"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 12:16:12 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 11:08:45 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message

I was going to suggest the Knauf U value calculator normally
available
as
a
trial version from
http://www.knaufinsulation.co.uk/ but it is unavailable at the
moment
as
it
is apparently being updated.

It may be worthwhile checking the site in a week or so if you
\re
still
interpreted.

The point is that the house has to be viewed
as upper and lower floors. the
difference in the upper floors is marked
in most houses.

Heatloss through walls of the same construction, accounting for
temperature variation, varies depending on whether you are upstairs
or
downstairs?

Grow up! The rooms in the upper floors have a large area that is the
ceiling with a cold loft over in winter and hot loft over in summer.

Yes, and all the exterior walls and windows have an even larger area
that is hot in the summer and cold in the winter.

They generally do not. Most it is about equal in area.

Nonsense.

Detached House. 7m x 7m x 5m high
Outside wall area 140 sq metres
Ceiling area 49 sq metres

You have to look at individual upper rooms.

My main bedroom
has a very large ceiling area. More than the walls.

By counting three walls as internal? That's a crock

Not in that room it isn't.

And when you take into
account much of the outside walls have build-in wardrobes across them,
there
is not much wall area at all compared to ceiling area. Most homes have
built-in floor to ceiling wardrobes these days, with many of them against
outside walls, which gives an extra level of insulation against the
outside
walls. Packing in loft insulation for the benefit of the upper rooms is a
win, win, win situation, giving greater benefits to these rooms than
others.
It is worth alone just for these rooms.

This is just pulling things out of the air.

It is NOT! It is looking at the house realistically, instead of one blob of
a box.

As I have told you. Last August in a heat wave, the coolest roomin my
house
was the main bedroom. The insulatio above proteced it from the 55C in
the
loft above. A breeze runningthrough the uper windows, which are beter for
breeze being higher up, and it was very comfortable.

Maybe you should try mirrors on the ceiling as well......

If these wo rk then I will. Do you have a URL?

Depends on the house in question. 90% plus will benefit and many others
will greatly benefit.

Figures? Otherwise this is just armwaving again.

Figures? For what type of house? Do they all one bedroom wall top to toe
built-in cupboards? Etc, etc.

If you are saying that adding insulation where there was none before
makes a significant difference to the overall effect in the house, I
will accept it. I don't accept that insulating up to 300-400 mm
rather than 100 or 150 makes a huge difference to the *total* for a
house because the figures don't support that.

You are a thicko! The upper rooms greatly benefit, of which there is
usually 3 or 4 bed and one or two baths. You make the silly mistake of
looking at the whole house and treating it as one with all rooms being
equal. Big mistake.

I've done heating calculations in fine detail for different
properties, counting losses and gains through internal surfaces as
well.

The devil is in the detail. Your detail was not fine enough. It is worth
having high levels of insulation in my house just to keep the bedrooms warm
and cool. For those who have an upper room as an office the benefits are
even greater. Keeping bedrooms cool is good in preventing cots deaths too.
I'm sure the lower rooms didn't benefit too much.

Even in the depths of winter, once the bedrooms are up to temperature, the
TRVs virtually stay off all day. I have the bedroom doors always closed, so
no heat is rising from downstairs into them.




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