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Electricity in CA, another close call
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Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This
graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
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On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How come California has such issues? Did you let the leftist weenies ruin your state ?:-) Arizona doesn't have water shortages or power problems... why does CA? ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
Jim Thompson wrote
in : On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How come California has such issues? Did you let the leftist weenies ruin your state ?:-) California has a whole lot more people than Arizona. (6x) for a 10% greater area And the grid in California was f#%ked by the right-wing capitalists like Ken Lay when they forced deregulation on hte unsuspecting weenies (to use your term).. Arizona doesn't have water shortages or power problems... why does CA? California has a whole lot more people than Arizona. ...Jim Thompson -- Bob Quintal PA is y I've altered my email address. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
Jim Thompson wrote:
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How come California has such issues? Did you let the leftist weenies ruin your state ?:-) Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. Arizona doesn't have water shortages or power problems... why does CA? L.A. slurps it all up. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg
wrote: Jim Thompson wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How come California has such issues? Did you let the leftist weenies ruin your state ?:-) Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. Arizona doesn't have water shortages or power problems... why does CA? L.A. slurps it all up. Yes, that's true. L.A. gets its top-off from our APS Nuclear facility in Wintersburg, Arizona. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How close does the "Available Resources Forecast" come to real resources? -- Boris Mohar -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote:
Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 18:31:06 -0700, "Herbert John \"Jackie\" Gleason"
wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:50:06 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: Yes, that's true. L.A. gets its top-off from our APS Nuclear facility in Wintersburg, Arizona. ...Jim Thompson Bull****. LA gets it from the BPS DC Intertie. Your **** is trivial dribs and drabs by comparison. Your ignorance is surpassed only by the size of the Al-Gore-dick in your mouth. Who=the-**** do you think feeds the intertie? ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
dimbulb morphs, again
Herbert John \Jackoff wrote:
Nothing, as usual. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
"Jim Thompson" wrote in message ... snip Yes, that's true. L.A. gets its top-off from our APS Nuclear facility in Wintersburg, Arizona. Is it a top-off or an unrequested fission surplus? ;-) |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 01:08:59 -0500, "Lord Garth"
wrote: "Jim Thompson" wrote in message ... snip Yes, that's true. L.A. gets its top-off from our APS Nuclear facility in Wintersburg, Arizona. Is it a top-off or an unrequested fission surplus? ;-) Actually, more output from that facility goes to California than to Arizona right now. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 21:17:04 -0400, Boris Mohar
wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How close does the "Available Resources Forecast" come to real resources? -- Boris Mohar Enough that they will start rolling blackouts. It happened a few years ago. Areas would get a loss of power for about 1 hour. At any given time, close to a quarter to a half of California's generation capacity is off-line for maintenance and other reasons. Plus, bad policies in Sacramento and stupid voters (deregulation) haven't helped. Shock of all shocks, we got rain, thunder and lightning in So. Cal last night. That's extremely rare! --- Mark |
Electricity in CA, another close call
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:31:48 GMT, qrk wrote:
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 21:17:04 -0400, Boris Mohar wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How close does the "Available Resources Forecast" come to real resources? -- Boris Mohar Enough that they will start rolling blackouts. It happened a few years ago. Areas would get a loss of power for about 1 hour. At any given time, close to a quarter to a half of California's generation capacity is off-line for maintenance and other reasons. Looks like Joerg's graph shows just that. Note the "step-down" from 52,000 to 45,000 at the beginning of the graph. Plus, bad policies in Sacramento and stupid voters (deregulation) haven't helped. And greenies against everything... no fossil fuel powered stations... and nuclear is BAD... just cause ;-) Shock of all shocks, we got rain, thunder and lightning in So. Cal last night. That's extremely rare! --- Mark Last night WAS strange... we had lots of lightning and thunder here, but NO rain. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
Stephen J. Rush wrote:
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. And then some of them tout electric cars. It's pathetic, many of them don't have a clue. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call
Jim Thompson wrote:
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:31:48 GMT, qrk wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 21:17:04 -0400, Boris Mohar wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:21 -0700, Joerg wrote: Just went through a tight electricity supply-demand squeeze again. This graph looks like it was a real close call. Doing our part on conservation here, 91F in the lab, soldering away, occasionally wiping the sweat off before it drips onto the boards. How close does the "Available Resources Forecast" come to real resources? -- Boris Mohar Enough that they will start rolling blackouts. It happened a few years ago. Areas would get a loss of power for about 1 hour. At any given time, close to a quarter to a half of California's generation capacity is off-line for maintenance and other reasons. Looks like Joerg's graph shows just that. Note the "step-down" from 52,000 to 45,000 at the beginning of the graph. Then there is the effect of "Oh, it's hot here in the other state as well so we'll need this chunk of power ourselves now". Yesterday it looked like we really came close. Less than 200MW reserves and that is razor thin when you look at the total. Part of Modesto had a blackout for other reasons. I guess without that we would have seen the lights go out in other places. Plus, bad policies in Sacramento and stupid voters (deregulation) haven't helped. One problem in the beginning of this "energy market scheme" was the reg not to be able to enter into long term hedge contracts. And greenies against everything... no fossil fuel powered stations... and nuclear is BAD... just cause ;-) But they want electric cars. Ha! That would be utter disaster for CA right now. [...] -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:08:13 -0500, flipper wrote:
[snip] Rather, I think it's more that 'greenies' (and to some degree 'liberals' in general) have an almost Cinderella like, bippity boppity boo, 'faith' that 'perfect solutions' (not my job to know how) exist and the only real reason they aren't in place already is due to some 'conspiracy' (and the 'ignorance' of the 'duped' who don't share the same fairy tale). [snip] The proper term is "Pollyanna".... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollyanna ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
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On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 14:45:01 -0500, flipper wrote:
[snip] Besides, I really really wanted to use bippity boppity boo and I could just see fairy godmother turning pumpkins into 'green' power plants ;) Sno-o-o-o-ort ;-) ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
"flipper" wrote in message ... On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 11:08:47 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:08:13 -0500, flipper wrote: [snip] Rather, I think it's more that 'greenies' (and to some degree 'liberals' in general) have an almost Cinderella like, bippity boppity boo, 'faith' that 'perfect solutions' (not my job to know how) exist and the only real reason they aren't in place already is due to some 'conspiracy' (and the 'ignorance' of the 'duped' who don't share the same fairy tale). [snip] The proper term is "Pollyanna".... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollyanna ...Jim Thompson I thought about using that but the basic 'happy', 'friendly', Pollyannaish character that sees good in just about everything, including people, didn't seem to comport with the 'vast conspiracy' outlook of most greenies/liberals and, not the only but, some of the 'un friendliest' things I've run across are greenies/liberals who think you're not. With Cinderella I was thinking of the Disney version with "some day your Prince will come" (he does) as "some day your perfect solution will come" (it will) and 'good things' appearing by 'magic' despite the 'conspiracy' of evil step sisters. Even so it's still infinitely more 'positive' than your, well, I'll say 'hardcore', greenie/liberal because Cinderella doesn't have to 'fight' and 'crush' the 'vast array of evil forces permeating all aspects of society'. Instead, 'good things' just 'naturally' happen to 'happy', friendly', people, or they transform others by simply being happy, friendly, people, and, in that respect, both are the antithesis of (hardcore) greenie/liberals who behave as if any diversity of opinion is proof of 'evil' and an 'enemy' to be despised, ridiculed, run out of town on a rail and/or 'eliminated' by whatever means. Besides, I really really wanted to use bippity boppity boo and I could just see fairy godmother turning pumpkins into 'green' power plants ;) Its the Dr Zeuss generation! |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
ian field wrote:
"flipper" wrote in message ... On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 11:08:47 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:08:13 -0500, flipper wrote: [snip] Rather, I think it's more that 'greenies' (and to some degree 'liberals' in general) have an almost Cinderella like, bippity boppity boo, 'faith' that 'perfect solutions' (not my job to know how) exist and the only real reason they aren't in place already is due to some 'conspiracy' (and the 'ignorance' of the 'duped' who don't share the same fairy tale). [snip] The proper term is "Pollyanna".... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollyanna ...Jim Thompson I thought about using that but the basic 'happy', 'friendly', Pollyannaish character that sees good in just about everything, including people, didn't seem to comport with the 'vast conspiracy' outlook of most greenies/liberals and, not the only but, some of the 'un friendliest' things I've run across are greenies/liberals who think you're not. With Cinderella I was thinking of the Disney version with "some day your Prince will come" (he does) as "some day your perfect solution will come" (it will) and 'good things' appearing by 'magic' despite the 'conspiracy' of evil step sisters. Even so it's still infinitely more 'positive' than your, well, I'll say 'hardcore', greenie/liberal because Cinderella doesn't have to 'fight' and 'crush' the 'vast array of evil forces permeating all aspects of society'. Instead, 'good things' just 'naturally' happen to 'happy', friendly', people, or they transform others by simply being happy, friendly, people, and, in that respect, both are the antithesis of (hardcore) greenie/liberals who behave as if any diversity of opinion is proof of 'evil' and an 'enemy' to be despised, ridiculed, run out of town on a rail and/or 'eliminated' by whatever means. Besides, I really really wanted to use bippity boppity boo and I could just see fairy godmother turning pumpkins into 'green' power plants ;) Its the Dr Zeuss generation! Whereas guys like us are still of the omnipotent and most magnificent Gyro Gearloose generation. You need it - we'll build it. Whatever it takes. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
"Stephen J. Rush" wrote in message . .. On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. I'm a lurker to this group. For the conspiracy people, the five messages before this one (that I can see headers for) are "no longer available on this server" |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 22:27:37 GMT, "regn.pickford"
wrote: "Stephen J. Rush" wrote in message ... On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. I'm a lurker to this group. For the conspiracy people, the five messages before this one (that I can see headers for) are "no longer available on this server" Do you live in California? The Terminator will be paying a visit ;-) ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
regn.pickford wrote:
"Stephen J. Rush" wrote in message . .. On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. I'm a lurker to this group. For the conspiracy people, the five messages before this one (that I can see headers for) are "no longer available on this server" That begs the question: Who controlleth thy server? But seriously, binaries groups aren't kept that long. Mine (SBC Global) still has all messages. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
And if we had dumped the national treasure chest into hot fusion (the real
stuff, hydrogen and helium) instead of bloodying the sands in the middle east over the last ten years, we'd have all the clean power you could ever hope to have. The uranium cycle isn't particularly dirty if you do it right, but the stuff is hard to come by, is located in some rather unfriendly territory for the most part, and is expensive. Hydrogen is available at the kitchen sink. Jim -- "If you think you can, or think you can't, you're right." --Henry Ford "Joerg" wrote in message ... Whereas guys like us are still of the omnipotent and most magnificent Gyro Gearloose generation. You need it - we'll build it. Whatever it takes. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
flipper wrote in
: On 30 Aug 2007 00:45:12 GMT, Bob Quintal wrote: And the grid in California was f#%ked by the right-wing capitalists like Ken Lay when they forced deregulation on hte unsuspecting weenies (to use your term).. No, the problem is the CA legislature 'called' the 'restructuring' deregulation but didn't deregulate. Instead, they layered on a new set of truly bizarre regulations. That's your opinion. And it's a misinformed one. -- Bob Quintal PA is y I've altered my email address. -- Bob Quintal PA is y I've altered my email address. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
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On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote:
Jim Thompson wrote: How come California has such issues? Did you let the leftist weenies ruin your state ?:-) Yes, Jim. Everything that's not in line with the neocon dogma is the fault of the "leftist weenies". Careful, Jim! Better check under the bed tonight for Leftist Weenies! ;-) Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? http://mysite.verizon.net/richgrise/.../23ramirez.jpg Cheers! Rich |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
RST Engineering (jw) wrote:
And if we had dumped the national treasure chest into hot fusion (the real stuff, hydrogen and helium) instead of bloodying the sands in the middle east over the last ten years, we'd have all the clean power you could ever hope to have. The uranium cycle isn't particularly dirty if you do it right, but the stuff is hard to come by, is located in some rather unfriendly territory for the most part, and is expensive. The problem is where to put it when used. Stashing it way down some mountain isn't going to cut it. Hydrogen is available at the kitchen sink. After investing some major amount of energy to get it split out ;-) -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
Jim Thompson wrote:
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 22:27:37 GMT, "regn.pickford" wrote: "Stephen J. Rush" wrote in message m... On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. I'm a lurker to this group. For the conspiracy people, the five messages before this one (that I can see headers for) are "no longer available on this server" Do you live in California? The Terminator will be paying a visit ;-) Nah, he did a good job so far. Since he took over there was not a single rolling blackout here. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 17:08:38 -0700, Joerg
wrote: RST Engineering (jw) wrote: And if we had dumped the national treasure chest into hot fusion (the real stuff, hydrogen and helium) instead of bloodying the sands in the middle east over the last ten years, we'd have all the clean power you could ever hope to have. The uranium cycle isn't particularly dirty if you do it right, but the stuff is hard to come by, is located in some rather unfriendly territory for the most part, and is expensive. The problem is where to put it when used. Stashing it way down some mountain isn't going to cut it. Hydrogen is available at the kitchen sink. After investing some major amount of energy to get it split out ;-) A leftist weenie would ignore that... hydrogen is FREE isn't it ?:-) ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 22:36:32 -0500, Stephen J. Rush wrote:
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: Maybe. Power plants are supposedly evil, so practically none are built. Nuclear is even more evil in the eyes of enviro-freaks. No wait, that's nucular, ain't it ...? But of course they all want their fresh cooled fromage, chilled Zin and all that stuff. The late John W. Campbell maintained that some of the greenies are so ignorant of physics that they literally don't see the relation between that ugly power plant down the road and the magic that allows them to get ice in August and keep meat for more than a few hours without worrying that it might become unsafe to eat. Oh, they dimly remember what they heard in elementary-school science classes, but it just doesn't register emotionally, any more than the mid-nineteenth-century hunters could believe that they would ever run out of buffalo. Rudyard Kipling saw it coming more than a century ago; look up "The Sons of Martha" at gutenberg.org. What galls me is the way they pulled off the ozone hoax. OOh! This gas that's 4 times as heavy as air magically levitates (conveniently skipping over the smog ozone in the cities), migrates to the South Pole, and destroys ozone. What an incredible load of crap! And the whole "science community" seems to have swallowed it hook, line, and sinker! Where do those idiots think the original ozone comes from? What replaces what gets broken down? Do they know that ozone decomposes spontaneously? The ozone isn't what "protects" us from UV. It's the oxygen. The oxygen stops a UV photon, which dissociates the O2 into 2 O, which atoms then eagerly oxidize the nearest oxygen molecule into ozone. In Other Words, ozone is the _result_ of UV being absorbed by plain ol' ordinary O2, molecular oxygen. There's no ozone over antarctita because there's so little incident sunlight, and ozone breaks down spontaneously anyway. When they discovered this "hole" the only reason it could be so astounding is that nobody's ever looked before. And don'f forget the Auroras (streams of charged particles from the Solar Wind), which have to be hell on ozone stability. But I guess they've thrown real science down the dumper long ago. Sigh. Thanks, Rich |
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On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:40:00 -0700, Joerg wrote:
That begs the question: NO IT DOES NOT "BEG THE QUESTION"!!!!!!!!!!! It "raises" the question It "demands" the question It "asks" the question It "calls for" the question etc. But to "beg the question", you would have had to make an assertion, then use your own assertion as if it's proof of itself. Thanks, -- Rich Grise, Self-Appointed Chief, Apostrophe Police And appartnely Grammar/Syntax/Style Police as well. ;-) |
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Jim Thompson wrote:
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 17:08:38 -0700, Joerg wrote: RST Engineering (jw) wrote: And if we had dumped the national treasure chest into hot fusion (the real stuff, hydrogen and helium) instead of bloodying the sands in the middle east over the last ten years, we'd have all the clean power you could ever hope to have. The uranium cycle isn't particularly dirty if you do it right, but the stuff is hard to come by, is located in some rather unfriendly territory for the most part, and is expensive. The problem is where to put it when used. Stashing it way down some mountain isn't going to cut it. Hydrogen is available at the kitchen sink. After investing some major amount of energy to get it split out ;-) A leftist weenie would ignore that... hydrogen is FREE isn't it ?:-) It's like Ethanol from corn. Just about now people begin to realize that food prices are starting to climb. Even for stuff they never thought about. Such as milk that comes from cows who are fed corn which has now become expensive ... -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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Apostrophe Police wrote:
On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:40:00 -0700, Joerg wrote: That begs the question: NO IT DOES NOT "BEG THE QUESTION"!!!!!!!!!!! It "raises" the question It "demands" the question It "asks" the question It "calls for" the question etc. But to "beg the question", you would have had to make an assertion, then use your own assertion as if it's proof of itself. I thought I made an assertion, here. - My server still has those posts. Now I feel as if I just got a ticket ... -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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On Fri, 31 Aug 2007 00:37:18 GMT, Joerg
wrote: Jim Thompson wrote: On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 17:08:38 -0700, Joerg wrote: RST Engineering (jw) wrote: And if we had dumped the national treasure chest into hot fusion (the real stuff, hydrogen and helium) instead of bloodying the sands in the middle east over the last ten years, we'd have all the clean power you could ever hope to have. The uranium cycle isn't particularly dirty if you do it right, but the stuff is hard to come by, is located in some rather unfriendly territory for the most part, and is expensive. The problem is where to put it when used. Stashing it way down some mountain isn't going to cut it. Hydrogen is available at the kitchen sink. After investing some major amount of energy to get it split out ;-) A leftist weenie would ignore that... hydrogen is FREE isn't it ?:-) It's like Ethanol from corn. Just about now people begin to realize that food prices are starting to climb. Even for stuff they never thought about. Such as milk that comes from cows who are fed corn which has now become expensive ... Hopefully it'll cost the DemocRats some seats. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
Bob Quintal wrote:
flipper wrote in : On 30 Aug 2007 00:45:12 GMT, Bob Quintal wrote: And the grid in California was f#%ked by the right-wing capitalists like Ken Lay when they forced deregulation on hte unsuspecting weenies (to use your term).. No, the problem is the CA legislature 'called' the 'restructuring' deregulation but didn't deregulate. Instead, they layered on a new set of truly bizarre regulations. That's your opinion. And it's a misinformed one. And, if I may ask, how do you know that? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com |
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RST Engineering (jw) wrote:
And if we had dumped the national treasure chest into hot fusion (the real stuff, hydrogen and helium) instead of bloodying the sands in the middle east over the last ten years, we'd have all the clean power you could ever hope to have. Is your name Lew Strauss by any chance? Strauss was the former chairman of the AEC. He coined the phrase that Nuclear power would make electricity too cheap to meter. After tons of money were dumped into the development of nuclear energy, guess what? It wasn't too cheap to meter. The hot fusion guys have succeeded in burning through all of the money that has been provided to them thus far, and they are no closer to breaking even than they were 15 years ago. I truly believe that they could absorb the entire budget of the free world and still not develop commercially viable fusion. The uranium cycle isn't particularly dirty if you do it right, but the stuff is hard to come by, is located in some rather unfriendly territory for the most part, and is expensive. Hydrogen is available at the kitchen sink. We have more fissionable material than we know what to do with. Availability of nuclear fuel is not the problem. The problem is that without breeder reactors we have no good way of disposing of the spent fuel rods. With breeders, we could in theory extract much more energy, but that would involve making plutonium, and plutonium scares Hollywood actresses, politicians and regulators. Fusion fuel becomes much more expensive when you have to cherry pick the molecules so that they have just the right combination of neutrons and protons to fuse. Household water isn't going to do it with anything that has been contemplated thus far. DiTritium Oxide, perhaps. -Chuck |
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Herbert John "Jackie" Gleason wrote:
On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 21:14:13 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 18:31:06 -0700, "Herbert John \"Jackie\" Gleason" wrote: On Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:50:06 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: Yes, that's true. L.A. gets its top-off from our APS Nuclear facility in Wintersburg, Arizona. ...Jim Thompson Bull****. LA gets it from the BPS DC Intertie. Your **** is trivial dribs and drabs by comparison. Your ignorance is surpassed only by the size of the Al-Gore-dick in your mouth. Who=the-**** do you think feeds the intertie? ...Jim Thompson NOT Arizona, you retarded ****. Do you even know what the BPA is? The damn dam,man! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonnevi...Administration http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_DC_Intertie http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Path_66 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Path_15 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sylmar%...%2C_California Etc,etc,yadda,yadda.... |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
"flipper" wrote in message ... On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 20:26:37 GMT, "ian field" wrote: "flipper" wrote in message . .. On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 11:08:47 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:08:13 -0500, flipper wrote: [snip] Rather, I think it's more that 'greenies' (and to some degree 'liberals' in general) have an almost Cinderella like, bippity boppity boo, 'faith' that 'perfect solutions' (not my job to know how) exist and the only real reason they aren't in place already is due to some 'conspiracy' (and the 'ignorance' of the 'duped' who don't share the same fairy tale). [snip] The proper term is "Pollyanna".... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollyanna ...Jim Thompson I thought about using that but the basic 'happy', 'friendly', Pollyannaish character that sees good in just about everything, including people, didn't seem to comport with the 'vast conspiracy' outlook of most greenies/liberals and, not the only but, some of the 'un friendliest' things I've run across are greenies/liberals who think you're not. With Cinderella I was thinking of the Disney version with "some day your Prince will come" (he does) as "some day your perfect solution will come" (it will) and 'good things' appearing by 'magic' despite the 'conspiracy' of evil step sisters. Even so it's still infinitely more 'positive' than your, well, I'll say 'hardcore', greenie/liberal because Cinderella doesn't have to 'fight' and 'crush' the 'vast array of evil forces permeating all aspects of society'. Instead, 'good things' just 'naturally' happen to 'happy', friendly', people, or they transform others by simply being happy, friendly, people, and, in that respect, both are the antithesis of (hardcore) greenie/liberals who behave as if any diversity of opinion is proof of 'evil' and an 'enemy' to be despised, ridiculed, run out of town on a rail and/or 'eliminated' by whatever means. Besides, I really really wanted to use bippity boppity boo and I could just see fairy godmother turning pumpkins into 'green' power plants ;) Its the Dr Zeuss generation! Jiminy Cricket!, did you just confer a doctorate on Zeus or elevate Seuss to Mount Olympus? Nah - just posted before checking the spelling. |
Electricity in CA, another close call - CalifornicatedAgain.gif
flipper wrote in
: On 30 Aug 2007 23:44:17 GMT, Bob Quintal wrote: flipper wrote in m: On 30 Aug 2007 00:45:12 GMT, Bob Quintal wrote: And the grid in California was f#%ked by the right-wing capitalists like Ken Lay when they forced deregulation on hte unsuspecting weenies (to use your term).. No, the problem is the CA legislature 'called' the 'restructuring' deregulation but didn't deregulate. Instead, they layered on a new set of truly bizarre regulations. That's your opinion. Of course. And it's a misinformed one. On the contrary, I looked at the 'restructuring' before forming any opinion, as opposed to you just assuming, without the slightest shred of evidence to support the notion,. that anyone who has a different opinion 'must' be 'misinformed'. California's problem was exacerbated by power grid gaming but the FERC report pointed out that the ensuing market manipulation was only possible because of the bizarre regulatory system the legislature created. Whose lobbyists created that bizarre regulatory system? It was lobbyists from the power brokers, that's who. Why? so that they could use the loopholes they put into the legislation in order to manipulate the market. Just as one example, California regulations artificially capped the price for in state production while out of state production was not, thereby creating a forced "two prices for the exact same product." Guess what that leads to. It leads to utility companies making a mint by buying cheap and selling high. -- Bob Quintal PA is y I've altered my email address. -- Bob Quintal PA is y I've altered my email address. -- Bob Quintal PA is y I've altered my email address. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
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Well, my university thought I knew a damned thing about it when they gave me
my degree in nuclear physics, but I can always be taught a thing or two. I purposely made it "simple" for those who don't have the background. I'll be happy to give you a thesis or a dissertation, but I think it somewhat inappropriate in these groups. You can't presume a group dedicated to drawing and displaying schematics can do the uranium fission equation(s). And Joerg, you are correct when you say it takes a fair amount of energy to dissasociate the oxygen from the hydrogen, but the energy budget (when we figure out the horrendous problem of containing the fusion genie) is balanced far to the right of the equation. And the fellow who talked about England, while money can't BUY an answer, it can sure as hell make it an attractive date. Jim -- "If you think you can, or think you can't, you're right." --Henry Ford "Bungalow Bill" wrote in message Again... You make it sound so simple, but you don't know a damned thing about it with remarks like that. |
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Bungalow Bill wrote: The goddamned war didn't do anything but make the asswupes that commit terror acts wake the **** up to the fact that we ain't gonna take it. It seems to have provoked them further actually. Graham |
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