On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 09:06:15 -0000, "Jim Alexander"
wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On 2 Mar 2005 14:31:01 -0800, wrote:



It seems to me that it's you who has the issue here. Firstly I have
never claimed or even given the impression that I am always right.

Pehaps the problem is in the message and how it is received.

I simply try to be as clear as possible. I can't be responsible for
how people choose to interpret what is said.


Personally when you forthrightly stated warranties on cheapos were scam
warranties I objected because in my personal experience that's not the case.

OK, let me be more specific about what I meant.

I didn't say or even mean to imply that the retailer wouldn't honour
the warranty by exchanging the product within the specified period.

My point was that the approach is a scam because exchange is usually
the *only* remedy that they have for many of these own/anonymous
products.

This means that if the thing breaks within the warranty period, a
replacement or refund happens without questions asked unless there is
evidence of misuse - and perhaps even then.

My issue is what happens after that - e.g. in months 13, 25 or 37 and
beyond.

There is no service organisation, no spares backup and no means of
repair in most cases. In effect the only option is to buy a new
product.

I have a number of issues with this approach:


1) The retailer does not make it clear to potential customers what the
reality of the situation is. There are helplines (which in reality
are a simple call centre that achieves little) and apparently
attractive warranties. They don't have notices by he products or in
the manuals that the arrangement is replacement only, that there is
not real support and that there is no provision for repair or spares
after the end of warranty. Many times I have seen customers at the
returns counter in DIY stores having brought back a product out of
warranty and being told that they can't have a replacement but will
have to buy a new one. The look of astonishment on some people's
faces has been a picture. They have assumed that because there is a
seemingly attractive warranty, that the manufacturer is taking his
support responsibilities seriously. Nothing is further from the
truth. The fact that the retailer is not open about this is, in my
view, a complete and utter scam and I feel that legislation should be
passed such that retailers are required to provide precise details of
the nature of the support during and after warranty. It is very
apparent that a significant proportion of customers are taken in by
what is basically a cynical marketing an distribution mechanism with a
certain predicted return rate. I believe that this is fundamentally
wrong.

2) If I am sharp enough to figure out the situation, my buying
decision becomes more complicated. If I choose the own label product
with N year replacement support, I have to take a view on how long the
product is likely to last after that. Since many of these products
are built down to a price and sold on features with a build quality
adjusted to achieve better than a certain return rate, I have to take
a fairly conservative to pessimistic view on longevity after the
warranty expires. For practical purposes, I have to consider that
the product is written down to zero and living on borrowed time after
the end of the warranty.

On the other hand, if I buy a product of better build quality and with
availability of spares and proper service then I have more options
available to me after the end of any warranty. With a better build
quality, there is a better chance that the product won't need repair
and spares for rather longer anyway which further reduces the expected
cost of ownership. When I also factor in the quality of use, absence
of messing around factor and stronger position with the retailer in
the event of a problem, it becomes easy to justify a higher purchase
price.

All of this is before one gets into the ecological soundness or
otherwise of the throw-away mentality.





A few examples, PP planer switch went intermittant, replaced without
question. I was planing Fermacel edges so a cheapo was definately what I
wanted. Challenge sander just kind of wandered over the surface unlike my
Bosch which had shamefully packed up. Refunded without question by Argos is
spite of it showing evidence of use. So no sign of scam warranty there.
Neither is it always the case that cheapos are crap. Lidl 18V cordless
drill, well not needed the warranty yet as its been a good buy and seems
sound electrically and mechanically though the batteries are not brilliant
but there are 2 and they still charge more quickly than they discharge in
use. When my Lidl kettle leaked, refunded without question. So no sign a
of scam warranty there either.

This is not the point that I was making. That was all about what
happens after the warranty has expired and the fact that the retailers
don't make the situation clear.






--

..andy

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