Whats wrong with my Telly then????
 

I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

Albert Grennock:
You are on the right track BUT do NOT modify the circuitry with changing
resistance values. More than likely the problem you are seeing is due to
faulty, dry, or high ESR electrolytics in the vertical deflection circuitry.
If you do not have an ESR meter then you must just replace suspected caps
...... or.....
TAKE it to a service shop for what should be a fairly inexpensive repair.
Do not wait until it develops further problems or the repair price will be
higher. Get a repair cost estimate so you can make an intelligent repair
decision.
--
Best Regards,
Daniel Sofie
Electronics Supply & Repair
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???


Yes, I already told you what it might be, Albert. Weren't the replies in
your last thread on the exact same subject good enough? You were given good
and sensible advice, especially about staying out of service menus and not
making adjustments. Don't ignore it unless you want a whole lot more grief.

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??


Maybe, just like fitting a 2,000,000 gallon expansion tank to your car will
'fix' a radiator leak. Something is clearly wrong, I'd expect some
components to fail fairly soon, probably after you do something catastrophic
and void the warranty.

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.


You said it would be a hassle to take it back to where you bought it. If you
aren't happy, and you cannot source the fault yourself, then that's what you
need to do, like it or not. If you really cannot get back to the shop, try
contacting the manufacturer. Either that or get it fixed locally at your own
cost.

If you do decide on the most sensible course of action and get a
refund/repair under warranty, don't be surprised if they refuse on the
grounds that you've tinkered with it.

Go on Albert, use the warranty, that's what they're there for!

Dave

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???


Yes, I already told you what it might be, Albert. Weren't the replies in
your last thread on the exact same subject good enough?

I like to get a variety of opinions, the fault could be a caused by a number
of things.
It might simply be that a component, resistor/pot is slightly out of spec.


You were given good
and sensible advice, especially about staying out of service menus and not
making adjustments.

Well as it turned out that adjustment is probably not in the service menu
(assuming it has one) anyway as there is a pot to do the job so that advice
was not much help anyway really. As I explained it is very unlikely I could
have
or would have done any damage using any service menu anyway, I think it
would
have been fairly obvious whether I would be able to use the facility safely
or not.
Also even if I did break it I would just say take it back to the shop and
say that
it was like that when it came out of the box, so I had nothing to lose by
trying.
No more immoral than selling a faulty set in the first place.

Don't ignore it unless you want a whole lot more grief.

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??


Maybe, just like fitting a 2,000,000 gallon expansion tank to your car
will
'fix' a radiator leak. Something is clearly wrong, I'd expect some
components to fail fairly soon, probably after you do something
catastrophic
and void the warranty.

Might be the radiator cap is just not screwed on properly, any how your idea
would probably need new engine to shift the extra weight.


Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.


You said it would be a hassle to take it back to where you bought it. If
you
aren't happy, and you cannot source the fault yourself, then that's what
you
need to do, like it or not. If you really cannot get back to the shop, try
contacting the manufacturer. Either that or get it fixed locally at your
own
cost.

If you do decide on the most sensible course of action and get a
refund/repair under warranty, don't be surprised if they refuse on the
grounds that you've tinkered with it.

Go on Albert, use the warranty, that's what they're there for!

It doesn't have a warenty as such, just my basic consumer rights to
return faulty goods, which I will be exercising and getting my money
back. They will not be able to prove I have tinkered with it anyway,
I don't consider taking the back off it tinkering with it.


Means cost time and effort taking it back, I doubt they will refund
that, I will consider myself lucky to get my money back.

It was not the model I wished to buy anyway due to their instore
trickery ie putting it on display with boxed models of a different
model below it, which show the low morality of the store selling
it, which is why I expect to have trouble getting a refund.

However if I do have any trouble getting a refund I will get a refund
the technicality that it is described as a 21" set when infact the screen
size is much closer to 20", a clear misrepresention which under
UK law entitles me to a refund. Infact I would probably be better off
not mentioning the other fault at all.
So three faults in all, mis-sold, mis reprentated and faulty - not bad going
eh?
You would think a store like that would go bust however they have a
virtual monopoly in the market so they can see whatever crap they like.

The store is Currys by the way part of the Dixons group
http://dsgportal01.dixons.co.uk/wps/portal/dixonsURL when you
go to an out of town shopping centre they own all bar one of the
shops selling electrical goods, pretty shocking really as far as
competition goes.
This kind of virtual monopoly should be illegal, and would be if
out politicians had not failed us.


Dave

"sofie" wrote in message
...
Albert Grennock:
You are on the right track BUT do NOT modify the circuitry with changing
resistance values. More than likely the problem you are seeing is due to
faulty, dry, or high ESR electrolytics in the vertical deflection
circuitry.
If you do not have an ESR meter then you must just replace suspected caps
..... or.....
TAKE it to a service shop for what should be a fairly inexpensive repair.
Do not wait until it develops further problems or the repair price will be
higher. Get a repair cost estimate so you can make an intelligent repair
decision.


The product is only a few days old so I will be getting my money back
(hopefully).
They can have it repaired it they wish but I imagine it will be dumped in a
skip.
They probably only cost £30 to make anyway, the other £100 being
'overheads'.


--
Best Regards,
Daniel Sofie
Electronics Supply & Repair
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

The product is only a few days old so I will be getting my money back
(hopefully).
They can have it repaired it they wish but I imagine it will be dumped in
a
skip.
They probably only cost £30 to make anyway, the other £100 being
'overheads'.


I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

Thanks for your input sunshine!!

"kip" wrote in message
.. .


The product is only a few days old so I will be getting my money back
(hopefully).
They can have it repaired it they wish but I imagine it will be dumped
in
a
skip.
They probably only cost £30 to make anyway, the other £100 being
'overheads'.


I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 23:03:38 GMT, "Albert Grennock"
wrote:

I bought a new
^^^

Warranty? Replacement by the retailer? :-)

Tom

Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

Tom !
The Guy is thick as two short planks ....
Forget about him .

kip
"Tom MacIntyre" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 23:03:38 GMT, "Albert Grennock"
wrote:

I bought a new
^^^

Warranty? Replacement by the retailer? :-)

Tom

Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

"kip" wrote in message
.. .
Tom !
The Guy is thick as two short planks ....

Which still leaves me with plenty more brains than you :O)

Forget about him .

kip
"Tom MacIntyre" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 23:03:38 GMT, "Albert Grennock"
wrote:

I bought a new
^^^

Warranty? Replacement by the retailer? :-)

Tom

Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.

The product is only a few days old so I will be getting my money back
(hopefully).
They can have it repaired it they wish but I imagine it will be dumped in a
skip.
They probably only cost £30 to make anyway, the other £100 being
'overheads



You opened your new TV, adjusted the circuit, and now you want your
money back? If the store were mine I'd throw you and the TV out the door.

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???


Yes, I already told you what it might be, Albert. Weren't the replies in
your last thread on the exact same subject good enough?

I like to get a variety of opinions, the fault could be a caused by a
number
of things.

Or you were hoping someone would post what you wanted to hear. It isn't
going to happen.

It might simply be that a component, resistor/pot is slightly out of spec.


And? That would still not be something you should interfere with.


You were given good
and sensible advice, especially about staying out of service menus and
not
making adjustments.

Well as it turned out that adjustment is probably not in the service menu
(assuming it has one) anyway as there is a pot to do the job so that
advice
was not much help anyway really.

*You* mentioned service menus, you were given sound advice about service
menus. What's the problem?

As I explained it is very unlikely I could
have
or would have done any damage using any service menu anyway,

Wrong. This was explained to you.

I think it
would
have been fairly obvious whether I would be able to use the facility
safely
or not.

Yes- it is obvious, you're right! If you'd been let loose in a service menu,
you'd have made things worse.

Also even if I did break it I would just say take it back to the shop and
say that
it was like that when it came out of the box, so I had nothing to lose by
trying.
No more immoral than selling a faulty set in the first place.


You have some evidence that the shop knew it was faulty? Have you any idea
how many TVs the Dixons/Currys group sells in a day? Do you expect them to
check every single one?

Don't ignore it unless you want a whole lot more grief.

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??


Maybe, just like fitting a 2,000,000 gallon expansion tank to your car
will
'fix' a radiator leak. Something is clearly wrong, I'd expect some
components to fail fairly soon, probably after you do something
catastrophic
and void the warranty.

Might be the radiator cap is just not screwed on properly, any how your
idea
would probably need new engine to shift the extra weight.


Fantastic.


Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.


You said it would be a hassle to take it back to where you bought it. If
you
aren't happy, and you cannot source the fault yourself, then that's what
you
need to do, like it or not. If you really cannot get back to the shop,
try
contacting the manufacturer. Either that or get it fixed locally at your
own
cost.

If you do decide on the most sensible course of action and get a
refund/repair under warranty, don't be surprised if they refuse on the
grounds that you've tinkered with it.

Go on Albert, use the warranty, that's what they're there for!

It doesn't have a warenty as such,

Yes you do.

just my basic consumer rights to
return faulty goods,

I'd be very surprised if there isn't a manufacturer's warranty as well.
Either way, so what?

which I will be exercising and getting my money
back. They will not be able to prove I have tinkered with it anyway,
I don't consider taking the back off it tinkering with it.


You're kidding? Few if any manufacturers would honour a warranty in such
circumstances. It would be a reasonable assumption by the manufacturer that
if you went inside, you 'tinkered' in some way.


Means cost time and effort taking it back, I doubt they will refund
that,

Of course not.

I will consider myself lucky to get my money back.


Quite, judging by your attitude so far. For most people, it would be a case
of walking into Dixons, saying,

'I wonder if you could help me, I bought this TV x number of days ago. It is
not the model I chose, and it has a fault. I have returned it in the
condition I received it in. could you please exchange it or give me a
refund.'

Upon which, the consumer would be leaving with a shiny new TV or a refund.

For you, I suspect it won't be such a pleasant experience!

It was not the model I wished to buy anyway due to their instore
trickery ie putting it on display with boxed models of a different
model below it, which show the low morality of the store selling
it, which is why I expect to have trouble getting a refund.


I don't think you can blame the store 100% for that.

However if I do have any trouble getting a refund I will get a refund
the technicality that it is described as a 21" set when infact the screen
size is much closer to 20", a clear misrepresention which under
UK law entitles me to a refund.

Wrong. CRTs are measured from outside corner edge to corner edge of the
actual CRT assembly before fitting to the TV, not the viewable area like
TFTs. A 21" CRT will correctly measure 20" or less diagonally viewable
space. That's the way it's always been. If you try that approach, they'll
laugh you out of the store.

Infact I would probably be better off
not mentioning the other fault at all.

Then they would be within their rights to tell you where to go, and have a
good chuckle.

So three faults in all, mis-sold, mis reprentated and faulty - not bad
going
eh?

If it were true, but it isn't.

You would think a store like that would go bust however they have a
virtual monopoly in the market so they can see whatever crap they like.


Monopoly? Dixons/Currys do not have a monopoly. In any case, if they had a
monopoly, by what logic would they go bust?!

Dave

Typical symptoms of a ******..
**** with the TV then take it back, I guess it takes all kinds.

"Jumpster Jiver" wrote in message
news:ut7Xe.2631$9a2.1606@trnddc04...
The product is only a few days old so I will be getting my money back
(hopefully).
They can have it repaired it they wish but I imagine it will be dumped in
a
skip.
They probably only cost £30 to make anyway, the other £100 being
'overheads



You opened your new TV, adjusted the circuit, and now you want your
money back? If the store were mine I'd throw you and the TV out the
door.

No I am sorry you have got that ever so slightly wrong, they sold be a
faulty
product and I am entitled to and will get my money back.
The fact that I opened it up in a attempt to fix the problem is neither
here nor there. Had I been able to fix it at my *own* expense it would
have saved *them* the cost of a refund. As it is they will have to cough up.

No doubt if you owned the store you could think up thousands of other
reasons
to refuse a refund, and continue to sell cr*p to the general public at a
handsome
profit.

Any attempt by you to assault me would have resulted in you receiving the
kind
of pasteing the office of fair trading should have given you a long time
ago.

Crooks like you shoud be barred from the retail business.

"kip" wrote in message
.. .
Typical symptoms of a ******..
**** with the TV then take it back, I guess it takes all kinds.

Get back under the bridge.

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???


Yes, I already told you what it might be, Albert. Weren't the replies
in
your last thread on the exact same subject good enough?

I like to get a variety of opinions, the fault could be a caused by a
number
of things.

Or you were hoping someone would post what you wanted to hear. It isn't
going to happen.

It might simply be that a component, resistor/pot is slightly out of
spec.


And? That would still not be something you should interfere with.


You were given good
and sensible advice, especially about staying out of service menus and
not
making adjustments.

Well as it turned out that adjustment is probably not in the service
menu
(assuming it has one) anyway as there is a pot to do the job so that
advice
was not much help anyway really.

*You* mentioned service menus, you were given sound advice about service
menus. What's the problem?

As I explained it is very unlikely I could
have
or would have done any damage using any service menu anyway,

Wrong. This was explained to you.

I think it
would
have been fairly obvious whether I would be able to use the facility
safely
or not.

Yes- it is obvious, you're right! If you'd been let loose in a service
menu,
you'd have made things worse.

Also even if I did break it I would just say take it back to the shop
and
say that
it was like that when it came out of the box, so I had nothing to lose
by
trying.
No more immoral than selling a faulty set in the first place.


You have some evidence that the shop knew it was faulty? Have you any idea
how many TVs the Dixons/Currys group sells in a day? Do you expect them to
check every single one?


Of course, any responsiible retailer would, try sell an untested TV on ebay
and see what kind of bids you get. These people are no better then crooks
and con artists.



Don't ignore it unless you want a whole lot more grief.

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??


Maybe, just like fitting a 2,000,000 gallon expansion tank to your car
will
'fix' a radiator leak. Something is clearly wrong, I'd expect some
components to fail fairly soon, probably after you do something
catastrophic
and void the warranty.

Might be the radiator cap is just not screwed on properly, any how your
idea
would probably need new engine to shift the extra weight.


Fantastic.


Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.


You said it would be a hassle to take it back to where you bought it.
If
you
aren't happy, and you cannot source the fault yourself, then that's
what
you
need to do, like it or not. If you really cannot get back to the shop,
try
contacting the manufacturer. Either that or get it fixed locally at
your
own
cost.

If you do decide on the most sensible course of action and get a
refund/repair under warranty, don't be surprised if they refuse on the
grounds that you've tinkered with it.

Go on Albert, use the warranty, that's what they're there for!

It doesn't have a warenty as such,

Yes you do.

just my basic consumer rights to
return faulty goods,

I'd be very surprised if there isn't a manufacturer's warranty as well.
Either way, so what?



Most of the warrenties are little more than a con to convince you you have
less rights then you actually have. You can expect a television to be fault
free
for at least 5 years, not the one year in their guarantee. The crooks
selling them
want you to think otherwise.
All those 3 and 5 year guarantees they *sell* you are a con as legally you
would expect such products to last that long anyway. It's just another
method
for those seedy crooked retailers to screw more money out of you.
If I had my way the con artists pushing such worthless guarentees would
be spend a good 10 years in jail for their trouble, like any other common
thief.




which I will be exercising and getting my money
back. They will not be able to prove I have tinkered with it anyway,
I don't consider taking the back off it tinkering with it.


You're kidding? Few if any manufacturers would honour a warranty in such
circumstances. It would be a reasonable assumption by the manufacturer
that
if you went inside, you 'tinkered' in some way.


Means cost time and effort taking it back, I doubt they will refund
that,

Of course not.

I will consider myself lucky to get my money back.


Quite, judging by your attitude so far. For most people, it would be a
case
of walking into Dixons, saying,

'I wonder if you could help me, I bought this TV x number of days ago. It
is
not the model I chose, and it has a fault. I have returned it in the
condition I received it in. could you please exchange it or give me a
refund.'

In which case they would refuse a refund because they will say its your
fault
you bought the wrong model.


Upon which, the consumer would be leaving with a shiny new TV or a refund.

For you, I suspect it won't be such a pleasant experience!

It was already unpleasent finding the TV was faulty and will be more hassle
having to return it, I would be better off going to a small claims court and
recovering the costs and inconvienience of returning it as well.
That might ensure they don't sell shoddy good in future.

It was not the model I wished to buy anyway due to their instore
trickery ie putting it on display with boxed models of a different
model below it, which show the low morality of the store selling
it, which is why I expect to have trouble getting a refund.


I don't think you can blame the store 100% for that.


I think I can. It wouldn't have happened if I owned the store, I can assure
you of that, no customer would leave my store with a wrong or faulty
product, I would ensure my staff were trained and did more than stand in
groups chatting about f all.


However if I do have any trouble getting a refund I will get a refund
the technicality that it is described as a 21" set when infact the
screen
size is much closer to 20", a clear misrepresention which under
UK law entitles me to a refund.

Wrong. CRTs are measured from outside corner edge to corner edge of the
actual CRT assembly before fitting to the TV, not the viewable area like
TFTs. A 21" CRT will correctly measure 20" or less diagonally viewable
space. That's the way it's always been. If you try that approach, they'll
laugh you out of the store.

I think you are joking, they might laugh me out of the store but I would
be laughing them out of a small claims court when it ruled in my favour.
They would be laughing even less when they picked up their legal bill.

Legal arguments like "Well we have always been crooked conmen,
and people should realise they will be cheated" don't tend to go down
very well in a decent court of law.





Infact I would probably be better off
not mentioning the other fault at all.

Then they would be within their rights to tell you where to go, and have a
good chuckle.

I doubt they will be chuckling with a broken jaw.


So three faults in all, mis-sold, mis reprentated and faulty - not bad
going
eh?

If it were true, but it isn't.

You would think a store like that would go bust however they have a
virtual monopoly in the market so they can see whatever crap they like.


Monopoly? Dixons/Currys do not have a monopoly. In any case, if they had a
monopoly, by what logic would they go bust?!

Maybe someone might burn all their stores down, use your imagination.


Dave

You have go to be lid of the year...
kip
"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

"kip" wrote in message
.. .
Typical symptoms of a ******..
**** with the TV then take it back, I guess it takes all kinds.

Get back under the bridge.

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

snip


No I am sorry you have got that ever so slightly wrong, they sold be a
faulty
product and I am entitled to and will get my money back.
The fact that I opened it up in a attempt to fix the problem is neither
here nor there.

Saying it does not make it so. You voided your warranty by opening the TV
up- it's that simple. If you feel this is not the case, be sure to tell the
shop you opened it up and attempted to fix it, see what happens.


Had I been able to fix it at my *own* expense it would
have saved *them* the cost of a refund. As it is they will have to cough
up.


It doesn't work like that. You are simply stating your own personal opinions
on how you think the world works. It is a fantasy, get real.

Dave

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...


snip


However if I do have any trouble getting a refund I will get a refund
the technicality that it is described as a 21" set when infact the
screen
size is much closer to 20", a clear misrepresention which under
UK law entitles me to a refund.

Wrong. CRTs are measured from outside corner edge to corner edge of the
actual CRT assembly before fitting to the TV, not the viewable area like
TFTs. A 21" CRT will correctly measure 20" or less diagonally viewable
space. That's the way it's always been. If you try that approach, they'll
laugh you out of the store.

I think you are joking, they might laugh me out of the store but I would
be laughing them out of a small claims court when it ruled in my favour.
They would be laughing even less when they picked up their legal bill.


Are you insane or just trolling? If you doubt how CRTs are measured, go into
any store and ask them, or write to the manufactirers and ask them.

In fact, start a new thread on this NG and ask the question, see what
responses you get.

Legal arguments like "Well we have always been crooked conmen,
and people should realise they will be cheated" don't tend to go down
very well in a decent court of law.



Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as they
come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed part
of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual viewable
space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the competition
for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.




Infact I would probably be better off
not mentioning the other fault at all.

Then they would be within their rights to tell you where to go, and have
a
good chuckle.

I doubt they will be chuckling with a broken jaw.


Oh for heaven's sake.


So three faults in all, mis-sold, mis reprentated and faulty - not bad
going
eh?

If it were true, but it isn't.

You would think a store like that would go bust however they have a
virtual monopoly in the market so they can see whatever crap they like.


Monopoly? Dixons/Currys do not have a monopoly. In any case, if they had
a
monopoly, by what logic would they go bust?!

Maybe someone might burn all their stores down, use your imagination.


You're in laa-laa land, and it appears I've been unknowingly taking
advantage of your incapacity. How callous of me. I promise I won't do it
again ;-)

Dave

Dave D wrote:

snip

Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as they
come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed part
of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual viewable
space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the competition
for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.

Hi...

The OP should try this incredibly simple test. Go and get an
8 x 10 enlargement made of his favorite photograph. Take it home,
measure it, and the piece pf paper will be virtually 8 inches by 10 inches.

Now get another made, this time have it mounted in a beautiful frame.
Take that one home, measure the visible portion of the paper.
Still 8 x 10? Or is some of it covered by the matte or the frame?

Ken

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...


snip


However if I do have any trouble getting a refund I will get a refund
the technicality that it is described as a 21" set when infact the
screen
size is much closer to 20", a clear misrepresention which under
UK law entitles me to a refund.

Wrong. CRTs are measured from outside corner edge to corner edge of the
actual CRT assembly before fitting to the TV, not the viewable area
like
TFTs. A 21" CRT will correctly measure 20" or less diagonally viewable
space. That's the way it's always been. If you try that approach,
they'll
laugh you out of the store.

I think you are joking, they might laugh me out of the store but I would
be laughing them out of a small claims court when it ruled in my favour.
They would be laughing even less when they picked up their legal bill.


Are you insane or just trolling? If you doubt how CRTs are measured, go
into
any store and ask them, or write to the manufactirers and ask them.

In fact, start a new thread on this NG and ask the question, see what
responses you get.

Legal arguments like "Well we have always been crooked conmen,
and people should realise they will be cheated" don't tend to go down
very well in a decent court of law.



Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as they
come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed
part
of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual
viewable
space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the competition
for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.




Infact I would probably be better off
not mentioning the other fault at all.

Then they would be within their rights to tell you where to go, and
have
a
good chuckle.

I doubt they will be chuckling with a broken jaw.


Oh for heaven's sake.


So three faults in all, mis-sold, mis reprentated and faulty - not
bad
going
eh?

If it were true, but it isn't.

You would think a store like that would go bust however they have a
virtual monopoly in the market so they can see whatever crap they
like.


Monopoly? Dixons/Currys do not have a monopoly. In any case, if they
had
a
monopoly, by what logic would they go bust?!

Maybe someone might burn all their stores down, use your imagination.


You're in laa-laa land, and it appears I've been unknowingly taking
advantage of your incapacity. How callous of me. I promise I won't do it
again ;-)

Dave

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...


snip


However if I do have any trouble getting a refund I will get a refund
the technicality that it is described as a 21" set when infact the
screen
size is much closer to 20", a clear misrepresention which under
UK law entitles me to a refund.

Wrong. CRTs are measured from outside corner edge to corner edge of the
actual CRT assembly before fitting to the TV, not the viewable area
like
TFTs. A 21" CRT will correctly measure 20" or less diagonally viewable
space. That's the way it's always been. If you try that approach,
they'll
laugh you out of the store.

I think you are joking, they might laugh me out of the store but I would
be laughing them out of a small claims court when it ruled in my favour.
They would be laughing even less when they picked up their legal bill.


Are you insane or just trolling? If you doubt how CRTs are measured, go
into
any store and ask them, or write to the manufactirers and ask them.

In fact, start a new thread on this NG and ask the question, see what
responses you get.

Legal arguments like "Well we have always been crooked conmen,
and people should realise they will be cheated" don't tend to go down
very well in a decent court of law.



Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as they
come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed
part
of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual
viewable
space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the competition
for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.



You don't understand the contract law when you say you will supply
10 tonnes of **** you must supply 10 tonnes of ****, not 9.5 tonnes
of weighable ****. Get real.






Infact I would probably be better off
not mentioning the other fault at all.

Then they would be within their rights to tell you where to go, and
have
a
good chuckle.

I doubt they will be chuckling with a broken jaw.


Oh for heaven's sake.


So three faults in all, mis-sold, mis reprentated and faulty - not
bad
going
eh?

If it were true, but it isn't.

You would think a store like that would go bust however they have a
virtual monopoly in the market so they can see whatever crap they
like.


Monopoly? Dixons/Currys do not have a monopoly. In any case, if they
had
a
monopoly, by what logic would they go bust?!

Maybe someone might burn all their stores down, use your imagination.


You're in laa-laa land, and it appears I've been unknowingly taking
advantage of your incapacity. How callous of me. I promise I won't do it
again ;-)

Your just a simpleton.


Dave

"Ken Weitzel" wrote in message
news:PoyXe.516091$5V4.39970@pd7tw3no...


Dave D wrote:

snip

Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as
they
come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed
part
of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual
viewable
space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the
competition
for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.

Hi...

The OP should try this incredibly simple test. Go and get an
8 x 10 enlargement made of his favorite photograph. Take it home,
measure it, and the piece pf paper will be virtually 8 inches by 10
inches.

Now get another made, this time have it mounted in a beautiful frame.
Take that one home, measure the visible portion of the paper.
Still 8 x 10? Or is some of it covered by the matte or the frame?


If you tried an arguement like that iin court you might escape imprisonment
one the grounds of diminished resposiblity. You would probably have to
cretified insane by a panel of doctor though.
Either way you aer going to locked up for a very long time.

Ken

Albert Grennock wrote:
"Ken Weitzel" wrote in message
news:PoyXe.516091$5V4.39970@pd7tw3no...


Dave D wrote:

snip

Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as

they

come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed

part

of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual

viewable

space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the

competition

for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.

Hi...

The OP should try this incredibly simple test. Go and get an
8 x 10 enlargement made of his favorite photograph. Take it home,
measure it, and the piece pf paper will be virtually 8 inches by 10

inches.

Now get another made, this time have it mounted in a beautiful frame.
Take that one home, measure the visible portion of the paper.
Still 8 x 10? Or is some of it covered by the matte or the frame?



If you tried an arguement like that iin court you might escape imprisonment
one the grounds of diminished resposiblity. You would probably have to
cretified insane by a panel of doctor though.
Either way you aer going to locked up for a very long time.

Darn, I guess I'm going to jail for a very long time, then.

I'd never get away with pleading insanity, if for no other reason than
that I can spell in, on, responsibility, certified, and are. Heck, I
even know that a panel of doctor makes no sense. I would've said
panel of Doctors :)

None of my business, but if I may, wonder what country you're in?

Ken

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???


Yes, I already told you what it might be, Albert. Weren't the replies in
your last thread on the exact same subject good enough?

I like to get a variety of opinions, the fault could be a caused by a
number
of things.
It might simply be that a component, resistor/pot is slightly out of spec.


Ha, ha, you funny boy! Maybe it was caused by a high-energy gamma ray
slicing through the component! Do you happen to live 35,000 feet above see
level? I'm glad you took the lid off of your new "telly" and immediately
started "troubleshooting". You are an adventurous person who wants to
explore their world, not content to mingle with the herd shuffling off to
the customer service desk. Grab the oscilloscope, heat up the soldering
iron, start swapping out surface-mount and ball-grid-array ICs until you've
fixed the problem!! Yeah!!!

Don't ever stop being you Albert.

"PabloRena --- AnalProbe" wrote in message
. ..

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???


Yes, I already told you what it might be, Albert. Weren't the replies
in
your last thread on the exact same subject good enough?

I like to get a variety of opinions, the fault could be a caused by a
number
of things.
It might simply be that a component, resistor/pot is slightly out of
spec.


Ha, ha, you funny boy! Maybe it was caused by a high-energy gamma ray
slicing through the component! Do you happen to live 35,000 feet above
see
level? I'm glad you took the lid off of your new "telly" and immediately
started "troubleshooting". You are an adventurous person who wants to
explore their world, not content to mingle with the herd shuffling off to
the customer service desk. Grab the oscilloscope, heat up the soldering
iron, start swapping out surface-mount and ball-grid-array ICs until
you've
fixed the problem!! Yeah!!!

Having a degree in electronics I think I will manage comfortably without
an oscilloscope.


Don't ever stop being you Albert.

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

[snip]
Having a degree in electronics I think I will manage comfortably without
an oscilloscope.

ROFLMAO - that just has to be the biggest laugh I've had all day. Next
you'll be telling us you have a degree in Law :)

"Anna Daptor" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

[snip]
Having a degree in electronics I think I will manage comfortably without
an oscilloscope.

ROFLMAO - that just has to be the biggest laugh I've had all day. Next
you'll be telling us you have a degree in Law :)

Yea I bet you have a Duke of Edinburgh award in soldering,
no doubt with a credit, and now consider your self an electronics
xpert.

"Dave D" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

snip


No I am sorry you have got that ever so slightly wrong, they sold be a
faulty
product and I am entitled to and will get my money back.
The fact that I opened it up in a attempt to fix the problem is neither
here nor there.

Saying it does not make it so. You voided your warranty by opening the TV
up- it's that simple. If you feel this is not the case, be sure to tell
the
shop you opened it up and attempted to fix it, see what happens.


Had I been able to fix it at my *own* expense it would
have saved *them* the cost of a refund. As it is they will have to cough
up.


It doesn't work like that. You are simply stating your own personal
opinions
on how you think the world works. It is a fantasy, get real.

Dont be such a tw*t.


Dave

"Ken Weitzel" wrote in message
news:gdCXe.522593$s54.103564@pd7tw2no...


Albert Grennock wrote:
"Ken Weitzel" wrote in message
news:PoyXe.516091$5V4.39970@pd7tw3no...


Dave D wrote:

snip

Not conmen, this is the way it's done, by all manufacturers AFAIK. It
stemmed from the technical identification/part number of the CRTs as

they

come from the manufacturer. The diagonal size of the entire CRT formed

part

of the part number.

Some manufacturers might point this discrepency out, others may not.
Personally I feel it is a bad way to measure CRTs, and misleading, but
that's not the point. For a single manufacturer to change to actual

viewable

space measuring, they would have to sell larger CRTs than the

competition

for the same money, while few people would probably notice the 1" or so
increase.

It would be nice if all manufacturers could agree on the change, but it
won't likely happen now- CRTs are near the end of their life.

Hi...

The OP should try this incredibly simple test. Go and get an
8 x 10 enlargement made of his favorite photograph. Take it home,
measure it, and the piece pf paper will be virtually 8 inches by 10

inches.

Now get another made, this time have it mounted in a beautiful frame.
Take that one home, measure the visible portion of the paper.
Still 8 x 10? Or is some of it covered by the matte or the frame?



If you tried an arguement like that iin court you might escape
imprisonment
one the grounds of diminished resposiblity. You would probably have to
cretified insane by a panel of doctor though.
Either way you aer going to locked up for a very long time.

Darn, I guess I'm going to jail for a very long time, then.

I'd never get away with pleading insanity, if for no other reason than
that I can spell in, on, responsibility, certified, and are. Heck, I
even know that a panel of doctor makes no sense. I would've said
panel of Doctors :)

None of my business, but if I may, wonder what country you're in?

You can wonder all you like if your mind is capable of any higher level
functionality.



Ken

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.




Here is one of those who runs the Dixons group, does he look
like a criminal to you too?
http://dsgportal01.dixons.co.uk/wps/portal/!ut/p/.cmd/cs/.ce/7_0_A/.s/7_0_GQ/_s.7_0_A/7_0_GQ
Would you trust this guy with your money?
http://dsgportal01.dixons.co.uk/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_GR/.cmd/ad/.c/6_3_1EO/.ce/7_1_251/.p/5_1_1BS/.d/0?PC_7_1_251_contentID=20341519#7_1_251

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...
I bought a new Ferguson FTV210N 21" television and it
seems the picture is too big vertically I eventually found a
'pot' (potentiometer) which seems to control the picture hight
but even at maximum adjust the picture is still too (big slightly).
(There didn't seem to a similar pot to do the same thing
horizontally, incidently, is this normal?)

Any ideas as to what is the problem???

I mean surely adding a bit more resistance would fix it??

Initially I though the problem might be 'fixable' in the TV's
service mode (is it indeed has one) but the pot controls it.




Here is one of those who runs the Dixons group, does he look
like a criminal to you too?

http://dsgportal01.dixons.co.uk/wps/portal/!ut/p/.cmd/cs/.ce/7_0_A/.s/7_0_GQ/_s.7_0_A/7_0_GQ
Would you trust this guy with your money?

http://dsgportal01.dixons.co.uk/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_GR/.cmd/ad/.c/6_3_1EO/.ce/7_1_251/.p/5_1_1BS/.d/0?PC_7_1_251_contentID=20341519#7_1_251


And here is another 'likely lad' Ladbrokes eh? Was that in the period
were they were caught rigging starting prices to swindle their customers?



http://dsgportal01.dixons.co.uk/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_GR/.cmd/ad/.c/6_3_1EO/.ce/7_1_251/.p/5_1_1BS/.d/4?PC_7_1_251_contentID=20342519#7_1_251

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...


snip


It doesn't work like that. You are simply stating your own personal
opinions
on how you think the world works. It is a fantasy, get real.

Dont be such a tw*t.


OK Albert, I'm done here. I've tried to be reasonable and help you to take
the right course of action. The thing is, I have nothing to gain either way-
I couldn't really care less whether you fry your TV or not.

Goodbye.

Dave

I really don't know why you Guys have put up with his stupidity this long.




"Albert Grennock" wrote in message

Dont be such a tw*t.



I couldn't really care less whether you fry your TV or not.

Goodbye.

Dave

"kip" wrote in message
.. .
I really don't know why you Guys have put up with his stupidity this long.


It's a bit like picking a scab. It's painful but addictive!

Dave

"Albert Grennock" wrote in message
...


snip


It doesn't work like that. You are simply stating your own personal
opinions
on how you think the world works. It is a fantasy, get real.

Dont be such a tw*t.


OK Albert, I'm done here. I've tried to be reasonable and help you to
take
the right course of action. The thing is, I have nothing to gain
either way-
I couldn't really care less whether you fry your TV or not.

Goodbye.

Dave

I really don't know why you Guys have put up with his stupidity this
long.




"Albert Grennock" wrote in message

Dont be such a tw*t.



I couldn't really care less whether you fry your TV or not.

Goodbye.

Dave

"kip" wrote in message
.. .
I really don't know why you Guys have put up with his stupidity this
long.


It's a bit like picking a scab. It's painful but addictive!

Dave

On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 00:46:30 GMT, "Albert Grennock"
wrote:


Well as it turned out that adjustment is probably not in the service menu
(assuming it has one) anyway as there is a pot to do the job so that advice
was not much help anyway really.

Are service menus "necessarilly" mutually-exclusive from adjustment
pots?

Tom

"Tom MacIntyre" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 00:46:30 GMT, "Albert Grennock"
wrote:


Well as it turned out that adjustment is probably not in the service menu
(assuming it has one) anyway as there is a pot to do the job so that
advice
was not much help anyway really.

Are service menus "necessarilly" mutually-exclusive from adjustment
pots?

One would have thought so.
You could wear a belt and braces but it's a rather costly way to dress.




Tom