Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote: On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 15:38:29 -0500, Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. Graham |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Am 03.07.07 19.42 schrieb Spurious Response:
On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 15:38:29 -0500, Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? Because initially we had been talking about wall outlets and according plugs, with flat (US, UK) or round (most of Central Europe) contacts and those connectors are rated 15A/130V (US) or 16A/250V (Europe). So when talking about alternatives, we have to stay in the same ratings range. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Am 03.07.07 19.40 schrieb Spurious Response:
On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 15:38:29 -0500, Wolfi wrote: All three pins on the other end of an IEC power cord are flat blades. You're talking about this IEC (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60309) power connector, rated from 16A up to 250A @690VAC? ;-) But it also uses round pins, not flat ones. No, silly. He was talking about the STANDARD US 120V IEC cord used on nearly everything made these days, from dongles to 70" FPDs. http://www.coleparmer.com/techinfo/t...ugs.htm&ID=346 Ah, that's what I reckoned, cords with the *international* standard socket type IEC 60320-C13 /max. 70°C/10A (and -C15 /max. 120°C/10A or max. 155°C/16A). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_connector http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ger%C3%A4testecker And there is also our famous Euro socket for small devices according to protection class II, the type IEC-60320-C7, which normally is the device sided end of the 2.5A Euro wall plug we had discussed earlier on. But they all have in common, that they provide excellent user protection against touching of live parts *and* they all plug mechanically *into* the counterpart with their housing, hence guiding mechanically stress away from the contacts and into the housing. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 02:31:10 GMT, Eeyore
wrote: Spurious Response wrote: On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 15:38:29 -0500, Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. Graham "I" was a euphemistic "I", idiot. As in I that represents any joe sixpack homeowner. One does not need 16 Amp per outlet capacity. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote: Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. "I" was a euphemistic "I", idiot. As in I that represents any joe sixpack homeowner. One does not need 16 Amp per outlet capacity. It's widely used in Europe. Graham |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote:
If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? For example, my 7.5 amp 230v Dyson DC-14 vaccum cleaner. The 120 volt version draws about 15 amps. Surprisingly, my Kenwood mixer uses 1000w (and there is a 1200w version). which is around 5 amps at 230 volts, and would be over 10 at 120. However, it seems that such a mixer is not available in the U.S. The Kenwood mixers sold in the U.S. are their smaller 600 watt units, and the much loved Kitchen Aid units are 350 watts, with one that's 500w. I seem to remember having a 12 amp or so toaster and hot water kettle in the U.S. Ours here are 1000 watts. Things like blenders are 300 to 400 watts, which would work with a 6 or 7 amp fuse, assuming the wattage rating is average and not peak. A friend of mine has an HP laser printer that is rated 500 watts, but the peak draw is 8 amps at 120 volts. The manual and printer itself say 500 watts, the 8 amps was on the web site. I would not be very happy to use a device with an 8 amp peak draw on a 10 amp circuit. But I'm unusual in that. I always assume that manufacturers lie (inflate output power, but ignore peak usage) when they state current requirments and that anything that provides current is rated for that current for a peak of a few miliseconds or less. This is very common for transformers (which many people use here to operate 120 volt appliances brought in to avoid high taxes and huge markups) and UPS's for computers, both of which are sold as being rated in WATTS, but really are rated in VA which are 1.414 times as much. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838 Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/ |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
In article ,
Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote: For example, my 7.5 amp 230v Dyson DC-14 vaccum cleaner. The 120 volt version draws about 15 amps. That would suggest an approx 2.5 HP motor. Is it really that large, or is that the start up current? I seem to remember having a 12 amp or so toaster and hot water kettle in the U.S. Ours here are 1000 watts. A 1000 watt kettle would take forever to boil. UK ones are normally 2500/3000 watts. -- *I never drink anything stronger than gin before breakfast * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
That would suggest an approx 2.5 HP motor. Is it really that large, or is that the start up current? Yes, it's really that large. Dyson is a well known English brand, look it up. The exact model is DC-14 animal. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838 Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/ |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
In article ,
Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote: That would suggest an approx 2.5 HP motor. Is it really that large, or is that the start up current? Yes, it's really that large. Dyson is a well known English brand, look it up. The exact model is DC-14 animal. I know what they are having fixed several. And seen many more on the council tip. A triumph of hype over common sense. -- *It IS as bad as you think, and they ARE out to get you. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
I know what they are having fixed several. And seen many more on the council tip. A triumph of hype over common sense. Not only is it the best engineered appliance I've ever owned, it's the best vaccum cleaner I've ever owned. Dyson's design was so good that Hoover stole it and was sucesfully prosecuted for patent infringment. It works well, and my totaly nontechnical wife can field strip it if it gets jammed, which is almost impossible. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838 Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/ |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
In article ,
Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote: I know what they are having fixed several. And seen many more on the council tip. A triumph of hype over common sense. Not only is it the best engineered appliance I've ever owned, it's the best vaccum cleaner I've ever owned. Dyson's design was so good that Hoover stole it and was sucesfully prosecuted for patent infringment. It works well, and my totaly nontechnical wife can field strip it if it gets jammed, which is almost impossible. They also have racks of spares on sale in near any store. No other vacuum cleaner I know of breaks down so often. A triumph of hype over engineering. -- *In some places, C:\ is the root of all directories * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 04:35:47 GMT, Eeyore
wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. "I" was a euphemistic "I", idiot. As in I that represents any joe sixpack homeowner. One does not need 16 Amp per outlet capacity. It's widely used in Europe. Graham Where, at twice the voltage, you need it even less. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
John Larkin wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jul 2007 00:32:33 +0000 (UTC), bz wrote: jakdedert wrote in : bz wrote: jakdedert wrote in news:e6yhi.8611$09.1625 @bignews8.bellsouth.net: In some cases it was possible to easily rewired with grounded 12/2 romex from the breaker box. In others, where that was not practical, the two-prongers were replaced with new outlets--also two prong. These are still available and should be used if upgrading to a properly grounded outlet is not done. If an earth ground is not available, a GFI outlet should be installed at the beginning of the run and 3 prong outlets along the rest of the run. The GFI will trip if a ground fault is present. The outlets should be marked to indicate that a GFI is installed and that no earth ground is present. I believe that this is much safer than using 2 prong outlets and meets code. Yes it is, and I'm perfectly aware of the fact. OTOH, replacing with original equipment is far more responsible than doing what most people do: replacing with a three prong outlet and either leaving the ground to float...or worse yet, bonding ground to neutral. Eventually, all those two-blade outlets will be rewired properly, with new circuits added. I've done about 25% of the house so far, but it's slow going.... Understood. I spent quite a bit of time putting GFI's in a house we bought and are renting out. It was built in the late 40's and expanded several times, some grounded outlets were installed but grounds were missing on several. Older parts of the house are on an aux breaker box. Figuring out what fed what was fun. Why don't houses come with schematics? John A lot of electricians can't read or write very well? Several times I was called to straighten out wiring they couldn't figure out. For instance, five overhead wires between a house and a garage, all solid black plastic. Neutral, two Line connections, and a three way, outdoor light with switches in the house and garage. They were dropped to install vinyl siding, then they couldn't figure out how to reconnect the wires. The sad part was the insulators were in a straight line at each end, and none of the wires crossed another so it was obvious what was wrong. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
bz wrote:
Figuring out what fed what was fun. Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Wolfi wrote:
Or should you mean that type, which is used for computer monitors and -power supplies? That is the IEC connector. It allows different cords to be used with the same equipment in multiple countries. If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? Have you ever had a desktop computer OR monitor that drew 3.68 KW? They were designed for exactly what they are used for: Portable, low power equipment. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote: Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. "I" was a euphemistic "I", idiot. As in I that represents any joe sixpack homeowner. One does not need 16 Amp per outlet capacity. It's widely used in Europe. Where, at twice the voltage, you need it even less. There's plenty of 3kW equipment here. Graham |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote: Wolfi wrote: Or should you mean that type, which is used for computer monitors and -power supplies? That is the IEC connector. It allows different cords to be used with the same equipment in multiple countries. If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? Have you ever had a desktop computer OR monitor that drew 3.68 KW? They were designed for exactly what they are used for: Portable, low power equipment. They're used on highish power equipment as well.. There's a 15A version too btw. Graham |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Wolfi wrote:
Am 02.07.07 21.35 schrieb John Larkin: On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 17:07:39 -0700, Spurious Response wrote: On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 01:16:30 -0500, Wolfi wrote: 2 and 3 prong plugs and receptacles not having strain relief... they don't need it. If one remains within the specs for their use, the outlet/plug combo never sees any particularly high mechanical stresses placed on it. Having seen plenty of badly bent contact blades on vacuum, TV set, computer & monitor, power drill and other shop devices' power cords, I strongly disagree. What part of "if one remains within the specs for their use..." do you not understand? If it's bent so much that it's hard to plug in, just bend it back. No big deal. Oh yes, it easily becomes a big deal as in case of an electric floor heater. Some moron in the past had moved it around so violently while being plugged in, that both contacts had been bent to at least 45° off direction befor it came out of the socket and when I tried to put them straight again, one of them broke off. I had quite a hard time to find a screw on replacement plug. Would you rather the plug held, and damaged the cable, so it caught on fire when you tried to use it? It did what it was supposed to do. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
|
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 11:05:44 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote: A 1000 watt kettle would take forever to boil. UK ones are normally 2500/3000 watts. If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. It must be nice to be able to build everything higher output, more consumptive. We have to conserve here. Miniaturize. What types of appliances get used in Japan? High wattage? Low? Other places? |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 21:23:06 GMT, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote: bz wrote: Figuring out what fed what was fun. Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Was it a Bogen intercom? They are a division of Lear Sigler. I worked there at one time, years ago. Beeping out each line should have been easy. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
In article ,
Michael A. Terrell wrote: They were designed for exactly what they are used for: Portable, low power equipment. They first saw the light of day as (in a slightly modified form) a kettle connector. -- *I will always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
In article ,
Spurious Response wrote: A 1000 watt kettle would take forever to boil. UK ones are normally 2500/3000 watts. If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. I'd be surprised if your electricity prices were higher than the UK. However, with a kettle, I doubt if the size of element makes much difference to the cost of boiling a fixed amount of water - only to the time taken. It must be nice to be able to build everything higher output, more consumptive. We have to conserve here. Miniaturize. Really? ;-) What types of appliances get used in Japan? High wattage? Low? Other places? With any appliance basically heating things it simply does the job quicker at higher power. May even be cheaper. -- *If you think this van is dirty, you should try having sex with the driver* Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
In article ,
Spurious Response wrote: Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Was it a Bogen intercom? They are a division of Lear Sigler. I worked there at one time, years ago. Beeping out each line should have been easy. I've yet to see an unmarked multi-pair cable. -- *He who dies with the most toys is, nonetheless, dead. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in
: bz wrote: Figuring out what fed what was fun. Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Bet you got a 'buzz' out of that. -- bz 73 de N5BZ k please pardon my infinite ignorance, the set-of-things-I-do-not-know is an infinite set. remove ch100-5 to avoid spam trap |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Am 03.07.07 22.52 schrieb Spurious Response:
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 02:31:10 GMT, Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 15:38:29 -0500, Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. Graham "I" was a euphemistic "I", idiot. As in I that represents any joe sixpack homeowner. One does not need 16 Amp per outlet capacity. Good luck plugging in a switchable 1200/1500W electric room heater, when 1200W just don't warm enough or a fix power 1350W type or a decent µ-wave.with 1kW or 1.1kW *output* power, sucking about 1.5kW out of the wall. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Where, at twice the voltage, you need it even less. There's plenty of 3kW equipment here. Graham How about we quit feeding the troll, and quit crossposting as well. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 14:04:20 -0700, the renowned Spurious Response
wrote: On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 04:35:47 GMT, Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Eeyore wrote: Spurious Response wrote: Wolfi wrote: If so, then you surely noticed the lousy Ampère rating of mere 10A for it, which is just 2.3kW, rather than the 3.68kW which you have with a 16A connector system? If I do not need 16 A power feeds as a result of not having any 16 A power requisites, then why would I need a 16 A cord and receptacle system? The standards aren't set around one person's requirements. "I" was a euphemistic "I", idiot. As in I that represents any joe sixpack homeowner. One does not need 16 Amp per outlet capacity. It's widely used in Europe. Graham Where, at twice the voltage, you need it even less. Who wants to be forced to use a puny 1500W appliance such as an electric kettle? 3,000W gets the job done fast. Best regards, Spehro Pefhany -- "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: A 1000 watt kettle would take forever to boil. UK ones are normally 2500/3000 watts. If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. What are those rates ? Graham |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 23:55:05 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote: In article , Spurious Response wrote: Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Was it a Bogen intercom? They are a division of Lear Sigler. I worked there at one time, years ago. Beeping out each line should have been easy. I've yet to see an unmarked multi-pair cable. It may have been individual twisted pair runs to each room. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response writes:
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 11:05:44 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: A 1000 watt kettle would take forever to boil. UK ones are normally 2500/3000 watts. If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. It takes the same amount of energy to boil a quantity of water whether you're using a 1 kW or 3 kW kettle. Infact it would probably take less energy with the 3kW kettle as it gets the job done quicker, which means less losses. It must be nice to be able to build everything higher output, more consumptive. We have to conserve here. Miniaturize. Agreed, but you can't really save on a kettle, unless you switch to some alternate energy source. What types of appliances get used in Japan? High wattage? Low? Other places? Not an appliance, and in Sweden, not Japan, but I have lowered my hosehold energy consumption from 40+ MWh annually to around 18 by converting from direct electrical heating to a rock heat pump, and paying attention to the consumption of appliances. I have a 200 m drilled collector in my back yard that feeds the heat pump. The collector is also used as a source (drain?) for cooling in the summer. One only needs to pump the +8° brine coming from the collector through a few convectors, no need to run any compressor. I'm currently installing the air conditioning parts of the system, which when finished will provide about 10 kW of cooling power for about 300 W of input power to run a brine pump and the fans in the convectors. Theoretically it will also warm up the collector slightly, which improves winter operation, but that is marginal, if any. Oh, and while were talking about electrical systems, domestic feeds in Sweden are almost universally 400V three phase. My main fuses are 25A. When we bought the house in 1987 it had 20A fuses, and electrical heating. One of the main fuses would occasionally trip in the winter when the washer and stove was used, while the radiators were running on full blast. Switching to 25A fuses solved that. After the heatpump conversion I can most likely go back to 20A fuses and save some on the electrical bill. When we bought the house, the stove, washer, dryer, boiler and sauna were all wired for three phase 400V operation. The radiators were 400V two phase. The new washer and dryer are single phase 230V units, and we've ripped out the sauna and the heatpump produces the hot water, so the stove and heatpump are the only remaining three phase consumers. |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote:
If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. Apart from the fact that the energy used in a more powerful kettle is slightly less, the rates in California appear to be about 12-15c/kWhr, compared with my UK rate of 9p (~18c). The big difference in costs here is that the climate is such that we don't need (and most of us don't have) air- conditioning. Paul Burke |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On 3 Jul, 19:05, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article . com, wrote: On 2 Jul, 16:45, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: In article .com, wrote: Who cares? I unplug and plug in items that are turned on all the time, worst case you get a little spark, it doesn't cause any problems. It's not hot enough to pit the plug prongs or contacts. Its well known that repeated small sparks make a total mess of the contact surface. This was one of the problems of our olf round pin system half a century ago. You'd have to explain that. Most of the old round pin sockets were switched - unswitched was a short lived fashion with 13 amp stuff. At least in my experience. The old round pin sockets were far more likely to be overloaded, though. Round pin systems did not consistently have good contact arrangement, leading to frequent bad connections between plug & socket, producing the same type of damage as occurs with unswitched sockets. I'd say it depended on the quality of the fitting The problem is transmittable, thus only one bad socket was needed for the problem to occur and spread to the others. So good sockets went down too. The way it occurs is one bad contact occurs, the plug pins get damaged, and when damaged pins are inserted into a good socket, bad contact occurs due to copper oxide and a rough surface. So the good socket is damaged. Plug something else into it, that plug gets damaged etc. Slow process, but have seen it happen. AFAIK its the only electrically transmissible disease :) - given most plug/socket arrangements have round pins. Including the heavy duty BS4343 type. Nowt wrong with round pins. The problem is that some of the older sockets didnt implement contact springing, either at all or effectively. Sometimes the split plug pin was the only sprung part, which is no good at all on 15A 3 pin plugs. NT |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On 4 Jul, 22:59, Spurious Response
wrote: On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 11:05:44 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: A 1000 watt kettle would take forever to boil. UK ones are normally 2500/3000 watts. If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. It must be nice to be able to build everything higher output, more consumptive. We have to conserve here. Miniaturize. Wrong way round. A 3kW kettle takes less energy to boil a given amount of water, not more. The energy required to heat the water (and nothing else) is the same regardless of power, but the heat losses are larger with a 1kW kettle, since it takes apx 3x as long, losing about 3x as much heat to the air. NT |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Thomas Tornblom wrote in :
Switching to 25A fuses solved that. After the heatpump conversion I can most likely go back to 20A fuses and save some on the electrical bill. How would going to 20A fuses save some on the electric bill? -- bz 73 de N5BZ k please pardon my infinite ignorance, the set-of-things-I-do-not-know is an infinite set. remove ch100-5 to avoid spam trap |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
bz writes:
Thomas Tornblom wrote in : Switching to 25A fuses solved that. After the heatpump conversion I can most likely go back to 20A fuses and save some on the electrical bill. How would going to 20A fuses save some on the electric bill? There are two parts to the bill, one consumption part, which obviosuly is not affected by this, and then a fixed part, which is dependent on the installed main fuse. The weaker the fuse, the less the fixed part is. When we moved in there was different tariffs for 16, 20, 25, 35A, but after a few years they dropped the 16 and 20 A tariffs. Now they are reinstating them. It will increase the fixed part by about $150 a year, which is not enough for me to bother. I rather not have to get out and replace blown fuses. :-) -- bz 73 de N5BZ k Thomas |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
On Thu, 05 Jul 2007 09:05:33 +0100, Paul Burke
wrote: Spurious Response wrote: If you paid California electric rates, you wouldn't use it very many times a year. Apart from the fact that the energy used in a more powerful kettle is slightly less, the rates in California appear to be about 12-15c/kWhr, compared with my UK rate of 9p (~18c). The big difference in costs here is that the climate is such that we don't need (and most of us don't have) air- conditioning. Paul Burke We pay a sliding scale for electricity here in San Francisco, from about 10 cents to as much as 22, nonlinear on consumption, to encourage saving. But we gat our heat and cooking from natural gas, and don't have a/c. At 7 AM, July 5, the forced-air heat is on. We pay more for gas than for electricity, maybe $200 a month total for both. John |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
bz wrote:
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in : bz wrote: Figuring out what fed what was fun. Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Bet you got a 'buzz' out of that. Actually, all the speakers were 25 volt line, so I used a McMartin background music receiver to find the speakers -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
Spurious Response wrote:
On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 21:23:06 GMT, "Michael A. Terrell" wrote: bz wrote: Figuring out what fed what was fun. Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Was it a Bogen intercom? They are a division of Lear Sigler. I worked there at one time, years ago. Dukane Beeping out each line should have been easy. Some of the speakers were over 1000' from that junction box and down multiple turns in the hallways. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Internal wiring of USA v UK mains plug
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article , Spurious Response wrote: Try figuring out where 50+ pairs of audio cables go on a large school intercom system, after some idiot kid rips all the wires loose, AND removes the tags. It took two full 8 hr days. Was it a Bogen intercom? They are a division of Lear Sigler. I worked there at one time, years ago. Beeping out each line should have been easy. I've yet to see an unmarked multi-pair cable. Where did I say it was multi-pair? I said that it was over 50 pairs. Shielded multi-pair audio cables wasn't being used for school intercoms when this system was built, and the architect's specs called for stranded 22 AWG Alpha twisted pair, shielded cable with a plastic jacket. If it was multi-pair, there would be no need to tag the individual pairs, would there? I DID use 66 series 25 pair terminal blocks to rewire that cabinet, so you could flip out a couple bridging clips to troubleshoot the wiring. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
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