Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty cooker.
It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some research on the
net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W are at least the
size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later came across a
transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as small as an
average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it here -
http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they confirmed
the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for right? Any help
would be much appreciated.

James

Ooh, how much? That's pretty.

It might work... make sure you have homeowners or renters insurance.

What kind of cooker? Can't you just use the stove? Or buy a new
cooker? Which would be cheaper?

James Kelly wrote:
I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty cooker.
It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some research on the
net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W are at least the
size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later came across a
transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as small as an
average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it here -
http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they confirmed
the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for right? Any help
would be much appreciated.

My understanding is that the tiny converters are basically TRIAC
switches which switch at a point to deliver the correct amount of RMS
power (but a really funky waveform) to a purely resistive load.

They are not good for sensitive electronics. They might not even be
good for a hairdryer's blower. But, assuming your cooker is just a big
resistive load I think it'll be OK.

I had a co-worker with a "fuzzy logic" rice cooker once and always
kidded him about having to reboot it. So at least some cookers have
some smarts in them and not all are just stupid resistors!

Tim.

On 30 Mar 2006 11:39:13 -0800, "Tim Shoppa"
wrote:

James Kelly wrote:
I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty cooker.
It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some research on the
net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W are at least the
size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later came across a
transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as small as an
average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it here -
http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they confirmed
the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for right? Any help
would be much appreciated.

My understanding is that the tiny converters are basically TRIAC
switches which switch at a point to deliver the correct amount of RMS
power (but a really funky waveform) to a purely resistive load.

My understanding is, that some of the cheaper '230 to 115 volt
converters' just contain a diode.
Which indeed halfs the applied power :-)

Do you get what you pay for ? Sure.
Peanuts for monkeys :-)

Just one word of advice: DON'T :-)

--
Kind regards,
Gerard Bok

"Gerard Bok"

My understanding is, that some of the cheaper '230 to 115 volt
converters' just contain a diode.


** Then you have no "understanding" of the issue.


Which indeed halfs the applied power :-)


** Shame that a resistive load operating from DOUBLE supply voltage
requires the power to be reduced by a factor of FOUR !!

Using just a diode will supply the load with DOUBLE its safe power level.

MADNESS.



....... Phil

Gerard Bok wrote:
On 30 Mar 2006 11:39:13 -0800, "Tim Shoppa"
wrote:
My understanding is that the tiny converters are basically TRIAC
switches which switch at a point to deliver the correct amount of RMS
power (but a really funky waveform) to a purely resistive load.

My understanding is, that some of the cheaper '230 to 115 volt
converters' just contain a diode.
Which indeed halfs the applied power :-)

Auugggh! Noooooo!!!! Nooooooooo!!!!!!

The "DIODE CUTS AC POWER DISSIPATION TO SAME AS HALF ORIGINAL VOLTAGE
IN RESISTIVE LOAD" thread rears its ugly head yet again!!!!!!

I'm sorry I ever posted in this thread!!!!!!! In my defense I NEVER
used the word diode!!!!! Nor did I ever say "Root Mean Square"!!!! I am
innocent, I tell you, INNOCENT!!!!

Tim.

On 30 Mar 2006 11:39:13 -0800, the renowned "Tim Shoppa"
wrote:

James Kelly wrote:
I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty cooker.
It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some research on the
net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W are at least the
size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later came across a
transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as small as an
average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it here -
http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they confirmed
the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for right? Any help
would be much appreciated.

My understanding is that the tiny converters are basically TRIAC
switches which switch at a point to deliver the correct amount of RMS
power (but a really funky waveform) to a purely resistive load.

They are not good for sensitive electronics. They might not even be
good for a hairdryer's blower. But, assuming your cooker is just a big
resistive load I think it'll be OK.

I had a co-worker with a "fuzzy logic" rice cooker once and always
kidded him about having to reboot it. So at least some cookers have
some smarts in them and not all are just stupid resistors!

Tim.

My new rice cooker is neuro-fuzzy. Just about perfect rice, but it
takes longer than my old National (Matsu****a) rice cooker (which has
worked flawlessly for decades).


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

On 30 Mar 2006 11:39:13 -0800, "Tim Shoppa"
Gave us:

James Kelly wrote:
I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty cooker.
It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some research on the
net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W are at least the
size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later came across a
transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as small as an
average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it here -
http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they confirmed
the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for right? Any help
would be much appreciated.

My understanding is that the tiny converters are basically TRIAC
switches which switch at a point to deliver the correct amount of RMS
power (but a really funky waveform) to a purely resistive load.

They are not good for sensitive electronics. They might not even be
good for a hairdryer's blower. But, assuming your cooker is just a big
resistive load I think it'll be OK.

I had a co-worker with a "fuzzy logic" rice cooker once and always
kidded him about having to reboot it. So at least some cookers have
some smarts in them and not all are just stupid resistors!

Tim.

Good answer!

There is certainly no transformer in that device!

It would be a very bad thing for electronic circuits with brains.

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W
are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later
came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as
small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it
here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they
confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for
right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James


The 50W rating is for a 3 minute shave.....

The 1600W figure is Peak Shaving Power Output, PSPO.

DNA

James Kelly wrote:
I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However,
I later came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W
and is as small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10.

Note that the power converter (it is not a transformer) isn't rated for
continuous use. I'm not sure whether your cooker application
constitutes 'continuous use' - but if it does, prepare to be
disappointed.

"Travis Jordan"

Note that the power converter (it is not a transformer) isn't rated for
continuous use.


** At 1600 watts, it is rated for more load current than the OPs pizza
cooker at 1250 watts.


I'm not sure whether your cooker application
constitutes 'continuous use' - but if it does, prepare to be
disappointed.


** Very unlikely to be any problem.

The chopped sine wave produced by the triac (dimmer) has an * rms * value of
120 volts. However, the "average rectified " value is only 64 volts due to
the peaky waveform since 2/3 of the sine wave is missing ( conduction angle
= 66 degrees out of 180).

The OP's pizza cooker takes a little over 10 amps rms to operate - so
similarly, the "average rectified" current level is just over 5 amps.

The triac inside the "converter" has to pass 5.5 amps *average* current
with a voltage drop of circa 1.5 volts - so the heat dissipation is only
8.3 watts.

Easily managed by a modest heatsink.





......... Phil

Phil,

Just to confirm,( against the general consensus of the group) are you saying
that you think it will work and shouldnt pose any serious danger. (I of
course assume liability!). I might be willing to give this a go just to see
what happens..( wearing rubber gloves of course)!

Regards,
James.



"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...

"Travis Jordan"

Note that the power converter (it is not a transformer) isn't rated for
continuous use.


** At 1600 watts, it is rated for more load current than the OPs pizza
cooker at 1250 watts.


I'm not sure whether your cooker application
constitutes 'continuous use' - but if it does, prepare to be
disappointed.


** Very unlikely to be any problem.

The chopped sine wave produced by the triac (dimmer) has an * rms * value
of 120 volts. However, the "average rectified " value is only 64 volts
due to the peaky waveform since 2/3 of the sine wave is missing (
conduction angle = 66 degrees out of 180).

The OP's pizza cooker takes a little over 10 amps rms to operate - so
similarly, the "average rectified" current level is just over 5 amps.

The triac inside the "converter" has to pass 5.5 amps *average* current
with a voltage drop of circa 1.5 volts - so the heat dissipation is only
8.3 watts.

Easily managed by a modest heatsink.





........ Phil

"James Kelly"

Phil,

Just to confirm,( against the general consensus of the group) are you
saying that you think it will work and shouldnt pose any serious danger.


** Nope.


(I of course assume liability!). I might be willing to give this a go just
to see what happens..( wearing rubber gloves of course)!



** The *peak voltage* of 310 volts, supplied by the triac, will could blow
the electronic timer inside to smithereens.

The peak of a 120 volt AC supply is only 170 volts - you see.


Like Harry said -

"...... do ya feel lucky - punk ? "





......... Phil

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W
are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later
came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as
small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it
here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they
confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for
right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James

Auto-transformers are smaller than transformers because they use the same
windings for primary and secondary.
Iron sheet volume follows.
The reverse effect is that there's no isolation.



"Slurp" a écrit dans le message news:
...

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W
are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later
came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as
small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it
here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and
they
confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for
right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James

On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 13:28:54 +0200, "frischmoutt"
Gave us:

Auto-transformers are smaller than transformers because they use the same
windings for primary and secondary.
Iron sheet volume follows.
The reverse effect is that there's no isolation.

The device he showed a pic of has NO transformer in it, you top
posting, Usenet retard.

That's the normal way to post on most company e-mailers (id; Lotus Notes).
I keep this habit;
Opinions are shared on the topic. I agree with myself.

Thanks for the feedback and the politeness dear Sir.


"Roy L. Fuchs" a écrit dans le message
news: ...
On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 13:28:54 +0200, "frischmoutt"
Gave us:

Auto-transformers are smaller than transformers because they use the same
windings for primary and secondary.
Iron sheet volume follows.
The reverse effect is that there's no isolation.

The device he showed a pic of has NO transformer in it, you top
posting, Usenet retard.

On Sun, 2 Apr 2006 22:24:43 +0200, "frischmoutt"
wrote:

That's the normal way to post on most company e-mailers (id; Lotus Notes).
I keep this habit;

---
You should be _wearing_ a habit, you pretentious little ****.
---

Opinions are shared on the topic. I agree with myself.

---
You're a myopic ass who's living in a fantasy world.

Wanna play on USENET and not get your ears pinned back?

Learn the rules.

1. Don't top post.
2. Use context.

Even for you, how hard can that be to learn?
---

Thanks for the feedback and the politeness dear Sir.

---
Stuff the sarcasm.

I notice that you've conveniently left out any reference to the fact
that Fuchs nailed you because you were too ****ing stupid to realize
that the device was _not_ a transformer, and instead of
acknowledging your error have now decided to go the route of
defending your post based on email posting conventions in your
company.

This is not your company's email, you ****ing twit, this is USENET,
where we'll rip your heart out in an instant if you **** with us.


--
John Fields
Professional Circuit Designer

frischmoutt wrote:
That's the normal way to post on most company e-mailers (id; Lotus
Notes). I keep this habit;

Then please post further comments on your company e-mail system, not on
this Usenet newsgroup.

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide 1000W
are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I later
came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and is as
small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can see it
here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them and they
confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you pay for
right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James


What sort of things do you cook with a 1235 watt cooker???. That's nearly a
third of my electric kettle!!

You sure the rating is not 12350 watts which would be more reasonable. As
someone else hinted - get yourself a £29.99 800W 240V microwave, much safer
and more efficient!

What sort of things do you cook with a 1235 watt cooker???. That's nearly a
third of my electric kettle!!

You sure the rating is not 12350 watts which would be more reasonable. As
someone else hinted - get yourself a £29.99 800W 240V microwave, much safer
and more efficient!



12,350W? That would draw more than 50A at 240V and produce over 42,000
BTU's, that's enough to heat a small house!


1,235W on the other hand is perfectly reasonable for a cooker.

That said, these converters are not transformers, they're essentially
triac light dimmers and will only work for purely resistive loads, such
as an electric cooker.

On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 06:25:46 GMT, James Sweet wrote:


12,350W? That would draw more than 50A at 240V and produce over 42,000
BTU's, that's enough to heat a small house!

Just added up our (cheapo) cooker consumption:-
4 hobs 2000,1500,1500, 1000
grill 2850
oven 2400
if all on at once = 11,250 watts.


Geo

"James Sweet" wrote in message
news:KX3Xf.11335$b07.3845@trnddc05...



What sort of things do you cook with a 1235 watt cooker???. That's nearly
a third of my electric kettle!!

You sure the rating is not 12350 watts which would be more reasonable. As
someone else hinted - get yourself a £29.99 800W 240V microwave, much
safer and more efficient!



12,350W? That would draw more than 50A at 240V and produce over 42,000
BTU's, that's enough to heat a small house!


1,235W on the other hand is perfectly reasonable for a cooker.

Really? My cooker is rated at 12500W, it has a 60A feed at 240V, quite
normal in the UK


That said, these converters are not transformers, they're essentially
triac light dimmers and will only work for purely resistive loads, such as
an electric cooker.

I did not say it wasn't.

Really? My cooker is rated at 12500W, it has a 60A feed at 240V, quite
normal in the UK


Aren't we talking a small portable cooker? A fullsized kitchen range is
normally 50A in the US, but I thought we were discussing a single burner
hotplate type thing or toaster oven?

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I
later came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and
is as small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can
see it here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them
and they confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you
pay for right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James
Note that it says 'converter', not 'transformer'. These units are
basically solid state switchers. They can work well, but with a lot of
caveats. Many units expecting a particular waveform, will hate them. Also,
a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically draw many
times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element switches on.
Whereas a transformer can withstand this sort of momentary overload,
switchers like this have less margin...

Best Wishes

Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.



"Roger Hamlett" wrote in message
...

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I
later came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and
is as small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can
see it here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them
and they confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you
pay for right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James
Note that it says 'converter', not 'transformer'. These units are
basically solid state switchers. They can work well, but with a lot of
caveats. Many units expecting a particular waveform, will hate them. Also,
a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically draw many
times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element switches on.
Whereas a transformer can withstand this sort of momentary overload,
switchers like this have less margin...

Best Wishes

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.


If it doesn't have adequate protection and the triac fails short circuit, it
could put 240V into your oven, which needless to say will cause a lot of
damage or even a fire.

Dave

James Kelly wrote:
Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.


I would highly recommend investing 10 pounds or so in a good ABC fire
extinguisher.

Just a thought.

I'd just watch and make sure it doesn't over heat. It may work. It may not..
I wouldn't be worried about explosion but it could potentialy burn up your
pizza cooker's motor.

- Mike

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.



"Roger Hamlett" wrote in message
...

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I
later came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and
is as small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can
see it here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them
and they confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you
pay for right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James
Note that it says 'converter', not 'transformer'. These units are
basically solid state switchers. They can work well, but with a lot of
caveats. Many units expecting a particular waveform, will hate them.
Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically
draw many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element
switches on. Whereas a transformer can withstand this sort of momentary
overload, switchers like this have less margin...

Best Wishes

Also as with any small appliance don't leave it plugged in when not using it
due to the danger of fire.

- Mike


"Michael Kennedy" wrote in message
...
I'd just watch and make sure it doesn't over heat. It may work. It may
not.. I wouldn't be worried about explosion but it could potentialy burn
up your pizza cooker's motor.

- Mike

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.



"Roger Hamlett" wrote in message
...

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I
later came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and
is as small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can
see it here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them
and they confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you
pay for right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James
Note that it says 'converter', not 'transformer'. These units are
basically solid state switchers. They can work well, but with a lot of
caveats. Many units expecting a particular waveform, will hate them.
Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically
draw many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element
switches on. Whereas a transformer can withstand this sort of momentary
overload, switchers like this have less margin...

Best Wishes

Michael Kennedy wrote:
I'd just watch and make sure it doesn't over heat. It may work. It may not..
I wouldn't be worried about explosion but it could potentialy burn up your
pizza cooker's motor.

- Mike

And also ruin a perfectly good pizza.

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.

I note that the unit doesn't appear to provide a ground
connection. This doesn't exactly give me warm fuzzies...

Greg Neill wrote:
"James Kelly" wrote in message
...

Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.


I note that the unit doesn't appear to provide a ground
connection. This doesn't exactly give me warm fuzzies...




I've never seen any sort of portable cooker that had a ground connection
anyway, mine has a standard 2 prong cord.

"James Sweet" wrote in message
news:AZ3Xf.11337$b07.8640@trnddc05...
Greg Neill wrote:
"James Kelly" wrote in message
...

Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.


I note that the unit doesn't appear to provide a ground
connection. This doesn't exactly give me warm fuzzies...




I've never seen any sort of portable cooker that had a ground connection
anyway, mine has a standard 2 prong cord.

Maybe so, but I'm willing to bet you are in North America, *not* the UK,
which is where the OP is based. Earthed metal bodied kitchen appliances like
bench top cookers are commonplace here.

Different country, continent for that matter- different regulations to
conform to.

dave

On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 21:58:37 +0100, James Kelly wrote:

Yikes, ok so I bought it, its only $10 and I'll take the chance.... Any
danger though? Could this cause the convertor to melt/explode/catch
fire.....? Thanks again everyone.

From the look of the cooker, http://tinyurl.com/fpyjo , it won't like it
at all. The heating elements might be OK with it, but the raggedy
chopped-up waveform will probably confuse its controller.

So I'm going to recommend not even trying it, unless you can verify
that the adapter won't blow up your cooker. (or that the cooker
won't mind the waveform).

Good Luck!
Rich




"Roger Hamlett" wrote in message
...

"James Kelly" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've recently moved to London in the UK and brought along my trusty
cooker. It states that it requires 120V @60/1235 watts. After some
research on the net it was apparant that transformers that provide
1000W are at least the size of a shoebox and around $70-100. However, I
later came across a transformer sold by jWin which rates upto 1600W and
is as small as an average 100w transformer and costs about $10. You can
see it here - http://tinyurl.com/hra3r I called the shop selling them
and they confirmed the specs.... am I wasting my time? You get what you
pay for right? Any help would be much appreciated.

James
Note that it says 'converter', not 'transformer'. These units are
basically solid state switchers. They can work well, but with a lot of
caveats. Many units expecting a particular waveform, will hate them.
Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically
draw many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element
switches on. Whereas a transformer can withstand this sort of momentary
overload, switchers like this have less margin...

Best Wishes

"Roger Hamlett"

Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically draw
many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element switches on.


** What bull**** !

Heating elements use wire with an essentially fixed resistance value.

Won't change by more than few percent from cold to hot.

Never heard of Ni-Chrome ???



......... Phil

"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...

"Roger Hamlett"

Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically
draw many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element
switches on.


** What bull**** !

Heating elements use wire with an essentially fixed resistance value.

Won't change by more than few percent from cold to hot.

Never heard of Ni-Chrome ???
Yes, heard of Ni-Chrome, and a _lot_ of modern equipment, does not use it
(cost)....
Many of the devices like the one being shown, use ceramic printed
elements, which have over 2:1 resistance change from cold to hot. Not as
large as things like Tungsten filament lamps, which typically have over
4:1, but still enough to need to be considered.

Best Wishes

"Roger Hamlett"


Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically
draw many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element
switches on.


** What bull**** !

Heating elements use wire with an essentially fixed resistance value.

Won't change by more than few percent from cold to hot.

Never heard of Ni-Chrome ???


Yes, heard of Ni-Chrome, and a _lot_ of modern equipment, does not use it
(cost)....


** Many cheaper alternatives exist - all with low tempcos.


Many of the devices like the one being shown, use ceramic printed
elements, which have over 2:1 resistance change from cold to hot.


** More absolute BULL****.

The variation is only a few percent.



Not as large as things like Tungsten filament lamps, which typically have
over 4:1,


** Tungsten lamps vary by a ratio of 10:1 or more.

You are just plucking numbers out of you fat bum.





.......... Phil

"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...

"Roger Hamlett"


Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically
draw many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element
switches on.


** What bull**** !

Heating elements use wire with an essentially fixed resistance value.

Won't change by more than few percent from cold to hot.

Never heard of Ni-Chrome ???


Yes, heard of Ni-Chrome, and a _lot_ of modern equipment, does not use
it (cost)....


** Many cheaper alternatives exist - all with low tempcos.


Many of the devices like the one being shown, use ceramic printed
elements, which have over 2:1 resistance change from cold to hot.


** More absolute BULL****.

The variation is only a few percent.



Not as large as things like Tungsten filament lamps, which typically
have over 4:1,


** Tungsten lamps vary by a ratio of 10:1 or more.

You are just plucking numbers out of you fat bum.
I suggest you take your medicine, and stop being rude.
I said 'Tungsten filament lamps', as are used in devices like this for
heating, _not_ for light bulbs. Given that this was a discussion about
heating units, I would hope that anybody using even a few of their brain
cells would understand this. In these applications, the filaments are
typically run under 1000C, and have hot/cold resistances in the order of
4/5:1. 10:1, is the figure for a light heating to around 2200C.
My figures are not 'plucked', but are based upon over 100 different
kitchen applicances, that were tested by a company who I sometimes work
for, as part of designing the electronics to feed a mains socket, from a
DC inverter, in a caravan. They took peak current readings (this working
off normal rated mains, so the inverter was not causing the difference),
with a recording meter, for just about every kitchen appliance (waffle
irons, kettles etc.), that they could borrow. We were suprised to find
that most modern units of this sort (grilling units etc.), had higher
inrush currents than we expected. Over 30%, drew nearly twice the current
on 'switch on', that they drew when running. Most drew between this, and
4* the current expected. Just two, drew slightly more than this (peaking
at 6.2*). The commonest heating elements, on dismantling a few units, were
effectively PCB's printed on a ceramic substrate, while the units
exhibiting the highest surge, had glass lamps running between dull red,
through to a bright red heat. Countries of origin, ranged from the UK,
Italy, and Japan, yet none (except one old kettle), behaved as a normal
ni-chrome heating element would behave.

Best Wishes

In article , Phil Allison wrote:

"Roger Hamlett"

Also, a 'cooker', that is rated at 1235W when running, will typically draw
many times this rating for a few seconds whenever the element switches on.


** What bull**** !

Heating elements use wire with an essentially fixed resistance value.

Won't change by more than few percent from cold to hot.

Never heard of Ni-Chrome ???

I had nichrome have cold resistance half its hot resistance. Less of a
change than most other metals - most metals have resistance about
proportional to absolute temperature. Tungsten has resistance varying
even more drastically with temperature than proportional to absolute
temperature.

- Don Klipstein )