On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 04:13:41 GMT, "James Sweet"
wrote:


If you're referring to their earlier model sprint engine or smaller
3.5/4hp they're not too bad as long as you don't run them to hard.
Anything past about 87 is pure crap. Especially their Quantum or
larger OHV junk.
Aluminum used in high stress parts such as valves and piston arms
etc...
B&S is also good about changing tolerances in mid production to ensure
aftermarket parts jobbers suffer, not to mention how it can make the
home repair owner's life hell.
I could go on and on...
I have a huge pile of B&S motors behind my shop(I do small engine
repair).
Most suffered catastrophic engine failure do to cheap material and
shoddy craftsmanship, some right out of the box.
As for interchangability.... IF you can get a part to cross you're
lucky.
I've had experiences where internal parts from one model wouldn't fit
an exact model of the following year or series.(Mostly piston arms/
crankshaft tolerances.)
B&S likes to vary the coil sizes as well. Techumseh's generally use
one size coil.
B&S likes to use a plethora of different length and style of control
cables as well, both throttle and safety/cutoff cables.(AND charge and
arm and a leg for them.)
B&S also uses the worst carbuerators I've ever seen as well as the
most ill concieved govenor system ever applied to small
engines.(plastic carbs on their small engines that once they wear out
that's it, just toss and replace. Even the more expensive engines use
crappy Walbro carbs.)
After just hours of use most B&S engines suffer uneven engine idle as
the govenor system can't adjust for engine runout.
I have some Techumseh engines that have been going for years and
hundreds of hours.( Steel alloy pistons and cast irons sleeves)
You're lucky to get the rated hours out of a B&S.(FYI the small 3.5/4
hp mower engines that Briggs makes are generally rated at 30-40 hrs of
use. I have managed to get as much as 100 out of some of the older
models but only after tweaking the govenors down and keeping fresh oil
iin them at all times.)
As for Briggs not needing service... I do a steady business on small
engine repair and most of the dead lawn equipment that come into my
shop have B&S motors.(Burned coils in the first year, engine
explosions due to poor craftsmanship/tolerances etc...)
I mostly swap them for a tecumseh engine and have happy customers
thereafter.
It could be said that at one time Briggs did make a quality engine,
however that's simpl not true anymore.(I DO have some vintage Briggs
from the early 60's and as late as the late 70's that are very fine
engines and put Brigg's later offerings to shame both in reliability
and power.)


Dang have they really gone that far downhill? I've had nothing but excellent
performance out of B&S engines, I particularly like the 80's-early 90's I/C
flatheads with the cast iron bore, maybe I've just been lucky but I've just
never had anything major go wrong with any of them and the carburetors have
been some of the easiest and most dependable I've ever dealt with. I've had
too limited experience with the OHV stuff, encountered them a few times on
pressure washers I've borrowed (and they worked well but were also fairly
new) but I've never had to work on them.
Actually, the only way to get a B&S that's built for durability is to
pay through the nose, usually somewhere in the range of 500 bucks or
more, whereas Techumseh are all built rugged.
Briggs is so bad about making so many different versions of the same
model engine that most all that are in the lawn care business and have
any savy run from them.
If you take apart those 80's/90's models of Briggs you mentioned
you'll find alot of copycat design in them. Take the starter recoil
mechanics and shroud for instance. A direct copy of Tecumseh's far
superior starter recoils, except they're built with far too much
plastic to hold up for long.(what's especially bad is the use of
PLASTIC pawls instead of steel. You'll only see the steel pawls in the
top end commercial Briggs motors, whereas ALL Tecumseh starter
assemblies use stainless steel pawls.)
Briggs is especially bad about using very cheap steel in the recoil
springs, which results in some pretty bad jams once the starters have
seen a bit of wear. Once the spring folds up and jams the whole
assembly it usually takes everything else as well as the pawls will
stick in the extended position.
You can't be serious about Walbro making a good carb, considered the
worst in the business.( That from my 30 some odd years working int he
bussiness.)
Briggs is also famous for having some of the worst electronics in the
ignition system. Coils that can fry out after just a few hours.(I
NEVER replace them with oem on any of my customers machines.
I've had better luck with Stens aftermarket than original Briggs.)
B&S, as I'd mentioned is bad about varying the size and values on
their coils as well. It can be a real guessing game as to what size
coil any particular model of a Briggs might take.(IMO this is
completely uneccessary, they could easily make one size and value coil
for all their single cylinder engines instead of the dozen or so they
do.)
Even the OHV's they make for use on pressure washers are shabby.
I have the service contract for a local rental companies fleet of
pressure washers. Virtually all the one's with Briggs engines have had
catastrophic engine failures(exploding engines usually from thrown
rods and spun cranks.)
We wound up replacing them with either Honda or Toyo engines, which
sadly enough cost LESS than the cruder, simpler designed and built B&S
engines.


I've had exactly the opposite experience with Tecumseh, though I was never
surprised because last I checked (about 10 years ago) they were always about
$100 cheaper than a comparable size B&S. I've had several of them throw
rods, ignition go wonky, carburetors that wouldn't stay in tune and would
clog up every time they sat a few months, hard starting, rough idle, and it
always seemed like they were unnessesarily hard to take apart for simple
stuff (head bolts holding the cowling on?!). They were the one brand I swore
off ever buying.
In all my years I've never even heard of a Tecumseh engine having any
internal failure, remarkable considering that you'll find them in alot
of off road recreation equipment that get run very hard, even to the
point of abuse.
As for their ignition... All that could go wrong is the coil, and
Tecumseh has the best track record for endurance in that regards.(I've
even taken coils off engines that had been sitting in the parts bin
for years and had them run on much later models with no problems.)
Any carb can clog up if you let it sit long enough. the walbro's are
worse for that in my opinion.
As for rough idle, you can't be serious? The only way to get any kind
of faulty idle on a Tecumseh carb is if you try and run them with a
rotted primer bulb or dirty gas.(Tecumseh uses a counterbalanced
govenor system that literally makes for a rock steady idle, unlike
Briggs which are famous for up and down idle states.)

That said, ask yourself how many hours on a given day you actually run
your briggs engine. If you just cut your own yard at most an hour? And
what one a week tops?
Remember when I told you about the actual ratings that Briggs gives
for expected engine life for their engines? On consumer models at best
50 hours.(pathetic really)
And yes IF you really take care of them you can get more, most owners
don't though which is where I get SO much business.( most scoff at the
thought of changing the oil at least every two use cycles which is
paramount for keeping an engine clean.)
I have customers in the lawn care business that on a usual day will
run their Tecumseh engines for as long as 7-8 hours, some even more.
On average they'll get as much as 5 seasons out of them, your'e lucky
to get one out of a B&S at that level of work load.
Many of my customers use commercial duty Snappers which almost always
come with Briggs engines and which crap out the first year.
I replace them with a comparable Tecumseh and will seldom see them
come back for service for as much as three years, then it's usually a
tune up and replacement of the primer bulb.
I have several old Craftsman mowers that i keep around for loaners on
warranty work, all run Tecumseh and the oldest one is from the early
80's and still going strong.

Guess I better hoard the few old (mostly late 70's-early 80's) B&S engines I
have.

Yeah, as anything later will dissapoint you.
As I said I have a huge pile of junk Briggs behind the shop.(once or
twice a year it means a trip to the scrap yard just to get rid of
them.)