On Mon, 6 Sep 2004 16:31:09 +0100, "David"
wrote:
"Mike Mitchell" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 6 Sep 2004 09:55:27 +0100, "David"
wrote:
"Mike Mitchell" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 2 Sep 2004 14:20:43 +0100, "David"
wrote:
You can make somebody an offer for anything, all they can do is refuse,
the
RRP is after all only a recommendation.
Yes, but under the Scottish sealed bids system, they refuse your offer
and, get this, they won't allow you to make another! It's the silly
season 24/7/365 over the border...
MM
But only if there are a number of bidders.
If you are the only bidder then you are free to go back and negotiate, but
then you don; really make a sealed bid anyway.
What does not happen is that the seller cannot play you off against
another
buyer. I thought that would appeal to you noble and ethical viewpoint.
There is no cheating or trickery. This appears to be the point that you
either do not wish or cannot understand.
But it would be much FAIRER if everyone put their cards on the table!
Then I can see what others are prepared to bid and on that basis can
decide whether to outbid them. They in turn can do the same against
me.
or more likely the seller or estate agent try and screw some more money out
of you and teh property goes over what its worth, and then you encourage
property inflation.. which is not a good thing.
But inflated prices in an open bid process can only happen if the item
in question is rare. This is not the case for properties as it might
well be, say, for works of art. The fact that open bid auctions happen
by the dozen or hundred every week points to the equity of this
system. Why would open bids for property (in Scotland or anywhere
else) not be just as beneficial to all parties, vendors and buyers?
Isn't a very low OO price just trickery? Why aren't new properties
sold like this?
But in a sealed bid system, buyers will offer well over the price
BUT PEOPLE DO NOT GENERALLY DO THIS (99% of the time). I do not know
who has told you this but no-one I know works this way
Then they don't get the property! One person is lucky enough to pip
them to the post, possibly by a very small amount. However, because of
lack of information (since it's a closed bid system and thus based on
guesswork) the buyer who lost out could be kicking himself because he
failed by such a small margin. So what happens? Well, to make sure of
getting the property, an inflated bid is put in, if that is what one
can afford. It's like asking a footballer to get the ball in the net
while the goal posts are invisible and someone keeps moving them.
the vendor is likely to be satisfied with, as that is the only way
they stand a chance of securing the property.
You would need to be absolutely so fecking stupid to pay way over the
VALUATION. nobody wants to have negative equity immediatley upon purchasing
the property... for some reason you do not comprehend this
What's a valuation at the end of the day? It is one man's opinion. Get
three estate agents into a property in England and you'll probably get
three different valuations, some as much as forty grand higher or
lower. A much better "valuation" would be for the seller to 'fess up
and tell everybody what the actual asking price is as he sees it. It
would avoid a lot of hassle of everyone having to get different
valuations, surveys and so on. Plus, because everything would be out
in the open, no one need feel shafted, which I'm sure is how many do
feel having gone through the mill and lost out a few times.
If people really did this then the house prices in Scotland would be waaaay
overinflated... this is not the case, because there is no playing parties
off against one another you pay what you think is reasonable, unless you are
just a daft, and have no common sense.
lets see if we can simplify it.
1. no other interested parties.... negotiate with the seller, put in an
offer/ possible reject/new offer /negotiate or whatever is reasonable.
I am not concerned with a single buyer, but with the situation where
there is more than one buyer, and possibly several, which is, as I
understand it, when the sealed bids process kicks in. Before I start
investigating a property I have become interested in, I do not know
how many other buyers I am going to be up against, exactly as when I
bid for an antique at an ordinary auction with all bids out in the
open. But in the latter case, at least I can balance my desire for the
object with the amount of readies I'm prepared to cough up, depending
on how I perceive the *competition* to be on the basis of the bids
against me. That is not the case with a far more expensive asset,
one's home.
2. 2 or more interested parties. closing date set. Both parties typically
have a VALUATION survey done before hand, or will discuss the matter with
solicitor or look up land registry, or state that offer is subject to survey
in the offer.
Yes, well, you're putting me off the system straightaway by this
valuation survey! How many such surveys can one finance? A survey
doesn't come cheap. And what is a "valuation" survey if it is
different from a proper, full, or structural survey, or is the buyer
expected to get one of those done as well *after* he has committed to
the sale by virtue of the sealed bids' binding nature? In England,
sure, you get the survey done, but you haven't exchanged contracts by
then.
Based on the market VALUATION you put in an offer +/- a few hundered quid of
this number. so you pay the market value or something very very close.
Again you may note that house price inflation in Scotland has generally not
been as high as the rest of the UK as the system does not encourage people
to up their offer subject to what eth seller/estate agent think they can
squeeze out of the market.
According to the BBC web site Scotland has experienced a 21% annual
rise, whereas similar figures for England a North 25.8%, South East
9.7%, West Midlands 17.3%, Wales 27.6%, therefore Scotland represents
a far higher increase than here in the south. Greater London, the
South West, East Anglia, and East Midlands were all lower than
Scotland's increase, and therefore it seems to me that inflation in
Scotland can fairly be described as roaring ahead.
People very, very, desperate for the property may very, very very
occasionally up the bid above the valuation (happens more often in Edinburgh
perhaps, and more often when someone is moving from England and has 1.
excess capital from there own house sale , 2. do not understand how the
system really works... (as is evidenced from your own viewpoint) and 3. are
taken in by the horror stories of estate egents concerning what xx% over the
asking price the houses are selling for in this area.).
Lots of verys in the above paragraph! Very good!
Hmmm maybe thats really not that simple for you.
THink of it this way an OO price is just something to get you to take a look
a the property. You then make your own decision with advice from some one
you can trust what the property is worth. you then pay the market value or
there abouts. Very occasionally some dumb arsehole pays a couple of grand
over the odds, this is the exception rather than the norm.
I believe that an open bid system would be fairer to all concerned,
would still obtain a good price for the vendor and no one need feel
cheated, as I am sure many do.
MM
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