Greetings and salutations....

On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 14:47:59 -0500, "Swingman" wrote:

"Peter De Smidt" wrote in message Dave Mundt wrote:

snip
Now...as the above points out, they [pit bulls] WERE bred for fighting,
whichs means that they WILL have a tendency (hard to overcome) to
fight with other DOGS. However, again, with proper training, it
is possible to overcome this, so the pit bull will not automatically
attack on sight...but...it does require training.
snip

That's quite scary, though, isn't it? Clearly most owners are not
knowledgeable or equipped to do such training, and it's a leap of faith
that it's possible to overcome this inborn tendency. You might make it
less likely that your dog will attack others, but will you totally
remove that urge? I doubt it.

Precisely!

Frankly, I (and every other human) have urges at times to
strike out and destroy other humans...but I do not give into those
urges because I was trained from birth not to. The urge is not
removed...just overridden.

Consider Siegfried and Roy. Clearly they trained and socialized their
animals much, much more than the average dog owner, but nonetheless
tragedy struck. Training can mitigate inborn tendencies, but that's not
the same thing as removing them.

Bad example because it is apples and cantelopes. S&R were
dealing with tigers...Wild Animals that were not pets in any way,
shape or form. They were more like bad-tempered, dangerous partners.
Dogs, though, have been socialized to mankind for thousands of years,
and, have developed into a creature that works well in a symbiotic
relationship with mankind. It's called domestication, and, has quite
a range..If it is 1 to 100, Tigers are at about 0. Dogs are at about
90-95 (cats are probably 50).


The behavior of ANY dog
completely depends on the training and level of attention
that the owner gives to the dog.

That's not true, the behavior of any dog completely depends on it's
training, and on it's genetic pre-dispositions and the environment.
Otherwise you could train a newfoundland to be as good a sheep herder as
your average border collie.

Absolutely correct ... and particularly with a breed like the pit bull, it's
damn scary that anyone can actually think otherwise.

Not absolutely, but breeding does make a difference. After
all, you would not want to send a dachshund out into a lake to
retrieve a downed duck, nor would you send a Lab down a hole to
hunt a badger. Ever since the first wolves joined mankind at the
fire, mankind has manipulated the gene pool to create an animal
that is suited to the hunting task at hand. Speaking of which...
have you ever seen a badger? they are one of the nastiest fighters
one could come across...so by this logic, dachshunds should be
restricted because they are tough enough fighters to take on
such an opponent. However, nobody is scared of a dachshund...
mostly because they have not been the subject of so much
bad press over the past few years.
Regards
Dave Mundt