On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 20:25:03 +0000, Richard Savage
wrote:

Andy Hall wrote:


Very good, but I'm a bit confused.

The diagram is the new layout, right?

The outside wall is at the bottom of the diagram?

The new hob is in the bottom left of the diagram, i.e. to the left of
the arch?

Could you elaborate just a bit because it doesn't seem that the duct
would need to cross in that case..... Obvioulsy this is not the
case......

.andy

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Sorry Andy,

I guess that in the long, and learned, discussion the original question(s) have been
blurred.

The current plan, as shown on the web, has the hob on the outside wall under a hood
venting to the outside. In the bottom right hand corner of the plan is a Franke sink
whose biggest bowl is some 300 x 400 mm. Diagonally opposite the sink is a double oven
'tower'. This is the only immovable item in the plan because of the need to hide a lot
of CH pipes in that corner. Water and gas are placed along the outside wall only.

The design is over two years old now (enforced delay thanks to ICL deciding it didn't
require my services when it became Fujitsu) and in that time we have ocasionally thought
long and hard about small sinks. The only solution we can think of is to locate the hob
next to the ovens and fit a 'proper' sink roughly where the hob is shown on the plan.
That raises the problems of providing a gas supply to the oven side of the room (see
another thread) and how to deal with smells and steam.


OK, so what I'm missing is what is wrong with the plan you have
posted?

You have the hob and the sink on the outside wall?

Is the issue that you think that the corner sink is too small?
300x400 is a bit, isn't it. Is this their Papillon PAX 652-E?

Generally having the hob a long way from the sink is not a brilliant
move, especially as it would be diagonally across the room and
presumably the room is a thoroughfare? This could create a real
danger.

Moving the hob to the other side of the room creates a major PITA,
because you have to get the services over there and I agree, given the
layout, you don't want a duct across at ceiling height. The only way
that I can see that would make that half reasonable would be to run a
flyover shelf across the top of the arch, as I mentioned earlier,
effectively continuing the cornice line around the arch end of the
room. You could use an extractor built into a top cupboard unit to
complete the line, effectively stopping to the right of the window.
The only thing is that that might make the room seem a bit narrow at
that end. I wouldn't do that for either aesthetic, but more
important safety reasons because of the hob location.

It seems to me that a better solution would be to keep the items
roughly as you have them and do something to achieve a larger sink
or a second one.

Can you put the washing machine anywhere else like the garage for
example? Otherwise I wonder if there is a way for it to go the other
side of the room on the oven wall?

Alternatively, could the washer go in the space the other side of the
sink as you have it now where the plinth heater is shown?

This frees up 600mm under the window and you could put a second sink
in there and a smaller one across the corner perhaps. It looks like
you have about 300mm to play with between dishwasher and hob so you
could perhaps move things around a bit in that respect.

The little vegetable sinks are a dead loss in practice - too small to
do anything useful apart from deliver stuff to a waste disposer if you
have one.

If you are tight on space, the best option is generally a double bowl
sink You can drain things in it, stick a board on top for more space
- a lot more flexible than a drainer.

You might be able to fit in a double bowl or larger sink by moving the
dishwasher closer to the hob and moving the washer as mentioned.

Corner sinks are deceptive - they appear to be large and make use of
the space but are not as big as you think in practice.






I briefly mentioned a extractor duct across the ceiling tonight and my beloved drew a
deep breath and said 'no way'. I'll wait a bit and ask her exactly what she means by
that ;-)

Best regards Richard


..andy

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