First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met.../0720dogs.html

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

wrote:
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

First of all, if someone poisoned my dog I would take revenge and it would
be SERIOUS!

Second, how did she poison the dogs? Did she hand feed the poison or did
she leave something out for them to eat? Little kids like to put things in
their mouths or even just handle them. Any poison that can kill a dog can
at the least make a child VERY sick. What if she inadvertantly poisoned a
small child (hell, I think they are WAY more annoying than dogs!)?

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met.../0720dogs.html

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001

1) Dogs are cuter than rodents and bugs
2) I don't know of anyone who has a pet cockroach

In article .com,
wrote:

First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....


Dogs are considered personal property. It is not okay to kill someone's
pet in this manner. I don't know how you can compare a pet to a cockroach.


Dimitri

"Amy Likes Pot!" wrote in message
...
wrote:
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

First of all, if someone poisoned my dog I would take revenge and it would
be SERIOUS!

Second, how did she poison the dogs? Did she hand feed the poison or did
she leave something out for them to eat?


The article said 'she hated animals, but left containers of food laced with
anti-freeze outside to lure them.' She is guilty of poisoning the dogs
IMHO.

Case closed.


td

D. Gerasimatos wrote:
Dogs are considered personal property. It is not okay to kill someone's
pet in this manner. I don't know how you can compare a pet to a cockroach.

Animals kept as pets are slightly above personal property. For
instance, if I took my lawnmower out on the front lawn and smashed it
to pieces with a slegehammer I might get a few odd looks. If I did
that to my dogs...

Amy Likes Pot! wrote:

First of all, if someone poisoned my dog I would take revenge and it would
be SERIOUS!

Second, how did she poison the dogs? Did she hand feed the poison or did
she leave something out for them to eat? Little kids like to put things in
their mouths or even just handle them. Any poison that can kill a dog can
at the least make a child VERY sick. What if she inadvertantly poisoned a
small child (hell, I think they are WAY more annoying than dogs!)?

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met.../0720dogs.html

I provided a link to the article for you to read. These responses are
all
likely from problem dog owners, from what I can see. NOT ONE of you
addresses the issue of keeping your dog OFF OTHER PEOPLE'S PROPERTY,
especially if they don't want your roaming dog on it, and this woman
obviously
didn't. And since you seem to be so concerned with kids, how do you
feel
when a strange dog, owned by *irresponsible* dog owners like you, comes
onto your property and attacks the child? Huh? But I see, you would
"take revenge" and it would be "SERIOUS." LOL.

I thought an adult or two might respond. I was wrong.

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

"McGyver" wrote in message
news:ZsOvg.14169$rT6.6091@trnddc03...
wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land
and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it
again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to
bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give you
back the trap.


Many local animal control agencies offer the use of humane traps free of
charge. And in fact will come out and set up the trap for the homeowners
themselves.


td

In article , says...
Little kids like to put things in
their mouths or even just handle them.

on this note take a look at this report. it sickens me.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive...62condom1.html

duh, if you're going to poison the neighbor's annoying dogs then don't leave
evidence of it on your own property.

or you could just drive the traps, and the dogs, 100 miles away and let the
dogs out there.

"Barky Bark" wrote in message
.com...
or you could just drive the traps, and the dogs, 100 miles away and let
the
dogs out there.


Nothing of value folks, move along.


td

are you talking about yourself again

McGyver wrote:

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

This should be animal control's job, not the property owner's. In the
case
of the woman in the story, they failed her, repeatedly.

The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give you
back the trap.

Assuming of course, the animal would jump up into the van or truck
in the first place. And what if the dog is unfriendly, threatening
and vicious, and takes his time taking the bait, if he does at all?
See, this is not a very good method.

If there were no means of defending one's property from dogs other than
killing them, there would be no law making it a felony to kill them. But
there are and there are.

If a threatening, vicious dog took to my property, he would likely be
shot, by me. I would call the owner to come pick up the carcass,
and if they wanted to call police, I'd encourage it myself. They send
people to prison for allowing dangerous animals to roam loose
nowadays, especially if they attack people. I'd consider the shooting
a public service.

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

wrote in message
oups.com...

McGyver wrote:

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with
invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to
the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land
and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the
pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it
again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to
bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

This should be animal control's job, not the property owner's. In the
case
of the woman in the story, they failed her, repeatedly.


You posted nothing as to the leash laws in the area.



The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give
you
back the trap.

Assuming of course, the animal would jump up into the van or truck
in the first place.

If, as the woman in this story did, you baited that trap with food that has
a strong odor, ie: fish, the dog will beat a path into the *humane* trap.



And what if the dog is unfriendly, threatening
and vicious, and takes his time taking the bait, if he does at all?
See, this is not a very good method.


See above:


If there were no means of defending one's property from dogs other than
killing them, there would be no law making it a felony to kill them.
But
there are and there are.

If a threatening, vicious dog took to my property,


Nowhere in the article you posted did it state any of the dogs were
threatening, vicious, etc.


he would likely be
shot, by me. I would call the owner to come pick up the carcass,
and if they wanted to call police, I'd encourage it myself. They send
people to prison for allowing dangerous animals to roam loose
nowadays,

*They* also send people to prison for animal abuse, *felony* animal abuse in
the case of malicious killing of animals.


especially if they attack people.

I didn't read that either of these dogs *ever* attacked people. Nor did I
read that they were threatening or vicious.



I'd consider the shooting
a public service.

Tell it to the judge.


td



-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

tiny dancer wrote:

Tell it to the judge.

There would be no judge. Moral of the story: if you don't
want harm to come to those dogs you claim to love so
much, keep them out of other people's space. What was
it that people used to say, "love 'em leash 'em" or something
similar. Might be good to remember.

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

tiny dancer wrote:Why don't to stop bug spray from spaying.
Enyone canstopit.
"McGyver" wrote in message
news:ZsOvg.14169$rT6.6091@trnddc03...
wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land
and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it
again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to
bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give you
back the trap.


Many local animal control agencies offer the use of humane traps free of
charge. And in fact will come out and set up the trap for the homeowners
themselves.


td

tiny dancer wrote:Why don't to stop bug spray from spaying.
Enyone canstopit.
"McGyver" wrote in message
news:ZsOvg.14169$rT6.6091@trnddc03...
wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land
and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it
again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to
bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give you
back the trap.


Many local animal control agencies offer the use of humane traps free of
charge. And in fact will come out and set up the trap for the homeowners
themselves.


td

On 20 Jul 2006 12:00:04 -0700, wrote:

Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.


Yeah, but they're cheating.
They strap bombs on their own children.

Our neighbors two kids caught the school bus just off our property.
Everyday the kids brought their two dogs to the bus stop with them allowing
them free roam to go back home. Two German Shepards chasing and attempting
to bring down our calves was not going to put "bread" on our table. Because
they were kids we made every attempt to get the cooperation of the parents.
As these dogs were attacking a commercial operation (livestock) we were
perfectly within the law shooting to kill them. But these dogs belonged to
kids with idiots for parents. I lured them into my house, called the pound
and called the parents after the pound had collected them informing them of
their whereabouts.
I never saw the dogs again. Many years later I found out the parents had
told the kids the mean lady and her husband had shot and killed them.
No such thing as bad kids...just bad parents! No such thing as a bad dog...
just bad owners!!!
Sometimes you just can't win.

In article .com,
wrote:

There would be no judge. Moral of the story: if you don't
want harm to come to those dogs you claim to love so
much, keep them out of other people's space. What was
it that people used to say, "love 'em leash 'em" or something
similar. Might be good to remember.



Moral of the story: if you don't want harm to come to those kids
you claim to love so much, keep them out of other people's space.


Agree? No problem with shooting kids who come onto your property
unwelcomed? Right?


Dimitri

wrote in message
oups.com...

McGyver wrote:

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with
invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to
the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land
and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it
again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to
bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

This should be animal control's job, not the property owner's. In the
case
of the woman in the story, they failed her, repeatedly.

Right. So she chose to deal with the problem herself. No problem, that's
what she should do. But she chose the wrong method.

The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give
you
back the trap.

Assuming of course, the animal would jump up into the van or truck
in the first place.

They will jump in. They like the smell of the good stuff. If the dog can't
jump, put a milk crate behind the tail gate. Don't worry about the dog not
being able and willing to go into the trap to the goodies.

And what if the dog is unfriendly, threatening
and vicious,

Who cares? The homeowner will be snug in her bed while the goodies are
being eaten in the trap. And while the homeowner is driving the trap to the
pound, she won't care how the dog is acting.

and takes his time taking the bait, if he does at all?

Look, if you want to be stuborn, I won't argue, here's the conclusion: Use
the least damaging means available or go to jail. Simple. If you don't
like the law, change it. If you need advice on how to change the law, ask.
All I do is tell you what the law is, and answer questions. I don't care if
you don't agree with the law.

See, this is not a very good method.

The trap is an excellent method.

If there were no means of defending one's property from dogs other than
killing them, there would be no law making it a felony to kill them. But
there are and there are.

If a threatening, vicious dog took to my property, he would likely be
shot, by me. I would call the owner to come pick up the carcass,
and if they wanted to call police, I'd encourage it myself. They send
people to prison for allowing dangerous animals to roam loose
nowadays, especially if they attack people. I'd consider the shooting
a public service.

Change the facts of the story and that changes the answers. That tactic
works really well if you don't like the original answers. I'll leave it to
others to deal with this set of made-up facts. I like to share the fun.
Have a nice day.

This answer must not be relied on as legal advice for the reasons posted
he http://mcgyverdisclaimer.blogspot.com

McGyver

writes:
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.

Perhaps because Israeli children aren't out trying to kill
Palestinians, and Israeli soldiers don't hide their weapons
and explosives or fire rockets from villages where Israeli
children live.

Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.

Perhaps because the Israelis are better at defending
themselves against terrorist attacks than Palestinians are at
killing Israelis.

"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001

Sharon never said this. It's a quote invented out of whole
cloth by the anti-Israel Palestinian Information Centre.

*plonk*

--
Help stop the genocide in Darfur!
http://www.genocideintervention.net/

In article , Jonathan Kamens says...

writes:
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.

Perhaps because Israeli children aren't out trying to kill
Palestinians, and Israeli soldiers don't hide their weapons
and explosives or fire rockets from villages where Israeli
children live.

Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.

Perhaps because the Israelis are better at defending
themselves against terrorist attacks than Palestinians are at
killing Israelis.

"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001

Sharon never said this. It's a quote invented out of whole
cloth by the anti-Israel Palestinian Information Centre.

*plonk*


Heh.

And then *your* political signoff:

Help stop the genocide in Darfur!
http://www.genocideintervention.net/

So, we can have the Duel of the Political Signature Lines, and everybody can
plonk everybody.

If there's to be a pox on either house, there should be a pox on both your
houses.

Banty (wondering if you had a political signoff about Bosnia, or is your
particular concern is about Darfur because......)


--

Banty writes:
And then *your* political signoff:

Help stop the genocide in Darfur!
http://www.genocideintervention.net/

So, we can have the Duel of the Political Signature Lines, and everybody can
plonk everybody.

If there's to be a pox on either house, there should be a pox on both your
houses.

I didn't plonk him because he had a political signature. I
plonked him because he lied and distorted facts in it. I gave
up years ago wasting time listening to or arguing with liars
on the Usenet.

If you think I lied or distorted facts in my signature about
Darfur, please feel free to plonk me.

Banty (wondering if you had a political signoff about Bosnia, or is your
particular concern is about Darfur because......)

I didn't, but I should have.

The Genocide Intervention Network and similar organizations
sprang up essentially as a *result* of what went on in Bosnia
and Rwanda and the fact that the world stood by and let it
happen. They are all part of a grassroots movement whose goal
is to stop ongoing genocides and even prevent future ones by
amassing sufficient strength in numbers to force the leaders
of civilized nations to act.

We didn't stop Bosnia. We didn't stop Rwanda. We didn't
stop the Armenian genocide. The world failed the people who
died in those genocides, and it's time for the world to grow
up and stop letting genocides happen.

--
Help stop the genocide in Darfur!
http://www.genocideintervention.net/

On 20 Jul 2006 08:32:01 -0700, wrote:


Amy Likes Pot! wrote:

First of all, if someone poisoned my dog I would take revenge and it would
be SERIOUS!

Second, how did she poison the dogs? Did she hand feed the poison or did
she leave something out for them to eat? Little kids like to put things in
their mouths or even just handle them. Any poison that can kill a dog can
at the least make a child VERY sick. What if she inadvertantly poisoned a
small child (hell, I think they are WAY more annoying than dogs!)?

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met.../0720dogs.html

I provided a link to the article for you to read. These responses are
all
likely from problem dog owners, from what I can see. NOT ONE of you
addresses the issue of keeping your dog OFF OTHER PEOPLE'S PROPERTY,
especially if they don't want your roaming dog on it, and this woman
obviously
didn't. And since you seem to be so concerned with kids, how do you
feel
when a strange dog, owned by *irresponsible* dog owners like you, comes
onto your property and attacks the child? Huh? But I see, you would
"take revenge" and it would be "SERIOUS." LOL.

I thought an adult or two might respond. I was wrong.

Try not to become hysterical.

I owned a lovely dog for 14 years. He was only loose twice in that
time and we found him and got him back on his chain very quickly. He
was in the house, on a chain, or on a leash at all times.

Leaving out poison indiscriminately is against the law. Dogs will
enter the property to get the food who otherwise might never have come
near that yard. Kids also sometimes roam off their own property. And
there is no telling what a kid will eat. Or feed, in a moment of
kindness or malice, to another kid. Kids have died as easily as dogs
from eating / drinking antifreeze. Creating an attractive nuisance is
against the law.

What the woman who poisoned the dogs did was wrong. I don't know what
solutions she could have had to her problems with dogs, but that
wasn't even a half good one.

What was wrong with her trying a political solution? Trying to become
the animal control officer or trying to get one elected / appointed
who'd get the dogs and owners under control?
--

r.bc: vixen
Speaker to squirrels, willow watcher, etc..
Often taunted by trout. Almost entirely harmless. Really.

http://www.visi.com/~cyli

In article , Cyli says...

On 20 Jul 2006 08:32:01 -0700, wrote:


Amy Likes Pot! wrote:

First of all, if someone poisoned my dog I would take revenge and it would
be SERIOUS!

Second, how did she poison the dogs? Did she hand feed the poison or did
she leave something out for them to eat? Little kids like to put things in
their mouths or even just handle them. Any poison that can kill a dog can
at the least make a child VERY sick. What if she inadvertantly poisoned a
small child (hell, I think they are WAY more annoying than dogs!)?

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met.../0720dogs.html

I provided a link to the article for you to read. These responses are
all
likely from problem dog owners, from what I can see. NOT ONE of you
addresses the issue of keeping your dog OFF OTHER PEOPLE'S PROPERTY,
especially if they don't want your roaming dog on it, and this woman
obviously
didn't. And since you seem to be so concerned with kids, how do you
feel
when a strange dog, owned by *irresponsible* dog owners like you, comes
onto your property and attacks the child? Huh? But I see, you would
"take revenge" and it would be "SERIOUS." LOL.

I thought an adult or two might respond. I was wrong.

Try not to become hysterical.

I owned a lovely dog for 14 years. He was only loose twice in that
time and we found him and got him back on his chain very quickly. He
was in the house, on a chain, or on a leash at all times.

Leaving out poison indiscriminately is against the law. Dogs will
enter the property to get the food who otherwise might never have come
near that yard. Kids also sometimes roam off their own property. And
there is no telling what a kid will eat. Or feed, in a moment of
kindness or malice, to another kid. Kids have died as easily as dogs
from eating / drinking antifreeze. Creating an attractive nuisance is
against the law.

What the woman who poisoned the dogs did was wrong. I don't know what
solutions she could have had to her problems with dogs, but that
wasn't even a half good one.

What was wrong with her trying a political solution? Trying to become
the animal control officer or trying to get one elected / appointed
who'd get the dogs and owners under control?

Oh, come on. She's to spend her life on solving a problem foisted upon her by
her neighbors??

I don't know what sympathy I have for either side, but I think in fairness you
should at least be able to acknowledge the spot that she had been put in by the
irresponsible habits of her neighbors.

Banty


--

Phulltillt wrote:
Our neighbors two kids caught the school bus just off our property.
Everyday the kids brought their two dogs to the bus stop with them allowing
them free roam to go back home. Two German Shepards chasing and attempting
to bring down our calves was not going to put "bread" on our table. Because
they were kids we made every attempt to get the cooperation of the parents.
As these dogs were attacking a commercial operation (livestock) we were
perfectly within the law shooting to kill them. But these dogs belonged to
kids with idiots for parents. I lured them into my house, called the pound
and called the parents after the pound had collected them informing them of
their whereabouts.
I never saw the dogs again. Many years later I found out the parents had
told the kids the mean lady and her husband had shot and killed them.
No such thing as bad kids...just bad parents! No such thing as a bad dog...
just bad owners!!!
Sometimes you just can't win.

Some people have no business with any kids or dogs. Unfortunately,
those types often have lots of both.

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

Jonathan Kamens wrote:
writes:
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.

Perhaps because Israeli children aren't out trying to kill
Palestinians, and Israeli soldiers don't hide their weapons
and explosives or fire rockets from villages where Israeli
children live.

Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.

Perhaps because the Israelis are better at defending
themselves against terrorist attacks than Palestinians are at
killing Israelis.

"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001

Sharon never said this. It's a quote invented out of whole
cloth by the anti-Israel Palestinian Information Centre.

Oh looky, another mass murder-supporting, bigoted Zionist spreading
their dirty little lies on USENET. Oh what a surprise.

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff

richard wrote:
Then explain this one:

Animal rights activists complain dilliegently about an animal, like a cow,
being whipped on the butt repeatedly as it moves through the line only to be
slaughtered. While none of them will complain about a jockey whipping his
horse during a race.

Dude, animal rights folks protest horse racing all the time. WTF are
you talking about?

"richard" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....


Then explain this one:

Animal rights activists complain dilliegently about an animal, like a cow,
being whipped on the butt repeatedly as it moves through the line only to
be slaughtered. While none of them will complain about a jockey whipping
his horse during a race.

I'm no AR activist, but I can still see the difference between these two
things.

Tara

McGyver wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

A woman has irresponsible neighbors who let their dogs run unrestrained
as a day-to-day practice onto her property. After lodging 45
complaints
to local animal control and police over a three-year period, with
apparently
no results, she decides to go the poison route. One dog dies and she's
facing a felony animal cruelty charge!

Of course, the situation would be different if she'd killed the dog OFF
of
her property. I agree that poisoning ain't a nice way to die, but
what's
next, a ban on HotShot and Raid? Are you gonna tell me that insects
don't feel discomfort when dying from Raid? Ever watched a cockroach
writhing in agony on its back after being poisoned by bug spray? On
my
condo property, a while back the powers that be decided to put out
little
lures which were to catch and poison "rodents" (squirrels and
chipmunks).
I was tempted to pick these traps up and toss them because I'm not
too keen on poisoning these critters, but I don't think they caught
many,
or any, as we apparently have smart chipmunks around here, but the
point
is, why is putting out these traps not considered also a felony?

A dog running onto a person's property can be far more annoying (and
dangerous)
than a cockroach or silverfish visiting. They can attack kids and
other animals,
not to mention get into trash cans and **** all over your lawn. I
just don't
get it.

It is simple enough. The law permits the land owner to deal with invasion
by other people's animals in the manner which does the least damage to the
owners of the animals. It is very easy to put a humane trap on the land and
bait it with good stuff. Then you take the trap, with dog, to the pound.
The pound calls the dog's owner who bails out the dog. Then you do it again
the following week. Eventually, the dog owner tires of paying money to bail
out the dog and does the responsible thing about controlling the dog.

The traps are inexpensive and easy to use. If the dogs in question are
heavy, the trick is to set the trap in the back of a pickup or van. The
animal control people will lift it out for you, take the dog out, give you
back the trap.

If there were no means of defending one's property from dogs other than
killing them, there would be no law making it a felony to kill them. But
there are and there are.

This answer must not be relied on as legal advice for the reasons posted
he http://mcgyverdisclaimer.blogspot.com

McGyver

Possibly illegal in town. In the country you can freely kill any dog
harassing your own animals. I currently have a neighbor letting one
run loose. First time it chases my cat or one of my dogs, it will be
dead and delivered to his door with an explanation.

Harry K

HOWEDY Richard,

richard wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones

Nuthin beats UNCONDITIONAL LOVE, eh Richard?

anyway)

He means anyHOWE, Richard.

and have had dogs myself, but this.....

Then explain this one:

Animal rights activists complain dilliegently about an animal,
like a cow, being whipped on the butt repeatedly as it moves
through the line only to be slaughtered. While none of them
will complain about a jockey whipping his horse during a race.

The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing Grand
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard got a story to tell
abHOWET whippin a horse.

Some thirty years ago The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely
Simply Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard
had finished doin some missionary HOWEspital work in Haiti and
following that took some work startin a horse and carriage tour
for a restaurant in Port Au Prince, Le Voudray, IIRC.

WON of the horsmen came from the Dominican Republic with
his own stallion. Roberto was a charming older gentleman
who'd worked forty years as coacher for The President.

Roberto was EXXXPLAININ HOWE to whip the horse to make IT GO FAST.

The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing Grand
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard EXXXPLAINED HOWE
HE could inspire HIS horse (grade gelding, anyWON of five
equally nice tropical horses availble in the stable, but
NUTHIN to compare to his own stallion).

Roberto told The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply
Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard HOWE
to whip HIS horse on his pee pee.

Of curse, that inspired a discussion of TRAININ METHODS which
triggered a argument, and of curse the ONLY solution was a
challenge to race.

While Roberto lashed his horse all he believed necessary, The
Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing Grand
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard PRAISED HIS
horse EVEN MOORE.

Roberto didn't take losin kindly.

HOWEver, he DID stop lashin his horse and learned to PRAISE HIM IN
ADVANCE.

Oh, and bye the bye, tara g aka tara.green2 is a lyin dog abusin drunen
drug
crazed mental case. You might want to ask her HOWE COME she understands
HURTIN animals to train them?:

"TaraG" wrote in message
news:gVawg.4930$uJ2.4847@trndny02...

"richard" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....


Then explain this one:

Animal rights activists complain dilliegently about an animal, like a cow,
being whipped on the butt repeatedly as it moves through the line only to
be slaughtered. While none of them will complain about a jockey whipping
his horse during a race.

I'm no AR activist, but I can still see the difference between these two things.

Tara

Roberto would say "No, no, no, Mr. Jerry".

WELCOME to The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply
Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizards'
100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog, Child, Kat And Horse Training Method Manual
Forums {); ~ )

I'm Jerry Howe, The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply
Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard {) ; ~ )

Here's your own FREE COPY of The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin
Insanely Simply Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And
Horsey Wizards'

The *666* Edition Of Your Own
FREE COPY
Of
The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing
GRAND
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizards'
100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL
FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog, Child, Kat And Horsey Training Method Manual {) ;
~ )

{#}: ~ } 8 { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } http://makeashorterlink.com/?K3AD21A3D { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } 8 { ~ :{@}

HOWEDY tarag aka tara.green2 you miserable stinkin lyin dog abusin
multidimensional drunken drug crazed chronic long term incurable
mental case and professional dog trainin FRAUD,

TaraG wrote:
"richard" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
First of all, I love dogs (most of the friendly ones anyway) and have
had dogs myself, but this.....

Then explain this one:

Animal rights activists complain dilliegently about an animal, like a cow,
being whipped on the butt repeatedly as it moves through the line only to
be slaughtered. While none of them will complain about a jockey whipping
his horse during a race.

I'm no AR activist,

INDEED? Seems you're a DOG ABUSER. Your "LEAVE IT" command will PROVE
IT.

but I can still see the difference between these two things.

Do tell?

Please. DO TELL, tarag?

Tara

WHAT'S the DIFFERENCE between BEATIN innocent defenseless dumb
critters?

WELCOME to The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply
Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizards'
100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog, Child, Kat And Horse Training Method Manual
Forums {); ~ )

I'm Jerry Howe, The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply
Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizard {) ; ~ )

Here's your own FREE COPY of The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin
Insanely Simply Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And
Horsey Wizards'

The *666* Edition Of Your Own
FREE COPY
Of
The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing
GRAND
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy And Horsey Wizards'
100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL
FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog, Child, Kat And Horsey Training Method Manual {) ;
~ )

{#}: ~ } 8 { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } http://makeashorterlink.com/?K3AD21A3D { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } { ~ :{@}
{#}: ~ } 8 { ~ :{@}

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------

So you're saying that the Israeli's are way smarter, have greater foresight
and built bunkers for their civilians. Wouldn't you?

In article , John says...



-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------

So you're saying that the Israeli's are way smarter, have greater foresight
and built bunkers for their civilians. Wouldn't you?

Or that they have a very technologically advanced backer.

Banty


--

John wrote:

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------

So you're saying that the Israeli's are way smarter, have greater foresight
and built bunkers for their civilians.

No.

Wouldn't you?

Wouldn't I what? Were you born a Ziobigot, or do you just support
them from watching too much TV?

-----
Kill ratio of Palestinian children to Israeli children 5.7-to-1,
Israel's favor.
Kill ratio of all Palestinians to Israelis: over 3-to-1.
---------
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/print/mear01_.html
----------
"Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We,
the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."
---Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 2001
--
Cliff