"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:36:53 GMT, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
Geeze Andy - did you see the work they produced?
Wasn't even looking - that's not the point.
That statement ignores the degree of accomplishment these kids have
achieved. It presumes they are absolute beginners. If they were, you would
have a more valid point, to a degree, but since they clearly are not, your
point loses all of its validity.
These guys aren't the
untrained, unskilled, off the street kids.
They're inexperienced. They're schoolkids - they can't be anything
_but_ (they just haven't had the time).
You don't need years of time under your belt to have developed the necessary
understandings and appreciations of certain things. I think I'm hearing
some eliteist stuff coming through. I find that hard to believe based on a
lot of other postings I've read from you, but I can't figure out what else
it would be.
One of the smartest comments I ever heard at school was from my
metalwork teacher. He pointed out that metalwork as a school subject
was basically pointless. Very few of us would ever handle a hacksaw
again. Of the few that went on to engineering apprentices, or
whatever, they'd be working 40 hour weeks. The couple of hours a week
we'd spent in the workshop during all our years at school would be
outweighed in no time at all. He was right.
I'd agree with that but what does it have to do with the discussion at hand?
Most of us do a number of things on a very part time or occassional basis.
That does not prevent us from doing them with all of the appropriate safety.
Nor does it imply that we need to go overboard trying to implement every
conceivable measure that might be considered a safety consideration in spite
of perfectly acceptable procedures.
You're not trying to make stuff here, you're primarily
trying to teach good techniques andd good habits for the future.
I think you need to look at the site completely Andy. They're making
things. Nice things. This is not first semister wood shop.
They are indeed making nice things. That's rewarding, and good on them
for doing it -- but it's still _incidental_ to a vocational course,
because that has to focus on what you learn to make afterwards. Of
course the best way to encourage this can be through the reward of
present achievements, but you still have to
Our discussion was not about whether they are pursuing a vocational
education.
A workshop like this has crosscut sleds to hand, and you use them
whenever you _can_, not whenever you _must_.
Wrong. Badly wrong. You use tools, adjuncts, and procedures when they
are
appropriate, not just for the sake of proving something. This is the
perfect example of taking it too far.
So what's wrong with using a sled ?
Nothing. It's a great adjunct - in its place. It's just not necessary to
use it all of the time. There are a ton of cuts on the table saw that do
not require or even benefit from the use of it. To state that a perfectly
safe cut on a saw without one is unsafe just because they didn't use one is
wrong and that's what I commented on.
This is an entirely appropriate cut to do on a sled. Doing it against
the fence like this is borderline for being in the proportions where
it becomes hazardous (neither of us can really tell from that
picture).
Wrong. There is plenty of support along the fence. It only requires a
glance to see that. This is not a small piece of wood he's trimming. It's
a matter of stability against the fence. He was only trimming an inch or so
off of a piece of wood that approached a foot in length. Please explain how
that proportion is boarderline to becoming hazardous. That's the problem
with blanket statements like one commonly finds here at the wreck - they
become mantras and ignore the fundamental principles. The cut he was doing
is one which a table saw does well and poses no problems to the operator.
The fellow in the picture was far from reaching any point of wood protruding
beyond the blade to be of concern.
A push block or any other device that lessens the control that the
operator's hands exert over the work piece would be flat out wrong.
Of course - but a block doesn't (a stick would).
It sure as hell would when the wood is still not fully on the bed.
I'm assuming that the "bed" here is actually a powered feed belt. If
it isn't, or if that belt slips, then you have the workpiece coming
back towards you. You need to control that, and you can't control it
with your fingers for the last part of the pass (at least not without
getting your fingers too close to the drum).
Andy - you're looking too hard for things to find wrong. Again, look at the
picture. He is providing the highest possible degree of control over his
workpiece. That's what it's about - it's not about gadgets and things. He
is not at the end of the push, he's at the beginning.
--
-Mike-