On Sun, 05 Dec 2004 20:33:21 GMT, (Fred) wrote:

Andy Hall wrote:

On Sun, 05 Dec 2004 19:14:01 GMT, (Fred) wrote:

OK, so to be completely clear.....

You measured at the kitchen tap before the work and got 15lpm (ish).

You have measured at the same tap and now it's down to 6lpm.

Yepp. That's it.

Did the plumber change anything between where the pipe comes up
through the floor (or wherever it comes in) and the kitchen tap?

No, certainly not in the kitchen.

At 6lpm, it isn't going to be any good.

Equally, the plumber should have made sure that the water coming from
the main was good enough an dshould certainly have known the
difference between what was mains and what was not.

This is very easy to do. All you have to do is hold your hand over
the tap. If it's hard to do, then it's mains pressure. Too late for
that now though.

Well, that's the thing. British gas man measured flow rate at the
kitchen tap (which I suppose is not the right tap to measure it as it
is a mixer of some sort).

It is the conventional place to measure.


Large local did not measure anything, small
local measured pressure.

It's largely pointless measuring pressure because the pressure can be
high with the tap turned off and fall dramatically when it's turned on
because of a restriction or simply an inadequate pipe.

What do I know about the right way of
measuring anything? Well, I would not pay the plumber if I knew how to
do it all myself.

It does make you wonder. Flow rate can be measured with a bucket and
a second hand on your watch. Not sophisticated.... :-)



One thing that you could try is to open the kitchen tap full. This is
so that any dislodged crud will tend to flush out of there rather than
through the boiler. Then turn the street stop tap all the way off
and all the way on a couple of times. I was able to clear a
problem that was once where there had been a build up of sediment
around the stop tap.

The thing is this: they did never turn off the water completely. They
turned on all the taps to prevent the water from rising.

Hmmmm........

I know
because I accidentally turned off the taps and had immediate water
spillage where the tank used to be. That kind of indicates to me that
it cannot have been mains.

But *none* of the plumbers pointed this out to me. And they *all* saw
the tank.

You say taps - plural.

Was this the kitchen tap and bathroom cold taps?





Would this be reason enough to withhold payment for the job btw?


I would. Basically, as far as you're concerned, there was a flow of
15lpm+ before and now it's down to 6lpm. that isn't good enough.

Ok. I know that 15l/min is not great, but it is usable. 6lpm is a joke
as far as I am concerned.

No it's hopeless. However, if the water flow from the street is
only 6lpm, then in one sense it is not the plumber's fault.
However, he should have measured and advised you accordingly.



It may be that something has dislodged from the pipe from the street
and caused a part blockage. If that's because the pipework is old etc.
then it's not directly the plumber's fault, although one could argue
that he should have flushed it through before installing.

Your other option is to contact the water supplier if it proves to be
a problem at the stop tap. They have to provide you with at least
9lpm at the kitchen tap, but if the issue is on your property, you
would have to pay.

You and a couple of other guys in here are a god sent. I hope you make
enough money in whatever you do. You know what, I would pay for
someone like you only to oversee the project, maybe select the plumber
and explain in good English stuff so that I can understand. You would
not have to do any work at all, just make sure that these people do a
proper job. I thought that I am reasonably competent handling
tradespeople, but the amount of time and energy I lost over this
particular project is immense, let alone loss of productivity at work.
But as you say: too late now.

Don't feel bad. I am sure that it can be rescued.

I would ask the plumber to come back and check what is really going
on.

I did have a fleeting thought that perhaps the kitchen tap was fed
from the tank. This would give an explanation as to why it was OK and
now isn;t - i.e. the main only ever delivered 6lpm. This would be
highly unusual though.

However, since water continued to run with cold taps turned on, it
suggests that these were and are from the mains. Also, you wouldn't
have been able to stop water reaching the tank by turning them on.

Don't be afraid to wheel him back.



--

..andy

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