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[email protected] jurb6006@gmail.com is offline
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Default SOLVED! GFCI tripping problem

"If it were my house and new construction, they would be ripping out the walls at their expense."

It is a bit difficult to eliminate all shared neutrals, if can be done but costs more both in labor and materials.

I saw licensed, bonded and insured electricians wire an apartment using 3 runs of 14-3 WG. (may have been 12 but if it was it had very thin insulation) I had 2 110 volt window A/c units in 2 different rooms and they ended up on the same side of the 220. I was getting 25 volts between neutral and ground, I had to get one of those extension cords for one of them to plug in into a different outlet. But the point is, there were only 3 neutrals for the whole apartment, an upstairs of a house.

They couldn't tape drywall either. I turned on the livingroom light and it looked like they hung the sheetrock inside out it was so badly built up. And they said "Well it is better than the old plaster ceiling right ?". I said "NO, it isn't". Licensed, bonded, insured, $ 35,000 job. About $ 1.12/sq. ft. which is 32 per sheet. i don't know about you but even though I hate drywall I could bring myself to hang 3 sheets of it for a hundred bucks, and it would not look like that despite my eyesight.

"A good electrical inspector may even require that."


On new construction - definitely. There is no way it can be code. You can go so far with using GFCI outlets all over the place but I am pretty sure they mean for the lights to be protected as well. this would be impossible without properly managing the neutrals. That means neutrals are only shared with everything on the same circuit, no other. And those heavy duty outlets in the kitchen that used to use 12-2 WG with the bridge between the hots cut and one to each breaker, one on each phase, not work. No good, it is a thing of the past. They came in handy, some people have like the microwave, toaster and coffee maker all right together. In most cases15 amps is not enough should you want to run all 3 at the same time. And that is a definite possibility.

I am pretty strict about wiring. In fact we got onw of those "really good" inspectors, Ivan Cucic, dubbed Ivan the Terrible by people who THINK they're electricians. I can understand the guy, he doesn't want people burned to death. And most of the code makes alot of sense. But as far as I can find, the need for arcproof breakers is at the very least overstated.

[political podium{short}] Regulatory agencies need regulation. For example, only a thousand or two people died from electrical fires, something like that, not sure if ANY died because of the lack of arcproof breakers. Take raw milk. If you sell raw milk in many states ad they catch you they treat you like you were cooking meth. A great threat to public safety right ? Yup, like a hundred people have gotten sick from contaminated raw milk that pasteurization MIGHT have prevented. I mean in like the past 10 years. OK ? Was it a knee jerk reaction ? Nope, lobbyists.
[/political podium{short}]

Arcproof breaker requirements are sponsored by manufacturers of arcproof breakers. You know the Teflon tape the local DIY sells you telling you it is code ? That is a lie, it is not required nor has it ever been. By code it is an acceptable substitute for pipe dope. Real plumbers use pipe dope. Another way to spot a wannabe (for the paycheck) is when they use Teflon tape on the nut on a compression fitting, or the nut on a flare fitting. Or on brass. Pipe dope or anything like it is for use on sealing threads only, and anyone who doesn't know the difference should not be doing plumbing. Especially gas.

Another licensed and bonded supposed plumber, puts hot water tank in house, discards steel pipes and puts in plastic. Easy, just run it to the tank and voila. MMM, HMMM.

Gas Kan gets there and says "If I hook up the gas now I'll lose my job. Why ? Mr. Knowitall forgot, or never knew to, put in a sediment trap before the gas valve. Not very important really, all it does is to make sure that a piece of crap from the inside of the pipe doesn't jam in the gas valve and make it stay on when turned off. Nothing big, right ?

Licensed bonded and insured means when they kill someone with their improperly performed work they don't lose their house n ****, especially when working under a corporate shell.

Fukum, we call nobody. In fact even cement work. After the driveway. It is too high. I wasn't here during the contracting of that bur first of all no standpipes, can't plow. I am going to cut them off one of these days. Ad it is to high. now I know damn well if I told them "Oh by the way, same height as the original" they would have tried to say something about code. I would have said "Show me the book". Like I installed a side draft furnace once to have some idiot come along ans say it is not code. Bull****.

I say to everyone - whenever a contractor starts about some code **** that makes no sense, remember these 4 words - "SHOW ME THE BOOK".

I'll bet you a hundred bucks they'll say they don't have one. Or that it costs too much to leave the office. Then you offer to go to the office. The end result is that they will be proven liars in some cases and in those cases they will just skulk away. Yeah "Well I'll get back to you on that". After the runaround you call someone else and they can practice their craft on others.

People **** me off, you can make a good living being honest - as long as you really know what you're doing.

Enough rant.

I know someone personally WITH the book (NEC and addendums for certain localities) and I can call her any time. Yes, she is in the elite union, the ones who wire nuclear power plants, hospitals etc., and one of them want to work on old residential. Some of them would turn down a hundred bucks an hour to do it. Well that's from 5 of them anyway...

Old residential is my specialty, these people do not want licenses or any of tat ****, they want a personal reference or two, and to talk and have you explain the why and why mot of a few things. They'll either forget about a permit or get a homeowner's permit. I encourage them to have my work inspected. There is almost always absolutely even remotely wrong with it, but they might find a few violations on the house I can make a few bucks fixing.

The only time Ivan the Terrible had anything to say was right when the requirement came that if you use a cold water pipe for ground it must be bypassed with clamped wires across every joint from your connection all the way to the other side of the meter. It was easier to just pound in a new ground rod, and he was pleased as punch. But that regulation had come out very recently and I hadn't caught wind of it yet. No problem, a clamp, 15 feet of green # 8 and ba da bing ba da boom.