Thread: jointers
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DerbyDad03 DerbyDad03 is offline
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Default jointers

On Thursday, March 18, 2021 at 2:46:08 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 3/18/2021 12:06 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Thursday, March 18, 2021 at 10:17:24 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 3/17/2021 3:25 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Mar 2021 10:49:22 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet

On 3/16/2021 2:03 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Tuesday, March 16, 2021 at 10:14:00 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 3/15/2021 8:50 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 15 Mar 2021 09:35:15 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet

On 3/14/2021 8:54 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 14 Mar 2021 09:11:21 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet

On 3/13/2021 1:49 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 13 Mar 2021 09:10:38 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet

On 3/12/2021 11:54 PM, wrote:
On Friday, March 12, 2021 at 4:28:38 PM UTC-6, wrote:
Laguna finally came out with their new line of jointers. The higher
end 8" helical jointer looks nice but at $2750, I think it's out of my
range. Interestingly, all of the Laguna jointers are parallogram.
There are no more dovetail jointers in their lineup. They have 54
cutters, like Powermatic.

The lower end 8" jointer is very similar (1.5HP vs 1.75HP WOW!) but
only has 20 cutters and goes for $2000. 20 cutters, really? There is
a picture of the cutter head. It looks like a kid missing half its
teeth. Click on
the plus sign on the safety cover.

It's very different than either the Jet or Powermatic so it's a tough

Is HP really much of a concern with jointers? I think its kind of like a drill press. HP isn't really a factor in deciding which drill press to buy. With a jointer you will be taking off more wood the wider the jointer is. But you can and do adjust the depth of cut so you are only taking off a tiny tiny tiny amount of wood. And you sneak up on taking off the wood. You don't start taking off a full cut. Now I'm not saying you want an underpowered jointer. But once you get enough HP, its enough. You can then ignore that spec.

I would agree with that analogy. With less HP you can make a shallower
cut or feed slower.


If the lower HP jointer has less than 1/2 the amount of teeth I would
think that each tooth is taking a bigger bite. And that could
"Possibly" be "something". LOL

Old style planers essentially had 3~4 blades that cut all across the
board. And that is a bigger hunk of wood being removed with each knife cut.

Yes, but there is always multiple teeth cutting in the helical cutter.
Any "flywheel" effect isn't going to help.

I certainly think this can be "over thought" into indecision..

Isn't that what we're here for?

LOL. I keep forgetting that. Provide as many scenarios as possible.
And add situations that are not pertinent to the issue. ;!)

Seriously, that's about where I am. I was 90% sure the Laguna was the
right way to go but the new, lower end one just isn't going to happen.
Only 20 knives? I don't seen $2800 for the upper model either. The
Powermatic is high, too. Unless something happens, it looks like the
Jet is the better deal. Jet always seems to have a 10% sale going on
so that pays the sales tax and a (very) little.

Well, the Laguna is certainly a more "sexy" looking machine and we all
know that is an important category.. ;!)
I had that to consider between the Jet and the Hammer. So maybe not so
important. ;~)

Then the color, that is going to be as clear as black or white.

Boo! Hiss! You should be punished for that one.
Two birds with one stone....

So with the lower end Laguna with 20 teeth...The upper end with almost
triple the teeth, 54, The Jet falls some where in between
with 36. I think that 20 teeth would be maybe a bit too coarse. I
think feed rate will even out the playing field on all of these models.

My 12" Jet has 56 teeth so the ratio is the same as with the 36 teeth on
the 8" Jet. I can attest that the cut is smooth AND QUIET or should I
say, q u i e t.

BUT with 54 teeth,,,, I would think smoother. But where do you draw the
line? Are you going to apply a finish as the work exits the jointer or
will you finish sand? If you are going to sand I would think the
quality of the cut on the Jet will be fine.

Sand. I have a drum sander so I might just as well use it. Edges
don't get sanded. For joints, that's pretty important. OTOH, the saw
is going to get to the edges anyway.
Me too but I rarely use it after the planer, more for smoothing out BS
rough cut, thicknessing a rough cut.

I do edge sand cabinet doors and drawer fronts.
Now I use the new Festool attachment for that.
Yesterday I edge sanded 16 drawer fronts, twice.

Once for the 90 degree edge and then again for the 45 degree
champher/bevel that I added to the front outside edge on the router table.

The guard might be a consideration but they all appear to be the
American version, pork chop. Oddly I thought the Euro style would be
weird. After using it I prefer it just from the stand point that the
American version slaps the fence every time the work clears.

I can see where the European style would be preferable. I hadn't seen
that before.
I think it is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. I hated the slap
of the pork vchop on my old jointer.

Table height is almost the same for both. The style/thickness of the
soles on the shoes you wear in the shop probably differs more.

Where do you like the switch? It appears that the Jet has dual
positions, high or low.
apparently you get both with the Laguna and the bump bar across the
front. I wonder if that would be an accidental shut down issue. I
often accidentally turn my SawStop off by leaning into the on off switch.

I thought of that for a minute but now that you mention it, it's
probably not a good idea. Turning it off in the middle of a cut
probably wouldn't be good. I also turn off my saw with my hip. It
keeps my hands free and eyes on them.

Table adjustments. That is a big difference between the two.. The
crank on the Laguna will be finer to adjust but slower. The lever on
the Jet is quick but more coarse. With a jointer the fine tune adjust
with the wheels is probably not a factor. And how often will you make
those adjustments once you find the setting that you like.

The Jet JWJ-8HH has cranks. The new Laguna has the levers. I played
with a Powermatic at Woodcraft. I couldn't figure out how to use
them. I got that they moved the table and that twisting them did
something but locking the lever also locked the twist.
I stand corrected. And YES the Powermatic is really strange. It's like
they wanted to be different but not in a good way.

Voltage is the same so you will have to deal with that.

The Laguna is 3 hp, the Jet is 2 hp. 2 is probably going to be plenty.

I have two 20A circuits, one for the DC and the other for the tools
(they aren't going to be used at the same time). A 30A (3HP) circuit
would be a RPITA.
Yes, and why I have a long 10/3 extension cord.

Can you put your hands on one before the purchase. Rockler and
Woodcraft are common stores, maybe not for you, but both carry both
brands. BUT right NOW neither are likely to have one on the floor to
look at. My local Woodcraft store is almost empty of anything that is
not built in the USA.

We have both (two of each, actually). With the shortage of power
tools, no one has anything right now. I'm really not ready to buy
quite yet so maybe the situation will correct itself before I am.
I understand the "over seas" manufacturers production is way down.

Will shipping be a consideration? I had my jointer/planer delivered
into my garage for $25 above purchase price,

Yeah. I'm done moving tools like that in my pickup. I gust about
ruptured a duck getting the lathe from the pickup into the basement. I
would have left it until morning but it was supposed to rain. I
didn't think it would be a good idea.

Is the Laguna mobile? YES, build in wheels.

The old one had fixed wheels. From the ratings it was an issue
moosing it around the shop.

Fixed wheels are better than no wheels but not much... My drum sander
has an enclosed base with fixed wheels. I have managed to place it
against a wall in a location that does not require turning. I pull it
straight out whan I use it and push it straight back in when I'm done.
I'm certain that it is lighter weight than a jointer so turning a
jointer will probably be more troublesome.

I bought the top end Bora mobile base for my 500 lb. jointer/planer.
Each wheel swivels vs the model with only 2 swivel wheels. It actually
glides more easily than my SawStop mobile base, and I thought it was
pretty easy to maneuver. The SawStop will remain in place when elevated
on to the wheels. The jointer will take off towards the garage door
opening, natural slant of the garage floor. I have to keep at least one
of the locking feet at each wheel, 4, locked.

And 4 wheels are probably better than 3.

Well with 3 wheels the equipment is stable, no rocking on an uneven
floor. If there is enough flex in the base 4 wheel works.

Not so fast. It's three wheels but four pads, the worst of both
worlds. The triangle under the three wheels doesn't have the same
base lines so a top-heavy machine is in much worse shape. A widget
will fall once it's center of gravity moves outside it's base in any
direction. The square layout of the "adjustment" pads makes it rock
on uneven floors. While the four-point adjustment pads can adjust,
the wheels allow the tool to move so adjusting is a useless exercise
in frustration.

I've got my table saw on a one of these bases.

I have my DP, bench top sanding station, and router table on those..
With OAK the one under the DP is barely adequate. A lot of flex.

Now put a 500# bandsaw on one. Tiimmmbeeerrrrr!

It's fine for straight in and out of it's storage spot, which works for the
vast majority of how I use it, but I have no room for wide sweeping turns.
If I need to move it sideways, I basically have to drag it.

You don't know how to make a 75 point turn? LOL

What's the point?

I really need to add 4 swiveling wheels. The only thing slowing me down is
that changing the height would mean modifying my outfeed table. I mounted
a channel on the back of the saw that the OFT slips into. The far end rests
on my workbench, perfectly level.

My out feed is mounted solely on the TS so no issues. I can even move
the saw with the out feed up and loaded.

The room my TS is in is rather cramped (TS, BS, DP, upright cabinets,
and cutting table (i.e. track saw) so I have one of these for an
outfeed table:
I used this on my old Jet cabinet saw and Now on my SawStop. For me It
is perfect. I never have to put it down to move the saw, it is always
on the same plane as the TS top as it is mounted directly to the saw and
takes up little room when folded down.

WOW have those things gone up!!! I paid $250 the first time 22 years
ago and about $300 8 years ago.

That might work on my Craftsman 113 long as I removed the motor.. ;-)

In my case, the same outfeed table that rests on the workbench most of the time
can be mounted in a similar manner as the HTC OFT so that it moves with the saw.

I think I had that saw too. Funny how the pulley guard, On the motor,
eats through the guard. So I had and our feed on mine too. It was from
WoodSmith plans. It had a slotted arm on each end of the saw. The out
feed slid along the arms with dowel pins and bolts.

I'm not picturing how an OFT would mount on the saw based on that limited
description. Could you expand on that - after reading the following - ?

When I pull the TS straight out of the hole-in-the-wall - the only way it can be pulled
out - I have about 12" between the back of the saw's table and the workbench.
Look to the left of the saw. That's the edge of the workbench just above the motor.

To install my OFT I essentially place it on the workbench and slide it towards the saw
into it's angle iron slot, then drop in the pins. There is no room to swing anything up,
slide up from the sides, etc.

Without hefting the saw sideways on its 3 wheeled base - (2 fixed, 1 swivel) and keeping
in mind the lack of space to make sweeping turns, would the OFT you are describing
work? I'm not against building a different OFT, but it has to work with my space limitations.

All I need to do is grab the 1 x 12 board and let gravity do it's job. The spacer at the
far end of the OFT serves 2 purposes. It makes the OFT dead level with the TS when
the OFT is resting on the workbench and it also prevents the 1 x diagonal board from
sliding out when I go mobile.

At the TS side, the OFT is friction fit between 2 pieces of angle iron and 2 drop-in
bolts act as pins to keep it inside the iron. I've got 2 extra storage holes in the angle
iron upstream of the OFT so I don't ever have to put the pins down. Haven't lost
them yet. ;-)

In a shop as small as mine, you have to do what you have to do. Ask Gunny Highway.

I used to have my shop and equipment ins a 2 car garage along with n
upright freezer, washer and dryer, wife's car, and yard stuff.
It was a puzzle to get everything out and back in.
I am now in a 3 car garage,and thought I was running out of room minus
the washer & dryer, freezer, and yard stuff. And then I added the
jointer and moved a couple of things to a new location. Seems I no
longer have a space issue. Funny how doing a little rearranging really
opens things up.

I've been drawing different layouts for years and haven't come up with anything
that will work. There really is no other place for the TS based on the room to use
it and the fact that I gain a foot of room when it's stored. Everything else, including
the interior and exterior doors basically means that my current layout is really the
best option.