On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 03:50:40 GMT, Robert
wrote:

On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 04:21:01 +0100, Andy Dingley wrote:

On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 15:16:54 GMT, Robert
wrote:

There was a day when companies priced their products on a fair markup.
Now it's 'competitive' pricing.

You're absolutely right.

Over the last twenty years we've seen a huge shift to this "global
Walmart" approach. Everything mass retail is now cheaper than it was
twenty years ago, even in dollar terms, not just in real terms.
Tool-wise I used to have the best toolkit on the block when I was just
starting out, now B&Q (our orange borg) are selling tools I only
dreamed of back then, and the TV shows suggest you can't do a thing
unless you own the latest colour of plastic sanding machine.

Everything now is made in the same handful of Chinese factories, works
equally badly, breaks in no time and the only discriminator left is
price. So we take a full-steam-ahead slam into a Thatcherite monopoly
where the only retailers left are Walmart and McDonalds. "Competitive"
pricing delivers low prices, but it also removes every retailer except
the very highest up the size and economy scale.

But I don't want cheap tools, I want _good_ tools. I now have the
ability to affordably buy more rubbish tools than I could previously
imagine. So why am I buying so few of them ? Why does my Dad bring
back a bagful of junk every time he goes shopping, and I don't even
bother looking unless it's either 50 years old or was hand-made by
elves somewhere and with a pricetag to match. I would _love_ to deal
with someone who's makign the product I want to buy, and sticking a
reasonable markup on it. I won't even look at the price tag ! I'll
maybe buy fewer of them, or wait longer before I buy it, but I'm
basically going to buy that grommet-flanger someday because I've
already decided I need one, whatever the price, not just because its
under $5 and her off the telly was using one.

Strangely one of the few companies left doing what you bemoan the lack
of seems to be Lee Valley. I agree with what you claim to be in favour
of ! So why are you then griping and applauding Princess Auto, when
they indulge in the sort of barrel-scraping I abhor ?



LV aren't making Holteys. They aren't shifting a million Eeezy-Set
"Handyman" models every week. They're developing and manufacturing a
tool (like their bench planes) that steals every good idea out there,
then manufactures it to the highest standard that a bench woodworker
can notice. And then the pricetag is still better than all the other
companies that are even vaguely comparable.

I was making a point.
Princess Auto is just one of the companies that buy the same third party stuff
Lee Valley does but sells it at a much lower price.

I'm not disputing that Lee Valley has a line of superior tools of their own.
Unfortunately I'm a power tool fanatic, hand tools are not for me.

I have dozens of tools, kitchen, and garden items from Lee Valley.
They are my #1 Christmas gift supplier, have been for years.
All my saw blades, bandsaw blades, sanding supplies, all come from Lee Valley.
I have bought out the gift item store.
From 5 strobe flashlights (very popular with teens) to 4 kitchen Cleavers, and
three Lee Valley knife sets. My last two wedding gifts came from Lee Valley and
the recipients are now big Lee Valley fans themselves.
If it's stainless and for the kitchen I've bought it from Lee Valley. I never
compared price. I never shopped around.

I just got tired of seeing Americans pay less than me in EVERY succeeding Lee
Valley catalog. From a Canadian company!
I'm not surprised to see all the Americans in this group support Robin.
We Canadians get hosed, so they can get a deal.

Quit whining- If you want compensation for your ummm... severe?
gouging, take a look at how much less you pay for prescription drugs.
Or go buy your stuff from one of the other suppliers.

There are still a few companies who price according to a fair profit on their
goods.
They are worth their weight in gold.

Mainly they've gone bust.

True, we still have a few who service the construction trade in my area.

The mass-market just isn't buying on that
basis. Record are gone. Clifton make their real money from megabuck
tools for aerospace. Stanley has been junk for years.