith, I am not selling it to you for $799.95.
For $799.95 you're getting a permanant solution to your leaky coil, a
system recharged to factory specs,all the bells & whistles, plus I'm
saving you $1100.05 in the process.


For me Bubba, Mrs Smith doesnt exist. Rarely if ever do I interface
with the person paying the bill on svc work. I do the work, send off
the invoice for any amount I want, and within net 15 or net 30, the
check arrives. if they squawk over pricing, they get billed even more
the next time.

You see Bubba, I have ulterior motives in using this product,
especially on older systems. My market niche is primarily prop mgmt
on commercial bldgs, & we both know how cheap some mgmt can be.
Instead of replacing those old dogs with 10 seer units, hahaha, guess
what? Now they have to buy 13 seer. Moooooo


would I install the product on a new install? probably not. a new
install that leaked and I could trace the leak to the evap? you bet,
in a heartbeat.

And as for you Fish........"Im good". No problems with you at all.
Steam that got vented and water under the bridge. As you know, my
twinkie gets overfilled with **** and its gotta come out somewhere.
You were the lucky catcher. :-)
Yes the price you charge seems very high but then on the other hand it
doesnt. AFter all, Ballplayers getting paid millions of dollars, BP
making 76 Billion in profits and our Federal goverment spending
Trillions that they dont have. All the while we are all sitting around
paying $3 a gallon for gas. Whats right and whats wrong?
The can of stop leak is interesting to say the least. Like anything
else, it just has to be marketed and sold properly. Id certainly be
interested in a longer (5-7yr) study on how well it holds up. It'll
keep me thinking..............
Bubba

"Richard J Kinch" wrote in message
. ..
But if it's leaking
refrigerant, how can it be working well enough to ice up?

Oddly, a low charge makes it run colder and ice up:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...20eda678cc180f

Don't confuse temperature with heat. The fact that part of your
evaporator
is below freezing temperature doesn't mean that it is moving much heat.


Nothing odd about an evap freezing on low charge. For every pressure, there
is a temp...how do you think we measure superheat?

"Richard J Kinch" wrote in message
. ..
Sally writes:

A repairman came out a little while ago and
said that the coil may need to be replaced (for $1,800) and that coils
typically only last 5-7 years.

The part will cost him about $300.

LOL..suggest you try it again..maybe 3 years ago it did.


The labor will likely take less than a full day.

The AC trade considers $1500/day profit reasonable. They whine about how
much it costs to run a pickup truck and pay some high-school graduate ...
as if you didn't need transportation to get to your $20/hour job.


This is what you get by allowing politicians to license tradesmen and
legalize the restraint of trade.

aka-SBM writes:

The part will cost him about $300.

LOL..suggest you try it again..maybe 3 years ago it did.

And what's happened in the last three years?

"Richard J Kinch" wrote in message
. ..
aka-SBM writes:

The part will cost him about $300.

LOL..suggest you try it again..maybe 3 years ago it did.

And what's happened in the last three years?

http://www.kitcometals.com/charts/co...istorical.html

Notice the 5 year chart.

--

SVL

PrecisionMachinisT writes:

http://www.kitcometals.com/charts/co...istorical.html

Oh yeah, I heard about that.

And to think we discarded these things as not having enough scrap value a
few years ago.

"Richard J Kinch" wrote in message
.. .
PrecisionMachinisT writes:

http://www.kitcometals.com/charts/co...istorical.html

Oh yeah, I heard about that.

And to think we discarded these things as not having enough scrap value a
few years ago.

And today, we are replacing stolen units on a freakin daily basis.

"aka-SBM" wrote in message
news
we are replacing stolen units on a freakin daily basis.

i sure dont miss NC. ;-)

--
Nathan W. Collier
http://UtilityOffRoad.com
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