On Sun, 28 Jul 2019 01:56:29 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 27 Jul 2019 15:31:46 -0000 (UTC), "Arlen G.
Holder" wrote:

From the US homeowner's perspective of working backward from a wall outlet
o What is the difference between ground and neutral in the US?

A friend is debugging why the washing machine metal case is hot only when
the water pipes are hooked up and water flowing through them

So you've got a washing machine cabinet that she will almost certainly
touch that is hot with 110VAC, and you've got water too, maybe dribbling
a little where the hoses connect to the washing machine, or the water
pipes, and maybe even a little bit on the floor. Plus if she retrieves
something from the tub**, she'll have wet, soapy hands. Soapy water is
even worse than plain water. Dangerous.

Water and electricity is is a very bad combination.

It sounds like there is a short in the water valve. The washing
machines I know use a double valve, that is, the hot and cold water
valves are one piece. So you don't have to decide which half it is.

Measure the voltage at an unpainted part of the case, when the machine
is on and the water (hot AND cold) is filling it, disconnect the four
wires to the water valve, turn the machine on again, measure the voltage
again. If it's much less, replace the valve, and measure again.

Until she gets it fixed, have her go to the laundromat.

**I have a top loader so I can add and subtract while it's running.


when I tried
to explain to that homeowner over the phone the difference between ground
and neutral - where - I'm not sure I have it all figured out myself.

She doesn't need to know this right now. She needs now to get the
machine fixed.

ONe valve on Amazon for many modesl of 285805 Clothes Washer Water Inlet
Valve with Mounting Bracket for Whirlpool Kenmore Maytag GE Frigidaire
Electrolux brands is only $13. Hers will probably be more but even if
it's $60 it's progbably well worht it.




I'm going to point her to this answer on the net.

*Is this correct for ground?*
o It's the round hole in a 3-hole outlet
o It's usually a bare copper wire (or sometimes green).
o It's connected to the sub panel without any breaks whatsoever.
o From the sub panel it connects to the main panel sans any breaks.
o From the main panel it goes directly to the main inlet cold water pipe.
o From that main cold water inlet pipe, it goes into a stake in the ground.
o It should never carry current unless there is a problem somewhere.
o Therefore, the voltage from it to the ground should be zero.

*Is this correct for neutral?*
o It's the taller slot in the typical grounded US outlet box.
o It's the white insulated wire (when black or red is the hot wire).
o It's connected to the sub panel but it may have connections between.
o From the sub panel it connects to the main panel sans any breaks.
o From the main panel it goes directly to the power company input.
o Generally that power company input will be a power pole.
o Within a few power poles will be the step-down transformer.
o From that step-down transformer the neutral will go into the ground.
o Therefore, the voltage from the outlet neutral to ground should be close to 0

In a way, they're similar in that both the ground and neutral eventually go
directly into the ground - but they're different in that the neutral
carries current while the ground only carries current when something is
wrong.

Before I point the homeowner to this thread, can you clarify or fix
mistakes in my understanding of the difference between neutral & ground?
Your analysis is correct. There are simple plug-in testers that will
tell you if the ground is connected and if the "polarity" of the
outlet is correct or backwards. They are widely available for under 10
bucks. From the description of the problem MY first step would be
investigating the ground. I SUSPECT the "ground" is floating or "live"
and you will measure a significant voltage between neutral and ground
- and less than line voltage between the line (black) and ground.

Combined with this there is SOMETHING in the house "injecting" power
into the ground. This COULD be the washing machine but not likely or
you would get a shock off of it when water not connected and flowing.

With the washer disconnected test between the water pipe and neutral
with the VOM. Bet you get a reading. Then shut off ALL breakers,
(voltage SHOULD go away) and turn them back on untill you get the
voltage back. Something on that circuit is defective.