In article ,
Charlie Self wrote:
Robert Bonomi writes:
And, as you know, they're shutting those machines down.
You *cannot* access AOL 'news' with a conventional newsreader, like "Agent".
I don't want to access AOL news. AOL does that fine. I wanted to use Agent in
conjunction with AOL to access Usenet NGs.
AHA! Quote: "What we have here is a failure to communicate". grin
I was using 'news' to *mean* exactly what you call "USENET NGs" -- *NOT* in
the sense of "current events stuff". In the computer crowd, 'news' has a
primary meaning that refers to USENET, with the 'current events' referent
being a _distant_ second-place -- *unless* context makes obvious that the
second-place meaning is what is intended. Sorry I wasn't clear.
A little history:
Traditionally, USENET was the network of server machines that exchange
'postings', 'articles', whatever-you-want-to-call-them. This network
was *very* different from the "Internet" although a fair number of USENET
servers _did_ talk to each other via the Internet. But a _lot_ of the
transmission occurred over point-to-point DIAL-UP, via automated scheduling.
In some instances people even moved stuff between locations via magnetic
tapes. The remark about "never underestimate the bandwidth of a station-
wagon full of mag tapes" *does* have a basis in fact. The station wagon
was transporting USENET data between a couple of colleges in the Research
Triangle Park vicinity, in North Carolina.
The information that was exchanged between these servers was known as
"USENET news", "netnews" , or just "news", for short.
This is why the 'categories' are known as "_NEWS_ groups". And, why
individual postings are often referred to as "_NEWS_ articles".
(I'm an _old_ f*rt -- I had USENET 'news' -- and e-mail, via the same
link -- for almost 10 years *before* I had an 'Internet' connection.)
Anyway, Agent _can_ do what you want. *BUT* you have to have made arrangements
with "somebody else" (other than AOL) for USENET access, _first_.
You'll have to specify the 'NNTP server' (aka 'news server') as the name
that that "somebody else" told you to use, and then, when the prompts come
up, enter the username/password that *THEY* assigned you (*not* your AOL
username/password).
the AOL software already authenticated you to AOL, now you go "through" the
connection AOL sets up -- but not *TO* AOL -- for USENET. Thus, only the
"somebody else" that runs the NNTP server needs to validate you. So you have
to give them _their_ username/password information.
i.e., start up AOL 9, and, after it logs in, minimize it, and run Agent.
And, when the username/password prompts come up, answer with the 'magic
words' that the NNTP server operator gave you for that purpose.
The *ONLY* thing you goofed up on, was using the wrong username/password.
The "wrong key" for _this_ lock. grin
For that, Agent requires FTP and
NNTP numbers, which I cannot locate in AOL. You say it doesn't have such
numbers, which is fine. I can dump Agent and free up some disc space.
*NO* 'conventional' USENET (aka 'news') software can talk to AOL's USENET
servers. AOL's servers do *NOT* speak "NNTP". The *only* thing that can
talk to AOL's USENET serves is AOL's integrated software. And _that_ will
work *only* as long as AOL keeps those servers running. which is the root
of the entire problem. wry grin
I haven't got a clue as to what is eating Mozzila's favorite son. It perks
up,
goes right along, and then cannot access AOL, even though it has my correct
screen name and password.
Obviously, It can't access any of AOL's 'proprietary' content -- like the
chat
rooms, etc.
And, in and of itself, it *won't* do the dialing like the AOL-ware will.
You need to start the AOL software _first_, then launch Mozilla's favorite
son.
Did that. Made no difference, except that I could get to the stage where I
entered my AOL username and password for Mozilla to use. It then was unable to
access AOL.
Of course. see above. Mozilla's USENET (aka 'news') functionality uses NNTP
to talk to servers. AOL's USENET server does *NOT* speak NNTP. doomed to
failure.
*HOWEVER*, if you got to _that_ point, with the pop-up windows prompting
for the username, and then the password, you were *VIRTUALLY* THERE. You
had _ALMOST_EVERYTHING_ done correctly.
You _were_ actually connected to somebody's NNTP server. (I don't know whose,
but "somebody's"
You were just using a username/password that was *not*
recognized by that server. You need one issued by the folks that run *that*
server, not the one from AOL.
Lastly, AOL _e-mail_ requires a *DIFFERENT*FROM*NORMAL* type of connection to
read mail. Besides the AOL software, there are a limited number of programs
that know how to make that kind of connection. Netscape version 7, and above
*is* one of the programs that _does_ know how. (when you create an
'account',
it has a special type "AOL account".)
Note: the Mozilla 'all-in-one' application, and, thus, presumably,
Thunderbird
as well, does *NOT* know how to connect to AOL's mail-reading servers.
Again, I do NOT want to read AOL mail or news. I want to access Usenet.
My misunderstanding. Couldn't figure out _why_ you were entering your *AOL*
username/password into Mozilla, except for that reason.
Revised comment: You're entering the *wrong* username/password. You have to
use the one that is given to you BY THE PEOPLE THAT RUN THE nntp SERVER you
are trying to connect to. Since AOL does *NOT* have an NNTP server (the USENET
servers that they are going to be shutting down are -not- NNTP compatible;
they speak their own private ******* language, rather than the standard), your
AOL username/password will _not_ be usable for any attempted NNTP access.
Following Mozilla's own instructions gets me nowhere.
Again, you have to enter the name (or IP address) of the *NNTP* server
to use. AOL doesn't have one of those. So there's nothing for Mozilla
to talk *to* at AOL. And if you specify "somebody else's" USENET server
(aka 'news' server, aka 'NNTP' server), then, "obviously" the AOL username/
password won't work -- you have to use the username/password that "somebody
else" gave you, for accessing _their_ systems.
More disc space freed up.
I will probably just use Google Groups. It is not particularly handy, and
doesn't seem to have filters, but I have neither the time nor inclination to
develop expertise in attaching various bits and pieces to AOL. I've already
****ed away a couple of days fiddling with this when I could have been doing
something profitable from either a fiscal or enjoyment stage.
I have no idea why these programs won't work with AOL 9.0, or whether it's
something I'm doing. I'd say the latter is most likely. But, as someone who
writes instruction manuals, I see that as a major fault in the instructions,
which, IMO, are often written so that someone can feel superior when saying
something like, "but, you see, everyone who KNOWS computers knows that step, so
it doesn't need to be written down."
It's the particular _combinations_ of things you're trying that doesn't work.
Desktop (i.e. 'client') software that uses NNTP to communicate with a remote
USENET server is *unable* to communicate with AOL's soon-to-be-eliminated
newsgroup servers.
Trying to use your AOL username/password to authenticate yourself when
talking to "somebody else's" NNTP server doesn't work. "Wrong key for the
lock".
To make software like "Agent" work, there are two things you have to do:
1) Set up an account for access with "somebody" that runs an NNTP _server_.
2) Enter _three_ pieces of information -- *as*provided* by that 'somebody'
in step 1 -- into Agent's configuration. The "server name" (or address),
the 'username', and the 'password'. Trying to use a username/password
from a source =other= than the 'somebody' from step 1 is guaranteed to
fail.
AOL does *not* run NNTP servers, Thus they do not qualify for step 1.
Therefore, you _cannot_ use your *AOL* username/password as part of
step 2. Thus you have to make arrangements with "somebody else".
For figuring out 'how to make things work', "news.individual.net" is a
good choice, because it doesn't cost anything to set up an account there.
Just point your web browser at http://news.individual.net and click on
the 'registration' link.